24 yo Pax dies on AerLingus from Lisbon

Dodge

Aerohead wrote: »

The people giving out these recordings to the newspapers are going to ruin our hobby the same with giving flight radar24 details.

One of the weirdest posts I've read on here.

Aragneer

Although a young man died in a tragic way, I still feel that he shouldn't be portrayed as a tragic victim. He was smuggling drugs when it is illegal to do so and he had got on that flight, prepared to either take or sell these drugs. Selling the drugs (depending on what they are) could or would ruin other people's lives and could potentially lead to other deaths (again, depending on the drugs).

Whilst of course, it is sad and tragic that a young life passed on today, it should not be forgotten that this young lad was a criminal, if reports are correct.

Bit on the cuff with this one really Not sure what to think.

AGC

Aragneer wrote: »

he had got on that flight, prepared to either take or sell these drugs. Selling the drugs (depending on what they are) could or would ruin other people's lives and could potentially lead to other deaths (again, depending on the drugs).

Or pass them onto someone who has forced him to bring them??

If he is smuggling it is highly unlikely he is going to be making profit from it.

LXFlyer

Storm 10 wrote: »

Just because someone died does not mean you should hand over cockpit recordings to the media. What has the fact he died got to do with the recording.

The point I was making is that Irish ATC is freely available online - no one had to "hand it over".

There is a bigger picture here than what might happen to a hobby.

One person is dead and all the people and crew on that flight had a nightmare experience that they won't forget anytime soon.

I am sorry, but I really do think people should have a bit more cop on.

notharrypotter

cockpit recordings

Are not publicly available.

Aerohead

Dodge wrote: »

One of the weirdest posts I've read on here.

What's weird about it, most if not all here listen into ATC traffic, what if the authorities sit up and take note of handing over a recordings of what happened to the press, the day could very well come when they make it illegal to possess an Air Band receiver.

ImDave

Aerohead wrote: »

What's weird about it, most if not all here listen into ATC traffic, what if the authorities sit up and take note of handing over a recordings of what happened to the press, the day could very well come when they make it illegal to possess an Air Band receiver.

It's not like its a secret you know! The press, particularly in the US, have been playing ATC recordings on TV and online for years.

andy_g

And less of the speculation please. Keep it civil and if you cant be civil step away for a bit then rethink what you wish to post.

DEFTLEFTHAND

My mother was on this flight. She said it was absolutely horrific, she was queing for the toilet when the incident began, he was walking over seats and trollies to get to the back, he put his arm up on her shoulder to get past her. He then went into the cubicle and sat down on the toilet seat, the door was open, he eyes started rolling back in his head. At this stage she went back to her seat as she was frightened, when he came out he started banging and shouting and had to be restrained, two nurses and psychologist were on board.

They performed CPR on him and he died a good half an hour before landing. They were left sitting on the plane for about two hours at Cork and every passenger was interviewed by guards. She's pretty shuck up about it today, feels very sorry for the chap, he had a horrible death.

my friend

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

My mother was on this flight. She said it was absolutely horrific, she was queing for the toilet when the incident began, he was walking over seats and trollies to get to the back, he put his arm up on her shoulder to get past her. He then went into the cubicle and sat down on the toilet seat, the door was open, he eyes started rolling back in his head. At this stage she went back to her seat as she was frightened, when he came out he started banging and shouting and had to be restrained, two nurses and psychologist were on board.

They performed CPR on him and he died a good half an hour before landing. They were left sitting on the plane for about two hours at Cork and every passenger was interviewed by guards. She's pretty shuck up about it today, feels very sorry for the chap, he had a horrible death.

A scene right out of a Halloween / zombie movie, the poor lady, horrific.

riclad

it seems there,s always some people who will go on planes carrying drugs .
Even though theres a high chance of detection from sniffer dogs and xray machines .
There was a woman arrested on the flight for carrying drugs in her luggage .

simdan

Rte news just posted that they found several packages inside the man. The plane is grounded and a woman is being held in custody

kub

Does EI have spare aircraft? Just imagining that with this one impounded by Gardai that they would be down 1.

Diamond Doll

Whatever he might have done wrong when he was alive, that sounds like a f*cking nasty way to die.

simdan

kub wrote:

Does EI have spare aircraft? Just imagining that with this one impounded by Gardai that they would be down 1.

They have 48 planes. It's only 2% but I'd say it will hit them hard

refusetolose

"And the aircraft - which Gardai had been treating as a crime scene - has since been released back to Aer Lingus."

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/packages-removed-from-body-of-man-who-died-on-aer-lingus-flight-701480.html

Amalgam

'Amphetamine' mentioned on RTE Radio 1 News. Not MDMA, not Heroin. I find that quite an odd choice of drug for Ireland. More of an English thing.

RIP to the man, he must have been aware the situation he was in was grim..

fits

Amalgam wrote: »

'Amphetamine' mentioned on RTE Radio 1 News. Not MDMA, not Heroin. I find that quite an odd choice of drug for Ireland. More of an English thing.

