Dogs running out of garden and biting passers by

steddyeddy

Just back from a walk up towards my mate's house in Shankill. Anyway on the walk up and walk down again two dogs ran out of a garden barking at me. One of them nipped at me on the way up and down. It's not too sore and didn't draw blood or anything (do dogs give warning bites?). Anyway it's annoying and I'm not too fussed about it but my friend walks up and down with a pram and is afraid they'll nip his son. You might ask "why does he walk that way" but it's not like he's walking into someone's garden. The dogs run out onto a public road whenever anyone walks past the house (which is on a main road). Any advice about how to go about this in a civil way?

VonVix

I think getting onto the dog warden about it is the best way. No-one should be leaving a dog out to do that to passers by.

delta echo charlie oscar

My advice would be to tell the guards,and ring dublin city councils dog warden service and let them know what the dogs are doing! Just think ur an adult and one if thems nipped you, just think of what could happen if it was a young child & if the child were to run,the dogs would chase them!

steddyeddy

VonVix wrote: »

I think getting onto the dog warden about it is the best way. No-one should be leaving a dog out to do that to passers by.

Well there's no gate on the house. Just a cattle grid if you know what I mean. They just nipped me in fairness but a nip could do a lot more damage to a child.

tk123

Report to the warden before there's an accident. I actually threatened somebody with the warden last week for the same thing - well the dog hadn't nipped yet but it was getting braver and closer every morning coming at my younger dog to the point it was getting too close to me trying to get at her if that makes sense. This had been going on since early this year and I'd just had enough or the owner doing nothing/laughing. My only regret is that I didn't record the dog as evidence if I did have to report to the warden so that might be an idea for you. The owner has given us a wide berth since so we'll leave it at that.

Pac2015

VonVix wrote: »

I think getting onto the dog warden about it is the best way. No-one should be leaving a dog out to do that to passers by.

I am reading alot of threads here similar to this one and people's first reaction is to call the dog warden and Garda, is it not possible in this day and age for people to call to the person's house when the dogs are in the back garden and speak to them on the situation, the dog warden wont just come out and take the dog away because its running free, they will issue warning to the owner and fine them and as for the Garda you would be wasting their time asking them to come out they will just tell you to call the warden.
I think what people need to understand is that if a dog is taken or surrendered via the owner to the dog warden chances are it will be be put to sleep within 24 hours so common sense would tell you to try tackle the problem with the owner first, plenty of people after been spoken too dont allow their dogs out freely like this, also this person needs to put up signs stating the dogs are likely to nip and also to put in more secure gates / fencing.

Ashbx

I think you should take a video of the dogs doing this (get more than one occasion if you can). Approach the owners about this and show them the video (the owners may genuinely be unaware that this is going on). If they havent done anything over the next week or so, go back to them and tell them you will inform the Gardaí/Dog Warden if this isn't fixed. If its still not fixed by another week or so THEN you can get the dog warden involved etc.

As PAC2015 said, you need to consider that this dog may be put down as a result of this so I don't think you should jump to the final solution. As I mentioned above, the owners may not even know that this is happening so give them a chance to fix it first.

Good luck!

steddyeddy

Hey guys I'm a dog lover so I'm not aiming for the dogs being put down. This is a very irresponsible owner and we're planning to drop into him tonight for a chat. We're driving in the garden and beeping in order to avoid the dogs.

Out of curiosity is nipping something dogs are trained to do? It feels very much like a warning.

Pac2015

steddyeddy wrote: »

Hey guys I'm a dog lover so I'm not aiming for the dogs being put down. This is a very irresponsible owner and we're planning to drop into him tonight for a chat. We're driving in the garden and beeping in order to avoid the dogs.

Out of curiosity is nipping something dogs are trained to do? It feels very much like a warning.

Nipping is not something dogs are trained to do its more bad habit that they picked up as a young dog most pups do it and need to be showed how to stop it or trained to not do it so possibly these owners did not do this.
People can mistake barking, growling as aggressive and sometimes its not the case but nipping can be dangerous so I think you are doing the right thing by speaking to the owner.

Ashbx

In my opinion, no! Dogs don't bite to give warnings, they bite to bite. They have lots of other ways to warn humans before a bite....a bite is usually the final action! Growling, curling of lip, ears back, lunging etc are the usual warnings.

I probably wouldn't go as far as saying the dog is trained to do it - the dog just wasn't trained NOT to do it! To me, it sounds more like a territory or fear issue. When you pass their house, you are passing "their" territory and out of fear they act aggressively. That's what I would take from it anyway!

tk123

steddyeddy wrote: »

Out of curiosity is nipping something dogs are trained to do? It feels very much like a warning.

