ESB public charging plans

Mike9832

slave1 wrote: »

Interesting that a good few years later it is only now imminent

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2019/0823/1070469-electric-car/

The ESB has said an announcement is expected "sometime next month" in relation to the cost of using their public charging network for electric cars.

The company says motorists will be given a notice period of "around a month" before the charges will come into force.

A spokesperson said that 90% of charging is still done at home and the costs for using the public charging network "will still be significantly cheaper" than running a petrol or diesel car.

Great news

Mike9832

DrPhilG wrote: »

That last paragraph is a worry. Suggests to me that they're going to big their arm in big time and justify it based on the theory that they're only price gouging 10% of your consumption.

Significantly cheaper than running a petrol or diesel "overall" but not on that particular journey when public charging is needed.

That's all well and good unless you're one of the very many early adopters who rely on the network regularly.

They've had a good run, time to buy right tools for the job now

unkel

DrPhilG wrote: »

That's all well and good unless you're one of the very many early adopters who rely on the network regularly.

It's excellent news for those people. The public network will be much more available (I deliberately did not use the word reliable though)

I expect the charges not to be more than what can be done by commercial companies, not paid for by the tax payer like Tesla, Ionity, etc. who seem happy enough to charge around the €0.40 per kWh mark. Which is fair enough. Even if you don't have home charging, that's per km still cheaper than diesel. On top of the low maintenance, low tax, discounted tolls, etc.

Absolutely no need for anyone to whinge about this.

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

It's excellent news for those people. The public network will be much more available

You're only addressing half of my statement.

Potentially good news for early adopters as chargers will be available. Thats good if they don't rely on them often.

But for those who use public chargers heavily, they will find themselves in a situation where a diesel would be cheaper to run.

Dont be at yourself

DrPhilG wrote: »

But for those who use public chargers heavily, they will find themselves in a situation where a diesel would be cheaper to run.

And that's fair enough -- as said above, people need to choose the right tools for the job. It makes no sense to price charging at a rate that will incentivise a small minority to use it in a way it's not intended.

unkel

DrPhilG wrote: »

But for those who use public chargers heavily, they will find themselves in a situation where a diesel would be cheaper to run.

Nope. I thought I made my point very clear? Even if you only ever charge at public fast chargers at 40c/kWh, your fuel is cheaper than diesel.

TJJP

ESB charging, app suggests (£/p)

1) Membership €4 per month, €0.25 per kWh

Or

2) Pay as you go, €0.29 per kWh

Or

3) Taxi plan, €0.25 per kWh introductory offer.

Del2005

Dont be at yourself wrote: »

And that's fair enough -- as said above, people need to choose the right tools for the job. It makes no sense to price charging at a rate that will incentivise a small minority to use it in a way it's not intended.

They will need to do something to incentivise people who don't have access to a home charger though. My journeys are ideal for a BEV but if I have to pay full whack to spend an hour charging there's no reason for me to change. There should be a way to link people's home electric account to their EV account if they can't access a home charger.

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

Nope. I thought I made my point very clear? Even if you only ever charge at public fast chargers at 40c/kWh, your fuel is cheaper than diesel.

But where did you get the 40c figure from?

And 40c/kWh may still be cheaper than diesel. But until now the enormous pain in the hole of relying on public chargers was negated by the savings.

If that saving is minimal, its no longer worth it.

I stuck with a Leaf for 3 years. Only car, 25k km a year and it was a drag having to use public charging a fair bit (not even that much). But I was saving €2k a year compared to diesel.

If I had that inconvenience and was only saving a few hundred a year I'd have ditched it.

DrPhilG

Dont be at yourself wrote: »

And that's fair enough -- as said above, people need to choose the right tools for the job. It makes no sense to price charging at a rate that will incentivise a small minority to use it in a way it's not intended.

Many of them did choose the right tool for the job at the time they bought.

It is not difficult to charge a sensible rate that both disincentivises abuse, but still maintains a significant saving over diesel.

