Web Summit quits Dublin

seamus

Strumms wrote: »

Do you expect Web Summit to start ringing around hotels ?

Yes?

Also do you expect the IRFU just to organize the world cup bid without the support of the government or just do everything on their own ?

Seriously? The rugby world cup is like holding 60 Web Summits in six weeks across an entire country, sometimes across different countries. The IRFU is also a public body acting in the public interest.

The Web Summit is a private company acting only in its own interests. That it does bring some benefit to the local economy is nice, but that's a matter for local government, not national.

Dyr

Strumms wrote: »

He was looking for the support of the Government. Not help with it and not for people to do it for him. That support was offered from a multitude of other governments. Do you know anything about event planning ? Do you expect Web Summit to start ringing around hotels ? Also do you expect the IRFU just to organize the world cup bid without the support of the government or just do everything on their own ? With government support and backing it would have brought all stakeholders together and the issues would have been easily solved had there been the will. The communication from the office of the Taoiseach and lack there of it proves that there really wasn't.

Do you know anything about event planning?

The Corinthian

CatFromHue wrote: »

I kinda get the feeling that they were planning on leaving anyway

Meh. PR spin. Move along. Move along.

brooke 2

newacc2015 wrote: »

It's nothing to do with the WiFi. They wanted a country that would throw money at the event. They were expecting authorities here to write them a cheque for hosting the summit in Dublin. It mentions in the article about financial incentives.

Personally I like to see that the government didn't contribute to it. Its extremely rare that contributions to these events bring any return

Paddy Cosgrove comes across as an entitled bully. I have family in the IT industry who are totally underwhelmed by him. Various commentators in the media were not at all put out at his move to Lisbon - "on your bike" was the general message coming from them. A few mentioned the Ploughing Championship which was on at the same time and brought in €250m+. This has been run for years by a woman who is now in her sprightly eighties and has never been heard to make primadonna demands as this Cosgrove upstart seems to be in the habit of doing. His latest attempts to 'shame' the government into spending our taxes on entertaining/transporting people who, AFAIK, have to pay up to €700 to participate in his summit, do not impress me, at all, at all!! Wonder how he got on in Lisbon? Did the hotels reduce their prices for him??

jonasjones

grundie wrote: »

I don't think this helps Mr Cosgraves case.

He's asking people at ministerial level to help him with stuff that he really should be dealing with himself.

Traffic issues? Speak to the Guards just like the FAI, GAA would do when planning a big game.

Public transport issues? Speak to CIE or private operators and be willing splash the cash to lay on extra services.

WiFi issues? Nothing to do with the government.

Hotels? Do what any other big conference organiser would do and negotiate competitive prices at specially selected hotels. Refuse to list any hotel on the summit website if they refuse to agree not to raise prices for the conference.

I read it as "I have all these problems that I really should be dealing with, but I want you to wave a magic wand and make them go away"

In that case the government representative should have told him as much, rather than stringing him along as long as he did. I don't have a dog in this fight, but the manner in which business was conducted by the government, failing to acknowledge or respond to communication, is not acceptable. You wouldn't get away with this in private industry and I'd expect much better from the office of the Taoiseach.

SEPT 23 1989

Does any other exhibition expect this sort of royal treatment?

VinLieger

The Corinthian wrote: »

Meh. PR spin. Move along. Move along.

Going off their very quiet yet significant letting go of employees after last years summit it's really not surprising, paddy has little loyalty to anyone but himself but that's fine he's running a private business however the saint paddy bringer of the web summit and Ireland's salvation image some people like to portray needs to be done away with

grundie

Strumms wrote: »

He was looking for the support of the Government. Not help with it and not for people to do it for him. That support was offered from a multitude of other governments. Do you know anything about event planning ? Do you expect Web Summit to start ringing around hotels ? Also do you expect the IRFU just to organize the world cup bid without the support of the government or just do everything on their own ? With government support and backing it would have brought all stakeholders together and the issues would have been easily solved had there been the will. The communication from the office of the Taoiseach and lack there of it proves that there really wasn't.

