Financially supporting your parents?

CaraMay

viv147 wrote: »

If our finances weren't combined then fair enough, but they are so yes ... he does need my blessing, just as i'd want get his before making a large purchase for myself.

But you are saying he can't take it from your lump sum. That's not cbined finances really is it? You seem to just want everyone to say you are in the right and he shouldn't be giving them money. Most families don't work like that in reality.

LegacyUser

Tabs101 wrote: »

Op I'd tread carefully, money and land cause a lot of falling outs within families. I'd be very reluctant to give money to people who can't live within their means and budget. Do you know how much debt they have? I think if you both decide to help them out its to pay off a debt rather than handing them over a wad load of money that they might not use towards their debts.
Their way of asking for a handout is despicable though. What are his two siblings who are living at home doing to help out?

Absolutely agree with this! You need some info:
- what is their total debt
- is their debt credit card, or mortgage, or both
- what are the people living in the house actively doing about earning money
- is everyone in the house contributing all they can towards mortgage & household expenses

Tbh I'd be inclined to vote a big no, unless everyone in the house is doing their utmost to contribute. If you want to help them out, or if you feel you have to help them out, then pay x amount (An amount that you decide - not them) directly to their mortgage provider. Via bank transfer from you to the mortgage provider - defo not to his parents bank account.

I think it would be incredibly foolhardy to get into a regular payment to his parents. Tell them that you'll do a once-off payment to keep the wolf from the door, but that's it. And that you can't afford any more. Or to do it again.

I'd also make sure that your partner wasn't being blabby about your savings or future plans.

canttalk

CaraMay wrote: »

But you are saying he can't take it from your lump sum. That's not cbined finances really is it? You seem to just want everyone to say you are in the right and he shouldn't be giving them money. Most families don't work like that in reality.

I dont know....My opinion is that families DO work like that... Especially if one is earning more than the other. She absolutely has a right to veto the use of money she had prior to their relationship. They're not married yet but even so really the combined aspect is only from money saved while together or if its used on a joint purchase like a house.

The partners parents need help. We all like to help our families and I think he should help, especially as he's the only one earning, and a decent salary at that. However the parents are being ridiculous, no child 'owes' for being brought up, and effectively they are asking for a wage, with no end in sight unless they have been truthful about their finances... Which I doubt!, heck I was getting 1000 euro as a postgraduate with a kid and that was just about enough to make it. Add a few hundred and that's some peoples take home pay in lower end jobs. The parents are taking the piss! It's not a nice or respectful way to ask for someone else's money

As advised OP, I suggest you tactfully suggest a small sum to send over and then that's it, unless he wants to send a small something (few hundred) every month out of his wages. Without you being completely privy to your in laws budget you can't commit that kind of cash. It would impact your own lifestyle anyway it's a lot of money. By the way do they know how much you have saved? Because that's the only reason I can see them asking for so much. Really that kind of info is not to be shared even casually with anyone other than your partner. It only causes many, many assumptions....

Hollister11

If I had money and my parents needed a dig out, I wouldn't question it.

And if we and my wife had 200K between us, and she was refusing, I think I'd leave her.

OP if this was your parents would you feel the same way ? Are you only reluctant to give me the money away because it's you husbands parents and not yours ?

viv147

Tabs101 wrote: »

Op I'd tread carefully, money and land cause a lot of falling outs within families. I'd be very reluctant to give money to people who can't live within their means and budget. Do you know how much debt they have? I think if you both decide to help them out its to pay off a debt rather than handing them over a wad load of money that they might not use towards their debts.
Their way of asking for a handout is despicable though. What are his two siblings who are living at home doing to help out?

I have no idea how much debt they have. We've asked before, and they usually just respond with 'why does it matter?' and then they don't tell us. We have very few details about what is actually going on with them. All we know is that they want our money.

CaraMay wrote: »

But you are saying he can't take it from your lump sum. That's not cbined finances really is it? You seem to just want everyone to say you are in the right and he shouldn't be giving them money. Most families don't work like that in reality.

