LPG + DCV

Monfreid

Hello,

I'm currently working on choosing the right heating system for my house.
I'm not in favor of UFH (slow response) so AWHP is not an option as it's not very efficient with radiators (so higher electricity bills).
I'm also not in favor of MHRV as it's expensive to install and maintain (filters) compare to DCV. (I prefer to breath fresh air that air that goes through filters that might be dirty)
So I might go for LPG + DCV.
For my house to be compliant with the new regualtions, which Renewable Energy systems can I choose from. (I know that PV is not one of them)

Thank you

Regards

KCross

Monfreid wrote: »

Hello,

I'm currently working on choosing the right heating system for my house.
I'm not in favor of UFH (slow response) so AWHP is not an option as it's not very efficient with radiators (so higher electricity bills).
I'm also not in favor of MHRV as it's expensive to install and maintain (filters) compare to DCV. (I prefer to breath fresh air that air that goes through filters that might be dirty)

Why is the slow response of UFH a concern? With a Heat Pump the house will be at the same temp all day so the slow response doesnt really matter. If you feel the need to quickly boost the temp in the house by a deg or two, light a stove but that should not be required.


The filters for my MHRV are not that expensive. I think they are about €10 a pair and they can be cleaned and reused. 2 sets a year does me.

If you prefer unfiltered direct air you are still breathing the "dirt", as you put, it since the dirt is just freely flowing in the air.

I know I'm not answering your direct question but since you are still at decision stage it might be worth reconsidering the reasons why you are ruling them out. I'm not saying they are better, just not worse for the reasons you gave!

Good luck with the build

893bet

New house? Do what ever your prelim BER suggested in order to meet part l. If not done then do one! No way of checking compliance otherwise.

Monfreid

Hi,
yes, pre BER is done, 1st option is AWHP+UFH+MHRV and 2nd option is LPG+PV+MHRV
I'm not too keen on option 1 because I've heard/read so many bad experience on HP. The main thing is that they need to be properly installed and set up otherwise you could end up with huge electricity bill. Also, I don't need something that runs all the time to maintain the floor at 16 deg mimimum so that it only has to run a little bit more to add 2 or 3 more degrees. Also, the response time for UFH is in both ways, to heat up and cool down.
With LPG, I know that I will put the heating on only when I need it. The PV are not efficient according to the energy consultant, just there to meet part L requirements so it's a waste of money but on the other hand, he said that going for anything else than PV would be too expensive and not worth it either.
so I haven't decided yet. Option 1 is given for 900 eur / year (if properly installed and set up, no garantee) for a 2200 sqf house compare to 1600 eur for LPG.
If you have a good experience of HP+MHRV system, please share it here.
Thank you

MicktheMan

Monfreid wrote: »

Hi,
yes, pre BER is done, 1st option is AWHP+UFH+MHRV and 2nd option is LPG+PV+MHRV
I'm not too keen on option 1 because I've heard/read so many bad experience on HP. The main thing is that they need to be properly installed and set up otherwise you could end up with huge electricity bill. Also, I don't need something that runs all the time to maintain the floor at 16 deg mimimum so that it only has to run a little bit more to add 2 or 3 more degrees. Also, the response time for UFH is in both ways, to heat up and cool down.
With LPG, I know that I will put the heating on only when I need it. The PV are not efficient according to the energy consultant, just there to meet part L requirements so it's a waste of money but on the other hand, he said that going for anything else than PV would be too expensive and not worth it either.
so I haven't decided yet. Option 1 is given for 900 eur / year (if properly installed and set up, no garantee) for a 2200 sqf house compare to 1600 eur for LPG.
If you have a good experience of HP+MHRV system, please share it here.
Thank you

Find a better energy consultant / ber assessor if that's the level of advice you're getting.
Those running costs are insane for any kind of a decent new build. You need to get out of the mindset of heating times because if the house is built correctly, there should be very little fluctuation in internal temperatures.
It is also impossible to offer advice here without knowing a lot more about your household, building design and construction type. This is what your energy consultant should be advising on.

BryanF

Monfreid wrote: »

Hi,
yes, pre BER is done, 1st option is AWHP+UFH+MHRV and 2nd option is LPG+PV+MHRV
I'm not too keen on option 1 because I've heard/read so many bad experience on HP. The main thing is that they need to be properly installed and set up otherwise you could end up with huge electricity bill. Also, I don't need something that runs all the time to maintain the floor at 16 deg mimimum so that it only has to run a little bit more to add 2 or 3 more degrees. Also, the response time for UFH is in both ways, to heat up and cool down.
With LPG, I know that I will put the heating on only when I need it. The PV are not efficient according to the energy consultant, just there to meet part L requirements so it's a waste of money but on the other hand, he said that going for anything else than PV would be too expensive and not worth it either.
so I haven't decided yet. Option 1 is given for 900 eur / year (if properly installed and set up, no garantee) for a 2200 sqf house compare to 1600 eur for LPG.
If you have a good experience of HP+MHRV system, please share it here.
Thank you

Do you understand the acronyms your using? It seems you need to do your own research

Lpg and dcv do not have anything to do with renewables

There is nothing wrong with PV

I'm not a fan of heat pumps either, but can you tell us about your house? Are you rural? Would you go for a wood stove or even wood fuel source?

rolion

Hi,

I'm lost with the letters...