Actually I do know about event planning. I've helped plan a few big conventions including a big literary convention that had 1000 attendees from all around the world.

It is your event so you have to take on the planning burden. Yes, you do have to go round calling hotels. Failte Ireland might help with providing lists and making introductions, but you still have to do the leg work. Need transport? Sort it out yourself. Never had to deal with traffic issues, but I'm sure speaking to the Garda Traffic Corp would sort that out.

The government has very little power to help in the short term (less than five years). In fact I believe they might actually be prevented from interfering in short terms issues such as these. Can a government minister order Transport for Ireland/CIE to provide extra transport for a single event? Nope. Can a minister order the RDS to upgrade their venue. Nope. Can they control hotel prices? Nope. What ministers can do is offer to help by drafting laws and strategies to make things better for all conference organisers in the long term.

All the communications listed are from August onwards and they read as "fix these problems or we move". They took ministers by surprise. Maybe if they said that they were minded to move away in the short term but would like to work with the government to developing a long terms strategy so they could return in few years, then maybe it wouldn't sound like blackmail.

The Rugby World Cup and is years away and if we get it then the government will spend the first year or two of planning by enacting the legislation needed to support it. After that the RWC planning company will take on the burden of planning and the government will be there to simply say well done and try and take some of the credit.

The Corinthian

VinLieger wrote: »

Going off their very quiet yet significant letting go of employees after last years summit it's really not surprising, paddy has little loyalty to anyone but himself but that's fine he's running a private business however the saint paddy bringer of the web summit and Ireland's salvation image some people like to portray needs to be done away with

Honestly, I think I may have met him once, but I don't know him so really can't comment on his character.

Of the event he organizes, I've already said that it's really only of use to those from large firms looking for a junket. Commercially, even where it comes to the talks, it's a waste of time and money, IMHO. IT is full of these kind of events.

He's an event organizer. That means it's 90% spin and it's likely that blaming the government or infrastructure is part of the spin. This is not to say that infrastructure in Dublin is not appalling, but it's good PR to go out on this note for him and, lets face it, were it not, we'd not be discussing it.

grundie

jonasjones wrote: »

In that case the government representative should have told him as much, rather than stringing him along as long as he did. I don't have a dog in this fight, but the manner in which business was conducted by the government, failing to acknowledge or respond to communication, is not acceptable. You wouldn't get away with this in private industry and I'd expect much better from the office of the Taoiseach.

Things move slowly at that level of government. Waiting a few weeks for a response, even if you are a VIP, should not be seen as unusual.

brooke 2

FionnK86 wrote: »

Not a loss to the bus company I worked for. Last year we were asked to provide transport to the event, in return for advertisement without any offer of financial payment to the company. It was turned down of course.

Cosgrove looking for another freebie? Quelle surprise!!

CatFromHue

Appendix 3 and 4, about meetings with the Dublin City Council for the end of May, never seem to be addressed in the emails between Paddy and The Office of the Taoiseach. I wonder what happened to them as he mentions on 3 Sep

We've never succeeded in getting a single meeting with Dublin's City Manager, nor been invited
to one

I know he mentions a few times that he's not looking for a penny but that wish list would cost alot I'd imagine!

Appendix 3 - List of Asks developed by WS for Dublin City Council convened Action
Group meeting for relevant stakeholders on May 29 2015
Dublin Web Summit - Dublin City Council
Wish List
Web Summit Nov 3-5, 2015

Asks Granted Previously
1. Suspension of parking permission on the perimeter roads for the duration of the
build and break of the Summit events in Herbert Park. Waive associated fees.
2. Access to banners around Dublin City to promote the event.

