The effect of confidence on professional footballers

Liam O

In particular I'm thinking of Chris Smalling. Looked for 2 or 3 seasons like he was unable to pass a ball, was shunted around a lot and just had a general air of dodginess about him.

In comes Van Gaal. Provides a stable system and in the last 11 odd months Smalling has probably been up there with the best defenders in the league. United have let in less than a goal a game in there 11 league games and have 7 clean sheets in that time. A lot of that is to do with Smalling.

Is this just to do with confidence? Was he going to turn into this player regardless? I doubt it but are there any other examples of such a turnaround in a player's career that you can think of?

bucketybuck

Confidence is a massive factor for professional footballers but you havent used a great example.

Whats this air of dodginess crap? Chris Smalling always had the potential, he just needed to stay injury free and then be given a consistent run of games. Its the exact same with Phil Jones, if he played 38 games this season we would be raving about him as well. With those two confidence is just one of many factors, and not near as important as simply getting onto the field regularly.

Captain Havoc

Rooney pre and post metatarsal.

brevity

Putting a player in a position and a system that plays to their strengths is a great start IMO.

Far to often players are shoehorned into roles that they are not suitable for and their confidence can start to wane if they don't perform well.

It tends to happen to young players as well which is a shame IMO.

Oranage2

Yes of course confidence plays a huge part but not as much as ability and that's why we we have the expression form is temporary class is......

Again I agree smalling isn't the best example, he's good, has always had the ability just was always injury prone. Plus Lvg plays an ultra defensive boring possession based game, even Titus Bramble would look good playing for united these days.

callaway92

I'd say motivation more than confidence affects how a player plays.

Rooney on £300,000 a week. Must be pretty hard to get motivated when you're on that every week. Easy life at this stage.

Kimbot

confidence effects even the non pro in anll of us. I can go out and play a crap game every week, I get one good one and my confidence is on the up I play better.

NoviGlitzko

Smalling had huge potential and it wasn't as if this season he turned into Jesus overnight. He was superb at the end of last season and I always seen flashes before that that he would be a top player, just was unlucky with injuries keeping him back at times. Jones is similar in that regard and could be a great player for United, although won't reach Smalling's heights IMO. Smalling is priceless for us at the moment, and especially given his age. Confidence is extremely important for a lot of players, but it's like as if Mikes level is harder to drop, especially as I think confidence is more important to attacking players.

Posted in June:

NoviGlitzko wrote:

An honest assessment of Ramos is he's extremely error prone, great in the air and knows how to get a goal, comfortable on the ground, not the best decision making, and good aggression. A good defender but give me someone like Smalling anyday.

Liam O wrote:

Calling Ramos "extremely error prone" and then going on to champion Chris Smalling is one of the more ridiculous things I've read on here. Ramos has been the standout CB for Real Madrid and Spain for a long time. Chris Smalling has had half a good season in the last 3 or 4 years.

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Would you all still take Ramos now?

Gavlor

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Smalling had huge potential and it wasn't as if this season he turned into Jesus overnight. He was superb at the end of last season and I always seen flashes before that that he would be a top player, just was unlucky with injuries keeping him back at times. Jones is similar in that regard and could be a great player for United, although won't reach Smalling's heights IMO. Smalling is priceless for us at the moment, and especially given his age.

Posted in June:



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Would you all still take Ramos now?

You've been itching to post that since the season started haven't you??!!

NoviGlitzko

Been eagerly awaiting the opportunity my friend!

WesternZulu

I know he had his injuries and lost some pace but Torres is the perfect example!

You could just tell that his confidence was absolutely shot to pieces at Chelsea and he never regained it!

garra

Confidence is a huge factor in how a player performs and in how younger player's develop. At Liverpool you only have to look at Ibe, pre-Klopp and now. 2 totally different players. One looking edgy and unable to take on a player to save his life, the other a rampaging trick-pulling bullying monster of a goal-scoring winger.*

The biggest influence on a player's form is their confidence, and the biggest influence on a player's confidence is their manager.

* indicates moderate hyperbole

bucketybuck

garra wrote: »

The biggest influence on a player's form is their confidence, and the biggest influence on a player's form is their manager

Which does make you wonder about United and Van Gaal, its like a conveyor belt of quality players losing all form and confidence under him. And thats not even talking the squad players he just didn't like, such as Rafael or Evans, but proven world class players like Rooney and Di Maria who seemingly lost all confidence and form under his management.

