Jose Mourinho

bur

Disliked him from day one, his Porto team were the greatest collection of cheats i've ever seen.

grumpymunster

BMMachine wrote: »

I think hes an absolutely detestable human being. I'll never forget the Anders Frisk incident. Playing games with Ref's lives and career because he lost a match.
Theres no debating his success, as an Inter "fan" I thought he did amazing at the club (Diego Milito, remember him? ) and is great with his players so yeah, at his actual job, hes one of the best in the world. Its just such a pity that he turns everything into a pro-wrestling bad guy angle when he loses and stamps his feet like a child. Him and John Terry are my two most hated active guys in football, which is great as Chelsea is my most hated team even without them in it (Russian gangster money. Success built on the blood of innocent people. Trophies worth that much?)

I suppose He was responsible for the response that Tom Henning Ovrebo got for the Chelsea Barca semi as well. Guess He might have been behind the grassy knoll as well - what about the Lindbergh baby he simply must have had something to do with that. He is an abrasive figure and will be a hate icon for many always so rational will go out the window

Poking Vito (?) in the eye was wrong and stupid (as was Wenger pushing him in his technical area but that appears to be OK, violence inflicted on Him is acceptable then. Double standards par for the course here).

His treatment of BOTH medical staff in public was wrong that should have been done in the private - not in the dressing room neither but in His office under calm conditions. He really should have acknowledged this error and apologised and I think He is paying the price for that now. Will He get over it - would have to say no better than 50-50 at this stage as there is certainly something very wrong in our dressing room at the moment. Seen as He had signed a new four year deal the day before that incident v Swansea one would assume He was in a good place before the match at least.

He does have a slight tendency to shoot from the hip I guess.

JustTheOne

grumpymunster wrote: »

I suppose He was responsible for the response that Tom Henning Ovrebo got for the Chelsea Barca semi as well. Guess He might have been behind the grassy knoll as well - what about the Lindbergh baby he simply must have had something to do with that. He is an abrasive figure and will be a hate icon for many always so rational will go out the window

Poking Vito (?) in the eye was wrong and stupid (as was Wenger pushing him in his technical area but that appears to be OK, violence inflicted on Him is acceptable then. Double standards par for the course here).

His treatment of BOTH medical staff in public was wrong that should have been done in the private - not in the dressing room neither but in His office under calm conditions. He really should have acknowledged this error and apologised and I think He is paying the price for that now. Will He get over it - would have to say no better than 50-50 at this stage as there is certainly something very wrong in our dressing room at the moment. Seen as He had signed a new four year deal the day before that incident v Swansea one would assume He was in a good place before the match at least.

He does have a slight tendency to shoot from the hip I guess.

This thread isn't about Wenger.

But yeah a little push is the same as sticking your finger in someone's eye socket.

Unbelievable.

Panthro

JustTheOne wrote: »

This thread isn't about Wenger.

But yeah a little push is the same as sticking your finger in someone's eye socket.

Unbelievable Jeff!!!

fixed.

JustTheOne

Panthro wrote: »

fixed.

Brilliant.

blag

grumpymunster wrote: »

I suppose He was responsible for the response that Tom Henning Ovrebo got for the Chelsea Barca semi as well. Guess He might have been behind the grassy knoll as well - what about the Lindbergh baby he simply must have had something to do with that. He is an abrasive figure and will be a hate icon for many always so rational will go out the window

Poking Vito (?) in the eye was wrong and stupid (as was Wenger pushing him in his technical area but that appears to be OK, violence inflicted on Him is acceptable then. Double standards par for the course here).

His treatment of BOTH medical staff in public was wrong that should have been done in the private - not in the dressing room neither but in His office under calm conditions. He really should have acknowledged this error and apologised and I think He is paying the price for that now. Will He get over it - would have to say no better than 50-50 at this stage as there is certainly something very wrong in our dressing room at the moment. Seen as He had signed a new four year deal the day before that incident v Swansea one would assume He was in a good place before the match at least.

He does have a slight tendency to shoot from the hip I guess.

Your pronoun capitalisation suggests you might like Jose a little too much.....