New Asks
1. Anglesea Road closed to allow attendees free access between venues for the days
of the event. As per the RDS Horse Show.
2. Dedicated shuttle buses provided by Dublin Bus for Web Summit attendees at peak times in the morning and evenings, to and from the RDS/City Centre, circulating to key hotels. Agree appropriate bus branding.
3. Temporary Dublin bike stations.
4. Access to the event space within Herbert Park and, in addition, to the (non-event space) Playing Fields located closest to Anglesea Rd. We would look to build marquees on these and reinstate the ground after insofar as we reasonably can
15th October 2015
34
5. Grant road closures for Dame Court, South William Street and Fade Street for parts of our Night Summit. Waive associated fees.
6. Grant us suspension of parking permission on the above roads for the duration of the road closures. Waive associated fees.
7. Entrance to city venues - complimentary rental of venues such as City Hall and Wood Quay. Venues within the City.
8. City Centre branding for Web Summit for two weeks leading up to event and during

Outside direct responsibility
1. Access to Garda Escort services for specific VIPs at specified times during the event. Estimated 10 such VIPs during the event. Movement, not security.
2. Airport registration of all attendees. Large space required for two/three days before the event and during the event.
3. Hotel agreement - suggested voluntary anti-gouging code limiting differential from usual pricing scales.
4. Leap Cards for all attendees for their stay in the City

brooke 2

murpho999 wrote: »

Disagree with this, go to a convention in the likes of Paris, Rome, Madrid etc you'll pay through the nose for a hotel.

You forgot Cardiff!

brooke 2

Bambi wrote: »

That's their modus operandi for pretty much everything. I'm sure the portugese are more amenable to the something-for-nothing business model

+100

Raging_Ninja

CatFromHue wrote: »

Appendix 3 and 4, about meetings with the Dublin City Council for the end of May, never seem to be addressed in the emails between Paddy and The Office of the Taoiseach. I wonder what happened to them as he mentions on 3 Sep



I know he mentions a few times that he's not looking for a penny but that wish list would cost alot I'd imagine!

"List of Asks"? "Asks"? They're fúcking requests ffs.

seamus

Raging_Ninja wrote: »

"List of Asks"? "Asks"? They're fúcking requests ffs.

"Request" implies that you'll get something in return, or that you're otherwise demanding something. "Ask" is a fancy business word for "favour", but you're not allowed ask for favours in business.

Raging_Ninja

seamus wrote: »

"Request" implies that you'll get something in return, or that you're otherwise demanding something. "Ask" is a fancy business word for "favour", but you're not allowed ask for favours in business.

That angers me as much as the substitution of the word "revert" for "reply" , which is equally stupid.

hardCopy

seamus wrote: »

"Request" implies that you'll get something in return, or that you're otherwise demanding something. "Ask" is a fancy business word for "favour", but you're not allowed ask for favours in business.

"Demand" might be a better word.

CatFromHue

One of the comments on the linked Web Summit page

Paddy Murray · Journalist at Sunday World
No mention anywhere of the €1m plus given by the Portuguese government?

brooke 2

deisedude wrote: »

I know a few people who have worked for Paddy and while they are all in agreement he is a very smart man they all said he was a nightmare to work for.

His tactics seem to be to scare and intimidate suppliers to drive the price down until he gets his way. Looking for money from the government by threatening to leave Ireand eventhough his private event is raking in cash is just the latest example in a long list.

I've attended Web Summit and the conference is all style over substance. I attended for the markting sessions and I took absolutely nothing of value from last years event. Sales pitches and buzz words were the order of the day.

Having worked for and attended international events across a number of different countries its not uncommon for the wifi to go down when thousands of nerds using multiple devices try to access it at the same time. However that doesn't excuse throwing your toys out of the pram, going on stage and complaining that its someone elses fault

Talking about it on Hook now. 'Appalled at the tone of the emails sent by Cosgrove to the government'!!

Shane Coleman giving it socks!!

PARlance

I'm glad this is going to backfire on him. People see through the bullsh*t Paddy.

Leaking confidential government papers is probably on a level of stupidity closely matched by not ensuring they had no wifi issues last year.

Dyr

Raging_Ninja wrote: »

That angers me as much as the substitution of the word "revert" for "reply" , which is equally stupid.

Can I touch base offline with our goys and revert back to you on that one?

sonny.knowles

Raging_Ninja wrote: »

"List of Asks"? "Asks"? They're fúcking requests ffs.

