UFC 193 - Rousey v Holm

Utopia Parkway

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

I am really baffled by people who delight in a champions loss.

People love to see underdogs win fights. Not to mention I don't think Ronda is particularly liked by a lot of people. No big mystery to it.

maximoose

Rousey via Decision

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

I don't think jeering anyone's defeat in sport is admirable. Its not taking sides. Taking sides would be celebrating Holms vistory not delighting in the loss of her opponent.

Ronda's antics in the lead up to the fight, and even on fight night, were far from admirable. It alienated her with a lot of otherwise neutrals who then wanted to see her lose.

Also add in the fact that she's been seen, as said above, as an arrogant brat by many for some time now and it's no surprise people are enjoying seeing her beat comprehensively.

I always thought and always will think she was a force of nature, pure willingness to win alone gave her an edge where her lack of skills would seem to be a hindrance. her athleticism and desire alone make her what she is, a cut above. Look anyone can have a "buster douglas" moment. I for one think she was doing too much and took the fight lightly. better coaching and prep would see her get that belt back and I'd bet my house on it. she had zero strategy and went in as most say arrogant thinking she just had to turn up!!!!I cannot be arsed with the Hate campaign. I got to see an MMA fight not a Celebrity big brother match. Yes she is bitchy but Meh, what ya gonna do.

K3v

Rousey via Decision

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

She has done more in the sport and her life those who delight in her loss ever will.

Just thinking of people clapping in delight when those who have achieved more stumble shows a real weakness in character to me. I am sure most of these people have never trained or would have mental strength to fight themselves.

I agree she has done so much for WMMA. As someone said somewhere, the UFC would be 2 divisions lighter if it was not for Ronda.

But that doesn't mean that I have to like Ronda for the person she is.
It was her arrogance that has people so satisfied with the outcome.
I enjoyed her domination of every opponent in previous performances, but to see someone who has the attitude of a bully, get their comeuppance is gratifying.



Her attitude at the weigh-ins and her Instagram post following it showed her true colours. Calling out Holm for a cheap shot, when it was Ronda's own fault. Not to mention the late late cheap shot by Ronda after the bell in Round 1. Hypocrite.



In another sense its great to see WMMA evolve also.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Rousey via Decision

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

She has done more in the sport and her life those who delight in her loss ever will.

Just thinking of people clapping in delight when those who have achieved more stumble shows a real weakness in character to me. I am sure most of these people have never trained or would have mental strength to fight themselves.

I am sure the same people are all lining up waiting for Conor to loose so they can share their delight also.

You'll like this one;

Theodore Roosevelt;

THE MAN IN THE ARENA Excerpt from the speech "Citizenship In A Republic" delivered at the Sorbonne, in Paris, France on 23 April, 1910

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.

Reed Enough Comedy

Reed Enough Comedy wrote: »

You'll like this one;

Very good I like that one.

Its like the lads who go to sneer at a white collar boxing fight but wouldn't dare risk their "street cred" for being revealed as the truest cowards in the room!!

AND SHooo ENDith the lesshheeen!:D

Stuxnet

Rousey via Decision

If Rhonda spoke like or had a face like Ireland's female UFC prospect...do you think she would of been so "ground breaking", I highly doubt it, she's there because of her looks and her ground game, no more. If she wasn’t the cute all American blonde, Dana never would of gave WMMA a seconds thought, he knew he could sell her. Her time is probably up, she needs to decide is she a class D Hollywood celeb that cant act, or MM'Artist.

Subcomandante Marcos

Rousey via Decision

This idea that people who don't practice something can't comment on it is a massive logical fallacy and borderline idiocy.

People who don't act or direct can't claim a movie is bad because they don't make movies themselves.
People who don't play an istrument or sing can't say a song is bad because they don't make music themselves.
People who don't cook or work front of house can't say a restaurant is bad because they don't work in the food industry themselves.
People who don't don't play sports can't say that Chelsea's players are doing pants in the league because they aren't professional footballers.

Where does this rabbit hole end? People can observe, consider and comment based on what they see. You don't have to practice an activity to understand it and have a valid opinion on it. Saying otherwise just makes you sound stupid.