...and while Wengers push wasn't right it's in no way as heinous as the eye poke.

blag

extra gravy wrote: »

Good article by Matthew Syed on his management style

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/public/football/article4576052.ece#pq=ZpwVJn

That was an good read and this paragraph pretty much sums him up for me:

"Mourinho, however, is a cultural terrorist. He sucks whatever vitality there is in a culture into the black hole of his ego. He is an impressive tactician, to be sure, but when it comes to sustainability, he is all at sea. He is too immature, emotionally and philosophically, to create dynastic success, at a football club or anywhere else. What success he achieves comes by napalming the native culture, and then moving"

grumpymunster

JustTheOne wrote: »

This thread isn't about Wenger.

But yeah a little push is the same as sticking your finger in someone's eye socket.

Unbelievable.

The title of the thread would suggest it is about Jose Mourinho but I am open to correction there, though I think "pretend outrage regarding Jose Mourinho" would be more apt. What I was trying to show and either failing miserably or simply the point was ignored because it does not fit with a particular argument is that His behaviour is not that dissimilar than others it is just the pretend outrage brigade like to get fixated on Him.

And lets face it is pretend outrage with the medical staff it is the treatment of Eva no mention of Jon Fearn - why maybe because he accepted the criticism and when back to work with no public complaint? Maybe because he is male and she is an attractive female? Either way it is pretend outrage.

So no I don't take that seriously as I don't take Him seriously. He manages the team I have supported man and boy other than that He has no impact on my life at all. By the same token you could say Bill Shankly possibly affected peoples mental health with the statement

" Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, I am very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that"

Its not

grumpymunster

blag wrote: »

Your pronoun capitalisation suggests you might like Jose a little too much.....

...and while Wengers push wasn't right it's in no way as heinous as the eye poke.

:D:D:D:D

bucketybuck

grumpymunster wrote: »

And lets face it is pretend outrage with the medical staff it is the treatment of Eva no mention of Jon Fearn - why maybe because he accepted the criticism and when back to work with no public complaint?

And what public complaint did she make at the time?

symbolic

grumpymunster wrote: »

What I was trying to show and either failing miserably or simply the point was ignored because it does not fit with a particular argument is that His behaviour is not that dissimilar than others it is just the pretend outrage brigade like to get fixated on Him.

So he is just randomly picked out of all the managers and people pretend to have an issue with him. I didn't get that memo.

sky88

I think jose is so intense with his players and he creates this tight knit group of players as he plays the majority of them regularly that they burnout mentally and physically.

I think Inter and maybe Porto are the only times hes left on good terms with a club and its players

grumpymunster

bucketybuck wrote: »

And what public complaint did she make at the time?

Complaint was the wrong word apologies. Was referring to her Facebook post. May have been understandable but perhaps also ill advised

Dirty Dingus McGee

grumpymunster wrote: »

I suppose He was responsible for the response that Tom Henning Ovrebo got for the Chelsea Barca semi as well. Guess He might have been behind the grassy knoll as well - what about the Lindbergh baby he simply must have had something to do with that. He is an abrasive figure and will be a hate icon for many always so rational will go out the window

Poking Vito (?) in the eye was wrong and stupid (as was Wenger pushing him in his technical area but that appears to be OK, violence inflicted on Him is acceptable then. Double standards par for the course here).

His treatment of BOTH medical staff in public was wrong that should have been done in the private - not in the dressing room neither but in His office under calm conditions. He really should have acknowledged this error and apologised and I think He is paying the price for that now. Will He get over it - would have to say no better than 50-50 at this stage as there is certainly something very wrong in our dressing room at the moment. Seen as He had signed a new four year deal the day before that incident v Swansea one would assume He was in a good place before the match at least.

He does have a slight tendency to shoot from the hip I guess.

He changed his name and became Abraham Simpson.

Panthro

JustTheOne wrote: »

Brilliant.