RIP to the man, he must have been aware the situation he was in was grim..

Id be surprised if it was anything other than cocaine.

punisher5112

The guy knew the risk but was happy to do most likely as the pay out would have being high.

Sick of drugs, drug dealers and people that feed the habit.


Drugs ruin people and their families.

simdan

Amalgam wrote:

'Amphetamine' mentioned on RTE Radio 1 News. Not MDMA, not Heroin. I find that quite an odd choice of drug for Ireland. More of an English thing.

What do you think the A stands for in MDMA? Amphetamine could mean one of many things.

It's a sad day for all involved

Amalgam

They made the distinction, as far as I can recall. One is complex, one is rather crude in chemical structure.

Strumms

punisher5112 wrote: »

The guy knew the risk but was happy to do most likely as the pay out would have being high.

Sick of drugs, drug dealers and people that feed the habit.


Drugs ruin people and their families.

Think about what you are saying.. He was 'happy to do it' ? I wonder.. A rectum full of a chemical substance over a prolonged length of time which if gets out and into your body is going to lead to death ? And for what a couple of grand ? I doubt it was a career move, I doubt it was even a choice. Very likely to repay a debt or under some form or duress. People make awful decisions in life sometimes that can take them to dark places.. I hate drugs too.. And drug dealers.. I'm sure this guys family and friends fell pretty much the same too.... It's the top level guys that are the a scurge not some poor ****ing mule... We are also being grossly nieve if we think drugs and there availability in society are not also facilitated by the establishment and people working in law enforcement either btw...

SeanBan86

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

galwayjohn89

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

Sums up pretty much everything I hate with the legal system in one post.

Would EI or Lisbon airport have a duty of care to detect drug mule? I wouldn't expect them too.

lotmc

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

No chance. Aer Lingus (and Lisbon Airport) are not obliged to conduct full internal body scans on all passengers. They would only be negligent if they had such an obligation, and failed to do so.
If passengers want compo they can sue, but will have a very tough time establishing negligence.

joeysoap

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

Bull****: Its that mentality that has the country bolloxed. Since when did Aer Lingus/Ryanair/EasyJet etc become responsible for carrying out body searches on passengers to detect drugs? Why not go the whole way and pay compensation for the loss of drugs? I suppose if you had been on that aircraft that ''landed' in the Hudson a few years ago you would have considered the pilot negligent for flying into a bird strike and then ditching in the river.

I read reports tonight that the lady in custody is a 'consultant' helping non EU citizens with their visa applications etc. Easy to spot a few mules in there I suspect.

newacc2015

Vuzuggu wrote: »

Sums up pretty much everything I hate with the legal system in one post.

Would EI or Lisbon airport have a duty of care to detect drug mule? I wouldn't expect them too.

Its not like Lisbon to Dublin is a trafficking route. The likes of Peru to Europe would be constantly checked for Coke, as its a trafficking route

My friend went to Amsterdam this year. There was sniffer dogs sniffing bags at the boarding gate in Dublin. Imagine looking for large amount of Cash

gctest50

newacc2015 wrote: »

Its not like Lisbon to Dublin is a trafficking route.......

tis now

The Rape of Lucretia

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

Please concede this is a wind-up.

Cessna_Pilot

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

Jesus wept

my friend

newacc2015 wrote: »

Its not like Lisbon to Dublin is a trafficking route.

? Huh

What are you talking about?

plenty of flights from Rio to Lisbon , mule alley

Tom Dunne

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

Utterly, utterly disgusting post.

"Let's see if I can get some money out of a tragic event. I'm not fussy, car crash, drug mule dying a horrible death on an airline? I'm not fussy. Just give me the money. It's my right"

deandean

my friend wrote: »

Extreme incident, medical tragedy or pellets bursting?

Good call there OP. Right on all three counts.

my friend

deandean wrote: »

Good call there OP. Right on all three counts.

I'm in the wrong business

Razor44

SeanBan86 wrote: »

AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

Negligence is all more or less based around reasonable forsee ability. Also what reasonable steps are taken to prevent Negligence.
Also to recover for nervous shock in Ireland is pretty hard. So they couldn't really claim for much at all. Plus the people who did cpr on him etc could maybe considered rescuers, so that also changes things. That's my limited understanding of the concept.

Either way it's not a nice way to go at all.

On another note dvi positioned to Dublin last night.

afatbollix

Well it has been confirmed that he had €60k worth of cocaine in his stomach. He had 80 pellets in him! Mad! Such a silly risk to take..



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/aer-lingus-passenger-john-kennedy-santos-gurjao-who-died-after-biting-fellow-traveller-had-41000-a6700806.html

Wanderer78

afatbollix wrote: »

Well it has been confirmed that he had €60k worth of cocaine in his stomach. He had 80 pellets in him! Mad! Such a silly risk to take..

jebus the pain of that. i wonder was the young fella coherst into it?

Irish Steve

SeanBan86 wrote: »

The other passenger on this flight were surely terrified by what went on. As said, a poster's mother was traumatized by it all.

