Chelsea Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016

hots

Cahill, Ivan and Matic were absolute roundabouts yesterday, Ivan should be out straight away for Alonso, Matic could be replaced by any of Oscar, Mikel and Chalobah and I'm convinced there'd be no drop off. As soon as Zouma and Terry are fit Cahill has to be CB #4, as another poster said, he's always been average but at least he was consistently that, now consistency is nonexistent.

Was disappointed with Haz and Willian too, we were sitting deep and getting burned and neither really made an impact defensively at all, a recipe for disaster against the best attacking fb pair in the league probably.

not sure on the 352, the last thing we need is more of our defenders on the pitch imo.

peteeeed

the thing with cahill is he always had his limits in terms of pace but he had a desire to win headers and tackles the champions league semi with barca and the final against bayern he was fantastic but he's lost his belief and confidence so when you lose that there is nothing left , he looks finished

grumpymunster

Well that was painful, but if you play with no defence then things like this are likely to happen. sadly once JT was ruled out of this game then the writing was on the wall and it was a matter of how many. But the first goal was a joke really, if we are to play with a back four whilst JT and Zouma are injured it has to be Luiz and Aina at CB but having Cahill and Ivan as the right side of our back 4 basically means we are playing with a back 2. Aina may be inexperienced but he has pace and cannot be worse than the muck on display currently.

Unless we look at a radical change soon then top 4 is gone, yea only 6 games in but that defence was not good enough last season and this season it is worse. And I repeat what I said after the Liverpool game - Ivan and Cahill should never play for us again and whoever is in charge of transfers at Chelsea should be sacked.

GavRedKing

Cahill was very lucky to get his chance at Chelsea it was down, in part, because we needed HG players for the futures. His time has come and gone at Chelsea, he reached his ceiling before signing for us and we should be aiming for a Cb thats levels above that.

The sad thing is we sold a much better to PSG and kept on Cahill only to re-sign that Cb in the summer and whats even funnier is all those memes saying the worse CB pairing since Luiz and Cahill is the new partnership of Luiz and Cahill is for the last 2 weeks, Cahill has been a serious liability. He was caught badly be Swansea, yes it was a foul but getting caught on the ball that day should have been a lesson too him.

Cahill got the ball and turned into trouble, onto Fers stronger tackling foot and he had a straight run on goal, you'd think he'd learn not to do that again and under less pressure against Arsenal, he turns back and gets caught by Alexis, wisdom suggests he should have launched it up the line to Ivan or willian or played square to Luiz but he choose the worse option, turning into face Alexis who was closing him down and gifting him a goal that shot any confidence. Thats without digging up the horrible clearance to Henderson against Liverpool and getting caught 5 on 1 back post against Lovren and Co.

If I never see Cahill in a Chelsea shirt again I'll be happy, Ivanovic at this stage is a shambles, has been for good 18 months too.

The only people I blame for this is not the managers that have come and gone but the directors and Emanelo. If they cant see that the club needed a CB then they're idiots, yes you have to pay insane amounts but thats the market.

Whats even more staggering is leaving Christensen going on another loan, in an ideal scenario I'd have gone with Aina, Azp, Zouma, Christensen, Luiz, JT, Alonso.

That would inspire more confidence than any formation that included Cahill and Ivanovic.

grumpymunster

Nice piece of analysis in the comments section on this piece from WAGNH regarding the goals, amazing we had possession in their half and less than 10 seconds later we are a goal down.

http://weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com/2016/9/25/13047214/chelsea-fc-branislav-ivanovic-arsenal-premier-league-2016-2017-interview-quotes

I would still love to know who at the Bridge though Cahill and Ivan are better defenders than Kalas, the die was cast with Christensen (most likely the same pillock) not having a recall clause after the first season with Gladbach. But we had Kalas and left him go out on loan again absolutely brain dead thinking.

It was not fully Joses fault when he got the bullet last season, but you have to wonder about Conte why is he still picking Cahill prior to the Arsenal game he was very poor against Swansea, Liverpool and Leicester. Matic is woeful and Ivan as bad but Conte is picking them that is really a serious error of judgement.

Johner

When Zouma and Terry are back I wouldn't mind seeing this team. The only good thing about the weekend is that we hopefully won't be seeing Cahill or Ivanovic for a long time.

Courtois
Azpilicueta, Zouma, Terry, Alonso
Luiz, Kante
Willian, Fabregas, Hazard
Costa

peteeeed

Johner wrote: »

When Zouma and Terry are back I wouldn't mind seeing this team. The only good thing about the weekend is that we hopefully won't be seeing Cahill or Ivanovic for a long time.

