EPA says Volkswagen cheated on emissions with 482,000 diesel cars

gctest50

BoatMad wrote: »

...........

Lets recap for those who have forgotten the salient issues
..........

i couldn't care less what VW did - the issue now is " what will the update do to the fuel economy/power delivery "

BoatMad wrote: »

Originally Posted by gctest50
a few lines added to a car insurance application sorts that :

Car insurances dont get to that level of detail , so thats not happening -- ever

..........

yet

straight from https://www.chill.ie/blog/insuring-a-modified-car/ :

If you are planning on insuring a modified car or are about to modify your current vehicle in any way then you need to tell your insurer straight away. If any modifications have been made to your car either by you or a previous owner then this will impact on the cost of your cover.

The insurer may request proof that the modifications were carried out professionally and that they were subsequently tested and don’t impact the safe use of the vehicle.

carried out professionally


and that they were subsequently tested !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When you get a quote for your car insurance, or are looking for a renewal quote, one of the questions you will be asked by the insurer is has your car been modified in any way?

Take a look at the following list and see if you have done any of the following to your vehicle, private or commercial, over the last year to help improve its performance or appearance?

• Replaced the exhaust system. (passenger vehicle)
• Upgraded wheel size. (passenger vehicle)
  
• Chipped engine. (passenger vehicle) .<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
• New sound system installed. (passenger vehicle)
  
• Modifying the vehicles fuel system. (passenger vehicle) .<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
• Lowering / raising the vehicle. (passenger vehicle)
• Added tinted windows. (passenger vehicle)
• Altered the body work, steps or exit. (commercial passenger vehicle)
• Removed seating. (passenger vehicle)
• Modified the chassis ( commercial goods vehicle)

https://www.chill.ie/blog/insuring-a-modified-car/

please share if you know more than them

.

BoatMad

gctest50 wrote: »

yet

straight from https://www.chill.ie/blog/insuring-a-modified-car/ :





carried out professionally




please share if you know more than them

.

These are to stop YOU carrying out modifications, not the people that designed the car in the first place. VW are the professionals , you are not ( nor is any local engineer or mechanic).

If VW say its a manufacturers modification, then it is a professional one

My argument was , the fact that there will not be and is not a need to have the upgrade done to the car, its not a safety issue,

gctest50

BoatMad wrote: »

These are to stop YOU carrying out modifications, not the people that designed the car in the first place.

VW are the professionals , you are not ( nor is any local engineer or mechanic).

If VW say its a manufacturers modification, then it is a professional one
...........................

Exactly.

And no-one only professionals should be carrying out modifications

yes ?

BoatMad

gctest50 wrote: »

Exactly.

And no-one only professionals should be carrying out modifications

yes ?

of course, in practice the only people that can design in modifications like this are the people that designed the car in the first place.

as to what those mods are thats a matter of much mirth and confusion imho

Toyotafanboi

BoatMad wrote: »

This is utter bull sh!ittery quite frankly

The ICCT tests of on-road production of NOX emissions , did not identify VW as the greatest producer of NOx, it made the cmains that in general all, cars were producing 7-20 times more NoX then shown in the NEDC test

VW just were the ones that got caught in the USA. ( by a peculiar round about way )


the ICCT were campaigning that the NEDC test was and is clearly unsuited for the purposes of controlling NOx emissions in Europe. This is well known , and why the EU is replacing it with the Worldwide harmonized light vehicles test procedure ( WLTP). which while still a lab test , has a greater correlation with real-road situations

currently european carmakers are arguing for a 1.7 compliance factor for WLTP or EURO 6 Modified tests , so that they can exceed treat limits by nearly a factor of two and still pass. sort of like saying a D in the leaving is actually classed as an A

The fact is ALL diesels are emitting way too much NOx, not just VW

Ah calm down now, you call my post utter bull**** then just go off on your own tangent barely referencing anything I said at all.

Is NoX not a contributer to ill health and death in humans?

Are VW not trying to play down the whole thing?

That's all I was saying. Sure others may be at it, but the thread topic is relating to VW's.

Special Circumstances

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Ah calm down now, you call my post utter bull**** then just go off on your own tangent barely referencing anything I said at all.

Is NoX not a contributer to ill health and death in humans?

Are VW not trying to play down the whole thing?

That's all I was saying. Sure others may be at it, but the thread topic is relating to VW's.

Agreed.
To me it seems like an open secret that manufacturers are very "wink wink nudge nudge cough cough there's your money" with the testers. Nobody seems to care as long as these cars can be sold cheaply as "clean" to cute hoors who will disable every emissions device they can as soon as they can.

