Which IT cert for employability

Thargor

Perfect thanks.

Reactor

Hello,

I am absolutely sick of my current career and would like to give the cert route a go, I have a microbiology background but have worked with Sharepoint day to day and like another poster said I think I could leverage this to look like a bit of experience in the field on my CV, I have very little IT experience apart from this although I would have no problem building a gaming pc from scratch, swapping OS's, partitioning drives etc so not a total novice.

Can I ask people who know about this stuff starting from scratch what they would reccomend? Im 32, should I bite the bullet and go back to college or is it possible to study and get these qualifications in your spare time? What should I do first to build a base from?

Any help appreciated thanks.

robarmstrong

I'd highly recommend throwing a glance towards the CompTIA A+ and Network+ exams to get yourself started off for basic certification in IT, this tends to push you towards the most basic IT Support Desk position.

Once you have those you can pick and choose where you wanna go, I recommend the Office 365 route because it's taking off big time not just in Ireland, but globally.

There's always places to find fantastic course/study material for a fraction of the price. You can go back to college if you want to really dedicate yourself (I don't know your financial situation etc mortgage/rent, so I can't really say for sure) or you could study part time.

Anything else just give me a message.

Reactor

CompTIA A+ looks like exactly what I was thinking of thanks, how do you start? Just pick one of the online course providers and do it? Do you have any reccomendations? Something I could study quietly at work would be ideal.

robarmstrong

I done a course that I managed to grab off of one of those voucher sites like Groupon etc so it cost me around 99e just for the exam.

I bought the book also for about 30 quid but it included the Network+ side of things too so all in all it cost me about 200 for both exams plus the book.

For Microsoft study materials go to Microsoft Virtual Academy, there are literally thousands of extremely helpful videos/links/articles. Also TechNet.

Try YouTube for CompTIA A+ and Network+ along with CBTNuggets!

Reactor

What do you think of this deal?

https://www.groupon.ie/deals/e-careers-com-38-37706474

I know the exams arent included but Im just wondering how you actually start...

Thargor

Reactor wrote: »

What do you think of this deal?

https://www.groupon.ie/deals/e-careers-com-38-37706474

I know the exams arent included but Im just wondering how you actually start...

Thanks for that, looks like a good place to start for the price of a night out anyway. Think Ill go for it tbh, I know it doesn't actually cost hundreds of Euro but still, might focus the mind a bit. Anyone got an opinions on it?

Eire Go Brach

Thargor wrote: »

Thanks for that, looks like a good place to start for the price of a night out anyway. Think Ill go for it tbh, I know it doesn't actually cost hundreds of Euro but still, might focus the mind a bit. Anyone got an opinions on it?

The Comptia A course is changing this year. The 800 series will be out of date soon. So I'd suggest you suss out doing the 900 series. Depends how quickly you plan on doing the exams.

Thargor

Good to know thanks.

Newport81

comptia courses only 12 euro on udemy just got the a+ there

Thargor

So do people think its best to wait a few weeks for the 900 stuff instead of wasting time on 800?

Reactor

Does CompTIA actually get you a job though? Im wondering if there's any point continuing looking into it, all you get is scam sites trying to get you to hand over money, it seems like one big scam industry the more I look at it, will an employer even care if theres a Comptia entry on your CV? A search on Monster.ie for it reveals one position that doesnt also require a degree, paying 24k, might as well get a minimum wage job somewhere for less hassle. This thread is the closest thing Ive found to rational information on the subject and most of your questions will go unanswered.

Reactor

I am just looking for information. Is CompTIA the right path into a career in IT? Is there career progression? Can I get CompTIA and keep adding onto it until I have a viable career or are you stuck in those 24k roles forever because you have no degree?

Im not articulating it well but I basically want to know what people would do to get a career in IT? Are you fooling yourself with certs etc? I wouldnt mind a few years at 24k as long as there was a glimmer of hope, better than the dole.

Reactor

Does anyone know anywhere discussing this that isnt completely dead or a scam site looking for you money?

Gonzovision

Reactor wrote: »

I am just looking for information. Is CompTIA the right path into a career in IT? Is there career progression? Can I get CompTIA and keep adding onto it until I have a viable career or are you stuck in those 24k roles forever because you have no degree?