Ditto, when you see a person acting in a particular way you don't have to be a behavioural psychologist to point out their behaviour and say you dislike it.

mdwexford

Rousey via Decision

Ronda has brought a lot of this on herself with her attitude. Ever since the Ultimate Fighter with Tate she hasn't come across great.

It does seem she needs to hate her opponent and make it personal to get motivated for a fight.

There wasn't this kind of backlash when Anderson or Barao got beaten. Even Jones didn't get this much abuse.

Saipanne

Holm via Submission

"Hey Mayweather, don't be hitting women. Boooo."

Later...

"Hey Mike Tyson, convicted rapist, you're my best friend."

Later still...

"Hey, wife beater Travis Browne, I love you."


This would sum up my dislike for her. That, and how classless she is AFTER fights.

If you don't understand my point after this explanation designed for five year olds, then I cannot help you.

Mr. Manager

Rousey via Decision

How she gets more hate than Jon Jones I'll never understand...

The guy is about as dirty a fighter as Palhares, has been convicted of driving under the influence, blurted someone homophobic stuff online, avid cocaine user and was arrested for a hit and run.

RedemptionZ

Travis Browne was cleared of domestic violence in fairness. Very unfair to call him a wifebeater based on a claim that was investigated and thrown out the door.

Although in general I agree with the logic and I would like to add another hypocrisy to that list: She did something about positive body image for females then a few weeks later is saying that Cyborg looks like a man. Complete hypocrisy.

I think the main reason people don't like Ronda is she genuinely comes across as a dick, the type you wouldn't get on with. McGregor is as someone said more of a pantomime villain, you know there's no real malice in what he's saying and he can be quite entertaining.

Easy Rod

Holm via Submission

Mr. Manager wrote: »

How she gets more hate than Jon Jones I'll never understand...

The guy is about as dirty a fighter as Palhares, has been convicted of driving under the influence, blurted someone homophobic stuff online, avid cocaine user and was arrested for a hit and run.

I dislike them both equally.

Also, you most certainly can't compare JBJ to Palhares in terms of being a dirty fighter and I don't really care what he chooses to put up his nose in his personal time.

RedemptionZ

Mr. Manager wrote: »

How she gets more hate than Jon Jones I'll never understand...

The guy is about as dirty a fighter as Palhares, has been convicted of driving under the influence, blurted someone homophobic stuff online, avid cocaine user and was arrested for a hit and run.

She only gets more hate because she's a lot more famous than Jones. After the hit and run on the pregnant woman I don't think JJ had many fans left.

Saipanne

Holm via Submission

Mr. Manager wrote: »

How she gets more hate than Jon Jones I'll never understand...

The guy is about as dirty a fighter as Palhares, has been convicted of driving under the influence, blurted someone homophobic stuff online, avid cocaine user and was arrested for a hit and run.

I have no love for Jones. I don't know how anyone could.


Though he is an amazing athlete.

xtal191

MartyMcFly84

Rousey via Decision

This idea that people who don't practice something can't comment on it is a massive logical fallacy and borderline idiocy.

People who don't act or direct can't claim a movie is bad because they don't make movies themselves.
People who don't play an istrument or sing can't say a song is bad because they don't make music themselves.
People who don't cook or work front of house can't say a restaurant is bad because they don't work in the food industry themselves.
People who don't don't play sports can't say that Chelsea's players are doing pants in the league because they aren't professional footballers.

Where does this rabbit hole end? People can observe, consider and comment based on what they see. You don't have to practice an activity to understand it and have a valid opinion on it. Saying otherwise just makes you sound stupid.

So why are panels of experts almost always made up of former professionals and not causal fans? Anyway my point is really around people who will never know what is like to try, dying for their chance to fling mud. Not really around casual fans.

MartyMcFly84

Rousey via Decision

You'll like this one;

Words of a true great.

Davei141

Holm via Submission

Who would have known that someone who acts like a complete muppet would invoke a lot of glee when they get KTFO? Baffling indeed MartyMacFly.