Courtois
Azpilicueta, Zouma, Terry, Alonso
Luiz, Kante
Willian, Fabregas, Hazard
Costa

Moses , Willian, , Hazard

i thought fab was ****e on saturday

GavRedKing

Johner wrote: »

When Zouma and Terry are back I wouldn't mind seeing this team. The only good thing about the weekend is that we hopefully won't be seeing Cahill or Ivanovic for a long time.

Courtois
Azpilicueta, Zouma, Terry, Alonso
Luiz, Kante
Willian, Fabregas, Hazard
Costa

I'd prefer to see

Tbo
Azp Luiz JT Alonso
Chalobah Kante
Moses Cesc Hazard
Costa

Begovic
Aina
Zouma
Oscar
Willian
Pedro
Batshuayi

GavRedKing

peteeeed wrote: »

Moses , Willian, , Hazard

i thought fab was ****e on saturday

I dont think we have a decent #10 in our ranks, Cesc is the best a bad of bunch but his best work is done in a deeper role, although Luiz passing range sometimes negates the need for a playmaker dropping in.

I'd not play Willian at #10 anyway the guy doesnt have a creative bone in his body.

Johner

peteeeed wrote: »

Moses , Willian, , Hazard

i thought fab was ****e on saturday

Yeah he was, but so was everyone apart from Costa really. I still think Fabregas has a lot to offer us.

grumpymunster

Conte has said good performances will be rewarded with a place in the team - so just how does Willian start before Moses?

peteeeed

i was thinking about leaders on the pitch when JT is not in the team and there was only one on saturday ......COSTA

GavRedKing

peteeeed wrote: »

i was thinking about leaders on the pitch when JT is not in the team and there was only one on saturday ......COSTA

4 yellow cards in 6 games too.

Although Saturdays one was a brilliant example of his reputation going before him, he'd been fouled, I think 7 times.

We didnt get a blatant corner he turns to Oliver to ask/gesture why not, booked. :pac:

We've got Hull away, Leicester and Utd at home in the next 3 games, if Costa can keep his emotions in check and get booked in the Utd game he'll only miss the West Ham league cup game but missing against Leicester
and especially Utd , would be a serious problem.

GavRedKing

grumpymunster wrote: »

Conte has said good performances will be rewarded with a place in the team - so just how does Willian start before Moses?

Theres at least 5 players that shouldnt be starting based on that.

Willian, Oscar, Matic, Cahill, Ivanovic.

The flip side is, the alternative are

Moses/Pedro, Cesc, Chalobah, Zouma (when fit), Alonso.

Does Conte trust the replacements? It seems like he does not trust the replacements.

GavRedKing

Part of me wants to see 3-5-2 also but we dont have the CMs to be able to work with.

Can we bring back Abraham, I'd even play him RB over Ivanovic.

Duck Soup

The Daily Mail says: "Chelsea manager Antonio Conte is targeting Burnley's Michael Keane, 23, and Middlesbrough's Ben Gibson, 23, as he plans an overhaul of his backline. Defenders Gary Cahill, 30, and Branislav Ivanovic, 32, are expected to be phased out of the Blues team as Conte targets a new full-back and two new centre-halves."

Antonio Conte plans defensive clear-out at Chelsea with Gary Cahill and Branislav Ivanovic expected to be phased out after Arsenal defeat

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3806815/Antonio-Conte-plans-defensive-clear-Chelsea-Gary-Cahill-Bransilav-Ivanovic-expected-phased-Arsenal-defeat.html

GavRedKing

Ivan and Cahill are grand when youre playing the dross of the league, coming up against any decent side with good attacking ability on the counter and we're boned.

The players and I count every one of them in this cant get back into any kind of shape or structure.

The fact that Ivan and Cahill are also vice and 3rd choice captains makes their lack of organising and f**k ups even more frustrating.

Panthro

GavRedKing wrote: »

I'd prefer to see

Tbo
Azp Luiz JT Alonso
Chalobah Kante
Moses Cesc Hazard
Costa

Begovic
Aina
Zouma
Oscar
Willian
Pedro
Batshuayi

I think this is our best 11.
Moses surely deserves a start. Him and Dave looked solid down that side.

GavRedKing

Panthro wrote: »

I think this is our best 11.
Moses surely deserves a start. Him and Dave looked solid down that side.

Zouma will start too but expecting him to walk back into the team after months out isnt fair on him, he'll need time to get back to speed and we cant rush him into action incase theres any relapse.

GavRedKing

I reckon Conte is going to need time to put his stamp on the team and it may even take another 2 transfer windows before we bed in the players he wants but this being Chelsea he'll be out on his arse by February.

grumpymunster

Uncle Guus by Christmas.