The previous plan that eCars brought out, I think it was €16 a month plus 50c a minute, was far too high.

Grumpypants

The best way to do it would be to charge for time not kw. Say have the first 10mins relatively free, next 10 mins with a small increase so people can pop in a fast charge and shoot off again to make it home.

Which is how it should be used.

And then start ramping up the price for those that use it as a free parking space or try to slow charge for hours.

Black_Knight

TJJP wrote: »

ESB charging, app suggests (£/p)

1) Membership €4 per month, €0.25 per kWh

Or

2) Pay as you go, €0.29 per kWh

Or

3) Taxi plan, €0.25 per kWh introductory offer.

Where you pulling that from?

TJJP

Black_Knight wrote: »

Where you pulling that from?

The disaster area that is the new ESB EV Plug in app has a sign up area. The ESB ecars android app seems to be gone. When you try to sign up in EV Plug in app you get those three options in £/pence. The app is otherwise very UK looking so it may not be what's intended at all.

DrPhilG

TJJP wrote: »

The disaster area that is the new ESB EV Plug in app has a sign up area. The ESB ecars android app seems to be gone. When you try to sign up in EV Plug in app you get those three options in £/pence. The app is otherwise very UK looking so it may not be what's intended at all.

ESB supply chargers in the UK. Its probably their pricing over there.

drunkmonkey

Rookie question, if you plug in a leaf for egolf how many kw can you consumer in an hours charging.

This seems to be about getting a return for forecourt retailers, so let's say a garage puts in 5 chargers at a cost of 50k (figures based on 20million cost for 2000 chargers). How long before the retailer starts to see a return on their investment. I'd say it would be fair to say that all 5 chargers would be active for 10% of the time every 24hrs. (most garages are closed from 10pm to 7am)

charlieIRL

DrPhilG wrote: »

ESB supply chargers in the UK. Its probably their pricing over there.

I just signed up for this and then realised its UK only. No option to cancel on app either. D’oh.

Gumbo

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Rookie question, if you plug in a leaf for egolf how many kw can you consumer in an hours charging.

This seems to be about getting a return for forecourt retailers, so let's say a garage puts in 5 chargers at a cost of 50k (figures based on 20million cost for 2000 chargers). How long before the retailer starts to see a return on their investment. I'd say it would be fair to say that all 5 chargers would be active for 10% of the time every 24hrs. (most garages are closed from 10pm to 7am)

Depends on the speed of the charger you install and then the speed that the on board charger can take.

The i3 can take 50kw charging I believe so in theory that’s 50 kw in an hour so the garage would be down 50 kWh. (50x0.18c = €9 based on full rate home charging). But the battery is only 33 kWh (newer one is 42ish or something) so it would be full in less than an hour not accounting for loses and charging speeds tapering off etc.

drunkmonkey

Right so, if we run with that, $9 cost for 50kw, 5 chargers going for 2.4hrs a day each. 45 in costs. Charging Unkles .40c per kw. They should make 55 a day profit. So it'll take 909 days to pay back the outlay for the garage. Less than 3yrs, that's about right from an investment point of view if the charge is .40c

DrPhilG

Lol, minister Shane Ross tweeted a picture today, boasting that he had found a charge point in Marley Park and suggesting that there was no shortage of public points.

Except the charger isn't commissioned, has never worked yet.

He since deleted the tweet but it has been well captured by screen shot.

expectationlost

DrPhilG wrote: »

Lol, minister Shane Ross tweeted a picture today, boasting that he had found a charge point in Marley Park and suggesting that there was no shortage of public points.

Except the charger isn't commissioned, has never worked yet.