Actually I think a lot of families do work like that, and like I said, I don't make any large purchases (either from our joint account or my own.) without talking to him first. That's how things are kept fair, even though the one account is in my name only. (Which is really only the case because I want to protect myself in case of a divorce.)

I should also mention that about half of that money is from inheritance/money left over from my college fund that my grandparents had set up for me.

viv147

canttalk wrote: »

I dont know....My opinion is that families DO work like that... Especially if one is earning more than the other. She absolutely has a right to veto the use of money she had prior to their relationship. They're not married yet but even so really the combined aspect is only from money saved while together or if its used on a joint purchase like a house.

The partners parents need help. We all like to help our families and I think he should help, especially as he's the only one earning, and a decent salary at that. However the parents are being ridiculous, no child 'owes' for being brought up, and effectively they are asking for a wage, with no end in sight unless they have been truthful about their finances... Which I doubt!, heck I was getting 1000 euro as a postgraduate with a kid and that was just about enough to make it. Add a few hundred and that's some peoples take home pay in lower end jobs. The parents are taking the piss! It's not a nice or respectful way to ask for someone else's money

As advised OP, I suggest you tactfully suggest a small sum to send over and then that's it, unless he wants to send a small something (few hundred) every month out of his wages. Without you being completely privy to your in laws budget you can't commit that kind of cash. It would impact your own lifestyle anyway it's a lot of money. By the way do they know how much you have saved? Because that's the only reason I can see them asking for so much. Really that kind of info is not to be shared even casually with anyone other than your partner. It only causes many, many assumptions....

We are married and he's not the only one earning -- although at present he is earning more than double what I am.

And no, they know nothing of our savings or either of our salaries. They must assume we're doing alright (which I guess we are) 'cause we're able to afford a nice apartment, two nice cars and take vacations every year.

Hollister11 wrote: »

If I had money and my parents needed a dig out, I wouldn't question it.

And if we and my wife had 200K between us, and she was refusing, I think I'd leave her.

OP if this was your parents would you feel the same way ? Are you only reluctant to give me the money away because it's you husbands parents and not yours ?

Yes I would help my parents, but they haven't been financially negligent. If they had been then no, I wouldn't help them out either.

LegacyUser

I posted a while ago saying that if you decide to help them, it should be a direct (traceable) payment to their mortgage provider.

The more I've read other posts and think about it, I do wonder if your partner has shared too much financial info with them. Do they see you as 'loaded', and can't understand why you won't dish out money?

Tbh even if you were Donald Trump, you don't have to support someone. Of course it would be a great thing to do, but given what you've said about financial irresponsibility - and the siblings - I'd be inclined to say no. In the interests of good familial relations, I'd offer a once off payment, 5k to 10k max, as a direct payment to their mortgage provider. And absolutely NO after that. And make it clear at time of handing over the once off payment that all future requests will be met with NO.

I really do wonder if your partner has said more than he should have about your finances. I also hate how you have conserved your own & inherited money, and he wants to blow it on his financially less than sensible family. That's not fair on you.

I dont want to be a doomsayer - but is his attitude about money v different from yours (there does seem to be a bit of 'easy come, easy go') and is that going to bite you on the arse in the future?

R.D. aka MR.D

I can't believe that people are giving the OP a hard time about wanting to make a joint money decision.

When they got married, they became a family in their own right. The husband's number one concern should be his direct family unit which is now him and his wife.

bp

Unless the kids at home are paying something towards the home (not if in school obviously) and the parents are able to work (in their 50s I think you said), then no I wouldn't.

Maybe offer a once off payment of a credit card bill then no more.

College fees in the US are huge (I think we forget that here) so your kids may need circa 100k each for college (wopuld that bea ccurate)?

Oh and in Ireland you can give a person 3k per year tax free. So if you have your mother in law 3k and your father in law 3k and your husband did the same that would be 12k or 1k per month. Could be a coincidence but just wanted to highlight it. And 12k a year for the next 20 odd years is a lot of money

Neyite

viv147 wrote: »

I have no idea how much debt they have. We've asked before, and they usually just respond with 'why does it matter?' and then they don't tell us. We have very few details about what is actually going on with them. All we know is that they want our money.
.

