Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread V

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Billysays no wrote: »

gilroy doing his best to prove joe wrong tonight. but i guess if your not joe's type your not joe's type

What exactly is he proving Joe wrong about? Has Schmidt said something specific about Gilroy?

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

I like the jersey the Irish club side were wearing tonight. Wish the senior team would do something a bit more interesting with theirs.

Billysays no

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

What exactly is he proving Joe wrong about? Has Schmidt said something specific about Gilroy?

He has by selecting mcfadden, which is insulting, and DK, which is mysterious.

aimee1

rsh118 wrote: »

Ferris is definitely working to make his name as a rentagob these days, but he's certainly articulating thoughts every Ulster fan has had at some point.

Perhaps we'll have to find a coach to lead us to 2 Heineken's who will inevitably then be picked up by the IRFU? How hard can it be??

alan quinlan was at this a few years ago. Questioning the coach over the Jordi/TOD issue. I would expect the former players to actually have a greater grasp of the hows and whys. Any one outside the squad environment only knows a small percentage of what goes on. Yet the coach who has won 6 trophies since 2010 gets criticised. At some stage over those 6 years he has to have made far more right decisions then wrong. If that was the other way around most/all of those 6 trophies would have been won by someone else.

Billysays no

and there is gilroy again just to prove the point. havn't seen mcfadden or DK rip a line apart like this lad does

aimee1

Billysays no wrote: »

and there is gilroy again just to prove the point. havn't seen mcfadden or DK rip a line apart like this lad does

did you see DK against the ospreys a month ago?

wp_rathead

molloyjh wrote: »

Jesus, do we really need to be put through this again? You're knocking a team that are 6 points behind you in the league with 2 games in hand and an almost certain 5 pointer coming up today. A team that nilled you only a few weeks ago. A team that has, just this season, failed in a competition that you've never qualified for off your own steam (but has as many European trophies as the other 3 provinces combined). A team with a history of winning trophies when you've won nothing. Please, for the sake of your integrity and everyone else's sanity, stop digging.

yikes, sounds like you wanted to get that off your chest a while molloy 0_o

Billysays no

aimee1 wrote: »

did you see DK against the ospreys a month ago?

difference is gilroy does it every week

Billysays no

did always love RKs incisive runs of years past. that is all gone. now its just a yard or two and its just a matter of going into contact. difference between what was and what is these days. joe is a whats was person it would seem.

CMOTDibbler

Billysays no wrote: »

difference is gilroy does it every week

Yet Gilroy isn't selected. So the question is why and for those who aren't blessed with a five year old's critical faculties, that shouldn't be too hard to work out.

'Mysterious' Dave Kearney has some ring to it!

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Billysays no wrote: »

He has by selecting mcfadden, which is insulting, and DK, which is mysterious.

You don't know specifically why Gilroy isn't selected though so how has he proven anything?

jacothelad

That's a great name. Like Steve 'Interesting' Davis only better. Dave and the Mysterons has a certain charm too.

Mysterious Dave... Better than Daverage that's for sure.

CMOTDibbler

jacothelad wrote: »

That's a great name. Like Steve 'Interesting' Davis only better. Dave and the Mysterons has a certain charm too.

Mysterious Dave... Better than Daverage that's for sure.

My new handle the next time I go for a reboot

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

jacothelad wrote: »

That's a great name. Like Steve 'Interesting' Davis only better. Dave and the Mysterons has a certain charm too.

Mysterious Dave... Better than Daverage that's for sure.

Oh, ooooh, oh, ooooh, oh, Mysterious Dave.

Billysays no

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Yet Gilroy isn't selected. So the question is why and for those who aren't blessed with a five year old's critical faculties, that shouldn't be too hard to work out.

I'm actually four years old. Stole me dads computer for a bit. As such can you be gentle and explain what you obviously understand and me, in my youth, miss

jacothelad

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

My new handle the next time I go for a reboot

You could try Mincewind....:D..or Li Tin Wheeedle.....:D

The Black Stags

Billysays no wrote: »

I'm actually four years old. Stole me dads computer for a bit. As such can you be gentle and explain what you obviously understand and me, in my youth, miss

Joe just doesn't think green suits him - he thinks it makes his pale skin look too pasty.

Billysays no

The Black Stags wrote: »

Joe just doesn't think green suits him - he thinks it makes his pale skin look too pasty.

