Marriage dilemma

Snatchy

Hello all,

A conversation that I had with my OH last weekend has been causing her some upset in the past few days and I was wondering how best to fix the situation.

I think I've come to a conclusion on what to do but was wondering what other folks think.

Just a bit of background first - I've been with my OH for just under a year; everything happened very fast for us but all at a seemingly natural pace; nothing seemed rush and the timing of everything has been great and has worked for us. We now happily live together and are looking forward to our future. Not to say that everything is perfect - we have different views on various things and have arguments like most couples but we almost always reconcile within a few hours.

We are both in our late 20's and are well settled and successful in our respective careers.

I am convinced that she is the person that I want to have in my life forever and I think she feels the same way.

She can be, on occasion, vulnerable and insecure about some things - when she feels this way I provide her with all of the comfort and reassurance that I possibly can and generally, she feels better afterwards.

Last weekend, after a few drinks, the general topic of marriage came under discussion between the us.

From what I recall, she said that she wants to (eventually, but from what I understood, sooner rather than later) get married because to her, marriage is an eternal commitment from me (and her) that I would never leave her and it would represent a formalisation of our relationship and be a testament to endurance and all that stuff.

My reaction was along the lines of "ehmmm - I haven't given this any thought and I'm really not sure that marriage would mean all that much to me; on a practical level, I can't see how our relationship would change; don't think its a big deal etc.".

She got a bit upset about that and I just ended the conversation by saying that I really just need time to think about what marriage would mean to me before going ahead with it (or the proposal part - I think I would need to do that bit first :P).

A few days later she mentioned that she had been feeling a bit down and insecure and that the cause was mainly my view (or lack thereof) on marriage. She added that all her previous relationships (of which there was only a handful) had ended before their first anniversary and that she feels as though "nobody wants to commit to her". She said that all guys say things like "I love you; we're going to be together forever; we'll get married etc. etc." but that nobody actually ever wants to make that commitment to her. I got a bit upset because I don't like being compared to her previous bf's and again, just restated my view from the weekend and told her that I need time to think about it. I also said the obvious: "I'm different to your previous bfs; we are going to last etc.".

So, my thoughts on this are:

- I love this girl to bits and would do anything to make her happy and give her what she wants;

- if that means marrying her, then fine I'll get married even though marriage, won't change the way I feel about her or us; and

- what I think I should say to her is that I want to make her happy and we will get married but before we do, she needs to get to the place where she understands and trusts in our relationship enough to realise that putting a ring on a finger and having a party isn't going to give it any more or less security than it already has; our relationship is an institution, the dynamics, strengths and weaknesses of which will remain unchanged despite the change in label. I have faith in our relationship enduring outside of the realm of any label or societally conforming enterprise and I would like her to come to share this view. Then we can get married.

Without referring to my OH as a needy, insecure girl who wants to "rush me to get married" (which is untrue because in the midst of our discussion on this, she fully admitted that her desire for marriage was selfish and she admitted to being insecure about it and that her intention is not to "rush" me), what are people's thoughts on this?

Enlighten an ignorant fella.

Thanks in advance guys

Diziet

I'd say that marriage is a public commitment and it clearly does make a difference to your girlfriend. Society views marriage the same way. So, while it is not essential to marry someone in order to have commitment, the public statement is a powerful one.

Wanting to be married is not necessarily insecurity, either. She stated what she wants in the long term, and got worried when what she stated was not aligned with your feelings on the matter. If you are late 20s and in a committed relationship, then marriage is a reasonable next step, there is nothing needy about that.

Exclamation Marc

Firstly, never call it a "party" in her presence

I have to say that I'm truly baffled that she admitted that her wanting to get married was selfish.

Snatchy wrote: »

I have faith in our relationship enduring outside of the realm of any label or societally conforming enterprise and I would like her to come to share this view. Then we can get married.

This is an extremely selfish view to have I'm sorry. If someone said to this me, I'd either laugh at them or tell them to get f'd. You don't have to share the exact same view to get married and to hold back on marriage and deny her a wedding day until you can get some sort of affirmation that your opinion is the correct one is just way out of line. You say you'd do anything for this girl, yet you won't do something that you've admitted means nothing to you unless she admits marriage means f-all. Is there anything to gain from that? Why not just let her enjoy it? It's clearly something she wants.

