Events Centre

mikeym

This is beyond a joke.

Why do people vote for FG?

cgcsb

mikeym wrote: »

This is beyond a joke.

Why do people vote for FG?

It's hardly FGs fault

the beer revolu

cgcsb wrote: »

It's hardly FGs fault

Everything is the current government's fault!
Everyone knows that.

Mumha

mikeym wrote: »

This is beyond a joke.

Why do people vote for FG?

And what miracle party would you advise people to vote for ?

vkid

Mumha wrote: »

And what miracle party would you advise people to vote for ?

Enda, Simon and Co should not have gone for the cheap photo op around this project for election gain, if they didn't want to take some heat for it.

cgcsb

vkid wrote: »

Enda, Simon and Co should not have gone for the cheap photo op around this project for election gain, if they didn't want to take some heat for it.

There isn't a political party in Ireland, Europe and perhaps the world that would not do the same. The failure of the project is nothing got to do with FG policy though.

j8wk2feszrnpao

cgcsb wrote: »

There isn't a political party in Ireland, Europe and perhaps the world that would not do the same. The failure of the project is nothing got to do with FG policy though.

Maybe not, but they'd be quick to take claim for it (as proven by the photo opportunity they took).
To say the failure has nothing to do with FG is being very kind to them.

Mumha

vkid wrote: »

Enda, Simon and Co should not have gone for the cheap photo op around this project for election gain, if they didn't want to take some heat for it.

It was a slam dunk cheap photo op, and as another poster wrote, any other political party in the same situation would have done the same. The fact that, as has been reported, the delays since then have been caused by wrangling between the developer, the operator and planning, were outside their control, doesn't stop other political parties from getting a kick in. I'm sure if it was FF in government, FG would be with the rest of the chorus, preaching from the sidelines. Don't let the actual facts get in the way of cheap shots.

Mumha

munstermagic11 wrote: »

To say the failure has nothing to do with FG is being very kind to them.

Please explain what you mean ?

vkid

Mumha wrote: »

It was a slam dunk cheap photo op, and as another poster wrote, any other political party in the same situation would have done the same. The fact that, as has been reported, the delays since then have been caused by wrangling between the developer, the operator and planning, were outside their control, doesn't stop other political parties from getting a kick in. I'm sure if it was FF in government, FG would be with the rest of the chorus, preaching from the sidelines. Don't let the actual facts get in the way of cheap shots.

There is 20 / possibly 32 million of public money going into this thing and Coveney has been well capable of making statements about the place over the last 12 months and more. Its irrelevant what FF or SF or AAA would do, could do or should do. FG are in power (kind of) and they should be in control of projects involving public money ( promised or paid out)...or at least aware of what is going on with them. None of them seemed to have a clue up to the recent meeting. Not a clue...blind empty statements about work starting this week, month...take your pick.

Thats a failing of the government right there...and a big one.

To say its not their fault is being kind imo, but whatever you are having yourself.

j8wk2feszrnpao

Mumha wrote: »

Please explain what you mean ?

ofcork

Permission has been granted for the extra student accommodation.

Mumha

Myles Mealy Drunk wrote: »

That's a photo op, we've been through that. What else ?

Mumha

vkid wrote: »

There is 20 / possibly 32 million of public money going into this thing and Coveney has been well capable of making statements about the place over the last 12 months and more. Its irrelevant what FF or SF or AAA would do, could do or should do. FG are in power (kind of) and they should be in control of projects involving public money ( promised or paid out)...or at least aware of what is going on with them. None of them seemed to have a clue up to the recent meeting. Not a clue...blind empty statements about work starting this week, month...take your pick.

Thats a failing of the government right there...and a big one.

To say its not their fault is being kind imo, but whatever you are having yourself.

If the event centre doesn't happen, what you state would be fair comment and on the ball (and Coveney would be rightly hammered for it), but not at the moment. And it would be the City Council as well, as it is their baby.

Up to now, we have had O'Callaghan stirring the sh1t with his ill-conceived efforts to derail the Beamish through his intervention and the intervention of his "boys" on the City Council. Not to mention the Livenation misgivings about the internal design, the re-design of the Office v Student Accommodation and BAM screwing as much as they can in extra state funds.

j8wk2feszrnpao

Mumha wrote: »

That's a photo op, we've been through that. What else ?

