Attitudes to drink driving

osarusan

'Sure I'm grand after a few pints, not affected at all' makes me want to beat somebody's brains in.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

Are you from a city or urban area as I think its more a city vs county thing rather than an age thing.

You've brought up this crap before. I highly doubt everyone posting on here denigrating drink driving is from an urban area. I'm grew up in the rural west of Ireland and consider drink driving unacceptable.

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

As I said earlier I'm 30 and I would say most of my friends wouldn't have much issue with driving after 2 or 3 pints, in fact at a friends wedding a while back probably 7 or 8 cars of us all pulled into the local on the way to the reception and all of us driving had 2 or 3 quick pints and drove on the 12 miles or so to the reception after (same story at most other wedding I've been to also).

That's kinda sad. You're heading to a reception, where there will be booze sold and you can't even wait that long?

colossus-x

The people who think its okay to have a pint or two before driving are the same people who bitch about cyclists who they see without a helmet or high viz jacket.

thelad95

Snickers Man wrote: »

There has to be an issue for the young and righteously indignant to get very priggish over in every generation. Right now, it seems to be against those who have a responsible--although not puritanical--attitude to drinking and driving.

Don't concur with your vehemence at all. It seems we won't be friends.

There is absolutely no such thing as responsible drink driving and if you think there is, you shouldn't be on the road. One pint may not make you drunk in the traditional sense but will usually have a small effect on your reaction speeds and hand-eye co-ordination, which guess what?! are both pretty important when it comes to driving.

I'm not being 'priggish' or 'righteously indignant' for the sake of it. If you're willing to put your life and the life of others in danger, even if only slightly, you shouldn't have a driving license.

RobertKK

I rarely drink, but if I do plan on having a drink my motto is:
If you drinl, don't drive.
If you drive, don't drink.
I just think you have to think of the lives of others first, kill yourself from having a drink is one thing, killing or injuring someone else is an entire different thing.

gormdubhgorm

thelad95 wrote: »

There is absolutely no such thing as responsible drink driving and if you think there is, you shouldn't be on the road. One pint may not make you drunk in the traditional sense but will usually have a small effect on your reaction speeds and hand-eye co-ordination, which guess what?! are both pretty important when it comes to driving.

I'm not being 'priggish' or 'righteously indignant' for the sake of it. If you're willing to put your life and the life of others in danger, even if only slightly, you shouldn't have a driving license.

Exactly any fool knows that even a few pints impairs judgement. Anyone who says otherwise is Codding themselves. I remember driving to work the morning AFTER a Christmas do. I was shocked at the way I was driving. I was obviously over the limit. I thought I was alert and attentive but in reality I was not switched on. For instance a plastic bag blowing across the road caused me to brake hard I was too clouded to know what it was first glance. I was not alert at lights either.
Also I will be honest I had assumed that a guy with a username thelad95 would drink and drive. But I stand corrected if you can see the dangers why do other people pretend they do not exist? Is it a bravado machoism? Or are people just thick/stubborn?

meeeeh

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Exactly any fool knows that even a few pints impairs judgement. Anyone who says otherwise is Codding themselves. I remember driving to work the morning AFTER a Christmas do. I was shocked at the way I was driving. I was obviously over the limit. I thought I was alert and attentive but in reality I was not switched on. For instance a plastic bag blowing across the road caused me to brake hard I was too clouded to know what it was first glance. I was not alert at lights either.
Also I will be honest I had assumed that a guy with a username thelad95 would drink and drive. But I stand corrected if you can see the dangers why do other people pretend they do not exist? Is it a bravado machoism? Or are people just thick/stubborn?

I don't know, you tell us because you did it.

Snickers Man

thelad95 wrote: »

There is absolutely no such thing as responsible drink driving and if you think there is, you shouldn't be on the road.