Saipanne

Holm via Submission

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

So why are panels of experts almost always made up of former professionals and not causal fans? Anyway my point is really around people who will never know what is like to try, dying for their chance to fling mud. Not really around casual fans.

And yet, without the "casual fans", the athletes would struggle to make even a basic living from the sport.

MartyMcFly84

Rousey via Decision

And yet, without the "casual fans", the athletes would struggle to make even a basic living from the sport.

Agreed

Tazzimus

Easy Rod wrote: »

I dislike them both equally.

Also, you most certainly can't compare JBJ to Palhares in terms of being a dirty fighter and I don't really care what he chooses to put up his nose in his personal time.

With those oblique kicks you could, deliberately trying to damage someones knees is pretty dirty.

As for the eye gouging..

Hoki

Holm via KO/TKO

Tazzimus wrote: »

With those oblique kicks you could, deliberately trying to damage someones knees is pretty dirty.

As for the eye gouging..

Lots of fighters do oblique kicks now,it's the fight game- you're trying to knock out or submit an opponent. Injuries happen all the time as a result of strikes or subs , if an injury happens as a result of an oblique kick so be it, the fighters know what they're letting themselves in for. Unless it's outlawed it's a valid tactic.

Tazzimus

Hoki wrote: »

Lots of fighters do oblique kicks now,it's the fight game- you're trying to knock out or submit an opponent. Injuries happen all the time as a result of strikes or subs , if an injury happens as a result of an oblique kick so be it, the fighters know what they're letting themselves in for. Unless it's outlawed it's a valid tactic.

Just because its allowed doesn't mean it's not a dirty tactic.
There's a difference between getting an injury from a fight (a la Bisping from Belforts headkick) and deliberately trying to injure someone so you win.

Injuries do happen yes but if you're intentionally trying to injure someone (outside the normal parameters of a fight) then that is a dirty tactic.

Subcomandante Marcos

Rousey via Decision

Tazzimus wrote: »

Just because its allowed doesn't mean it's not a dirty tactic.
There's a difference between getting an injury from a fight (a la Bisping from Belforts headkick) and deliberately trying to injure someone so you win.

Injuries do happen yes but if you're intentionally trying to injure someone (outside the normal parameters of a fight) then that is a dirty tactic.

Punching someone in the face, elbowing them in the eye, trying to get a join lock, trying to knock them out, all of that is "deliberately trying to hurt someone so you win". Don't be so naive. Should leg locks and oblique kicks be banned just because someone might get injured?

Don't want to be on the receiving end of oblique kicks? Figure out a way to stop them or negate them. There's nothing "dirty" about it, it's just combat sports.

TheTownie

John Wayne Parr ringside (thanks to Joe Rogan) and catches the KO on his phone

https://twitter.com/johnwayneparr/status/666047797079076865

Lukker-

Holm via Submission

Tazzimus wrote: »

Just because its allowed doesn't mean it's not a dirty tactic.
There's a difference between getting an injury from a fight (a la Bisping from Belforts headkick) and deliberately trying to injure someone so you win.

Injuries do happen yes but if you're intentionally trying to injure someone (outside the normal parameters of a fight) then that is a dirty tactic.

What about liver shots? Kidneys? What about breaking someones nose? Or jaw? What about targeting a cut above the eye? Or the temple, or the ear so they lose their balance.

Think your watching the wrong sport if thats your attitude. You say dirty, every MMA fighter ever would say smart.

Hoki

Holm via KO/TKO

Tazzimus wrote: »

Just because its allowed doesn't mean it's not a dirty tactic.
There's a difference between getting an injury from a fight (a la Bisping from Belforts headkick) and deliberately trying to injure someone so you win.

Injuries do happen yes but if you're intentionally trying to injure someone (outside the normal parameters of a fight) then that is a dirty tactic.

You have no evidence JJ is intentionally trying to injure someone though?? That's just your opinion which has no evidence that he's trying to inure someone apart from the fact that the strike 'could' injure someone. It's an acceptable strike. I don't see the issue. It's not as if he's headbutting guys.

TheNap

Every single strike is designed to injure/hurt someone . Its fighting . Thats the aim .