Awww.....shucks...!:o
:pac:

dfx-

extra gravy wrote: »

Good article by Matthew Syed on his management style

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/public/football/article4576052.ece#pq=ZpwVJn

very hard to disagree. I'm not sure he'd be a good fit at Munich. He'd win the league in the short term of course, but he needs something to fight against or in his case invent stuff to fight against.

grumpymunster

JustTheOne wrote: »

This thread isn't about Wenger.

But yeah a little push is the same as sticking your finger in someone's eye socket.

Unbelievable.

Just a thought but it is interesting that you condone violence against an individual as being ok once you don't like the individual.

Had it been the other way around there would have been huge pretend outrage - you know it, I know it hell the dogs in the street know it at this stage.

Had it been the other way around the F(riends) of A(rsenal) would have Him up on charges and He would have got a (justified) ban and fine.

Its pretty clear he is a divisive figure but I really find the pretend outrage to be hilarious.

Funny reading that Times article (that chap has a huge love affair by all things Fergie and United from his various articles) it is interesting he makes no mentioned of Jon Fearn - pretty biased and indeed sexist reporting but the Times has been well noted for that for many a year.

extra gravy

grumpymunster wrote: »

Funny reading that Times article (that chap has a huge love affair by all things Fergie and United from his various articles) it is interesting he makes no mentioned of Jon Fearn - pretty biased and indeed sexist reporting but the Times has been well noted for that for many a year.

Why is it funny reading? What has he written about Mourinho's management style that's incorrect?

MaroonAndGreen

dfx- wrote: »

very hard to disagree. I'm not sure he'd be a good fit at Munich. He'd win the league in the short term of course, but he needs something to fight against or in his case invent stuff to fight against.

What did he fight against at Porto? Would be similar enough to Bayern wouldn't it? Joining the dominant club in a league?

grumpymunster

extra gravy wrote: »

Why is it funny reading? What has he written about Mourinho's management style that's incorrect?

I found it humorous because it is quite biased but his opinion to which he is entitled. People in their pretend outrage take the negative spin being put on Him.

I decide (to which I am entitled) to ignore that because it does not fit my argument and instead feign my pretend outrage that he has reported in a sexist manner by not including any reference to Jon Fearn in his drivel sorry piece. It is interesting he referred to referees, ballboys in the plural but the team doctor in the singular (and later to Eva Carneiro by name) does he feel that Jon Fearn was not wronged. Or does he feel that his opinion piece caries a better punch by being blatantly sexist in that regard.

That truly is outrageous and we should never read his opinion piece again.

GavRedKing

grumpymunster wrote: »

I found it humorous because it is quite biased but his opinion to which he is entitled. People in their pretend outrage take the negative spin being put on Him.

I decide (to which I am entitled) to ignore that because it does not fit my argument and instead feign my pretend outrage that he has reported in a sexist manner by not including any reference to Jon Fearn in his drivel sorry piece. It is interesting he referred to referees, ballboys in the plural but the team doctor in the singular (and later to Eva Carneiro by name) does he feel that Jon Fearn was not wronged. Or does he feel that his opinion piece caries a better punch by being blatantly sexist in that regard.

That truly is outrageous and we should never read his opinion piece again.

Nobody ever think of poor Jon Fearn.

Its easier to be sensationalist by making it look like Joses outburst was all hinged on Eva and her going on the pitch but anyone with half brain, or so I assumed, would know there was 2 of them on the pitch and his outburst was at the medical staff and not an individual.

Both were invited back to work with the club, one of them has decided to go back, the other declined and I wish her all the happiness in the world.

extra gravy

GavRedKing wrote: »

Nobody ever think of poor Jon Fearn.

Its easier to be sensationalist by making it look like Joses outburst was all hinged on Eva and her going on the pitch but anyone with half brain, or so I assumed, would know there was 2 of them on the pitch and his outburst was at the medical staff and not an individual.

Both were invited back to work with the club, one of them has decided to go back, the other declined and I wish her all the happiness in the world.