At this stage Roman has to realise it is more fundamental than the manager. Conte has not really had a transfer window yet and I would advocate at least letting him see out his contract.

bullpost

grumpymunster wrote: »

Uncle Guus by Christmas.

At this stage Roman has to realise it is more fundamental than the manager. Conte has not really had a transfer window yet and I would advocate at least letting him see out his contract.

Going to be difficult, but I agree we should keep Conte. And this is despite the fact I don't believe we will make top four this year. Even at this early stage we have too much ground to make up in terms of gelling as a team - Man C, Man Utd, Liverpool and Arsenal too far ahead .

Panthro

grumpymunster wrote: »

Uncle Guus by Christmas.

At this stage Roman has to realise it is more fundamental than the manager. Conte has not really had a transfer window yet and I would advocate at least letting him see out his contract.

If I hear the term "steadying the ship" ever again it'll be too soon

justshane

Whatever happens between now and the end of the season I trust Conte, and hope Roman does too. So much deadwood in this team needs rooted out. Give him time and he will come good, he's a winner who will find the system and identify the players to make us realistic and consistent challengers.

Suryavarman

Roman had plenty of faith in Mourinho last year. Mourinho wasn't sacked until the week before Xmas despite us losing 9 out of 16 games and being 1 point above relegation. We've only lost two games so far this season and both of those teams are top sides. Liverpool are second favourites for the league. We actually have a decent run of fixtures up until we play Tottenham a home in two months time. Our two most difficult games will be United and Everton at home.

It'll be apparent to Roman now that our backline needs investment. If it doesn't get the investment it needs in January then we still have the quality needed to finish top 6 at least. If it does then we have a good chance of finishing top 4. Either way Conte will be the manager at the start of next season.

MaroonAndGreen

The harsh reality is that times are very tough when we are including a player who hasn't started a game for us (Chalobah), a former Sunderland left back (Alonso) and Victor Moses in our best 11.

It really makes you question recruitment. We have actually left a lot of good players go in recent years. KDB, Lukaku.. even Ryan Bertrand, he'd be alright now

MaroonAndGreen

Was any of us really happy about the Alonso signing? The only box he ticks are left footed and left back.

Techless

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

Was any of us really happy about the Alonso signing? The only box he ticks are left footed and left back.

Buy back Bertrand

GavRedKing

The problem with writing this season off already is, we wont win the league but we should be pushing for top 4 but I think we'll fall short.

So that leaves us outside the top 4 and needing to invest quality but will probably also see us lose the better playes in the side, Courtois, Costa and Hazard namely.

Of those 3, only Costa has performed every game hes played so far.

GavRedKing

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

The harsh reality is that times are very tough when we are including a player who hasn't started a game for us (Chalobah), a former Sunderland left back (Alonso) and Victor Moses in our best 11.

It really makes you question recruitment. We have actually left a lot of good players go in recent years. KDB, Lukaku.. even Ryan Bertrand, he'd be alright now

Just on Alosno, Chalobah and Moses, its more to do with the guys that theyed be replacing have been so underwhelming for the best part of 18months.

We left the young players like KdB and Lukaku go because we needed short term success, Jose delivered that and the youth were thrown under the bus, apart from RLC who subsequently got roasted a few times from Jose even after a good display.

Conte has similar restrictions, if he doesnt improve the position of the squad in the short term he'll be out on his arse and on the beach in a few months which doesnt exactly help the development of the youth thats despite having one of the best English youth setups and best youth side in Europe for the last 2 years.

The guys 18-21 that are talented enough for the senior level but not Chelsea ready yet, are left out on loan and might play the odd game with the senior Chelsea side down the line before being left go as ready made replacements are brought in.

The guys between 15-18 are trained and learn their profession from some of the best coaches in hope of making it to the senior side but it doesnt happen and its a never ending cycle.

The youth side has produced some excellent players and nearly all of there careers have stalled with loans and not being trusted with the senior side, until thats addressed and the senior players cant feel safe between September - December and February - May, as they wont be replaced with youtths as the club isnt going to be bringing through stars any time soon when we can dip into the market and even thats been a cluster f**k the last 4 years, other than the odd hit, theres much more misses and failing to get players through the door.

Panthro

http://metro.co.uk/2016/07/27/chelsea-has-a-fantastic-academy-antonio-conte-promises-promote-youth-academy-6033752/

Conte needs to back up his claim not being afraid to promote the youth.

GavRedKing

Hull at home should be 3 points, well, it has to be before we fall further behind the chasing pack.

He has 6 days to sort out what he wnats to do and who to drop and unless JT gets injured again, should have at least 1 defender that can organise and defend.

peteeeed

GavRedKing wrote: »

Hull at home should be 3 points, well, it has to be before we fall further behind the chasing pack.