Tazzimus

Hoki wrote: »

You have no evidence JJ is intentionally trying to injure someone though?? That's just your opinion which has no evidence that he's trying to inure someone apart from the fact that the strike 'could' injure someone. It's an acceptable strike. I don't see the issue. It's not as if he's headbutting guys.

I see you and lukker ignored the part in brackets then.

I get that injuries happen, and yes dirty tactics can be a bit of a gray area, especially with MMA, but there is a big difference between breaking someones nose/jaw etc during the fight and intentionally trying to damage someones knees and possibly end their career fighting.

As for my opinion, I've seen vids of him saying its worth "giving people a limp" so it's not just in my head.

Even taking the oblique kicks out of it, you still have the eye gouging I mentioned, that's just a dick move. Jones in my eyes is a dirty fighter, same as Palhares.

Anyway, we're getting off the topic of the thread I think.

mdwexford

Rousey via Decision

TheTownie wrote: »

John Wayne Parr ringside (thanks to Joe Rogan) and catches the KO on his phone

https://twitter.com/johnwayneparr/status/666047797079076865

Haha look on Rogans face at the end is gold.

maybe she was told to target rouseys knee alright. I personally hate those kicks and also foot stomps, loada bollocks!

LeeJM

First time posting on this forum so I'll just clarify I was a huge UFC from about UFC 34-100 and then stopped while still keeping up with results and watching big fight highlights. Just wondering why people have a problem with oblique kicks and foot stamps? They arent illegal and arent exactly dirty tactics. If Im in a fight and can earn $50k+ for winning then damn right Im gonna do everything within the rules to win.

TheTownie

Ask any MMA fighter and they will you they'd rather hurt/break a limb than get a concussion because pretty much anything can be improved/repaired except the brain so give the oblique kick/stomps talk a rest lads/lasses.

darced

Holm via Submission

This post has been deleted.

martyos121

Rousey via Submission

Oblique kick talk is pure nonsense. It's a part of MMA and always will be.

I would much rather take a few of them to each knee than one shot to the liver any day, and nobody gives out about liver shots.

Andre 3000

martyos121 wrote: »

Oblique kick talk is pure nonsense. It's a part of MMA and always will be.

I would much rather take a few of them to each knee than one shot to the liver any day, and nobody gives out about liver shots.

That's because most people have never got a shot to the liver. Truly a horrific feeling. Nothing you can do about it either...seems the more you try to deal and cope with it the worse the pain gets as your whole lower body starts to spasm. I'd take a clean shot to the jaw over a liver shot any day.

stiffler123

Rousey via Decision

Mr. Manager wrote: »

How she gets more hate than Jon Jones I'll never understand...

The guy is about as dirty a fighter as Palhares, has been convicted of driving under the influence, blurted someone homophobic stuff online, avid cocaine user and was arrested for a hit and run.

You can't tell people who they can and can't like. "Hey pussy are you still there?" I laugh every time I see that clip. Whatever you think of their personalities, you will still never miss one of their fights. They are great martial artists. So what if a few were glad Rousey lost.

Lukker-

Holm via Submission

stiffler123 wrote: »

You can't tell people who they can and can't like. "Hey pussy are you still there?" I laugh every time I see that clip. Whatever you think of their personalities, you will still never miss one of their fights. They are great martial artists. So what if a few were glad Rousey lost.

I actually wish we saw more of the real Jon Jones. That was captured when they were meant to be off camera. What we usually get from Jones is whatever his PR guy writes. Wish he'd just embrace his inner bad guy, he'd be much more entertaining

I love when he says "I would literally kill you if you spit in my face"

Sounds like something from step brothers.

batman_oh

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

So why are panels of experts almost always made up of former professionals and not causal fans? Anyway my point is really around people who will never know what is like to try, dying for their chance to fling mud. Not really around casual fans.

So you can't have an opinion on sport unless you play it and can't support one person/team over another. Why do you watch anything? Seriously?
I'd recommend never attending a sporting event or watching it in the company of another human

Easy Rod

Holm via Submission

Tazzimus wrote: »

With those oblique kicks you could, deliberately trying to damage someones knees is pretty dirty.