If marriage means nothing to you and your relationship is going to go the distance , just suck it up and put a smile on your face down the line. Give the girl the day she wants. It clearly means nothing more to you than spending some money on a 'party' and a ring but it clearly means a lot to her. It'd be different if you were viciously anti-religious and in that case I'd say it could be a huge stumbling block, but you're just trying to prove a moot point.

Most girls and guys view marriage as the next step in a long-term committed relationship. It's probably a long time away for you as you're only together a year, but don't be so harsh on her. You don't have to suddenly start pining for a wife, but don't force her to change her mind on it.

nonsense ^

in a balanced, fair and stable relationship you shouldn't feel forced into something as unnecessary as a wedding before your partner trusts you or that relationship

Exclamation Marc

Deleted User wrote: »

nonsense ^

in a balanced, fair and stable relationship you shouldn't feel forced into something as unnecessary as a wedding before your partner trusts you or that relationship

Yet its ok for him to demand that his girlfriend change her opinions on marriage before he agrees to marry her?

He's not bothered with it, says it means nothing to him but he'll do it once she admits that he's right. Can he not just do it without having her change her mind? He's not hell-bent against it, just wants her to admit her views on it are wrong before he does it. Just seems a bit petty really.

If he said he had a serious problem with religion, the catholic church, marriage etc, fair enough, but he just thinks nothing of it.

Dial Hard

Deleted User wrote:

in a balanced, fair and stable relationship you shouldn't feel forced into something as unnecessary as a wedding before your partner trusts you or that relationship

You don't have to have a wedding to get married, you know.

njs030

Manufactured Miracle wrote: »

Yet its ok for him to demand that his girlfriend change her opinions on marriage before he agrees to marry her?

He's not bothered with it, says it means nothing to him but he'll do it once she admits that he's right. Can he not just do it without having her change her mind? He's not hell-bent against it, just wants her to admit her views on it are wrong before he does it. Just seems a bit petty really.

If he said he had a serious problem with religion, the catholic church, marriage etc, fair enough, but he just thinks nothing of it.

I took it to mean he wants her to understand it won't change anything, that with or without a wedding he will feel exactly the same and so will she.
It sounds as if ops girlfriend thinks she's going to wake up the day after the wedding feeling secure and content and he's right to be concerned because that's something that comes from inside her not from a ring and piece of paper.
Marriage isn't a magic solution, is no more secure than pre-marriage since divorce was legalised even though divorce takes 4 years the marriage can be ended at anytime when one person walks away. It needs 2 people to make it work.

Dial Hard

Dial Hard wrote: »

You don't have to have a wedding to get married, you know.

fully agree. would go that way myself, purely to sort out legalities etc. is it an option here?

Exclamation Marc

notjustsweet wrote: »

I took it to mean he wants her to understand it won't change anything, that with or without a wedding he will feel exactly the same and so will she.
It sounds as if ops girlfriend thinks she's going to wake up the day after the wedding feeling secure and content and he's right to be concerned because that's something that comes from inside her not from a ring and piece of paper.
Marriage isn't a magic solution, is no more secure than pre-marriage since divorce was legalised even though divorce takes 4 years the marriage can be ended at anytime when one person walks away. It needs 2 people to make it work.

Well I think I read it it to mean something else, but if the OP means it the way you're setting it out, then fair enough I completely agree

It just read to me like "I don't care about marriage, I'll do it if you want as it doesn't bother, but you must agree that my opinions on marriage are correct".

If it is a case that she purely wants it for some sort of relationship stabiliser, then I completely agree with you.

Snatchy

notjustsweet wrote: »

I took it to mean he wants her to understand it won't change anything, that with or without a wedding he will feel exactly the same and so will she.
It sounds as if ops girlfriend thinks she's going to wake up the day after the wedding feeling secure and content and he's right to be concerned because that's something that comes from inside her not from a ring and piece of paper.
Marriage isn't a magic solution, is no more secure than pre-marriage since divorce was legalised even though divorce takes 4 years the marriage can be ended at anytime when one person walks away. It needs 2 people to make it work.