Ask me bo**ix.

ThisRegard

Paddy got too greedy and big headed. He went cheap on the WiFi in the RDS and is trying to deflect his own failings on to the government. And he expected the government to temporarily introduce price controls on to hotels.

He charges a fortune for tickets but won't invest himself.

He's deluded to blame the government.

He was on Matt Cooper earlier and came across very badly. When asked if he went the cheapo option with the WiFi he stuttered, mumbled and waffled, the obvious implication that he did. Entitled gob****e.

5rtytry56

ThisRegard wrote: »

Paddy got too greedy and big headed. He went cheap on the WiFi in the RDS

Cheap and Nasty :mad::pac::(:mad::(

wowy

In his correspondence, Paddy frequently says that Web Summit "aren't looking for a penny". In Appendix 2 of the docs (Bid Document), the first section is all about Host Contributions (while not a direct payment to Web Summit, these are still a cost to the host city/local authority), but interestingly point 5 is "Financial Contribution" - "a contribution of €100 per foreign attendee from the city". That sure looks to me like looking for money. He might want to have read that document before assuring everyone that he wasn't looking for any money.

In the "Asks" document (Appendix 3), Web Summit are then looking for various fees from their Asks (requests/demands) to be waived. Again, that strictly speaking isn't asking for money, but it's the same outcome.

Some of the Asks they wanted are very demanding; complimentary use of City Hall & Wood Quay, Garda escorts for VIP guests, closure and removal of parking from Dame Court, Fade Street & South William Street & associated fees to be waived (retailers and rates payers on these streets can't even get that having been campaigning for years, but Web Summit thinks that they can demand that? The arrogance...)

Web Summit has just gotten too big for Dublin. Rather than simply announce that they have outgrown Dublin and move on elsewhere to chase greater profits (and so lose goodwill), this is great spin to lay the fault at everyone else (not that Nick Reddy was blameless, he should have responded to emails sooner with proper replies; however, why is the Department of the Taoiseach even being involved?), and say that they have no choice but to leave Dublin.

But anyway, point is that it's all lies about "Not looking for a penny".

PARlance

ThisRegard wrote: »

Paddy got too greedy and big headed. He went cheap on the WiFi in the RDS and is trying to deflect his on failings on to the government. And he expected the government to temporarily introduce price controls on to hotels.

He charges a fortune for tickets but won't invest himself.

He's deluded to blame the government.

He was on Matt Cooper earlier and came across very badly. When asked if he went the cheapo option with the WiFi he stuttered, mumbled and waffled, the obvious implication that he did. Entitled gob****e.

Was listening to it too, thought Cooper went fairly easy on him but he still managed to come across very poorly.

His "story" doesn't stack up at all.

The wifi and hotels aren't the governments problem, they (Gov) made it quite clear to him it wasn't. He skimped on the wifi and was left with egg on his face. Expecting hotels to reduce his rate when he expects delegates to pay ~€1,000 to attend, well that's just a bit Irish, Paddy.

The traffic and transport aren't the Gov's issue either, not directly. You talk to they relevant bodies, but the only problem with that is that they expect you to pay for it... Talking to the Government = trying to get them all for free.

He started by saying he issued the release in the interest of full transparency... releasing emails from Aug-Sept isn't the full story. Grandstanding of the highest order. He closed by saying/stressing that all issues were only minor ones... probably the only bit of real truth in the interview. It's a pity the Gov have to be seen to be the bigger person in this.

CatFromHue

PARlance wrote: »

He started by saying he issued the release in the interest of full transparency... releasing emails from Aug-Sept isn't the full story. Grandstanding of the highest order. He closed by saying/stressing that all issues were only minor ones... probably the only bit of real truth in the interview. It's a pity the Gov have to be seen to be the bigger person in this.

Yeah I'd like to know what happened after the end of May meeting with the DCC

brevity

ThisRegard wrote: »

He was on Matt Cooper earlier and came across very badly. When asked if he went the cheapo option with the WiFi he stuttered, mumbled and waffled, the obvious implication that he did. Entitled gob****e.