Both were invited back to work...big deal. If they weren't treated so badly in the first place, the club wouldn't have had to save face and invite them back. Fearn obviously doesn't mind working somewhere where you get publicly humiliated by the manager.

bucketybuck

GavRedKing wrote: »

Both were invited back to work with the club

How magnanimous of the club.

grumpymunster

extra gravy wrote: »

Both were invited back to work...big deal. If they weren't treated so badly in the first place, the club wouldn't have had to save face and invite them back. Fearn obviously doesn't mind working somewhere where you get publicly humiliated by the manager.

Good Lord He said they were naive running onto the pitch given the state of play. He was wrong to do it certainly publicly humiliated give it up, good God the pretend outrage knows no bounds.

greendom

grumpymunster wrote: »

Just a thought but it is interesting that you condone violence against an individual as being ok once you don't like the individual.

Had it been the other way around there would have been huge pretend outrage - you know it, I know it hell the dogs in the street know it at this stage.

Had it been the other way around the F(riends) of A(rsenal) would have Him up on charges and He would have got a (justified) ban and fine.

Its pretty clear he is a divisive figure but I really find the pretend outrage to be hilarious.

Funny reading that Times article (that chap has a huge love affair by all things Fergie and United from his various articles) it is interesting he makes no mentioned of Jon Fearn - pretty biased and indeed sexist reporting but the Times has been well noted for that for many a year.

You're really going to need to drop that if you want your points to be taken seriously.

grumpymunster

greendom wrote: »

You're really going to need to drop that if you want your points to be taken seriously.

That is to reinforce what would have happened had it been the other way around in my opinion. Had that happened to Wenger do you honestly think it would have been ignored and brushed aside so easily.

After the Chelsea Arsenal match Wenger (possibly quite rightly in all fairness) was openly critical of the performance of Mike Dean. Nothing happened.

Contrast that with last weekend after the Saints match.

So I make my pretend outrage so much more obvious than others to show how truly inane it all is.

Glad to see you agree with the post in general though

extra gravy

grumpymunster wrote: »

Good Lord He said they were naive running onto the pitch given the state of play. He was wrong to do it certainly publicly humiliated give it up, good God the pretend outrage knows no bounds.

I'm not outraged at all, merely stating fact. He publicly called them impulsive and naive and then banned them from first team duties...to most people that would be humiliating. The proper way would have been for the matter to have been dealt with behind closed doors but we all know he's far too crass and attention seeking to have done that.

MonsterCookie

greendom wrote: »

You're really going to need to drop that if you want your points to be taken seriously.

Another bull**** case of Jose says it so it must be true.

The camera doesn't lie. Wengers push on mourinho was wrong but hardly in the same league as a poke in the eye. Equally, Costa assaulting Kos was far more violent than anything Gabriel did. The ref didn't deal with things sufficiently so the FAvtook the opportunity to rectify after the fact which was too late as far as I'm concerned-?how anyone could suggest this favoured Arsenal is beyond me.

I used to enjoy watching Chelsea play but at this stage I think they are a boring team with a spiteful manager who is clearly rubbing off on his fans and affecting their judgement!

Bring back Ranieri, Di Matteo or dare I say it Rafa!!!

greendom

grumpymunster wrote: »

That is to reinforce what would have happened had it been the other way around in my opinion. Had that happened to Wenger do you honestly think it would have been ignored and brushed aside so easily.

After the Chelsea Arsenal match Wenger (possibly quite rightly in all fairness) was openly critical of the performance of Mike Dean. Nothing happened.

Contrast that with last weekend after the Saints match.

So I make my pretend outrage so much more obvious than others to show how truly inane it all is.

Glad to see you agree with the post in general though

not really, once I see that it looks like a paranoid rant so I ignore the rest

MaroonAndGreen

MonsterCookie wrote: »

Another bull**** case of Jose says it so it must be true.

The camera doesn't lie. Wengers push on mourinho was wrong but hardly in the same league as a poke in the eye. Equally, Costa assaulting Kos was far more violent than anything Gabriel did. The ref didn't deal with things sufficiently so the FAvtook the opportunity to rectify after the fact which was too late as far as I'm concerned-?how anyone could suggest this favoured Arsenal is beyond me.

I used to enjoy watching Chelsea play but at this stage I think they are a boring team with a spiteful manager who is clearly rubbing off on his fans and affecting their judgement!