But VW couldn't even build an engine that would pass the lax "wink wink" regime. They weren't even in the same ballpark, and that is why the attention is on them.
They had to lie, cheat and stonewall as long as they could. Can you imagine what these things are emitting once they get into the hands of the "shur tid onlaay shmoke lad, nedder hurt anyone" brigade.

A triumph of marketing. "Clean diesel" versus science. Although I would have thought common science would have been enough for most people

5W30

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Agreed.
To me it seems like an open secret that manufacturers are very "wink wink nudge nudge cough cough there's your money" with the testers. Nobody seems to care as long as these cars can be sold cheaply as "clean" to cute hoors who will disable every emissions device they can as soon as they can.

But VW couldn't even build an engine that would pass the lax "wink wink" regime. They weren't even in the same ballpark, and that is why the attention is on them.
They had to lie, cheat and stonewall as long as they could. Can you imagine what these things are emitting once they get into the hands of the "shur tid onlaay shmoke lad, nedder hurt anyone" brigade.

A triumph of marketing. "Clean diesel" versus science. Although I would have thought common science would have been enough for most people

Can't wait to read the next thread where someone says "shuuure dem tdi engines are the best built, Toyota me hole"

Most VAG owners seem to fail to comprehend that they were sold a bucket of ****e. It's like buying an NCT cert on DoneDeal and claiming it's legit.

Gazzmonkey

shuuure dem tdi engines are the best built, Toyota me hole

everlast75

5W30 wrote: »

Can't wait to read the next thread where someone says "shuuure dem tdi engines are the best built, Toyota me hole"

Most VAG owners seem to fail to comprehend that they were sold a bucket of ****e. It's like buying an NCT cert on DoneDeal and claiming it's legit.

And that to me is the most ridiculous hyperbole I've read so far on this entire thread... and that's saying something.

I've mine since May and am extremely happy with it. The fuel efficiency, quality of drive, style and repayments are all excellent.

There's an issue with the NOx gases - to date it hasn't affected me in the least. I've checked and my engine is not part of the recall.

The brand of VAG is tarnished no doubt, so maybe 10% of potential buyers might not go with them now, but it will come out that they are all at it.

What I find truly hilarious is to watch all the people who clearly hate diesel and/or VAG proclaim their ruin as a result of this.

Special Circumstances

There's an issue with the companies morals, ethics and reputation - but shur I've got my cheap tax and that's all that matters
/* shakes inhaler... hoooosh hooosh */ Be grand lads, nothing to see here. We all partied.

BoatMad

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Agreed.
To me it seems like an open secret that manufacturers are very "wink wink nudge nudge cough cough there's your money" with the testers. Nobody seems to care as long as these cars can be sold cheaply as "clean" to cute hoors who will disable every emissions device they can as soon as they can.

But VW couldn't even build an engine that would pass the lax "wink wink" regime. They weren't even in the same ballpark, and that is why the attention is on them.
They had to lie, cheat and stonewall as long as they could. Can you imagine what these things are emitting once they get into the hands of the "shur tid onlaay shmoke lad, nedder hurt anyone" brigade.

A triumph of marketing. "Clean diesel" versus science. Although I would have thought common science would have been enough for most people

are you referring to the US EPA tests or EU NEDC as they have very different levels of NOx

As far as we know no one ( i.e. the testing houses ) has so far claimed that VW gamed the tests in Europe and the cars here didn't conform.

Toyotafanboi

everlast75 wrote: »

I've mine since May and am extremely happy with it. The fuel efficiency, quality of drive, style and repayments are all excellent.

The image and repayments. The only thing most new VW buyers care about.

What I find hilarious is the only people in this thread who are trying to play this down are VW owners. Which is typical.

I wouldn't be an active diesel hater, although I dont particularly enjoy it in my own vehicles. The "proclamation of VW's demise" is looking to be factually correct. Huge dip in share share values has already happened, some countries applied bans on the sale of affected vehicles, a certain percentage of customers will also now be put off purchasing a future VAG and it's going to cost billions for the recalls to be completed.

None of these are good for a company.

BoatMad

Most VAG owners seem to fail to comprehend that they were sold a bucket of ****e. It's like buying an NCT cert on DoneDeal and claiming it's legit.

Wow , just WOW

BoatMad

gctest50 wrote: »

do you think irish engineers ( actual ones ) are inferior in some way ?