Now thats a reasonable answer. Thanks. Agree totally

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

The Black Stags wrote: »

Joe just doesn't think green suits him - he thinks it makes his pale skin look too pasty.

That's ridiculous. Green would be an improvement over white surely?

Mahatma Geansai

Stephen Ferris is not happy with Schmidt's selections for the France game.

He is of the opinion that Joe is relying on the Leinster lads that he has previously coached. He highlights the inclusion of Madigan and McFadden ahead of the superior Jackson and McCloskey.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

Stephen Ferris is not happy with Schmidt's selections for the France game.

He is of the opinion that Joe is relying on the Leinster lads that he has previously coached. He highlights the inclusion of Madigan and McFadden ahead of the superior Jackson and McCloskey.

The few times I've seen Ferris on BBC NI he is very blinkered in his views. I know a lot of the former players turned pundits are the same but Ferris is particularly bad at hiding it.

I'd love to see McCloskey in the team but put him on the bench instead of McFadden and what happens if Trimble or Kearney go down injured in the first 10 minutes?

CMOTDibbler

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

Stephen Ferris is not happy with Schmidt's selections for the France game.

He is of the opinion that Joe is relying on the Leinster lads that he has previously coached. He highlights the inclusion of Madigan and McFadden ahead of the superior Jackson and McCloskey.

Yes, already covered on the match thread.

Ferris in clickbait balls.ie bullcrap story :rolleyes:

And MG you're bullying people again.

wp_rathead

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

The few times I've seen Ferris on BBC NI he is very blinkered in his views. I know a lot of the former players turned pundits are the same but Ferris is particularly bad at hiding it.

I'd love to see McCloskey in the team but put him on the bench instead of McFadden and what happens if Trimble or Kearney go down injured in the first 10 minutes?

It is possible:
McCloskey goes 12- Henshaw moves to FB- Rob to the wing
But yes, it is a lot of juggling alright so McCloskey not ideal for bench

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Yes, already covered on the match thread.

Ferris in clickbait balls.ie bullcrap story :rolleyes:

And MG you're bullying people again.

CMOTDibbler

wp_rathead wrote: »

MG complained that he was being bullied by people here. He doesn't acknowledge that he is baiting people here and provoking it and yet here he is doing it again.

So he's bullying by proxy.

.ak

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

MG complained that he was being bullied by people here. He doesn't acknowledge that he is baiting people here and provoking it and yet here he is doing it again.

So he's bullying by proxy.

Keep the discussion to rugby, if you have an issue with a post then report it.

molloyjh

wp_rathead wrote: »

yikes, sounds like you wanted to get that off your chest a while molloy 0_o

Not at all. I'm just sick of how low this place has been getting dragged lately. Sensible and friendly debate has been flung out the window for what is nothing short of utter nonsense at times. My ignore list has grown significantly in the last few weeks and will continue to do so for the foreseeable it would appear. At some point I'm going to have to ask myself if boards is really worth it. Which is disappointing because I've enjoyed it so much over the years.

jacothelad

molloyjh wrote: »

Not at all. I'm just sick of how low this place has been getting dragged lately. Sensible and friendly debate has been flung out the window for what is nothing short of utter nonsense at times. My ignore list has grown significantly in the last few weeks and will continue to do so for the foreseeable it would appear. At some point I'm going to have to ask myself if boards is really worth it. Which is disappointing because I've enjoyed it so much over the years.

It's a bit like Rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock. Scissors cuts paper, paper covers rock, rock crushes lizard, lizard poisons Spock, Spock smashes scissors, scissors decapitates lizard, lizard eats paper, paper disproves Spock, Spock vaporizes rock, and as it always has, rock crushes scissors.

irishbucsfan

molloyjh wrote: »

Not at all. I'm just sick of how low this place has been getting dragged lately. Sensible and friendly debate has been flung out the window for what is nothing short of utter nonsense at times. My ignore list has grown significantly in the last few weeks and will continue to do so for the foreseeable it would appear. At some point I'm going to have to ask myself if boards is really worth it. Which is disappointing because I've enjoyed it so much over the years.

It takes a serious amount of messing to get yourself put on molloyjh's ignore list.

Discussion on here during internationals is a bit like a Liveleak video. You know it's going to be awful and you know you're going to regret it but it's almost impossible to refrain from.