Well there is and I do and I am. And you're not going to stop me; neither are you going to goad me into being irresponsible (by my own definition) because I know I'm right.

thelad95 wrote: »

I'm not being 'priggish' or 'righteously indignant' for the sake of it. If you're willing to put your life and the life of others in danger, even if only slightly, you shouldn't have a driving license.

Looks like you're agreeing with me. We won't be friends.

Peist2007

Deleted User wrote: »

It's just a complete culture change. Many in my age group and older would regale of days of drinking blind drunk and thought nothing of it, and remember the days when we would think nothing of cramming 6 into a Starlet after a match and a few pints or coming home from the local disco with a jarred driver in the early hours.

It's the same thing with baby seats. Grew up in an era when kids would be in the front seat with no seat belt. But you wouldn't dream of it now. Cars are more powerful, far more dangerous, Gardai are more vigilant, public opinion has gone completely against it.

An example of someone who needs to be told what is right and wrong. A sheep, if you will.

Ghost Buster

The worst Ive ever done was nursed a pint over about two hours and then driven. It really didnt feel right.I dont mean morally. I could actually feel it. Psychological perhaps but I wont repeat it.

Snickers Man

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I remember driving to work the morning AFTER a Christmas do. I was shocked at the way I was driving. I was obviously over the limit. I thought I was alert and attentive but in reality I was not switched on. For instance a plastic bag blowing across the road caused me to brake hard I was too clouded to know what it was first glance. I was not alert at lights either.

That's irresponsible driving. By my definition.

I said in my original post that I had never "knowingly" got pissed and driven. But there was one occasion, more than 20 years ago, when I drove home the morning after the night before, in reality the afternoon after the early morning before, a heavy night of celebration in a hotel where I was staying. It had involved a series of "boat-race" competitions, ie relays of silly men racing each other to drink a series of shorts.

The following day I left it as long as I could before checking out, not because I felt drunk but because I felt very ill. indeed I had to stop twice on the way home to, er, expurgate.

Later, talking to a friend, he told me I was lucky not to have been breathalysed as I would probably have been well over the limit.

That shocked me. I was not then aware of the morning after effect. As I said it was 20+ years ago. I have never done that since. I now know better. As I presume do most people thanks to the scare stories the guards put out about catching people in the morning during the Christmas season.

And quite right too.

Never EVER get drunk and drive. Not even the next day.

blue note

I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if this has been said already.

But I don't think the absolute attitudes to drink driving are fair. There's a big difference between someone who was marginally over the limit driving and someone who drove home after 4 pints or something. But it's become the worst thing you can do in a car. Whereas, there are other driving problems which are similarly dangerous. Lots of people have proudly told me of outrageous speeds that they have done on motorways and backroads. They might apologise for them, but do so with a cheeky grin on their face. Or people driving when they clearly need more sleep to get behind a wheel. Someone who drives as part of their job driving home at 2 in the morning after a long week and saying that they fought to stay awake the whole way, people home from a long plane journey who thinks it's okay to drive home instead of sleeping first. Driving in these instances is worse than driving marginally over the limit, but hardly even frowned upon by most people.

I wouldn't be surprised if tiredness and speed are bigger factors in accidents than alcohol. There needs to be a shift in attitudes in relation to these to make them socially unacceptable. If we cut these down as much as we have drink driving we'd have much safer roads.

Tarzana2

blue note wrote: »

But I don't think the absolute attitudes to drink driving are fair. There's a big difference between someone who was marginally over the limit driving and someone who drove home after 4 pints or something. But it's become the worst thing you can do in a car. Whereas, there are other driving problems which are similarly dangerous.

And many people who oppose drink-driving also oppose these other things. I doubt many people think it's a good idea to drive exhausted.

Mickeroo

Is two pints actually under the limit or is that hypothetical?

blue note

Mickeroo wrote: »

Is two pints actually under the limit or is that hypothetical?

Two pints is over the limit for most people.