So they want you to hand over a lump every month, indefinitely, and you are not allowed to know where that is going- like groceries or mortgage or bills? Doesn't sound fair.

Penny Tration

Neyite wrote: »

So they want you to hand over a lump every month, indefinitely, and you are not allowed to know where that is going- like groceries or mortgage or bills? Doesn't sound fair.

This.

I wouldn't hand over 1k a month anyway because that's essentially covering their rent/mortgage, leaving them able to continue to p!ss away their money.

What I WOULD do, is directly pay a debt, up to 5-10k.

The problem is, they're demanding a monthly wage and wont tell you what it's for. That's not on and I wouldn't give them a cent in that situation.

If they're willing to tell you and your husband what, exactly, their arrears are, then I'd pay the arrears and that's it.

enda1

OP you shouldn't pay a penny until they get themselves jobs and get the kids kicked out and rent out the spare rooms. They appear simply jealous and willing to leach on the successful son in America...

mapaca

I would only agree to give them money on the condition that they come clean about their outgoings, debts, loans, etc. Then pay it directly off a bill, not into their bank account. I would also want to know how much the brothers are contributing, if anything. Tread carefully, this has the potential to blow up into a huge family row.
Of course we would all like to be in a position to help out family when they're in need, but their "you owe us" attitude stinks.

tinkerbell

No way OP, just no way. You have no idea what the debt is as they won't discuss it and they have your husband's siblings living at home. They can't just demand €1k pm and just expect you to hand it over no question.

Yes you have a lot of savings but in the U.S. that won't get you very far when it comes to college educations if you have children. So I would be telling them no.

Forgot password

Forgot password wrote: »

Don't forget to consider that they could be faced with a tax bill on receiving gifts from children. I think the threshold is about 30k, so after 30 months they could be liable for capital acquisitions tax

In this situation it could be worked (totally legally) as to avoid using the 30k threashold and not pay any tax (up to 12k per year).

Every person can receive 3k per year per giver. So if the op and her partner pay from a joint account to the joint account of his parents the parents can receive 12k per year tax free and it does not eat into the threashold of 30k which remains intact.

viv147

Be careful... wrote: »

I posted a while ago saying that if you decide to help them, it should be a direct (traceable) payment to their mortgage provider.

The more I've read other posts and think about it, I do wonder if your partner has shared too much financial info with them. Do they see you as 'loaded', and can't understand why you won't dish out money?

Tbh even if you were Donald Trump, you don't have to support someone. Of course it would be a great thing to do, but given what you've said about financial irresponsibility - and the siblings - I'd be inclined to say no. In the interests of good familial relations, I'd offer a once off payment, 5k to 10k max, as a direct payment to their mortgage provider. And absolutely NO after that. And make it clear at time of handing over the once off payment that all future requests will be met with NO.

I really do wonder if your partner has said more than he should have about your finances. I also hate how you have conserved your own & inherited money, and he wants to blow it on his financially less than sensible family. That's not fair on you.

I dont want to be a doomsayer - but is his attitude about money v different from yours (there does seem to be a bit of 'easy come, easy go') and is that going to bite you on the arse in the future?

Thanks for the concern -- although he hasn't actually said anything about our finances, which is part of what makes this thing so strange. I think they're just drawing the conclusion that we're loaded (comparatively to them anyway) based on the apartment we live in and the cars we drive. They don't know what either of our salaries are, nor do they know about what we have in savings. I am positive of this.

And my husband and I actually have a smilier attitude toward money -- mine as a result of my parents teaching me right, and his a result of his parents showing him what not to do. Also, like I said in the OP, IDEALLY he would like to help them out because they're his parents and he loves them, but he isn't about to just send them money each moth either cause that'd be irresponsible.

bp wrote: »

Unless the kids at home are paying something towards the home (not if in school obviously) and the parents are able to work (in their 50s I think you said), then no I wouldn't.

Maybe offer a once off payment of a credit card bill then no more.