Im not articulating it well but I basically want to know what people would do to get a career in IT? Are you fooling yourself with certs etc? I wouldnt mind a few years at 24k as long as there was a glimmer of hope, better than the dole.

It depends on what you want to do. The A+ on it's own may not even get you an entry level position. It covers the absolute basics of desktop support. I think it's probably best to partner an A+ with some jobsbridge and hopefully get your foot in the door somewhere.

In regards to being stuck on 24k, you won't be if you put the work in and up-skill further, but until you are actually working it's very hard to decide what area to specialize in. There are so many avenues that are available.

From personal experience, I started with a Comptia A+ and N+, got some work experience, and finally landed a job in the sector and have specialized into my current role (network virtualization) from there.

Reactor

Thanks a million for replying. I just want something I can work towards is the most basic way I can put it, a proper career instead of endless low paying crap. How long do you have to work before you can specialize into something real? I just did a couple of Comptia practice exams there and scored 80% without reading any reference material so it shouldnt present too much hassle to me, Im just questioning if this is actually the way people get into IT or am I fooling myself?

Gonzovision

Reactor wrote: »

Thanks a million for replying. I just want something I can work towards is the most basic way I can put it, a proper career instead of endless low paying crap. How long do you have to work before you can specialize into something real? I just did a couple of Comptia practice exams there and scored 80% without reading any reference material so it shouldnt present too much hassle to me, Im just questioning if this is actually the way people get into IT or am I fooling myself?

If you want to work in support, Comptia are fine for a start. However the real learning begins when you start working. You will need to have an appetite to continually learn and up-skill. That means you will have to study certs, do lab work after your days work is done. A lot of hard work will be required. So if you want a job where you can leave everything in the office, IT may not be for you. Continual learning is a major part of it.

In terms of how long, it all depends on what sort of environment you get a job in. Some smaller IT businesses you will get hands on in a lot of different areas but at a lower level, where as if you work in an enterprise sized company your focus will be narrower but may also be deeper.

The best thing to do is try get the jobsbridge placement and see what area you are interested in.

If it's servers, go the Microsoft cert route , if it's networking, go look at some Cisco certifications, virtualization go VMware etc.

At the end of the day it'll all be about the effort you put in and interest you show.

Reactor

Thanks again, Id have no problem doing that work as long as I knew it was worthwhile and not a scam, Im just making sure Comptia is the way to start. What do you do and do you like it?

micosoft

So making the assumption here that you want to work for a non-tech company in IT and that you are not a software developer.

So the question I have is whether you want to go down infrastructure or Enterprise Software (not development) route.

So I would suggest thinking strongly about not going down the infrastructure route. The shift to cloud is real and means that organisations simply don't need as many infrastructure people and promotional opportunities are drying up. You can get trapped on the helpdesk etc. If that's what you want fine, but it's hard to get out of and pay is static or declining. DevOp's and the likes of AWS/Azure do not need infrastructure guys, just Dev's that understand infrastructure.
Forget about Cisco and Juniper. It's a tiny market and getting smaller rapidly with the likes of Cisco Meraki. CCNA's roles are not being renewed when the helpdesk can use simple cloud configurable web interfaces. Unless you are really really good and get some of the advanced certification and get work in niche areas I'd forget about it.

On the other hand enterprise cloud software is doing very well.

For example - think about doing Salesforce Certification (admin and config rather then developer). Huge shortage and lots of opportunity.
Workday and plenty of others have decent certification programmes and you get a role with decent promotion opportunities (Business Analysis, Project Management, Consultant etc)

Reactor

Thats the worry alright, that the whole thing is obsolete, who's to say Salesforce Certification wont be obsolete by the time I get it, where would you even get a job with it? Ive worked with sharepoint (just using it to add/remove/generate reports) for 5 years but is there any point seeing if I can persue something in that?

Reactor

Does anyone know a forum for asking these questions or anywhere you can get a bit of advice?

robarmstrong

What are your questions sorry and I'll do my best to answer them - haven't been looking at this thread often enough.