Tarzana2

Mickeroo wrote: »

Is two pints actually under the limit or is that hypothetical?

If drank in quick succession, it's over the limit.

If drank over a good few hours, probably not.

blue note

Tarzana2 wrote: »

And many people who oppose drink-driving also oppose these other things. I doubt many people think it's a good idea to drive exhausted.

No-one thinks it's a good idea, but I've spoken to people who wouldn't dream of driving with drink in them (some so much so that if they had a glass of wine with dinner they would refuse to drive 4 hours later) but would regard driving when they badly need sleep as something they just have to do.

dudara

On a recent trip to Ohio, in the US, I saw different number plates on some cars. I asked about the difference and I was told that they indicated drivers convicted of a DUI. You had to display the plates for a certain length of time before you could go back to normal plates. Interesting approach.

Tarzana2

Tarzana2 wrote: »

That's kinda sad. You're heading to a reception, where there will be booze sold and you can't even wait that long?

The few pints in the local are an important part of wedding day tradation. More often than not the bride and groom pop in also, there is usually sandwiches organised etc. Well at the weddings I go to anyway.

The pub is usually near the church so everyone heads there after the mass for a few and then onto the reception. People are long enough at the hotel without going straight there from the mass.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

The few pints in the local are an important part of wedding day tradation. More often than not the bride and groom pop in also, there is usually sandwiches organised etc.

It's never been a part of any wedding I've attended. All rural. The nibbles happen at the reception venue. And tradition or not, it doesn't excuse drink driving.

Wompa1

Tarzana2 wrote: »

It's never been a part of any wedding I've attended. All rural. The nibbles happen at the reception venue. And tradition or not, it doesn't excuse drink driving.

I've been to a bunch of country weddings. Can't remember the drinks in a pub like that either. I remember it at one but the reception was in a hotel that was literally less than 5 minutes walk away from the Church. That one was in Mayo. The bride and groom took off from the Church to go do their pictures and all of that. Most walked up to the pub. Except those with elderly people who drove. That wedding also got very messy, unfortunately. People were drinking too early

Tarzana2

Wompa1 wrote: »

I've been to a bunch of country weddings. Can't remember the drinks in a pub like that either. I remember it at one but the reception was in a hotel that was literally less than 5 minutes walk away from the Church. That one was in Mayo. The bride and groom took off from the Church to go do their pictures and all of that. Most walked up to the pub. Except those with elderly people who drove. That wedding also got very messy, unfortunately. People were drinking too early

Exactly, what is with the need to get stuck into the sauce that early when there's a whole day of drinking to be had. I was at a wedding a few years ago where the booze was flowing at the after ceremony drinks bit. Way too much booze. Many people could barely remember the meal the next day.

Wompa1

I'm in the group of people who believe the limit should be 0. Obviously it can't be 0 due to mouthwash, natural amounts etc. I have never knowingly drank and then drove. Once when I was in my early 20's I went out the night before Paddy'S Day and had to drive home on Paddy's Day around 2pm. I felt fine and calculated and figured I would be below the limit at that time.

I was about halfway home when it hit me, I started to feel f*cked up. I rolled down the windows and the air made it even worse. I drove the rest of the way home at a snail pace.

A year or so later. My housemate and I bought a digital breathalyzer, so we could check ourselves before driving the day after. Great investment!

Tarzana2

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Exactly, what is with the need to get stuck into the sauce that early when there's a whole day of drinking to be had.

Because its a bit of craic, I don't think I've been to a wedding where there wasn't a pit stop after the mass for a few pints, it's actually one of the things I look forward to on the day of a wedding, the popping into a local with a crowd for a bit of a laugh, I'd be gasping for a pint too especially if there was pints drank the night before also. Sometimes there is food in the pub organised sometimes its an impromptu pit stop. There would also be nibbles at the reception too either way.