If you agree with the stance that they have zero fault in all this, then no need to waste time.

Mumha

Myles Mealy Drunk wrote: »

If you agree with the stance that they have zero fault in all this, then no need to waste time.

Of course they don't have zero fault (at the very least in creating the expectation of a start date, yet they have allocated Govt money to this project where previous goverments haven't), but there are others as I have posted earlier, with much greater fault yet you don't rail against them ?

j8wk2feszrnpao

Mumha wrote: »

Of course they don't have zero fault (at the very least in creating the expectation of a start date, yet they have allocated Govt money to this project where previous goverments haven't), but there are others as I have posted earlier, with much greater fault yet you don't rail against them ?

Can you point out where I railed against them?
I simple replied to a comment, stating it is very kind to absolve them of any blame.

opus

I happened to walk past it earlier, there was one machine in there loading rubble onto a truck, going by the size of the heaps it's going to take a while but guess they're in no rush :rolleyes:

Mumha

opus wrote: »

I happened to walk past it earlier, there was one machine in there loading rubble onto a truck, going by the size of the heaps it's going to take a while but guess they're in no rush :rolleyes:

It'll be interesting to take a pic from the same position in a week, to see what, if anything, has gone from that pile.

DylanGLC

Does anyone have any update on this? Is it going to get the extra funding or should we just give up hope? I wonder how far progressed the build would be now had it been on the other site

flo8s967qjh0nd

DylanGLC wrote: »

Does anyone have any update on this? Is it going to get the extra funding or should we just give up hope? I wonder how far progressed the build would be now had it been on the other site

The meeting last month seems to have done its job - distracted everyone and bought some more time to drag out this disaster. Everyone seems to have gone quiet. Even the twitter account has gone to ground.

flo8s967qjh0nd

They must have been reading the thread
http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Final-Cork-Events-Centre-costings-to-be-sent-to-the-government-following-Bam-meeting-bb6a6eed-4df8-4371-a010-39c8804d55fe-ds

DylanGLC

Nancy Unkempt Shop wrote: »

They must have been reading the thread
http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Final-Cork-Events-Centre-costings-to-be-sent-to-the-government-following-Bam-meeting-bb6a6eed-4df8-4371-a010-39c8804d55fe-ds

Pray and cross your fingers it actually happens! I only found out about this build at all until recently and it has been agonising waiting for proper development on it - not sure how people have stayed sane waiting since last year (and for any efforts made prior to this location). I believe Cork has a lot going for it, but one area it is certainly lacking is entertainment. For me personally, outside of the cinema and 'shopping', there is very little to do. The Events Centre would be a huge deal

BullBlackNova

DylanGLC wrote: »

Pray and cross your fingers it actually happens! I only found out about this build at all until recently and it has been agonising waiting for proper development on it - not sure how people have stayed sane waiting since last year (and for any efforts made prior to this location). I believe Cork has a lot going for it, but one area it is certainly lacking is entertainment. For me personally, outside of the cinema and 'shopping', there is very little to do. The Events Centre would be a huge deal

I reckon people are setting themselves up for some serious disappointment here.

Bam indicated that the centre will have occupancy 200 or so days a year. I think it was '3 days per week' they said, but going by every other centre in the country, that will naturally mean 4-5 on busy weeks and 1 on quieter weeks. No issues there.

But, it is a concert, theatre and convention centre - multi-purpose, not singular.

Cork already has a relatively busy convention sector - just ask the hotel sector, they're swamped on Tuesdays and Wednesdays most weeks - and I feel like a lot of these events will be moved to the event centre instead.

If they are taking up 2-3 days per weeks for part of the year, it is a sizable chunk of the occupancy that they are aiming for already.

These events will still be of huge benefit to the city and to the nearby businesses, but I reckon the centre will have far less for the average punter than many people are anticipating. A lot more business focused events and conventions than, say, live music events, for example.

In fact, listen to anyone from the business community speak about it (Chamber, CBA, etc.) - they all refer to it as a convention centre, not an event centre. That's what they're billing it as, that's probably what it'll be.

Obviously, this is speculation on my part but I just don't think Cork has the population to currently sustain a live music and theatre scene that would need to sell ~15,000 seats per week.