I think, by the end of the interview, he regretted the whole thing.

And it was very obvious that he lied or omitted information when asked about the WiFi.

seamus

PARlance wrote: »

He closed by saying/stressing that all issues were only minor ones... probably the only bit of real truth in the interview.

I loved that. If the issues were only minor, then why the fnck were you emailing the Taoiseach about them Paddy instead of dealing with it yourself?

Fncking numpty.

For Forks Sake

brevity wrote: »

I think, by the end of the interview, he regretted the whole thing.

And it was very obvious that he lied or omitted information when asked about the WiFi.

Cooper doled out the rope, Paddy kept making nooses for himself.

His own words, 30,000 visitors. And that's over the guts of a week.

Or just over half an Aviva stadium , or just over a quarter of Croker. They seem to manage alright with traffic management etc.

I also do not believe for one minute, his claim that other cities offered to somehow implement price controls on hotel rooms.

_Tombstone_

Talking sh1te on RTE1 there.

Byeeeeee Paddy.

ThisRegard

For Forks Sake wrote: »

I also do not believe for one minute, his claim that other cities offered to somehow implement price controls on hotel rooms.

Apparently in the docs he released there's mention of €1 million given by the Portuguese government which I'm sure helped his decision, despite his repeated claims he was looking for nothing.

Dyr

brevity wrote: »

I think, by the end of the interview, he regretted the whole thing.

And it was very obvious that he lied or omitted information when asked about the WiFi.

What did he say about the wifi?

awec

Very poor form to release those emails.

Any future business contact of his must wonder if their emails will find their way online if Paddy doesn't get his way.

markpb

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Or just over half an Aviva stadium , or just over a quarter of Croker. They seem to manage alright with traffic management etc.

Whatever about the rights and wrongs of this, events in both of those stadiums _do_ have traffic management plans. Those plans are put in place by DCC and AGS, not the organisers. Roads are closed, on-street parking is revoked and Gardai are scheduled to be there - all things that Cosgrave asked for. Years of experience has taught us that this is necessary when large numbers of people arrive in a single location.

awec

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Cooper doled out the rope, Paddy kept making nooses for himself.

His own words, 30,000 visitors. And that's over the guts of a week.

Or just over half an Aviva stadium , or just over a quarter of Croker. They seem to manage alright with traffic management etc.

I also do not believe for one minute, his claim that other cities offered to somehow implement price controls on hotel rooms.

18000 people descend on the RDS at the same time when Leinster are playing big games at home and there is no traffic management in place.

brevity

Bambi wrote: »

What did he say about the wifi?

He said he paid for a package that was "offered to him" (I forget the cost but it seemed a lot)

Matt Cooper then asked was there a better package that he could have paid for and he was flustered by that question and just said "We paid for the package that was offered" Matt pressed asking again if there were better packages on offer and he fumbled "No.No."

Sounded really bad.

Dyr

brevity wrote: »

He said he paid for a package that was "offered to him" (I forget the cost but it seemed a lot)

Matt Cooper then asked was there a better package that he could have paid for and he was flustered by that question and just said "We paid for the package that was offered" Matt pressed asking again if there were better packages on offer and he fumbled "No.No."

Sounded really bad.

I spoke to one of the guys who provided implementation, the bould costello is leaving a fair chunk out of the wi fi story from what I heard

Tobyglen

Cosgrave charges 1000s for tickets to a marketing/IT gig, he then expects all and sundry to bow to him. Breathtaking arrogance.
WFT is he getting onto the government to manage Wi-Fi and to fix Hotel prices.

Vast majority of stuff isn't great, much better material available freely on tedtalks.

The_Valeyard

F*ck his web summit.

My simple thoughts.

darkpagandeath

So they did not get the list of free stuff they wanted and left is that correct ?

seamus

darkpagandeath wrote: »

So they did not get the list of free stuff they wanted and left is that correct ?