As for an early start, we were at the grooms house drinking at 8am when I was groomsman there a while back. I reckon by the time we were leaving for the church there was 25 people+ in the house (neighbours, relations, groomsmen etc) and the drink was flowing

Bolloxology

I don't agree with the 0 limit and think it should be 2 pints.However thats subjective as im fine on 2 pints but accept others may be different.
But 0 and 2 are not the problem here,despite what the goons in the media might want us to believe,Its lunatics like the bloke in court last week who binge drink and get behind the wheel that are the problem.
I have always had a pint or 2 and driven and will continue to do so when circumstances dictate.
The real problem on Irish roads imho is plain and simple BAD driving, speeding,lane hopping,driving in the fast lane.Drug driving?

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

Because its a bit of craic, I don't think I've been to a wedding where there wasn't a pit stop after the mass for a few pints, it's actually one of the things I look forward to on the day of a wedding, the popping into a local with a crowd for a bit of a laugh, I'd be gasping for a pint too especially if there was pints drank the night before also.

Worrying!

Tarzana2

Bolloxology wrote: »

I don't agree with the 0 limit and think it should be 2 pints.However thats subjective as im fine on 2 pints but accept others may be different.

That's why it needs to be zero.

meeeeh

Tarzana2 wrote: »

That's why it needs to be zero.

Does it? I think we should also forbid mobile phones or make up placed outside of the boot of a car because it seems to be too much temptation for people. Also do not allow any nibbling and coffee drinking while driving because that also limits attention. Just in case.

Tarzana2

meeeeh wrote: »

Does it? I think we should also forbid mobile phones or make up placed outside of the boot of a car because it seems to be too much temptation for people. Also do not allow any nibbling and coffee drinking while driving because that also limits attention. Just in case.

Mobile phones should be forbidden for the driver whilst in transit, unless the device isn't hand held (and even then, maybe), yes.

People also shouldn't be eating whilst driving, though it would difficult to monitor.

What's your point?

colly4211

Simple as, you should never drink and drive. If your going to drink get a God dam taxi. End of

Tasden

Snickers Man wrote: »

You see, there's Ireland's "drinking problem" right there: You're not drinking properly unless you're getting pissed. Everything else is incomprehensible.

It's ridiculous. It's destructive. it's not good for you. It's not even particularly pleasant. Especially if it's habitual.

I admit, I have been severely pissed in my life. I will probably do so again. If Ireland win the World Cup, or beat the All Blacks, or I have a lottery win. But generally speaking I like to have a few pints fairly regularly. If I'm meeting people for an evening I may have four or five (and wouldn't dream of driving after such a load) but if i pop into the pub for one or two after work that's great. And it doesn't impair me at all so why the hell can't I then drive home? I'm not breaking any law.

The problem with your attitude is that it informs much of our legal policy and much of what we do is counter productive. By erroneously claiming that drinking one pint is morally equivalent to drinking ten we actually encourage the latter.

Surprise surprise the Irish don't drink a lot of alcohol in an overall sense compared with other countries in Europe. We do tend to binge drink more: ie store up all our drinking for major sessions. I'm not sure it's a good idea.

Two will do.

What?

Nowhere in my post did i say anybody needs to get drunk to be drinking "properly".
I was asking why they feel the need to make it an alcoholic drink over any other drink if they are driving?

To relax/unwind? The taste? Doesn't matter, it impairs your driving so have a soft drink.

The taste of your drink is not more important than other people's safety imo. And having one to unwind or relax, as said in my post, is because it alters the mind and so shouldn't be done prior to driving. I'll be honest, people putting something as trivial as the taste of their chosen drink before people's safety didn't actually occur to me, I thought they'd have a more "valid" reason for drinking alcohol and driving than "it's what i like the taste of so that's what I'm going to drink". Not that feeling more relaxed or whatever is more justified at all but I could somewhat see why they would, wrongly imo, be tempted to choose it over a soft drink in that case.

Tarzana2

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Worrying!