Obviously, Live Nation are in this business and they will know that, hence the reason they are so insistent on the versatility of the venue. I reckon we will get some gigs, etc., but not as many as people are expecting.

That is, of course, taking Bam at their word that they will start soon, etc.

DylanGLC

BullBlackNova wrote: »

I reckon people are setting themselves up for some serious disappointment here.

Bam indicated that the centre will have occupancy 200 or so days a year. I think it was '3 days per week' they said, but going by every other centre in the country, that will naturally mean 4-5 on busy weeks and 1 on quieter weeks. No issues there.

But, it is a concert, theatre and convention centre - multi-purpose, not singular.

Cork already has a relatively busy convention sector - just ask the hotel sector, they're swamped on Tuesdays and Wednesdays most weeks - and I feel like a lot of these events will be moved to the event centre instead.

If they are taking up 2-3 days per weeks for part of the year, it is a sizable chunk of the occupancy that they are aiming for already.

These events will still be of huge benefit to the city and to the nearby businesses, but I reckon the centre will have far less for the average punter than many people are anticipating. A lot more business focused events and conventions than, say, live music events, for example.

In fact, listen to anyone from the business community speak about it (Chamber, CBA, etc.) - they all refer to it as a convention centre, not an event centre. That's what they're billing it as, that's probably what it'll be.

Obviously, this is speculation on my part but I just don't think Cork has the population to currently sustain a live music and theatre scene that would need to sell ~15,000 seats per week.

Obviously, Live Nation are in this business and they will know that, hence the reason they are so insistent on the versatility of the venue. I reckon we will get some gigs, etc., but not as many as people are expecting.

That is, of course, taking Bam at their word that they will start soon, etc.

That was actually what I was mostly expecting. My idea is that when an act comes to Dublin (Drake a few weeks ago, Shawn Mendes, Ariana Grande and Ed Sheeran in the coming months) they would also come to Cork. So maybe five 'big' acts per summer, and a few spread out over the rest of the year. I think I also read they plan on having it support an ice rink? I wonder if that is still possible, and if so, if it would become the new home for Cork On Ice (although if you're right about it being so busy for business meetings, they probably couldn't close it off for the whole of December)

Mumha

BullBlackNova wrote: »

I reckon people are setting themselves up for some serious disappointment here.

Bam indicated that the centre will have occupancy 200 or so days a year. I think it was '3 days per week' they said, but going by every other centre in the country, that will naturally mean 4-5 on busy weeks and 1 on quieter weeks. No issues there.

But, it is a concert, theatre and convention centre - multi-purpose, not singular.

Cork already has a relatively busy convention sector - just ask the hotel sector, they're swamped on Tuesdays and Wednesdays most weeks - and I feel like a lot of these events will be moved to the event centre instead.

If they are taking up 2-3 days per weeks for part of the year, it is a sizable chunk of the occupancy that they are aiming for already.

These events will still be of huge benefit to the city and to the nearby businesses, but I reckon the centre will have far less for the average punter than many people are anticipating. A lot more business focused events and conventions than, say, live music events, for example.

In fact, listen to anyone from the business community speak about it (Chamber, CBA, etc.) - they all refer to it as a convention centre, not an event centre. That's what they're billing it as, that's probably what it'll be.

Obviously, this is speculation on my part but I just don't think Cork has the population to currently sustain a live music and theatre scene that would need to sell ~15,000 seats per week.

Obviously, Live Nation are in this business and they will know that, hence the reason they are so insistent on the versatility of the venue. I reckon we will get some gigs, etc., but not as many as people are expecting.

That is, of course, taking Bam at their word that they will start soon, etc.

This is from the Echo this time last year

Friday, February 12, 2016


A HALF a million people will visit Cork city each year to attend the 200 concerts, shows, exhibitions and conferences at the new Cork Events Centre that was launched today.

Entertainment company Live Nation, who operate the Three Arena and Bord Gáis Energy Theatre in Dublin, said the new venue will have a €50m annual economic impact on the city.

....



Mike Adamson, Chief Executive if Live Nation Ireland (right), said they were focused on making the Cork Events Centre a unique venue so that the people of Cork will ‘own’ it.

“We will be targeting 170 to 200 performances per annum with a huge variety,” he said. “We believe the economic impact on Cork will be about €50m per annum, with about half a million people per year coming for concerts.”