It's quite telling that some people have never had a good word to say about Ireland under Joe during a period when we've won two 6 Nations. Some people would only be too delighted to see us slip back to 5th in the 6 Nations rather than continue to improve.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

jacothelad wrote: »

It's a bit like Rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock. Scissors cuts paper, paper covers rock, rock crushes lizard, lizard poisons Spock, Spock smashes scissors, scissors decapitates lizard, lizard eats paper, paper disproves Spock, Spock vaporizes rock, and as it always has, rock crushes scissors.

irishbucsfan

jacothelad wrote: »

It's a bit like Rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock. Scissors cuts paper, paper covers rock, rock crushes lizard, lizard poisons Spock, Spock smashes scissors, scissors decapitates lizard, lizard eats paper, paper disproves Spock, Spock vaporizes rock, and as it always has, rock crushes scissors.

I think these two sentences say more about the cultural differences between the North and the South than I ever could.

rsh118

It's mad the amount of whinging/wanting to cap the youth occurring when we are in with a realistic (fairly) shot of winning 3 6N in a row. Offer me that in 2008 and if have just about snapped not only your hand, but most of your shoulder off too.

wp_rathead

molloyjh wrote: »

Not at all. I'm just sick of how low this place has been getting dragged lately. Sensible and friendly debate has been flung out the window for what is nothing short of utter nonsense at times. My ignore list has grown significantly in the last few weeks and will continue to do so for the foreseeable it would appear. At some point I'm going to have to ask myself if boards is really worth it. Which is disappointing because I've enjoyed it so much over the years.

ara sure it's just six nations season :cool:
it gets like this every year
I remember when Kidney kept picking Donnacha O'Callaghan this place was going mental :P

English Lurker

wp_rathead wrote: »

It is possible:
McCloskey goes 12- Henshaw moves to FB- Rob to the wing
But yes, it is a lot of juggling alright so McCloskey not ideal for bench

On the juggling thing - not aimed at you specifically rathead, but rather this was the first post I saw scrolling up on it and it's been nagging at me when lurking on this thread for a while - but England had a subs bench of 9 only, 10 only (barring moments when the game's already won) and 12 only last 6N and I don't think it harmed us. I'm sure I could think of other examples if I took a minute - it's really not an unusual way to play rugby.

Obviously, each to their own and if that's how Schmidt wants to play it I'm not the one to tell him otherwise, and it's not that Schmidt's current way is wrong, but specialist subs and backline juggling is a completely doable and rational way to approach the matter if so chosen.

Some people seem to be thinking/saying that utility subs is the only way to be doing it - I'd not go along with that.

Billysays no

wp_rathead wrote: »

It is possible:
McCloskey goes 12- Henshaw moves to FB- Rob to the wing
But yes, it is a lot of juggling alright so McCloskey not ideal for bench

i get so annoyed. Actually i really do get annoyed. In fact if i were to be honest i truly and honestly get annoyed. I guess its because i do love this game. And then i'm not saying people don't love this game. you cant win. its all only opinions. so i vehemently back my opinion :-)

The Black Stags

rsh118 wrote: »

It's mad the amount of whinging/wanting to cap the youth occurring when we are in with a realistic (fairly) shot of winning 3 6N in a row. Offer me that in 2008 and if have just about snapped not only your hand, but most of your shoulder off too.

But the argument isn't really like what you're portraying here.

The young players that people want capped aren't just being hauled out into conversation for the sake of getting some new blood in after a poor WC. They are actually the form players at the moment and people think that would improve our chances of a third 6 nations.

But anyway - Joe knows best he has all the information he could possible need at his disposal and will make the best decision possible to win.

rsh118

The Black Stags wrote: »

But the argument isn't really like what you're portraying here.

The young players that people want capped aren't just being hauled out into conversation for the sake of getting some new blood in after a poor WC. They are actually the form players at the moment and people think that would improve our chances of a third 6 nations.

But anyway - Joe knows best he has all the information he could possible need at his disposal and will make the best decision possible to win.

I agree with you to an extent, they are certainly the form players, but I think the argument has changed a little in the last 7 days.

Originally it seemed to centre around the idea that we would finish 3rd or 4th anyway and therefore it might be worth playing more guys with less international experience. Not to say that's what everyone felt, because it isn't in fairness.

I guess I just think that form should only be one factor in the argument, cf Ma'a Nonu who had a real talent for being ****e at super rugby and at the same time the world's best 12.