NoviGlitzko

bucketybuck wrote: »

Which does make you wonder about United and Van Gaal, its like a conveyor belt of quality players losing all form and confidence under him. And thats not even talking the squad players he just didn't like, such as Rafael or Evans, but proven world class players like Rooney and Di Maria who seemingly lost all confidence and form under his management.

That's more down to his tactics IMO. But yeah, since they weren't suiting his tactics they also fell out of form.

efb

Liam O wrote: »

In particular I'm thinking of Chris Smalling. Looked for 2 or 3 seasons like he was unable to pass a ball, was shunted around a lot and just had a general air of dodginess about him.

In comes Van Gaal. Provides a stable system and in the last 11 odd months Smalling has probably been up there with the best defenders in the league. United have let in less than a goal a game in there 11 league games and have 7 clean sheets in that time. A lot of that is to do with Smalling.

Is this just to do with confidence? Was he going to turn into this player regardless? I doubt it but are there any other examples of such a turnaround in a player's career that you can think of?

Wenger did the same in 98

tastyt

Smalling is definitely playing well lads but it's only been 12 or 13 games. It's a lot easier to play well as a centre back when you have two good defensive midfielders sitting in front of you as lvg does.

If he does it over 3 or 4 seasons and wins championships and cements his place in the international team then maybe he can be compared to Europe's best

Liam O

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Would you all still take Ramos now?

Yes.

Smalling was terrible and regressed for 3 or so seasons. There was never a sign that he could play at the level he has for the past 11 months or so. I'm delighted to be wrong about him but it doesn't change the past.

gosplan

A lot of that is Richard Dunne syndrome.

CB looks way better playing with a more defensively minded midfield.

Edit: as outlined above

Corholio

I'd be surprised if United fans still wouldn't take Ramos, quality centre half for years now despite his braindead moments. Smalling has been excellent this season but Ramos is pure quality. I'm not sure how somebody would turn down the chance if it was given. It does seem these days that players are elevated by fans to statuses like 'best defender in the league' or 'world class' so fast now, gone are the days that you were only a real, good quality player after a season or two. I disagree with a lot of it too, I think the one-upmanship has grown hugely over the years and now fans are eager to claim their players form as the best etc. I'm not saying this just about Smalling, just in general really.

bucketybuck

Liam O wrote: »

Yes.

Smalling was terrible and regressed for 3 or so seasons. There was never a sign that he could play at the level he has for the past 11 months or so. I'm delighted to be wrong about him but it doesn't change the past.

Rubbish. Smalling always showed he had potential and plenty of us could see it. Lets take a trip down memory lane...

2 years ago:

We talk about the average Cleverley and Jones, but for myself the one player I would like to see push on this year is Chris Smalling, who seems to be the forgotten man around here. Last year was a non-event for him, hopefully he can get injury free and start to cement a first team spot, because unlike some others he actually has the ability to be world class.

Say for example Rio was dropped for Smalling and results suffered, thats fine because Smalling could develop into a true great.

I think that Smalling, Jones and Rafael do indeed have the ability and the potential to become world class for the club

3 years ago:

Smalling is twice the player Jones is. Jones has the whole chest thumping british bulldog thing that the media likes, but Smalling is on a different level

Theres plenty more and none of it hindsight, Chris Smalling always showed he had lots and lots of potential. It was never a sure thing and he needed the game time but saying he was terrible and there was never a sign he could play at this level is just pure rubbish.

Corholio

bucketybuck wrote: »

Theres plenty more and none of it hindsight, Chris Smalling always showed he had lots and lots of potential. It was never a sure thing and he needed the game time but saying he was terrible and there was never a sign he could play at this level is just pure rubbish.

While I agree he was never 'rubbish', quoting things you said years ago is still guessing as clearly shown from stating that Jones and Rafael could be world class. I'm sure there's an equal amount of quotes about players that were completely wrong. Potential is a very sensitive thing that goes wrong a lot more than it goes right. Smalling is still not world class or anything, but having a very good season.

bucketybuck

Corholio wrote: »

While I agree he was never 'rubbish', quoting things you said years ago is still guessing as clearly shown from stating that Jones and Rafael could be world class. I'm sure there's an equal amount of quotes about players that were completely wrong. Potential is a very sensitive thing that goes wrong a lot more than it goes right. Smalling is still not world class or anything, but having a very good season.