He has 6 days to sort out what he wnats to do and who to drop and unless JT gets injured again, should have at least 1 defender that can organise and defend.

Away

GavRedKing

peteeeed wrote: »

Away

Ahhhh

Its Hull away
Leicester home
Utd home

So lose, win, win :pac:

MaroonAndGreen

GavRedKing wrote:

Its Hull away Leicester home Utd home

6 points is a must at least. For all the talk about Liverpool's great start, it's just the game played between us that separating the two teams isn't it? We won't be doing too badly regards top 4 if we get 6 points from next 3

MaroonAndGreen

Ultimately it's the club failing miserably in the last 3 transfer windows that has us in this position, whoever is in charge of it needs to have their job re-evaluated big time

MaroonAndGreen

To think we once used to have a team full of leaders like Cech, Ashley, JT, Ballack, Lamps and Drogba...

Lukker-

Ballack is 40 today, happy birthday!

Suryavarman

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

To think we once used to have a team full of leaders like Cech, Ashley, JT, Ballack, Lamps and Drogba...

It'll be a long time before we have a team like that again. The top 3 teams in Europe are that much better and we are that much worse that we just aren't attractive to top players anymore.

justshane

Leaders is a huge problem, or lack of leaders. As the previous poster said JT, Lamp, Drog, Ash, Ballack, Essien, Ricki and Claude even were players who would put in the shift when things were bad. Just don't have that core spine anymore. Cech, JT, Lampard and Drogba was a consistent spine of talented leaders that we can't seem to come close to replicating.

TimRiggins

For Luiz to come in after a week and be the one to try and rally the players around him after we concede is just embarrassing.

GavRedKing

TimRiggins wrote: »

For Luiz to come in after a week and be the one to try and rally the players around him after we concede is just embarrassing.

Ivan is a vocal player, not a leader though and hes our vice captain.

Cahill is 3rd in command and he needed Cesc and Luiz to talk to him after the mistake, had we been solid for 10mins after that we might have stood at a chance but the confidence was gone.

Ozils goal was the killer just before half time and it was pretty lucky, brilliant counter attack but a miss hit volley bouncing over the gk and in off the far post, you couldnt make it up.

Arsenal did however deserve to be out of sight at that stage, they had played well and we had played as bad as I can remember in recent months.

Think it was Ivan, captain on the day, that came out and said the players abandoned Contes game plan, if so, they should be hung out to dry, the manager has to get his tactics right and to try and impose that game plan on the players to put into effect, if the players than go and decide to not pursue it, something has to change.

justshane

GavRedKing wrote: »

Ivan is a vocal player, not a leader though and hes our vice captain.

Cahill is 3rd in command and he needed Cesc and Luiz to talk to him after the mistake, had we been solid for 10mins after that we might have stood at a chance but the confidence was gone.

Ozils goal was the killer just before half time and it was pretty lucky, brilliant counter attack but a miss hit volley bouncing over the gk and in off the far post, you couldnt make it up.

Arsenal did however deserve to be out of sight at that stage, they had played well and we had played as bad as I can remember in recent months.

Think it was Ivan, captain on the day, that came out and said the players abandoned Contes game plan, if so, they should be hung out to dry, the manager has to get his tactics right and to try and impose that game plan on the players to put into effect, if the players than go and decide to not pursue it, something has to change.

Where did he say this? If true this is extremely worrying.

GavRedKing

justshane wrote: »

Where did he say this? If true this is extremely worrying.

The article is click bait, I seen it on Sunday or Monday and didnt bother looking at it.

We did not believe in what we were doing at the beginning and we were punished.

As a team we did not answer anything the manager asked of us. We have to be honest with ourselves and put more attention on the small details. We have to be more focused and concentrated on the game.

We have worked very hard on different ways. Our way of playing has changed a bit and you always need time. In the last two games it has not been the usual Chelsea way, but if it starts working it will be very good for us. We will be very, very dangerous.

This was onthe club website too.

GavRedKing

Thorgan scored against Barca .

TimRiggins

GavRedKing wrote: »

Thorgan scored against Barca .

Scenes if we activate our buy back clause and drop Eden for him.

GavRedKing

TimRiggins wrote: »

Scenes if we activate our buy back clause and drop Eden for him.

Sell willian for him.

duploelabs

GavRedKing wrote: »

Sell willian for him.

The tabloid's editors brains would explode with having a hazard on either wing

GavRedKing

duploelabs wrote: »

The tabloid's editors brains would explode with having a hazard on either wing

Theres another brother, about 14 or 15 whos meant to be better than them all.

What would be the Chelsea way is to buy Thorgan and sell Eden.

Johner

It's a no brainer activating Thorgan's release clause. Even if it was just to sell him on for profit.