They've probably never been socialised or told what they're doing is wrong.

The warden will only take a dog that's being abused/in a bad situation so don't feel guilty if you do end up calling them - they don't just take people's dogs to the pound to be PTS for no good reason. At most they'll have a word with the owners and make them buy a license if they don't already have them. The guy I was dealing with is known in the area to be a skinflint so that was why I threatened him with the warden - told him he'd have a nice bill for the 4 licenses and so far the problem is solved

Ayyyy Lmao

Shout like crazy at the dogs, even if it makes you look mental! Make them feel scared. I know it's mean, but I couldn't bare the thought of the poor thingsbeing taken away to the pound and ending up dead

Make the dogs feel very afraid, if their owner comes out, then you can approach them with your problem. If this doesn't work... I'm not going to stop you from reporting them when a child is at risk. Good luck<3

Cows Go µ

Ayyyy Lmao wrote: »

Shout like crazy at the dogs, even if it makes you look mental! Make them feel scared. I know it's mean, but I couldn't bare the thought of the poor thingsbeing taken away to the pound and ending up dead

Make the dogs feel very afraid, if their owner comes out, then you can approach them with your problem. If this doesn't work... I'm not going to stop you from reporting them when a child is at risk. Good luck<3

I would not do that at all, I know way too many dogs who lash out when afraid, especially near their own property where they feel like they need to defend their home.

Stheno

Good luck hope you make progress

toptom

They should be muzzled if there going to be able to get out into a public space, Some brutal owners out there shouldn't be allowed own pets.

Pac2015

Ayyyy Lmao wrote: »

Shout like crazy at the dogs, even if it makes you look mental! Make them feel scared. I know it's mean, but I couldn't bare the thought of the poor thingsbeing taken away to the pound and ending up dead

Make the dogs feel very afraid, if their owner comes out, then you can approach them with your problem. If this doesn't work... I'm not going to stop you from reporting them when a child is at risk. Good luck<3

Such bad advice....ignore ignore ignore !!

steddyeddy

We drove into the garden and sounded the horn until he came out. He was friendly enough but wasn't budging on the dogs. He says there was a series of burglaries in the area (he's right) and not taking chances. He doesn't want to block of his gate either because his elderly mother can't open it.

I understand his concern but the fact is my friend and several other people cone up and down that road with a pram daily.

kylith

It's illegal to allow dogs to roam, which is what he is doing. Did you tell him that your next port of call would be the warden? That might encourage him to fix his gate. I'd also tell him (but not actually do it) that until the warden sorts the problem one way or the other I was going to take to carrying a hurley to defend myself with.

I often run and walk the dog around there, I'd be grateful if you can let me know where they are exactly (PM might be best), as I have managed to avoid them so far but it would frighten the bejaysus out of me if they came at me like that.

steddyeddy

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I often run and walk the dog around there, I'd be grateful if you can let me know where they are exactly (PM might be best), as I have managed to avoid them so far but it would frighten the bejaysus out of me if they came at me like that.

Sent whoopsy!

steddyeddy

kylith wrote: »

It's illegal to allow dogs to roam, which is what he is doing. Did you tell him that your next port of call would be the warden? That might encourage him to fix his gate. I'd also tell him (but not actually do it) that until the warden sorts the problem one way or the other I was going to take to carrying a hurley to defend myself with.

Well I walk up the hill with a stick. I'm used to hiking in countries where there are actual dangerous animals so it's a force of habit.

My friend was upset about the man's nonchalance regarding the fact the dogs could injure his child. We forgot to mention the warden but did mention the dogs would pose a danger to a young child.

JustAThought

If you complain to gaurds/warden etc they will probably be seized & killed. What you could do is to write by registered post stating the problem & what happened & giving a deadline to deal with it by keeping them in the back garden or havingba chance to fence/gate properly the front garden. As you know the house the address shouldnt be a problem. You can follow up with a meeting with them when the dogs are safely away if you both want. I wouldnt be driving into a big house with 2 angry dogs & beeping!!!
The owners might not know & I'd hate to think of dogs being seized & killed because of a stupid or careless owner. If your friend with the pram also writes this should give them double cause for concern - two different voices to the warden will mean a lot more. Noone wants their pets to be causing damage ir danger, or to be taken from them and destroyed - give them a chance to fix it.

nicol

The owner could also invest in an electronic dog Fence. We use one on our dog to keep her on our property. She still likes to bark at passers-by but can't get near them,and she would still deter any potential burglars.

steddyeddy

nicol wrote: »

The owner could also invest in an electronic dog Fence. We use one on our dog to keep her on our property. She still likes to bark at passers-by but can't get near them,and she would still deter any potential burglars.