Bring back Ranieri, Di Matteo or dare I say it Rafa!!!

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Can't even read the rest of your post after that.

''Assaulting''

:pac:

GavRedKing

MonsterCookie wrote: »

Another bull**** case of Jose says it so it must be true.

The camera doesn't lie. Wengers push on mourinho was wrong but hardly in the same league as a poke in the eye. Equally, Costa assaulting Kos was far more violent than anything Gabriel did. The ref didn't deal with things sufficiently so the FAvtook the opportunity to rectify after the fact which was too late as far as I'm concerned-?how anyone could suggest this favoured Arsenal is beyond me.

I used to enjoy watching Chelsea play but at this stage I think they are a boring team with a spiteful manager who is clearly rubbing off on his fans and affecting their judgement!

Bring back Ranieri, Di Matteo or dare I say it Rafa!!!

Now I know youre extracting the urine.

Ya might aswell throw in AVB, Scolari and Grant too. :pac:

For the record only ex manager I'd have back is Ancelotti.

Panthro

It's becoming a tad embarrassing to read the continued Arsenal vs Chelsea argument spill over time and time again at this stage to be honest, in my opinion.

grumpymunster

GavRedKing wrote: »

Now I know youre extractiung the urine.

Ya might aswell throw in AVB, Scolari and Grant too. :pac:

For the record only ex manager I'd have back is Ancelotti.

John Hollins is still sorely missed, and as for Butch Wilkins God don't get me started

greendom

Panthro wrote: »

It's becoming a tad embarrassing to read the continued Arsenal vs Chelsea argument spill over time and time again at this stage to be honest, in my opinion.

Do you think it will ever reach Liverpool - United levels ?

grumpymunster

greendom wrote: »

not really, once I see that it looks like a paranoid rant so I ignore the rest

Hmmm quite interesting, I admit that my outrage is pretend (like pretty much all of this thread I feel) and you think that is a paranoid rant. I suggest you look up the description of either paranoid or rant as you don't normally start with an admission that your outrage is a pretence.

Wow this thread is the gift that just keeps on giving.

extra gravy

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Can't even read the rest of your post after that.

''Assaulting''

:pac:

Not sure what the issue is here? If you slapped someone and knocked them to the ground on the street, it's an assault. Don't see why it should be any different on the football pitch.

GavRedKing

greendom wrote: »

Do you think it will ever reach Liverpool - United levels ?

Well on a smaller, southern scale it sort of is to a degree.

Although I'd say a few Arsenal or Spurs fans consider the NL Derby to be the biggest derby game of the year.

Arghus

As a coach his record is beyond dispute, he's definitely one of the greatest ever in that respect.

However his carry on as a human being has been pretty disgraceful. Everyone loves a pantomine villain, but I think he's become a more nasty presence on the football landscape as the years have gone on. He used to have charm on side, that used to let him get away with it, at least up until the last few years. But now he's a pretty odious figure: most of his media soundbites are totally ludicrious and transparently self-serving. The alarm bells of most people on Jose-watch started ringing this season after "doctor gate", but, for me, his comments about Benitez's weight and his wife were his opening salvo of classlessness this year. Yeah maybe what she said would annoy him, but it was Rafa Benitez's wife: a complete nonentity in the football universe. If ever there was an opportunity to show a bit of class, this was it. But, no, once again he stooped to the ocassion.

Yeah Jose! You sure told her... you absolute prat.

GavRedKing

extra gravy wrote: »

Not sure what the issue is here? If you slapped someone and knocked them to the ground on the street, it's an assault. Don't see why it should be any different on the football pitch.

Contact sport.

Also, Kosclieny should be done for assualt too if thats the case, Costa started swinging arms caught Kos, Kos threw him to the ground, Costa got up, and chested him and Kos hit the deck.

If the force of Costas chest enough to knock a man, then Wenger has to be done for his "vicious" assualt on Jose too on the sideline last year.

greendom

grumpymunster wrote: »

Hmmm quite interesting, I admit that my outrage is pretend (like pretty much all of this thread I feel) and you think that is a paranoid rant. I suggest you look up the description of either paranoid or rant as you don't normally start with an admission that your outrage is a pretence.