Still want McCloskey in there myself though, and Jackson.

Neil3030

rsh118 wrote: »

It's mad the amount of whinging/wanting to cap the youth occurring when we are in with a realistic (fairly) shot of winning 3 6N in a row. Offer me that in 2008 and if have just about snapped not only your hand, but most of your shoulder off too.

I'm presuming the majority on here are in a similar demographic to myself - late twenties to early thirties, played and attended club matches as a kid, played in school if your school had a team, watched Five Nations matches against the likes of England or France just hoping we'd keep the score respectable, etc. To be in with a crack of three consecutive Six Nations titles is simply dreamworld for me, Schmidt could field his mother and I'd support the decision.

Then I suspect there are the few who got into the game largely on the back of provincial successes in the mid to late naughties and KNOW NOTHING OF OUR PAIN. The first provincial cut being the deepest, it forces all perspectives through a provincial filter. Which is fair enough, it's just at odds with how the majority of people interested in the Six Nations look at things.

Oh and some people.... some people are just jerks.

Billysays no

Neil3030 wrote: »

late twenties to early thirties

1920s into 1930s. With you on this. Getting a bit hard to type these days so I ask my grandson to do it for me

rsh118

I'd almost forgotten the pain

astonaidan

Dont really post in here as its not really worth the drama. But Fergus getting selected is a joke. Its a safe selection if ever their has been one.
TOH has done much more to deserve getting selected this season, Gilroy aswell. Im not Dave Kearneys biggest fan but hes been playing well and with Bowes injury and Earls, hes the next bet taking that Zebo looks to be converting to fb and injured to.
But looking at Fergus on the bench this week, really pissed me off

CatFromHue

astonaidan wrote: »

Dont really post in here as its not really worth the drama. But Fergus getting selected is a joke. Its a safe selection if ever their has been one.
TOH has done much more to deserve getting selected this season, Gilroy aswell. Im not Dave Kearneys biggest fan but hes been playing well and with Bowes injury and Earls, hes the next bet taking that Zebo looks to be converting to fb and injured to.
But looking at Fergus on the bench this week, really pissed me off

You have to put it, McFadden's selection, into context though and also where he is in the 23.

What I mean is look at the best selection for the bench to cover as many positions in the back line as possible.

Unless there's an injury I can't see him playing any part tomorrow.

Gilroy is in much better form than McFadden but is he a better bench option?

astonaidan

CatFromHue wrote: »

You have to put it, McFadden's selection, into context though and also where he is in the 23.

What I mean is look at the best selection for the bench to cover as many positions in the back line as possible.

Unless there's an injury I can't see him playing any part tomorrow.

I am putting it into context infairness, both TOH and Gilroy are well able to cover FB and wing and have been miles ahead of Fergus this season. Fergus is what Fergus is a average pro 12 winger.
I would love if JS just cut lose from these sort of selections tbh, for me its my only critique of him, his coaching style is a winning style, it was much easier at Leinster, they had what 30 games a season to get these group of lads playing the way they played, with outside players to help him
Thats not really possible with the national team, but just because they players were solid choices for 23 at club level, doesnt mean they should be anywhere near the squad never mind the team

CatFromHue

McFadden is prob better than that but he's not in great form at the moment so that's a fair comment.

I don't think TOH has any time with the Senior squad so will have zero knowledge of of the attacking moves, how the team is structured, or how they defend. Gilroy doesn't have much more either but McFadden does have a bit. So in a week where they barely trained that knowledge comes in vital. As you say yourself he doesn't have alot of time with these guys and even less on a 6 day turn around week when you lose 2 back 3 players and a week after you lost another (Fitzgerald).

You know yourself that if a guy, no matter how good, shows up with only one or two training session under his belt before a game (like TOH or Gilroy would) they're going to be lost come game time. An inferior player who at least knows the moves is going to perform better than them.

Billysays no

CatFromHue wrote: »

McFadden is prob better than that but he's not in great form at the moment so that's a fair comment.

I don't think TOH has any time with the Senior squad so will have zero knowledge of of the attacking moves, how the team is structured, or how they defend. Gilroy doesn't have much more either but McFadden does have a bit. So in a week where they barely trained that knowledge comes in vital. As you say yourself he doesn't have alot of time with these guys and even less on a 6 day turn around week when you lose 2 back 3 players and a week after you lost another (Fitzgerald).