Come on, on the day of a wedding excitement and craic levels are high and people want to get on the beer good and early. You wouldn't want to come to the wedding from my circle of friends, everyone is in a rush to the pub as early as possible.

Bolloxology

Tarzana2 wrote: »

That's why it needs to be zero.

I take your point but wholeheartedly disagree.

Zero limit will not make any significant dent on road deaths.

I don't have the figures to hand but i'm willing to wager alcohol is NOT a contributing factor to the majority of road fatalities.

I know personally a few poor drivers who never drink and drive but have been involved in crashes,albeit minor.

meeeeh

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

Come on, on the day of a wedding excitement and craic levels are high and people want to get on the beer good and early. You wouldn't want to come to the wedding from my circle of friends, everyone is in a rush to the pub as early as possible.

You have seriously unhealthy attitude to alcohol.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

Come on, on the day of a wedding excitement and craic levels are high

I've drank champagne on the morning of weddings. Half a bottle before trotting up the aisle ahead of my sister. But I was very glad to take a break in the middle of the day and just chat and have a few nibbles and some tea and soft drinks.

Craic and boozing are not mutually inclusive. I've been to seriously boozy weddings before and they're a bit pointless, most of the day is a blank to many attendees the next day.

Tarzana2

Bolloxology wrote: »

Zero limit will not make any significant dent on road deaths.

I don't have the figures to hand but i'm willing to wager alcohol is NOT a contributing factor to the majority of road fatalities.

Well, there's a smoking gun if ever there was one.

meeeeh

meeeeh wrote: »

You have seriously unhealthy attitude to alcohol.

Not everyone is afraid of a bit of craic and a good skip of drink.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

Not everyone is afraid of a bit of craic and a good skip of drink.

You're aware that craic can happen without drink, right? If I couldn't have craic with my friends whilst sober, I'd question those friendships.

Tarzana2

Tarzana2 wrote: »

You're aware that craic can happen without drink, right? If I couldn't have craic with my friends whilst sober, I'd question those friendships.

For me the craic and drink go hand in hand!

An event or night out without drink, yeah I'll stay at home thanks.

It took me 3 mins between leaving working this afternoon and having a pint in my hand and I haven't left the pub since....:D:D

Kerplunk124

Few my friends do it now and again and I ****ING HATE IT. They never listen to me though.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

An event or night out without drink, yeah I'll stay at home thanks.

Sightseeing, cinema, a trip to the beach? You'd really need booze to enhance these?

gormdubhgorm

Snickers Man wrote: »

That's irresponsible driving. By my definition.

I said in my original post that I had never "knowingly" got pissed and driven. But there was one occasion, more than 20 years ago, when I drove home the morning after the night before, in reality the afternoon after the early morning before, a heavy night of celebration in a hotel where I was staying. It had involved a series of "boat-race" competitions, ie relays of silly men racing each other to drink a series of shorts.

The following day I left it as long as I could before checking out, not because I felt drunk but because I felt very ill. indeed I had to stop twice on the way home to, er, expurgate.

Later, talking to a friend, he told me I was lucky not to have been breathalysed as I would probably have been well over the limit.

That shocked me. I was not then aware of the morning after effect. As I said it was 20+ years ago. I have never done that since. I now know better. As I presume do most people thanks to the scare stories the guards put out about catching people in the morning during the Christmas season.

And quite right too.

Never EVER get drunk and drive. Not even the next day.

Well. I just used it as an example because I would consider that I would never drink and drive. But the next morning I obviously I still had alcohol in my system in hindsight. although I was positive I felt fine at the time. It shocked me if I am honest.

gormdubhgorm

Wompa1 wrote: »

I'm in the group of people who believe the limit should be 0. Obviously it can't be 0 due to mouthwash, natural amounts etc. I have never knowingly drank and then drove. Once when I was in my early 20's I went out the night before Paddy'S Day and had to drive home on Paddy's Day around 2pm. I felt fine and calculated and figured I would be below the limit at that time.