Wow this thread is the gift that just keeps on giving.

As I said as soon as I saw the FA comment I ignored the rest !

hots

GavRedKing wrote: »

Contact sport.

Also, Kosclieny should be done for assualt too if thats the case, Costa started swinging arms caught Kos, Kos threw him to the ground, Costa got up, and chested him and Kos hit the deck.

If the force of Costas chest enough to knock a man, then Wenger has to be done for his "vicious" assualt on Jose too on the sideline last year.

Don't mention that bit! When talking about that game the only thing you're allowed to mention is evilbasterd Costa or the blind ref. Nothing else happened.

grumpymunster

greendom wrote: »

As I said as soon as I saw the FA comment I ignored the rest !

Ah I see you accept that you make generalisations in ignorance of the facts, yea that I can believe.

Arghus

Oh and on the question of Jose and the United job- Whether he was offered it or not is one thing, which we mere mortals can have no real idea of. Ferguson says a lot of things, in a lot of his biographies and you'd wonder how often his recollection of events is in accordance with factual reality.However: I don't think there's much doubt, in my mind, that Jose wanted it.

Look at his interview after the champions league game in 2013 - a dry run for a job interview if ever I saw one, a display of humility and grace.... what is this Jose? Short of fellating Ferguson live on air, there wasn't much more public sucking up to an institution that he could have done.

grumpymunster

Not sure if he wanted it or not but seen as he has a book out next week I am sure is part of the reason he brought it back to light.

Or is that a tad cynical

CSF

Arghus wrote: »

As a coach his record is beyond dispute, he's definitely one of the greatest ever in that respect.

However his carry on as a human being has been pretty disgraceful. Everyone loves a pantomine villain, but I think he's become a more nasty presence on the football landscape as the years have gone on. He used to have charm on side, that used to let him get away with it, at least up until the last few years. But now he's a pretty odious figure: most of his media soundbites are totally ludicrious and transparently self-serving. The alarm bells of most people on Jose-watch started ringing this season after "doctor gate", but, for me, his comments about Benitez's weight and his wife were his opening salvo of classlessness this year. Yeah maybe what she said would annoy him, but it was Rafa Benitez's wife: a complete nonentity in the football universe. If ever there was an opportunity to show a bit of class, this was it. But, no, once again he stooped to the ocassion.

Yeah Jose! You sure told her... you absolute prat.

To me, this is part of the ridiculousness of the other side of the argument. When Mourinho humiliates the male physio, no hassle. When it's a woman, outrage. When Mourinho says harsh things in retaliation to Wenger making comments about him, nobody cares too much. When it's in retaliation to a woman making comments about him, public outrage.

There are plenty of valid sticks to beat Mourinho with, and they seem to be his eventual downfall almost everywhere he goes, but at least let's be consistent in our outrage.

gosplan

grumpymunster wrote: »

That is to reinforce what would have happened had it been the other way around in my opinion. Had that happened to Wenger do you honestly think it would have been ignored and brushed aside so easily.

After the Chelsea Arsenal match Wenger (possibly quite rightly in all fairness) was openly critical of the performance of Mike Dean. Nothing happened.

Contrast that with last weekend after the Saints match.

So I make my pretend outrage so much more obvious than others to show how truly inane it all is.

Glad to see you agree with the post in general though

It was right to be critical of Dean.

Jose just attacks the refs and questions their professionality whenever his team lose. What else does he expect to happen?

CSF

gosplan wrote: »

It was right to be critical of Dean.

Jose just attacks the refs and questions their professionality whenever his team lose. What else does he expect to happen?

This is more hypocrisy. It has been brought up time and time again that public criticism of referees is unacceptable and references made to times it led to problems in the personal lives of the referees involved and their families. But then when its your team and the decision goes against you, it is suddenly acceptable. But it isn't, and Wenger should have been charged in the same way that Mourinho was correctly charged over the weekend.