College fees in the US are huge (I think we forget that here) so your kids may need circa 100k each for college (wopuld that bea ccurate)?

Oh and in Ireland you can give a person 3k per year tax free. So if you have your mother in law 3k and your father in law 3k and your husband did the same that would be 12k or 1k per month. Could be a coincidence but just wanted to highlight it. And 12k a year for the next 20 odd years is a lot of money

It's 100k and upwards usually. We've mentioned that to them before though actually, and they don't seem to care.

bp

Christ that is expensive....we don't really understand that here as it is technically free....well a couple of grand a year

Wompa1

He doesn't want to give either. So, are you talking about this because you think it's inappropriate that they asked? If so, I think most people agree with you. Though, I guess it depends on the persons character. Most people I know would be ashamed to ask their children for money. I know my mother felt ashamed asking me.

I've got a kid on the way now. My giving days to parents or charity are over for a while now. I'm in a similar situation to you guys. I'm making a lot of money. My partner is not making very much but loves what she does and can potentially make more down the line. We don't have a joint account. At this point, we haven't even discussed it.

Based on the outcome of this. If he does give money. Maybe you should consider separate accounts in the future.

TimeToShine

OP this is an absolute minefield for you. By all means give your opinion but in general you should keep quiet and let your husband deal with it, you'll only cause trouble for yourself otherwise.

Calhoun

Forget that just giving an opinion and leaving it to the husband, i would make sure i knew exactly what was happening joint savings as it has a big impact on the future depending on what he agrees to.

You guys have your own family and future to look after and that is where the focus should be. If however you are to help, i would not agree to anything but my own terms and not a cent would be given with two layabouts in the house.

MouseTail

I think their financial state is your business if they are asking you to ameliorate it. The priority for them should be keeping the house, and forget the €1k a month. We have a generous social welfare system here, and no one is going to starve. How much are the arrears on the mortgage, have they entered MARP (a process where you enter an agreement with your bank to deal with arrears) have they visited MABS(a free advisory and advocacy service for people with money and debt problems) I would make that a condition of helping out.

Rachiee

I think there's a big difference between a dig out and sending someone money to live on for the forseeable future. I think absolutely you should help but sending an allowance is ridiculous. if they are having problems with the mortgage I'd be more inclined to transfer funds to the mortgage account out pay off a difficult debt or just randomly pay off an enormous gas bill send some extra money at Christmas bid a monthly account for the foreseeable future is ridiculous IMO.

Xterminator

i have to say if my mum was in debt and i could help; i would want to. simple as.

i do think their are different ways of helping and that funding a lifestyle that is not appropriate would not be good for them or you. But a lump sum off a debt write down to clear a credit card or arrears on a mortgage etc would seem to be very appropriate.

to say we might need that money in the future and refuse would just seem morally wrong. And im not talking about the how they ended up in this position or why. simply you have the means to help and to refuse to do so in any shapre or form would seem mean spirited, even if you do have very valid concerns.

Tiger Mcilroy

Xterminator wrote: »

i have to say if my mum was in debt and i could help; i would want to. simple as.

i do think their are different ways of helping and that funding a lifestyle that is not appropriate would not be good for them or you. But a lump sum off a debt write down to clear a credit card or arrears on a mortgage etc would seem to be very appropriate.

to say we might need that money in the future and refuse would just seem morally wrong. And im not talking about the how they ended up in this position or why. simply you have the means to help and to refuse to do so in any shapre or form would seem mean spirited, even if you do have very valid concerns.

I cant agree with this, the op outlined the manner in which the money has been requested and they are getting blanked on the details. How is it morally wrong to throw good money after bad when faced with emotional blanckmail and demands? the OP and her partner have no responsibility for 4 adults that seem incapable of running a household between them.

Im sure the OP and her partner want to help but lets be objective and if the people demanding money wont even be open and honest then she is dead right to be cautious.

pwurple

Has your husband discussed this with his brothers? They probably know more about the financial situation.

Help them to help themselves...