In short, Mr. Cosgrave asked the council for list of things, not least he wanted three major commercial streets in the city centre closed for his private pub crawl, garda escorts for his presenters, shuttle busses for his attendees, and exclusive use of city centre council buildings. For free. While he charged his attendees €1,000 per head just to attend what is a relatively small event in real terms.

When he got no satisfaction from the council, he decided to email the Taoiseach threatening to move the web summit elsewhere, but obviously unable to claim that it was a monetary issue, he instead asked the leader of the country to devise a traffic plan for his event, talk to the hotels and arrange favourable rates, and put on a few extra busses for him. Oh, and also fix the WiFi in the RDS.

The leader of the country, having more important things to do than handhold some entitled spa through their own event management took some time to respond but eventually told him to go and sort it out himself.

Paddy then stamped his feet and threw a tantrum and released a pile of emails that proved that in fact he was the one being unreasonable, not the government. And that the only reason he went to Lisbon is because the Portuguese were clearly dumb enough to throw €1m at him and give into his diva-esque demands.

jaykay74

Its Garth Brooks all over again. "Someone get me the tea-shock on the phone"...

keith16

He certainly has a point IMO. The government are happy to ride the bandwagon he brought into town but offered nothing of real substance in return.

ressem

The Taoiseach's advisors should have politely but firmly redirected him to the local authorities.

The RDS should be able to provide a draft plan to event planners though, with the relevant Dublin county council and garda contacts to refine it. The Leinster rugby stadium management people definitely will have meetings with these people before every large game, for emergency planning etc.

Problem with wifi is that most interference is generated by the clients. The network designers have to create little low power pico-cells containing 60 or less devices, on 2.4 and 5 Ghz. And reject old devices.

It's a specialized labour-intensive setup, which was why the RDS was looking at 1 million to set it up. Simple wifi solution my arse.

Paddy Cosgrave wrote:

Finally, the RDS are blocking a simple wifi solution in the RDS. They need to
understand that putting up barriers that increase the cost to over €1 million this coming year, when it's free and reliable in other cities,

Aidric

keith16 wrote: »

He certainly has a point IMO. The government are happy to ride the bandwagon he brought into town but offered nothing of real substance in return.

True. I remember Enda gurning at the last one as he opened the Nasdaq.

brooke 2

seamus wrote: »

In short, Mr. Cosgrave asked the council for list of things, not least he wanted three major commercial streets in the city centre closed for his private pub crawl, garda escorts for his presenters, shuttle busses for his attendees, and exclusive use of city centre council buildings. For free. While he charged his attendees €1,000 per head just to attend what is a relatively small event in real terms.

When he got no satisfaction from the council, he decided to email the Taoiseach threatening to move the web summit elsewhere, but obviously unable to claim that it was a monetary issue, he instead asked the leader of the country to devise a traffic plan for his event, talk to the hotels and arrange favourable rates, and put on a few extra busses for him. Oh, and also fix the WiFi in the RDS.

The leader of the country, having more important things to do than handhold some entitled spa through their own event management took some time to respond but eventually told him to go and sort it out himself.

Paddy then stamped his feet and threw a tantrum and released a pile of emails that proved that in fact he was the one being unreasonable, not the government. And that the only reason he went to Lisbon is because the Portuguese were clearly dumb enough to throw €1m at him and give into his diva-esque demands.

I'm sure Trinity must be proud of him!

(Bitchy, I know but, wasn't he the guy who said he would only employ people with a Trinity education?)

The sense of entitlement dripping from him is absolutely repulsive!

For Forks Sake

ressem wrote: »

It's a specialized labour-intensive setup, which was why the RDS was looking at 1 million to set it up. Simple wifi solution my arse.

Cosgrave spent 400k....and then tried to blame all and sundry when it went tits up.

ThisRegard

keith16 wrote: »

He certainly has a point IMO. The government are happy to ride the bandwagon he brought into town but offered nothing of real substance in return.

He got plenty over the years.

And WTF have the government got to do with his **** up last year regarding the WiFi?