“The great thing about the Cork Events Centre is that it will be hugely diverse. It will be a convention centre, it will have family shows, concerts, theatre, exhibitions. It’ll make it a very unique venue that can change very quickly from one format to another.

“It’ll be the first of its type. As the Three Arena was the first of its type and has been copied three times already elsewhere in Europe, I’m sure it will be the same with the Cork Events Centre. It’s an exciting project. Making it a customised venue so that it is multi purpose and customised for its population and give it an identity and give it character so that the city then ‘owns’ it and Cork will take it on.”

“When it is up and running there will 25 to 30 full time staff and then up to around 200 to 300 part time staff for performances including stewards, technical stage staff and production,” Mr Adamson said.

However there is more clarity from this Irish Times article last month, after the City Council/Bam meeting....

Developers, BAM are seeking an extra €12 million in public funding to help build a 6,000 seat events centre, Cork City Council was told last night

It comes after design changes sought by operator, Live Nation have pushed the overall cost of the Cork project from €53 million to €65 million.

Council sources pointed out to The Irish Times that if the government does grant the latest tranche of public money sought by BAM, it will bring the funding breakdown to almost 50 per cent private/50 per cent public with the public providing €32 million and BAM and Live Nation providing €33 million.

Mr Cullinane’s briefing with city councillors was held in committee so press were not present. Mr Cullinae refused to speak to the media either before or after the two hour meeting which was described by one informed source as “politely robust”.

However, according to the source, Mr Cullinane made the case that the project, located on the site of the former Beamish and Crawford brewery on South Main Street, would create 63 full time job and 585 spin off jobs in support services as well as the hospitality sector in Cork.

He said it was estimated that there would be returns to the government through general taxation while there would be a €200,000 a year return to Cork City Council in rates with a spin-off benefit to the Cork economy of between €17 and €18 million a year which would also have a tax yield.

He said the increased cost came from design changes sought by Live Nation, who only came on board after the tender process, which would see an expansion in the size of the centre from 10,000sq metres to 13,500sq metres to accommodate support facilities to make it a commercial success.

The final costings, outlined by Mr Cullinane and BAM, have to be approved by the Cork City Council design team and the council evaluation with be sent with BAM’s application for extra funding to the Dept of Public Expenditure, councillors were told at the briefing.

Cork's current convention capacity is in the small category compared to what the new event centre (and even PUC) will provide. It's a different scale entirely.

The fact that Livenation came back on board, have a financial interest in this, and went to the bother of demanding the expansion of the Event Centre footprint to ensure the viability of the business, gives hope imo. As you said yourself, Livenation know their business, they had pulled out but are now back in.

Let's not forget, it's as easy (if not easier) for all those from here to Dublin, to hop on the M8 and head south rather than north. And cheaper too.

DylanGLC

I assume any news on what the government say won't be till after the weekend. I really really hope this happens! September needs to come sooner.

Does anyone know anything on their other plans for the site, such as the student accommodation and offices?

Meursault

I am inclined to believe the extra money will be approved by the government. No doubt, Simon Coveney would have had discussions with Pascal O'Donoghue about the extra funding required, prior to the meeting with the Council and BAM. 

If Simon Coveney thought that government funding would not be forth-coming, the whole project would have been cancelled by now. There is no way he would want to protract this any a longer, especially given the fact that an election is likely in the near term. He would want the bad news over and done with as soon as possible to give him a chance for the south central constituents to forget about it and move on.

That's my optimistic take on it anyway.

Mumha

Meursault wrote: »

I am inclined to believe the extra money will be approved by the government. No doubt, Simon Coveney would have had discussions with Pascal O'Donoghue about the extra funding required, prior to the meeting with the Council and BAM. 

If Simon Coveney thought that government funding would not be forth-coming, the whole project would have been cancelled by now. There is no way he would want to protract this any a longer, especially given the fact that an election is likely in the near term. He would want the bad news over and done with as soon as possible to give him a chance for the south central constituents to forget about it and move on.

That's my optimistic take on it anyway.

I agree, having put so much political capital into this, Coveney would be toast if it fell through. Coveney had already been quoted before the Feb 20 meeting that POD was already amenable to giving the extra money.

ofcork

I see BAM are involved in a big building project in Dublin may concentrate on that and feck the event centre.