If they brought it up again with me, in your husband's position, I'd be asking for all the details, just like a bank would. In their 50's there really shouldn't be much of a mortgage left at all. Unless they remortgaged for cars or holidays or an extension etc.

Can they downsize a car? Switch mortgage provider. Tidy themselves up financially?

viv147

MouseTail wrote: »

I think their financial state is your business if they are asking you to ameliorate it. The priority for them should be keeping the house, and forget the €1k a month. We have a generous social welfare system here, and no one is going to starve. How much are the arrears on the mortgage, have they entered MARP (a process where you enter an agreement with your bank to deal with arrears) have they visited MABS(a free advisory and advocacy service for people with money and debt problems) I would make that a condition of helping out.

I agree, their finances become our business once they start asking us for money ... but unfortunately they don't seem to see it that way.

And yea, that's the other thing I don't really understand. With the welfare system over there being as generous as it is ... shouldn't they (between the four of them?) realistically really be able to afford paying off their mortgage payment while still having money left over for food and other basic necessities? I don't really see why they should need our money at all, if not for all the extras like going out drinking on the weekends or whatever?

pwurple wrote: »

Has your husband discussed this with his brothers? They probably know more about the financial situation.

Help them to help themselves...

If they brought it up again with me, in your husband's position, I'd be asking for all the details, just like a bank would. In their 50's there really shouldn't be much of a mortgage left at all. Unless they remortgaged for cars or holidays or an extension etc.

Can they downsize a car? Switch mortgage provider. Tidy themselves up financially?

All his brothers know is that their parents are in a bad way, they don't know any details. (Or if they do they're not sharing.)

And I'm pretty sure as it is his parents only have one car between them. (Not sure the kind.) I'm not sure if either of his brothers have a car, and I know nothing about their mortgage provider.

pwurple

viv147 wrote: »

All his brothers know is that their parents are in a bad way, they don't know any details. (Or if they do they're not sharing.)

And I'm pretty sure as it is his parents only have one car between them. (Not sure the kind.) I'm not sure if either of his brothers have a car, and I know nothing about their mortgage provider.

Sounds like everyone is burying their heads in the sand.

An open conversation about the issues is what is required. Throwing good money after bad is rarely the solution.

This may be a helpful resource.
https://www.mabs.ie/

R.D. aka MR.D

Xterminator wrote: »

to say we might need that money in the future and refuse would just seem morally wrong. And im not talking about the how they ended up in this position or why. simply you have the means to help and to refuse to do so in any shapre or form would seem mean spirited, even if you do have very valid concerns.

Would you be saying that if they were spending all their money down the bookies, the pub or (highly unlikely for a couple in their 50's but you never know!) on cocaine or heroin? Wouldn't it be 'morally wrong' to give them the money in those cases?

To be fair, the first 2 might be realistic options especially since they seem so reluctant to explain what they need the money for or where their money has gone. However, we don't know and bizarrely the OP and her husband don't know the full facts so nobody can say for sure!

How can they be helped when they won't give the full picture?

ladygirl

There are four Fully grown adults living in that house. ALL capable of working and refusing to do so.. I would not under any circumstances give them a penny. They have the means to help themselves but choose not to..

And No OP - this is not common in Ireland, I am actually dumbfounded at how selfish and greedy his family are. The normal Irish mammy is completely the opposite - she would always want to help her children not take from them

Don't give into this demand, you are beginning your own family and should you be lucky enough to have children of your own then you can use that money to help them.

Dutchess

Having read the thread, I would definitely not hand over the money if I was in your situation, OP.

The main things that do not sit well with me are:
- The request/demand for a certain sum over a certain period. I think asking for money from people whose financial situation you do not exactly know should not include this. If I were to ask someone for help, i would appreciate whatever they suggested they could do.
- The refusal to inform you on why they need this money. Enough said. We all have the right to know where our money goes.

I do not feel like I owe my parents for anything. They chose to have me, and having children means you take on a responsibilities, including financial ones. Someone's children go on to take care of their own children. Circle of life and all that. That is not t say I would not help if it was needed and I could. but certainly not from that perspective.