Of course its guessing, I never claimed I could predict the future and like I said it was never a sure thing. The point is that those "guesses" were not based on thin air but on players showing the qualities and potential they had. You won't find posts like that from me about Paddy McNair or Tyler Blackett because they never showed what Smalling did when he arrived at the club.

And so what if I mentioned Jones and Rafael as well? Rafael could easily have been world class, the kid put the likes of Bale and Ribery in his pocket plenty of times, he showed his potential, and like I said earlier all Jones needs is the same run of games Smalling got and I would wager he would also show his qualities.

And if he does get that run and does show his quality, should we expect somebody to then claim that he never, ever showed any sign that he could be that good?

theoneeyedman

My granny would look good in that team, a back 4 that sits back with fullbacks not allowed to pass halfway, and 2 holding midfielders that sit in front. It's a system designed to protect dodgy centre backs. Championing Smalling for looking decent in this system is bunkum: he has SFA to do and the system means he rarely gets exposed. He's a decent enough player, but a long way from being one of the best if you ask me

NoviGlitzko

Liam O wrote: »

Yes.

Smalling was terrible and regressed for 3 or so seasons. There was never a sign that he could play at the level he has for the past 11 months or so. I'm delighted to be wrong about him but it doesn't change the past.

So you would take a defender who's never played in the EPL, 4 years older, over a guy who's now one of the best defending talents in Europe? We've only scratched the surface with him as well. He's 25. I'd say Kompany has only rivaled Smalling this season at CB in the EPL.

As for the past, that is simply wrong. Myself and my brother have been raving about him for years. A lot of people who didn't know about him slapped a label on him that he was like Jones, whens hes a different player. Contrary to what people think he's also very comfortable on the ball. I'm struggling to think of a player who's ever beaten him 1 on 1. You have to remember he's hardly had a decent run of games with injury.

Corholio wrote: »

I'd be surprised if United fans still wouldn't take Ramos, quality centre half for years now despite his braindead moments. Smalling has been excellent this season but Ramos is pure quality. I'm not sure how somebody would turn down the chance if it was given. It does seem these days that players are elevated by fans to statuses like 'best defender in the league' or 'world class' so fast now, gone are the days that you were only a real, good quality player after a season or two.

That works both ways. People also think of foreign players like Ramos as some sort of savior over the potential we have. How do we know he would succeed in the Premier League? And it was a comparison between the two, but if we could have Smalling & Ramos then great.

bucketybuck wrote: »

Of course its guessing, I never claimed I could predict the future and like I said it was never a sure thing. The point is that those "guesses" were not based on thin air but on players showing the qualities and potential they had. You won't find posts like that from me about Paddy McNair or Tyler Blackett because they never showed what Smalling did when he arrived at the club.

Good reply - this is pretty much me. I've been backing two players for the last couple of years on here hoping they get a chance at the club. Smalling & Lingard. I'm delighted Jesse is getting a chance as it's long overdue. Once he gets confidence his end product will improve massively because he's always shown he has it.

NoviGlitzko

theoneeyedman wrote: »

My granny would look good in that team, a back 4 that sits back with fullbacks not allowed to pass halfway, and 2 holding midfielders that sit in front. It's a system designed to protect dodgy centre backs. Championing Smalling for looking decent in this system is bunkum: he has SFA to do and the system means he rarely gets exposed. He's a decent enough player, but a long way from being one of the best if you ask me

Have you watched any of our games? We lead a high line and get exposed a lot. Smalling has saved our ass so many times this season and his leadership has been brilliant. If he got injured we'd be in a lot of trouble.

Giggsy11

theoneeyedman wrote: »

My granny would look good in that team, a back 4 that sits back with fullbacks not allowed to pass halfway, and 2 holding midfielders that sit in front. It's a system designed to protect dodgy centre backs. Championing Smalling for looking decent in this system is bunkum: he has SFA to do and the system means he rarely gets exposed. He's a decent enough player, but a long way from being one of the best if you ask me

Woah, everything is wrong with this post. Must be a record.

Flint Fredstone

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Woah, everything is wrong with this post. Must be a record.

Some tripe in there, the fullback point especially. Rojo the left back that's not allowed pass the halfway line looked like he spent more time in the opposition half the other night. Luke Shaw was regularly overlapping Depay. Darmian and Young have been getting forward plenty too. You have to wonder do people actually watch games or just recycle sound bites from lazy "analysts"

Liam O

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

So you would take a defender who's never played in the EPL, 4 years older, over a guy who's now one of the best defending talents in Europe? We've only scratched the surface with him as well. He's 25. I'd say Kompany has only rivaled Smalling this season at CB in the EPL.