As for the eye gouging..

I'm not sure how I've ended up on a thread defending Jones but here I am.:pac:

As many others have pointed out, oblique kicks are a completely legal technique and there is no room for sympathy when two men are locked in a cage trying to incapacitate each other.

Eye gouging is also a strong term. Jones has been guilty of eye pokes on a number of occasions but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that they are unintentional. Eye pokes are a fairly regular occurrence in the fight game with fighters pawing to deflect shots or use their reach to maintain distance. It's a poor technique on his behalf, Ironically one of very few technical flaws he has, but Refs are honing in on it.

ASOT

Holm via Submission

Can't believe 100of us managed to pick the right outcome of the fight, unreal lads good work.

Into The Blue

Holm via Submission

ASOT wrote: »

Can't believe 100of us managed to pick the right outcome of the fight, unreal lads good work.

Jasus, don't start them off again!

cletus

Rousey via Decision

ASOT wrote: »

Can't believe 100of us managed to pick the right outcome of the fight, unreal lads good work.

Just voted for Ronda via sub there meself.

Dtp1979

Holm via Submission

Lukker- wrote: »

I actually wish we saw more of the real Jon Jones. That was captured when they were meant to be off camera. What we usually get from Jones is whatever his PR guy writes. Wish he'd just embrace his inner bad guy, he'd be much more entertaining

I love when he says "I would literally kill you if you spit in my face"

Sounds like something from step brothers.

When I read that, I'm hearing it in John C Reilly's voice

this type of thing did not help rousey in fairnes. and she's visably rattled too.


interesting. the video halfway down.

http://deadspin.com/how-ronda-rousey-lost-1742721532

Swashbuckler

Rousey via Decision

rusty cole wrote: »

this type of thing did not help rousey in fairnes. and she's visably rattled too.


interesting. the video halfway down.

http://deadspin.com/how-ronda-rousey-lost-1742721532

Not sure I agree with the general jist of the article. I don't think Rousey decided to keep the fight standing. I don't think she had a choice coz every time she tried to close the distance she was met with a left cross flush to the face. Holm punished her the first few times she tried to close so to say Ronda wanted to keep the fight standing is just not true in my opinion.

Tazzimus

Easy Rod wrote: »

I'm not sure how I've ended up on a thread defending Jones but here I am.:pac:

As many others have pointed out, oblique kicks are a completely legal technique and there is no room for sympathy when two men are locked in a cage trying to incapacitate each other.

Eye gouging is also a strong term. Jones has been guilty of eye pokes on a number of occasions but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that they are unintentional. Eye pokes are a fairly regular occurrence in the fight game with fighters pawing to deflect shots or use their reach to maintain distance. It's a poor technique on his behalf, Ironically one of very few technical flaws he has, but Refs are honing in on it.

Maybe I'm not explaining myself correctly, I dunno, anyway: I'm not saying they're illegal, just that they're a bit of a dirty move, well aware they're legal. The eye pokes: If it was anyone else I'd say fair enough they're unintentional but c'mon, this is Jones.
Fantastic fighter: Yes
Dirty fighter: Also yes
Complete bag of dicks: Most definitely


Right I'm done I swear Now to watch the card finally.

Subcomandante Marcos

Rousey via Decision

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Not sure I agree with the general jist of the article. I don't think Rousey decided to keep the fight standing. I don't think she had a choice coz every time she tried to close the distance she was met with a left cross flush to the face. Holm punished her the first few times she tried to close so to say Ronda wanted to keep the fight standing is just not true in my opinion.

Even when Ronda did get close and initiate a clinch, she was dominated by Holm. Firas Zahabi's breakdown of the fight is excellent. He explains the importance of how Holm reacted when Ronda went for the headlock and how she managed to maintain posture and out grapple Ronda, going through the mechanics of how she managed to throw Ronda herself.

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2015/11/16/9742130/ufc-193-video-ronda-rousey-vs-holly-holm-full-fight-breakdown-firas-zahabi

dave1982

Holm via Submission

Read a article where it was said Holm was the biggest 135lber she has face rest of girls she fought should be in 125 or less divisions