Basically,personal I've setup a target that my combined bills are to come at less than e100 every two months.

Got underfloor heating on ground floor level as I love the feel of heat on my feet and I've reduced radiators valves at 2.Constant warm,everywhere....amazing.

Getting heat recovery ventilation due to house been very well insulated top to bottom (risk of condensation) and my wife opening windows in the morning,cooling whole house and boiler jumping to 70 degrees to heat back to 21 degrees thermostat setup.I can hear the flame raising from my bed...

Getting PV 3 or 5 kw as I want to have most of light consuming devices running without been stressed that eats my cash.Also by heating my water in a 300l cylinder keeps the heating in the house free of charge by the Act of God.

So...I see using renewable to give me inner comfort rather than and only cost based decision.
I know for example PVs systems are not cheap but I want to turn that light or that TV without paying anything to anyone !!! Getting fresh air (with a pollen filter) without cooling whole house.

And,in your case of a new build...is much easier to do it than myself DIY retrofitting an oldish house.

Good luck.

Monfreid

BryanF wrote: »

Do you understand the acronyms your using? It seems you need to do your own research
Lpg and dcv do not have anything to do with renewables

I know exactly what LPG & DCV stand for and that they have nothing to do with Renewable Energy as well :-)

But to be compliant with Part L, I need also a renewable energy system to go with LPG+DCV. PV would be an option only if i go with MHRV instead of DCV but I'd prefer DCV. My energy consultant says that the renewable energy systems to use with LPG+DCV would be too expensive so it's not worth it but I don't have any other info like what sort of systems or price. He is very busy and hard to get on the phone or get quick feedback by emails.

He is very keen on heat pumps but I'm not a big fan of them mainly because if not set up properly you end up with huge electricity bills and also because I don't like UFH (I lived in an appartement with UFH and when it was too hot (if the weather change quickly outside), the only way to cool down was to open the windows ... so it defeat the point of saving energy)

My house is 2200 sft, 1 and half storey, rural, with one wood stove and I was thinking of getting a back boiler as well.

quentingargan

Monfreid wrote: »

I know exactly what LPG & DCV stand for and that they have nothing to do with Renewable Energy as well :-)

But to be compliant with Part L, I need also a renewable energy system to go with LPG+DCV. PV would be an option only if i go with MHRV instead of DCV but I'd prefer DCV. My energy consultant says that the renewable energy systems to use with LPG+DCV would be too expensive so it's not worth it but I don't have any other info like what sort of systems or price. He is very busy and hard to get on the phone or get quick feedback by emails.

He is very keen on heat pumps but I'm not a big fan of them mainly because if not set up properly you end up with huge electricity bills and also because I don't like UFH (I lived in an appartement with UFH and when it was too hot (if the weather change quickly outside), the only way to cool down was to open the windows ... so it defeat the point of saving energy)

My house is 2200 sft, 1 and half storey, rural, with one wood stove and I was thinking of getting a back boiler as well.

I think heat pumps got a reputation for big bills when used to heat old houses. Modern well built houses should be cheap enough to heat with any system really, whether LPG or Heat Pump. I am inclined to prefer quick heating and cooling from rads than UFH so I get the point, but I am thinking of using a heat pump with rads in my own house.

If your roof is facing south and 220SqM, you would meet your renewable component with 4 PV panels or just over 1kw. Perhaps less, since your wood stove would make a renewable contribution. Hardware cost for that would be about €1500 to €1700 plus VAT (less if you go for cheap bright aluminium frames). Installation about an extra 10 hours of work. Not sure that is prohibitive. I know without an export tariff, the payback time is ludicrous, but it will run some daytime loads such as HRV / DCV etc., and if the house is occupied during the day midweek as well as weekends, it will eventually wash its face, so its not a total loss.

murphaph

quentingargan wrote: »

I know without an export tariff, the payback time is ludicrous, but it will run some daytime loads such as HRV / DCV etc., and if the house is occupied during the day midweek as well as weekends, it will eventually wash its face, so its not a total loss.

...and as battery tech improves and becomes cheaper, it won't be too long (IMO) before it'll be economical to install enough battery storage for the PV to up your self produced % to 80% or so with ease, rapidly reducing the payback time.

Monfreid

quentingargan wrote: »

I think heat pumps got a reputation for big bills when used to heat old houses. Modern well built houses should be cheap enough to heat with any system really, whether LPG or Heat Pump. I am inclined to prefer quick heating and cooling from rads than UFH so I get the point, but I am thinking of using a heat pump with rads in my own house.

If your roof is facing south and 220SqM, you would meet your renewable component with 4 PV panels or just over 1kw. Perhaps less, since your wood stove would make a renewable contribution. .

The house should be A3 with LPG or A2 with Heat Pump. The garden is north facing so one side of the roof is south facing. The pre BER report was advising LPG+MHRV+7 PV. But I would prefer DCV instead but don't really know what system could be used instead of PV
I agree that a modern house should not cost a lot to heat, regardless if you use Heat Pump or LPG.