He since deleted the tweet but it has been well captured by screen shot.

heres the picture, he really shoots himself in the foot https://twitter.com/CAugustenborg/status/1165750107100389377

just to be clear you would know the thing isn't working even if you were just posing for a photo with it and you didn't want to charge right that minute? It looks like there is still plastic wrap around the bottom of it. Would there be a light a display to show its not working?


does anyone know what particular type of charger that is? here is close up photo https://www.plugshare.com/location/190508 https://www.plugshare.com/location/196776 quantum rolec charger https://issuu.com/www.rolecserv.com/docs/rolec_product_catalogue_2018__singl https://vimeo.com/232622200

slave1

Thanks for that, says it all

jusmeig

expectationlost wrote: »

heres the picture, he really shoots himself in the foot

You are not supposed to take this man seriously.
It's wrong on so many levels.
A Dublin->Rathdown TD who "found" a charger near his home.
This tic should be advocating keeping people AWAY from the public network unless they are on long runs. He should be educating and encouraging people to charge AT HOME, and if possible double up with Solar PV.
As I said, You are not supposed to take this man seriously.

unkel

jusmeig wrote: »

It's wrong on so many levels.

Indeed. And you would need to go for a very long walk in Marlay park before a slow charge would make a meaningful difference to the range of your 64kWh EV...

expectationlost

unkel wrote: »

Indeed. And you would need to go for a very long walk in Marlay park before a slow charge would make a meaningful difference to the range of your 64kWh EV...

is it a slow or fast 22kw (but not the fastest) https://www.zap-map.com/charge-points/connectors-speeds/ https://www.plugshare.com/location/190508

unkel

expectationlost wrote: »

is it a slow or fast 22kw (but not the fastest) https://www.zap-map.com/charge-points/connectors-speeds/ https://www.plugshare.com/location/190508

Doesn't matter what charger it is, it will take almost 10 hours to fill up that Kona from empty to full

expectationlost

expectationlost wrote: »

heres the picture, he really shoots himself in the foot https://twitter.com/CAugustenborg/status/1165750107100389377

just to be clear you would know the thing isn't working even if you were just posing for a photo with it and you didn't want to charge right that minute? It looks like there is still plastic wrap around the bottom of it. Would there be a light a display to show its not working?


does anyone know what particular type of charger that is? here is close up photo https://www.plugshare.com/location/190508 https://www.plugshare.com/location/196776 quantum rolec charger https://issuu.com/www.rolecserv.com/docs/rolec_product_catalogue_2018__singl https://vimeo.com/232622200

UCC prof accusers Shane Ross of engaging in 'fake news' https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/shane-ross-deletes-tweet-amid-claims-of-fake-news-stunt-1.3997889


still wondering if you were just intent in taking a photo and weren't actually wanting to charge would you know that the things weren't working ?

0lddog

Is this hullabaloo about charge points just something that we have talked ourselves into ?

Here is a piccy from last year of a service station in Sant Cruz de Tenerife. Diesel, Petrol and 'leccy were all on offer

Grumpypants

Why hasn't some smart company come up with a home network charging solution. An Air B&B for chargers. How many plugs a left idol all day around the country. I know mine is while im at work.

Have people sign up, then get shown a free charge point at someones house and the app unlocks the charger and charges them for the power used. Person who owns the charger gets a cut.

KCross

Grumpypants wrote: »

Why hasn't some smart company come up with a home network charging solution. An Air B&B for chargers. How many plugs a left idol all day around the country. I know mine is while im at work.

Have people sign up, then get shown a free charge point at someones house and the app unlocks the charger and charges them for the power used. Person who owns the charger gets a cut.

There is plugshare if you want to share your home charge point on an ad-hoc basis.

Outside of that do you really want random strangers parking at your house for hours on end for a few euro? I dont think it would fly.

Black_Knight

KCross wrote: »

There is plugshare if you want to share your home charge point on an ad-hoc basis.

Outside of that do you really want random strangers parking at your house for hours on end for a few euro? I dont think it would fly.

https://parkpnp.com/ie/ with the added bonus of having a charging port would be an option. Charge for the parking, not the electricity. Infact you can filter by "Electric charging"