You know yourself that if a guy, no matter how good, shows up with only one or two training session under his belt before a game (like TOH or Gilroy would) they're going to be lost come game time. An inferior player who at least knows the moves is going to perform better than them.

while i have pushed the same toh/gilroy argument you make a very valid point

astonaidan

CatFromHue wrote: »

McFadden is prob better than that but he's not in great form at the moment so that's a fair comment.

I don't think TOH has any time with the Senior squad so will have zero knowledge of of the attacking moves, how the team is structured, or how they defend. Gilroy doesn't have much more either but McFadden does have a bit. So in a week where they barely trained that knowledge comes in vital. As you say yourself he doesn't have alot of time with these guys and even less on a 6 day turn around week when you lose 2 back 3 players and a week after you lost another (Fitzgerald).

You know yourself that if a guy, no matter how good, shows up with only one or two training session under his belt before a game (like TOH or Gilroy would) they're going to be lost come game time. An inferior player who at least knows the moves is going to perform better than them.

You make a good point, the only argument Id have is why they werent called up to the squad at the start to get familiar with the moves then released back to provinces, this is more a IRFU problem though

CatFromHue

I suppose that in the last week or so we've just lost 3 wingers in Earls, Zebo, and Fitzgerald so if Schmidt had called up Gilroy we would have had Earls, Trimble, Dk, Rk, Zebo, and Gilroy all in camp at once which would have had Les Kiss saying what are you doing with my player, I need him for 2 games.

With McCloskey I think it's better for him to be starting games with Ulster than holding tackle bags with Ireland. Come the Summer it may be different but at the moment you have to remember before this season he'd only 10 Pro 12 starts and 1 European Cup start.

galwaylad14

wp_rathead wrote: »

ara sure it's just six nations season :cool:
it gets like this every year
I remember when Kidney kept picking Donnacha O'Callaghan this place was going mental :P

I won't lie I've been acting the bollocks on this page all week complaining about a couple of Connacht lads not getting picked and going on about how superior they are to Dave Kearney and McFadden especially (in reality I think these are marginal calls at best and I fully understand why Joe would pick the guys he's more familiar with)

I've no doubt Tiernan, Healy, Marmion, Dillane etc will all get their chance with Ireland under Joe.

But the ultimate ****storm I remember here about selections, and I usen't post here back then, just read the page, was when Kidney kept picking O'Gara and Paddy Wallace on the bench. Must have been 2011 or 2012. It just really made no sense to have an out half and an out-half/1st centre as your only backs on the bench, would literally have been the equivalent of Schmidt picking Jackson and Madigan as the two backs subs.

But I remember the place going mental over it, I think if a winger got injured the plan needed to involve about 4 positional switches that would have lead to Wallace going to centre, D'Arcy to full back and Kearney to the wing or something mad like that.

It does show the logic in Schmidt wanting versatile subs, though I still think Gilory really should have been involved this week. He's in a different class to McFadden as an outside back.

But then again Joe picks the team and how many Bouclier de Brennus/Heineken Cups/Six Nations championships have any of us won? None.

molloyjh

molloyjh wrote: »

Not at all. I'm just sick of how low this place has been getting dragged lately. Sensible and friendly debate has been flung out the window for what is nothing short of utter nonsense at times. My ignore list has grown significantly in the last few weeks and will continue to do so for the foreseeable it would appear. At some point I'm going to have to ask myself if boards is really worth it. Which is disappointing because I've enjoyed it so much over the years.

Its usually just during the international window but it's been fairly continuous since the world cup. It's quite telling that no one is bothering signing up to do match threads this year.

Anyway, it's match day WOOOOOOO!

former total

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Its usually just during the international window but it's been fairly continuous since the world cup. It's quite telling that no one is bothering signing up to do match threads this year.

Anyway, it's match day WOOOOOOO!

For all the abuse directed at Joe this week, it's a great sign that the selection people are so incensed about is the reserve outside back. It shows that, despite all the accusations of Leinster bias, conservatism and whatever else, people fundamentally agree with what he's doing but just need something to rant about.

There is ALWAYS at least one selection that, regardless of who is picked or how the team is doing, brings down all sorts of invective on Joe's head. It's just the way of the Internet. So it's McFadden's turn this week. Grand. Earls will be back next week and the greatest injustice since <Hook-esque biblical reference> will be righted once more.

So yeah, let's get behind the team. WOOOOOOO