I wonder would passengers be entitled to make a negligence claim against the airline or the airport in Lisbon and get damages? AFAIK it is legitimate to sue on the basis of psychological trauma caused to a third party through witnessing a horrible event. Example, a passerby who witnesses a horribly graphic car crash could have a legitimate claim against the person in the wrong for psych trauma even though they themselves were not physically involved in the crash.

In this instance the pax could sue AL or lisbon airport on the basis that they failed to detect this man and/or his drugs and as a consequence the events of the day ensued causing such an ordeal to all the other pax.

AL/ lisbon airport have a duty of care towards all their pax to keep them from harm, physical or mental.
+ AL/lisbon airport failed in that duty of care by not detecting the drug mule
+ Passengers suffered mental trauma from the resulting ordeal, (ie an injury/loss)
= Negligence.

There's a simple solution to your problem.

Find an airline that will allow you to check in at least 3 days before the flight, requires you to strip naked for the security scan before entering the holding facility and accept a body cavity searches and swab check of all orifices, and keep you in strict quarantine with intrusive security everywhere, including showers and toilets, so that they can be sure that nothing inappropriate has been swallowed by a passenger.

Good luck on that one. The cost might be somewhat prohibitive.

Are you related to an ambulance chaser by any chance?

duskyjoe

I read the lady allegedly accompanying the deceased was carrying 2kg of "powder" with her that was not narcotics or an illegal substance .,..Wonder was she doing a dry run?

Odelay

duskyjoe wrote: »

I read the lady allegedly accompanying the deceased was carrying 2kg of "powder" with her that was not narcorics. Wonder was she doing a dry run?

Maybe a distraction? Or letting on she was doing it too where he was taking all the risk?

aviator7

Odelay wrote: »

Maybe a distraction? Or letting on she was doing it too where he was taking all the risk?

Maybe he had the potent stuff and she was carrying whatever mixing agent they use?

I'm just guessing... I'm no expert on it all!

Also, seems like an expensive ordeal for Aerlingus. Buses for passengers and crew to Dublin, having a plane out of service held by gardai for a day, arranging transport for crew to fly the plane back to Dublin, cost of fuel and crew on a ferry flight. Must have cost them a massive amount of money.

RIP to the young man anyway. A very sad situation regardless of his decisions.

Locker10a

aviator7 wrote: »

Also, seems like an expensive ordeal for Aerlingus. Buses for passengers and crew to Dublin, having a plane out of service held by gardai for a day, arranging transport for crew to fly the plane back to Dublin, cost of fuel and crew on a ferry flight. Must have cost them a massive amount of money.

All part and parcel of running an airline! These sort of displacement cost are common and happen on a monthly sometimes weekly basis due to weather, tech aircraft etc! Its a very very costly business to be in

Dodge

joeysoap wrote: »

Bull****: Its that mentality that has the country bolloxed.

To be fair, it's one bloke on the internet. He's not representative of the thinking on this thread, so shouldn't be representative of the country either.

homerjay2005

Dodge wrote: »

To be fair, it's one bloke on the internet. He's not representative of the thinking on this thread, so shouldn't be representative of the country either.

unfortunately, there is a huge compensation culture in this country. there are certain type of people who believe they are entitled to every penny they can get off the state and then call foul on everything when they are expected to pay something themselves.

Magico Gonzalez

South American drugs are currently flowing into Europe via the disastrous situation in north africa in vast quantities, often through doing deals with local warlords or worse. These mules are often small time operations based out of mutual desperation and sometimes even sent out with the hope they fail. Distractions whille the big amounts flood in with bribes paid and people looking the other direction. There are bigger criminals in this whole chain than some unfortunate who needed to take the risk to make some money. Right now the Peruvian army are under the microscope for letting planeloads pass through their airspace.

Bigger fish to fry, and the only way to do it is legalisation and treating addiction as a medical issue. Sadly.

Anyone who wants to get their hands on this stuff right now can.

fr336

aviator7 wrote: »

Also, seems like an expensive ordeal for Aerlingus. Buses for passengers and crew to Dublin, having a plane out of service held by gardai for a day, arranging transport for crew to fly the plane back to Dublin, cost of fuel and crew on a ferry flight. Must have cost them a massive amount of money.

It's a business, what's expensive to individuals isn't as expensive to them. I'm sure they'll cope!

joeysoap

Also, didn't we read in the ST a few weeks ago that Portugal no longer treats using heroin/cocain as an offence. They apparently decided about 10 years ago that it was a losing battle so they stopped trying and now just go after the bigger pushers. Also apparently quite successful in Portugal itself by all accounts, addicts numbers are well down in the 10 years but of course it makes it easier for 'small' time pushers here to purchase stuff there and ship it here. Wasn't somebody caught at Cork a few weeks ago coming from Faro with drugs?

here we go

https://mises.org/library/portugal%E2%80%99s-experiment-drug-decriminalization-has-been-success