.

all engineers with the exception of those that designed it are inferior, unless they have access to ALL the design documentation and manufacturing data

5W30

BoatMad wrote: »

Wow , just WOW

"Chape tax laaad"

"I won't go for the software fix cuz shuuure they'll get rid of the powwwwer to save the earth"

Das Auto

BoatMad

5W30 wrote: »

"Chape tax laaad"

"I won't go for the software fix cuz shuuure they'll get rid of the powwwwer to save the earth"

Das Auto

but what has Tax ( which is on C02 emissions ) got to do with NOx which is what VW are embroiled in the USA

5W30

BoatMad wrote: »

but what has Tax ( which is on C02 emissions ) got to do with NOx which is what VW are embroiled in the USA

The fact that people don't care about the NOx outputs or fixing them as long as the tax is cheap and the performance doesn't change.

Toyotafanboi

BoatMad wrote: »

but what has Tax ( which is on C02 emissions ) got to do with NOx which is what VW are embroiled in the USA

He's saying that people dont care about NoX being bad for their health or the company lying to it's customers so long as the tax stays cheap. Seems to be fairly in keeping with owners on this thread too.

BoatMad

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

He's saying that people dont care about NoX being bad for their health or the company lying to it's customers so long as the tax stays cheap. Seems to be fairly in keeping with owners on this thread too.

but but car tax has nothing to do with NOx, ?????

Gazzmonkey

Its amusing to see some people are genuinely offended if you drive a diesel VAG nowadays

Makes me love mine even more, to those that don't like it.... you can suck my NOx :cool:

Special Circumstances

I reckon there's at least three people with access to the whatever computer Boatmad is logged in under. Just one of the mad mad things going on in this thread.

5W30

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

Its amusing to see some people are genuinely offended if you drive a diesel VAG nowadays

Makes me love mine even more, to those that don't like it.... you can suck my NOx :cool:

Nobody is offended that you drive a diesel VAG.

What is offending is that people like you don't give a fcuk.

BoatMad

Special Circumstances wrote: »

I reckon there's at least three people with access to the whatever computer Boatmad is logged in under. Just one of the mad mad things going on in this thread.

I'm on a Mac , we're three times more productive that WinDoze users:pac:

mickdw

BoatMad wrote: »

I'm on a Mac , we're three times more productive that WinDoze users:pac:

Nah. I never found the staff in vw hq very productive. I'd say there are 5 people at least covering this.

BoatMad

5W30 wrote: »

Nobody is offended that you drive a diesel VAG.

What is offending is that people like you don't give a fcuk.

why should they , its not that their VW car is any different to any other diesel, on the road, and its all out of their hands anyway

Toyotafanboi

BoatMad wrote: »

but but car tax has nothing to do with NOx, ?????

I know !!!!!

He was just saying cheap tax is all people want! They don't care that the car is more carcinogenic than smoking 20 a day as long as the tax stays cheap owners are happy to keep the going.

BoatMad

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

I know !!!!!

He was just saying cheap tax is all people want! They don't care that the car is more carcinogenic than smoking 20 a day as long as the tax stays cheap owners are happy to keep the going.

sounds reasonable

Dermo123

Anyone remember the Intel saga in 1994. The keyrings intel made with the defective chips had a very apt logo.

everlast75

Special Circumstances wrote: »

There's an issue with the companies morals, ethics and reputation - but shur I've got my cheap tax and that's all that matters
/* shakes inhaler... hoooosh hooosh */ Be grand lads, nothing to see here. We all partied.

You said it was a bucket of ****e.

I replied you that from my perspective it isn't and explained why.

You then change the topic to cheap car tax? How about telling my why the car is a bucket of ****e, akin to a 250e Micra on Gumtree, which properly fits that description.

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

The image and repayments. The only thing most new VW buyers care about.

What I find hilarious is the only people in this thread who are trying to play this down are VW owners. Which is typical.

I wouldn't be an active diesel hater, although I dont particularly enjoy it in my own vehicles. The "proclamation of VW's demise" is looking to be factually correct. Huge dip in share share values has already happened, some countries applied bans on the sale of affected vehicles, a certain percentage of customers will also now be put off purchasing a future VAG and it's going to cost billions for the recalls to be completed.

None of these are good for a company.

I already said their reputation was tarnished. I also said people will be put off buying them.

I believe that will be overcome, but I'm not a professor in economics and neither are you, so its just our view.

Of course we are worried about image and repayments. We just made a 20, 30 or 40k investment - who the F*** would not be concerned!? To trivialize or downplay that as being a bad thing is nonsense. You and everybody else would be exactly the same.

What I have a problem with is people with obvious disposition to disliking the brand and/or the fuel gloating on here and stating with utmost certainty that anyone with one is banjaxed and the company will go under. So, I tend to discount those that have a vested interest. I would prefer to rely on the facts and await the outcome.

5W30

everlast75 wrote: »

How about telling my why the car is a bucket of ****e, akin to a 250e Micra on Gumtree, which properly fits that description.

A 250 euro Micra is far from a bucket of ****e to be fair to Nissan.