As for the past, that is simply wrong. Myself and my brother have been raving about him for years. A lot of people who didn't know about him slapped a label on him that he was like Jones, whens hes a different player. Contrary to what people think he's also very comfortable on the ball. I'm struggling to think of a player who's ever beaten him 1 on 1. You have to remember he's hardly had a decent run of games with injury.

That works both ways. People also think of foreign players like Ramos as some sort of savior over the potential we have. How do we know he would succeed in the Premier League? And it was a comparison between the two, but if we could have Smalling & Ramos then great.


Good reply - this is pretty much me. I've been backing two players for the last couple of years on here hoping they get a chance at the club. Smalling & Lingard. I'm delighted Jesse is getting a chance as it's long overdue. Once he gets confidence his end product will improve massively because he's always shown he has it.

In Smalling's first season or so I was very high on him. I was ok with him for a year or so when he was being moved around as I felt he'd come back better. For the 2 years after that (haven't totally fact checked my timeline) he was poison. I remember on football weekly last season someone praising LVG for turning Smalling into a player who looks like he can pass the ball.

Every time the ball was at his feet he was panicking and doddling over it. It was painful to watch. He looks assured now and very confident. It happened so suddenly it was amazing. I was still a bit wary of him at the start of the season but he's convinced me in the last couple of months that he can be really great. Absolute powerhouse performances and on the ball looks twice the player.

Flint Fredstone

In answer to the op, confidence and belief in your own ability is arguably the biggest factor in what sets the great apart from the good.

NoviGlitzko

Liam O wrote: »

In Smalling's first season or so I was very high on him. I was ok with him for a year or so when he was being moved around as I felt he'd come back better. For the 2 years after that (haven't totally fact checked my timeline) he was poison. I remember on football weekly last season someone praising LVG for turning Smalling into a player who looks like he can pass the ball.

Every time the ball was at his feet he was panicking and doddling over it. It was painful to watch. He looks assured now and very confident. It happened so suddenly it was amazing. I was still a bit wary of him at the start of the season but he's convinced me in the last couple of months that he can be really great. Absolute powerhouse performances and on the ball looks twice the player.

I'll agree that he's improved on the ball but he was always always decent IMO. Underrated by many. He's a cool customer. I dunno, maybe we just seen it in a different light.

Sorry to go off topic. Main this is we have him now playing great.

Corholio

bucketybuck wrote: »

And so what if I mentioned Jones and Rafael as well? Rafael could easily have been world class, the kid put the likes of Bale and Ribery in his pocket plenty of times, he showed his potential, and like I said earlier all Jones needs is the same run of games Smalling got and I would wager he would also show his qualities.

And if he does get that run and does show his quality, should we expect somebody to then claim that he never, ever showed any sign that he could be that good?

I'm agreeing with your point that he did show potential and was obviously signed because he had that. I would disagree with Rafael and Jones though, I never thought at all that Rafael could 'easily' have been world class, far too reckless and a poor man marker. Jones looked for a while that he could but I don't think he's ever made the next step, and that's not down to injuries or positionally either, I just think sometime there are very good players who are far from terrible but also far from world class, I think Jones fits in well there.

Richard Hillman

Goalkeeping especially has a massive effect on confidence. We have seen many keepers over the years completely crumble after a few mistakes. Rob Green for example was a fantastic premier league keeper but that mistake in the World Cup took him years to get over.

Massimo Taibi was also a fantastic keeper in Serie A. Went to United, made one mistake and it destroyed him. He went back to Serie A and returned to being a top keeper after a few years.

There are plenty of outfield players around the world that can be world class some days and pub team the next. Their whole game can stem from something as little as a poor first touch in the first 5 minutes or even a few misses in the warm up.

It is all about mental strenght and the ability to write things off as a given. You're gonna lose the ball sometimes, you're gonna miss easy chances, you're gonna flap at a cross. The best players simply dont really care at making the odd mistakes. Whilst some people can get caught up on the smallest things. I say that from personal experience of playing. You end up trying too hard.

pavb2

I find it interesting when team confidence is mentioned, it's not tangible can't be measured but undoubtedly it has a significant effect.