Arghus

CSF wrote: »

To me, this is part of the ridiculousness of the other side of the argument. When Mourinho humiliates the male physio, no hassle. When it's a woman, outrage. When Mourinho says harsh things in retaliation to Wenger making comments about him, nobody cares too much. When it's in retaliation to a woman making comments about him, public outrage.

There are plenty of valid sticks to beat Mourinho with, and they seem to be his eventual downfall almost everywhere he goes, but at least let's be consistent in our outrage.

I'm not beating Mourinho with the sexist-stick here. I do think that the furore the surrounded the treatment of a female member of staff- while the media completely ignored the role and fate of the male medic- was pretty rank hypocrisy on the medias part. Though I do think there was an implication of sexism in the way he explained himself to the press, I wouldn't crucify over that particular incident.

I brought the incident of Benitez's wife up, not because it struck me as an example of sexism on Mourinho's part, but as an example of how petty he is. Why should he care about a joke she made? Who is she to him after all? The appropriate thing would have been to say nothing. But no score is too little to settle for Jose. So he gave it back to her: with interest. I think his comments were nasty and totally unneessary, and made him look terrible. And that's him to a tee. He might be sinned against, but he always goes that extra mile to get the boot in, regardless of gender.

TheDoc

Mourinho is an odd manager to sometimes critique because people put his achievements down and seemingly that ends the debate. Mourinho is clearly a very good manager but the way he operates should be of no real surprise to anyone. I didn't buy into any of the nonsense on his return that things would be different.

I've always had question marks about him being able to oversee a club for an extended period of success and competitiveness, and query his coaching ability. Can he plan and structure and manage a club properly, when it gets passed buying in finished products? Can he properly manage a squad fully, and not just a first 11-13? Can he actually coach, do players become better under him, or are they already the finished product, or about to peak regardless of him?

Looking back through his previous clubs, I struggle to pinpoint youthful players he has coached, promoted and utilised as part of a first team plan. His integration of young players seems non existent. I think players simply get burnt out with the intense defensive projection he constantly omits and demands. Everything is the siege mentality, and built around the siege mentality, and that must be taxing on any of his players.

Mourinho has always appeared to me to be in the sort of categories I'd put Klopp and Simeone. That sort of motivator coach style. It's intense, it builds tight bonds and relationships, but after a few years, it starts to wear off, and it's nearly irreversible once it starts slipping.

His character and comments are really just dramatics and nonsense for the cameras. I'm sure he doesn't really believe it, just like how anyone with half a brain knows its rarely the truth. This infamous deflection tactic as someone else mentioned, is not the case. You can be pretty sure that when a few million people watch a televised game, they are going to know what happened, and no deflection tactics are going to change that. It only makes the manager and by association the club, more detested and disliked by rival fans and even neutrals.

I know when he came up in the United megathread as a potential replacement to Ferguson I was very nervy about the situation and not sure it was the right fit or thing to do.

As much as you can hate or love him as a character, as a manager he has astronomical success, but still has some areas that question marks hang over. I felt Chelsea would struggle to retain the title this season due to the poor investment and not keeping things fresh. Felt Chelsea got away with MURDER last season being so lucky with injuries and how no one around them could mount a meaningful challenege. I would never have imagined Chelsea being THIS bad but at the same time I'm not overly surprised either.

The Mourinho effect wears off fast on squads and players and doesn't last for long. The only way it was changing is if he changed, and after a little six month goodwill tour on the cameras when he came back, he started to slip into the same old Jose.

gosplan

CSF wrote: »

This is more hypocrisy. It has been brought up time and time again that public criticism of referees is unacceptable and references made to times it led to problems in the personal lives of the referees involved and their families. But then when its your team and the decision goes against you, it is suddenly acceptable. But it isn't, and Wenger should have been charged in the same way that Mourinho was correctly charged over the weekend.

I'm not saying either was acceptable.

But Wenger was correct. He'll get leeway because he doesn't openly challenge the FA at every available opportunity.

Jose is permanently on the attack so the FA are in a state of war when it comes to Chelsea and it's all down to Jose.