That's an idea but at what point does me repeatedly contacting the owner become harassment?

granturismo

JustAThought wrote: »

If you complain to gaurds/warden etc they will probably be seized & killed. What you could do is to write by registered post stating the problem & what happened & giving a deadline to deal with it by keeping them in the back garden or havingba chance to fence/gate properly the front garden. A....

Seizure and pts will never happen after a first visit in this case unless possibly the dogs attacked the warden.

The OP has approached the dog owner who refuses to remedy the situation. The dog warden should be the next port of call. Any decent warden will approach the situation as a complaint with two sides to the story, in the absence of video evidence.

steddyeddy

It's a sparsely populated area and most people drive up the big hill rather than walk it. Saying that I'd be surprised if more people hadn't had the same experience.

Cows Go µ

I would not advise recommending an electric fence. They are well known for being unreliable and are more likely to cause a problem in the future. They work by giving the dog a small shock and I wouldn't condone that in the first place but also if the dog wants something enough, he will put up with the pain to get to it. Then he will be stuck on the other side of the fence as the pain is never worth it to get back home.

As for the harassment, don't worry about that. He's letting his dogs roam and they have already nipped at people, every time his dogs run out at someone he deserves to get someone at his door complaining

DBB

There's a fair bit of misinformation in this thread about what happens to dogs in this situation.
Dogs that rush out of their gate like these ones will not ever be grabbed by the warden and put to sleep. If the warden did so, he would be abusing his powers under his warrant.
What does happen, because this is the law, is that the wardens approach the owner, and warn them to contain their dogs as per legal requirements. The warden may or may not also issue a fixed penalty notice to the owner for allowing their dogs in a public place and not under effectual control.
If the owners do not comply, then the warden may escalate the case to the district court, where the judge will make the order for the dogs to be properly contained, and in all likelihood, issue a fine too.
To cover a variety of potential scenarios here, if the warden met the dogs out on the street, and did not know who owned them, he will lift them and bring them to the pound. They will be clearly advertised on the county council website as being in the pound, and the owners have 5 days to reclaim them.
If not reclaimed, the chances of the south Dublin pound putting them to sleep is very, very small. They are far more likely to be rehomed.

However, if the owner continues to allow his dogs to rush out at people, and somebody gets bitten, then the victim can initiate a prosecution, with the warden, under the section of the 1986 Control of Dogs Act which deals with dangerous dogs (Section 22), that is, dogs that injure or kill humans or livestock.
In such a case, the judge can direct that the dogs be rehomed, or destroyed. But it is important to note... The threat of euthanasia only becomes salient with dogs that have injured somebody.
Even in cases where the dog has bitten, if the victim does not press the issue, the wardens will often reach a deal with the owner whereby they ensure it can't happen again by taking steps to ensure their dog cannot leave his garden unaccompanied. In other words, even in cases where the dog has bitten, it's still not threatened with euthanasia. In some cases, the owner will voluntarily euthanase their dog as some people won't tolerate a dog that has injured a person. That's their choice.

I just wanted to put some perspective on the actual reality of what happens when dogs rush out gates at people, because there are far too many "if you complain the dogs will DIE" posts going on here, which is just scaremongering. And untrue... Unless the dogs bite and the victim sees the case through to court. But it's a long road to get to that stage.
There is no requirement for a person to approach the owner when a dog rushes out the gates at them, but fair play to the op who did. Reporting the matter to the wardens is a perfectly appropriate thing to do, and as this will not result in any dogs being euthanased at the outset, there need be no fear or guilt put on a person for doing so.

Pac2015

steddyeddy wrote: »

It's a sparsely populated area and most people drive up the big hill rather than walk it. Saying that I'd be surprised if more people hadn't had the same experience.

You would have to ask why do they drive up rather then walk might it be because of these dogs, I am involved in rescue and this really is unacceptable this is how dogs end up in the pound being put to sleep because owners like him refuse to have the dogs restrained or put in an enclosure.
I would go back to him and tell him you have taken advice and you and some other people are concerned by his attitude tell him that some people have advised you to call the dog warden but that its not a route you want to take he can easily put in gates like electric ones that you can open using a buttons or a clicker or he can have the dogs in a large run they would still be able to alert him to any burglars.
I would be insistent on this occasion or you know what these dogs will end up biting someone and the they will be taken and put to sleep by the county vet, he also is breaking a law by letting them roam.