OP here - that is exactly what I meant. Thank you

CaraMay

Did she want to marry all these guys who wouldn't commit to her op? If so, my only concern is that she just wants to get hitched - to anyone.

R.D. aka MR.D

Would it really not change how you feel? Not one tiny bit?

I'm only asking because to be honest it seems like it's a lot easier for people to walk away from a long term relationship than a marriage. For example, when people come on here, the advice to married people is usually more along the lines of 'work on your marriage' rather than a knee jerk 'break up'. Society does view marriage differently and I wonder if you would too. The fact that you've made it all legal and made a declaration to friends in family (even if it's just a phonecall to say you guys got married down at the registry office)

If you said the things to me that you want to say about 'getting to a place' and so on. I'd be really hurt. I'd feel like you were trying to manipulate me into feeling the 'right' way.
I'd be especially annoyed if you made it seem like you were marrying me to do me some huge favour. How depressing!

If you don't want to marry her, you don't want to marry her.

Personally, I'd give it some time. Wait a few years and see how you feel then.

OneOfThem

Sounds like she just had a little internal panic due to her insecurities. I reckon just keep reassuring her of your commitment, and insure that she understands clearly that you wanting her to feel secure in the relationship in and of itself, rather than that being dependant on marriage, is important to you, and that you feel it's important for the relationship, so she isn't misinterpreting it in the way the previous poster did (or any other way). Tell her that you would like the opportunity to help build that strength of foundation for the relationship with her. Then follow through on that. It sounds like once she gets over the initial panic she'll come around.

kylith

CaraMay wrote: »

Did she want to marry all these guys who wouldn't commit to her op? If so, my only concern is that she just wants to get hitched - to anyone.

This is what would concern me also, especially since you really haven't been together very long. You can't really know someone after a year, you haven't even been through a 'proper' Christmas together, and as they say 'marry in haste, repent at leisure'. You're in your 20s, no-one is terminally ill; there is no great rush to get married. She sounds to me like she is desperate for you to prove you love her by getting married but I would agree with you - marriage won't make you love her any more, and rushing into a commitment like that could leave you in financial trouble if it breaks down, which is more likely since you've been together a relatively short time.

Speak to her about long-term plans and where marriage and a family fits into your 5-year plan: what you want to have achieved, as a couple, before tying the knot. Hopefully seeing that you are committed to her and that long-term commitment is part of your plan for the future will help her calm down a bit.

Barely There

She's in her late-20's, so presumably doesn't want to be wasting time with someone who doesn't want to settle down and have kids over the next few years.

That's pretty understandable given the biology at play.

While you mightn't view marriage as all that important, she obviously does and want's to know you're committed to the idea in the medium future.

In the immortal words of Beyoncé, 'If you like it, put a ring on it'.

zeffabelli

She wants the certainty that comes with marriage. If you handed me the argument you handed her is have to ask, well if you are that certain then what's the problem?

No matter what way you paint it marriage is s public statement which connects you to family and community. If you want to stay private, that's fine, but it's better to be real about these things and what they mean.

And if you don't then she has every right to consider herself still on the market.

beks101

It sounds like she's just testing the waters, now that you've been together long enough to start thinking about the future, and freaking out because it sounds like you might not be on the same page. All the more poignant given her age is one where women generally start to think about these things.

I don't think the woman can be blamed for wanting to get married and settle down and all that down the line. Ireland is still very much a conservative society where that is encouraged, it happens all around you once you're mid-20s and beyond, and regardless of societal norms, maybe it's just something she envisages in her future. It's totally her right to question you and see where you stand on it, as much as it is your right to feel the way you do.

The real question is, how much are you both willing to compromise to keep each other happy? If it's "just a big party" to you, and yet you love her and want to be with her; and she views it as a symbol of your everlasting commitment to each other - are you willing to consider marrying this woman down the line?

It doesn't have to be tomorrow or next week: just something that you're open to and will set as a 'next step' once you've a bit more mileage in the relationship. In turn, she could perhaps agree to try to loosen up and take the pressure off for the next year or two, while you get to know and trust each other more without focusing on this "end goal" to the detriment of your relationship.