I was about halfway home when it hit me, I started to feel f*cked up. I rolled down the windows and the air made it even worse. I drove the rest of the way home at a snail pace.

A year or so later. My housemate and I bought a digital breathalyzer, so we could check ourselves before driving the day after. Great investment!

Exactly people forget about the following day. I think you are supposed to leave two hours per every pint to get out of your system it is easy to feel grand, but get behind the wheel and find your not right. It just showed to me how bad it must be when people get in a car straight from the pub or wherever.

Minderbinder

I think a few pints is okay. Based on my own tolerance I could drink a maximum of five or six pints and wouldn't really be drunk. Stronger alcohol would make me drunk. I probably wouldn't drive with more than three and it's just a kilometer on a quiet road. I know people say there is no excuse, which is true. If I'm caught that's my own fault. I trust my own judgement. Most people you hear about on the news have no control of themselves and are generally careless regardless of whether they've had a drink or not. There are usually other circumstances like emotional turmoil which when added to alcohol is a recipe for disaster.

gormdubhgorm

Minderbinder wrote: »

I think a few pints is okay. Based on my own tolerance I could drink a maximum of five or six pints and wouldn't really be drunk. Stronger alcohol would make me drunk. I probably wouldn't drive with more than three and it's just a kilometer on a quiet road. I know people say there is no excuse, which is true. If I'm caught that's my own fault. I trust my own judgement. Most people you hear about on the news have no control of themselves and are generally careless regardless of whether they've had a drink or not. There are usually other circumstances like emotional turmoil which when added to alcohol is a recipe for disaster.

But you are only trusting your own judgement. Which basically means you gambled. Like putting 50000 on Ireland to beat Bosnia in the fog. It can be a disaster anything can happen.. You are taking a chance a chance of hurting/killing yourself or others. We are only skin and bone. Our organs are not well protected against a collision simple as that.

MarkAnthony

Minderbinder wrote: »

I think a few pints is okay. Based on my own tolerance I could drink a maximum of five or six pints and wouldn't really be drunk. Stronger alcohol would make me drunk. I probably wouldn't drive with more than three and it's just a kilometer on a quiet road. I know people say there is no excuse, which is true. If I'm caught that's my own fault. I trust my own judgement. Most people you hear about on the news have no control of themselves and are generally careless regardless of whether they've had a drink or not. There are usually other circumstances like emotional turmoil which when added to alcohol is a recipe for disaster.

The first thing that alcohol does is impair your judgement.

Ferris_Bueller

Interesting reading all of the comments, I would have thought it would be a closer affair in terms of people who said yes/no considering it's just 2 pints. I'd sometimes have a pint or two shandys and then wait an hour or two and drive home, but I suppose having read this thread it's making me think about it. Not really worth it when you could just be drinking two pints of ribena down in the pub instead.

I genuinely would think that if I had a pint at 8pm and drove home at 10pm my driving wouldn't be effected at all, but as people have said it's probably just because I think I can get away with it or nothing related to drink driving has effected me or anyone I'm close to yet.

Tarzana2

Beau Unkempt Package wrote: »

but the beach, Only reason to go there is to fill up with drink

That may be the most depressing thing I have ever read.

Tarzana2

Tarzana2 wrote: »

That may be the most depressing thing I have ever read.

The beach is boring, I wouldn't bother going unless there was a bar close by.

To be honest I've very little interest in trips abroad etc anyway so it's no big surprise that the beach is an after thought.

I'd much rather spend money on a heavy weekends drinking than flights or accommodation abroad.

Azalea

Lord God Nox you're a (gin and) tonic! I wouldn't acknowledge if I thought you were on a wind-up but I think you're actually for real!

Anyway, I had four or five pints last night - was well drunk!
My tolerance has seriously dropped, which happens eventually. Definitely will never drive after even one pint.