Reactor

Nah you've been a great help thanks, Im just trying to get a clear picture of whether this whole thing is a viable strategy for getting out of my current rut or if Im only dreaming and should focus on trying to do something with my existing (crap) qualifications.

A while back I was thinking of getting the Microsoft basics done and then doing the Sharepoint module, is this setting myself up for failure? How do you know whats current and whats going to be obsolete?

Im sure theres a forum or Facebook page dedicated to these questions?

robarmstrong

Reactor wrote: »

A while back I was thinking of getting the Microsoft basics done and then doing the Sharepoint module, is this setting myself up for failure? How do you know whats current and whats going to be obsolete?

Im sure theres a forum or Facebook page dedicated to these questions?

Going with SharePoint is definitely not a failure - there will always be a need for a company to have internal storage - intranets with sites and subsites and so on so forth. I recommend getting the MCSA in Server 2012 - MCSA in O365 - MCSE in SharePoint 2013.

This is an excellent base to become a SharePoint Administrator. Judging by the trends and how popular O365 is becoming - it'll last for a long time as it offers both on-premise and in-cloud storage facilities (SharePoint Online - covered in O365 study materials).

Due to it's popularity there are numerous well known apps that are collaborating with O365, SalesForce being just one of them! Don't worry about being "obsolete" at all.

I'm honestly not sure of the forum/Facebook page in regards to this - I tend to have answers to most Microsoft/IT career related questions that pop up in the forum since I've joined anyways.

Reactor

Thanks for that, I would always prefer to get the Microsoft certs tbh, everything else I look at just seems to be interested in getting you to input your credit card details.

How hard is it to get those MCSAs for an IT novice though? Where do you start, as in, what is the actual study material people are supposed to use? Is there a Microsoft equivalent of CompTIA I should do first and work from there?

Sorry for all the questions and thanks again for all your help.

robarmstrong

Reactor wrote: »

Thanks for that, I would always prefer to get the Microsoft certs tbh, everything else I look at just seems to be interested in getting you to input your credit card details.

How hard is it to get those MCSAs for an IT novice though? Where do you start, as in, what is the actual study material people are supposed to use? Is there a Microsoft equivalent of CompTIA I should do first and work from there?

Sorry for all the questions and thanks again for all your help.

Try the Microsoft Virtual Academy for study material - I have practice exams for the MCSA in O365 I can e-mail to you. Although these exams aren't for "novices" you can still pass if you just pay attention to the MVA videos and study appropriately.

You can do basic exams in like Word, Excel, etc but to be honest I would not recommend them, personally think they're a waste of time.

Purchase a subscription (or constantly use trials) to Office 365, practice plenty, that's what I did and it worked out fine for me.

Reactor

Im really sorry about this but how do you start? Like say you were a total novice and you said "Im going to get an MCSA in Server 2012", what do you do?

Are these certs just add-ons for an existing IT career or are they any good to a beginner at all?

robarmstrong

Reactor wrote: »

Im really sorry about this but how do you start? Like say you were a total novice and you said "Im going to get an MCSA in Server 2012", what do you do?

Are these certs just add-ons for an existing IT career or are they any good to a beginner at all?

First things first - join Microsoft Virtual Academy - they have essentially the entire course online of videos which are fantastic boosts to study.

Secondly - Study! Watch all the videos - purchase some practice exams/download more study material especially books.

My friend has no IT career experience but he studied for a solid 4 months to get an MCSA in Office 365.

MVA - https://mva.microsoft.com/ this will have exactly what you need. I've only been in IT for about 3 years so I'm still kind of a beginner myself.

Reactor

Ive searched that site and others all morning and I cannot find it, there are about 200 entries under Office 365 and none of them seem to be what to study for an MCSA in Office 365.

This is the closest link I can find:

http://borntolearn.mslearn.net/mcsa90/?vid=412ExamPrep#WindowsServer2012

But there seems to be no homepage or landing page that tells you how to start anywhere, this is why Im worried that Im making a massive mistake pursuing this stuff without a degree, every resource seems to imply you want these certs just to freshen up your CV on top of the IT stuff you've already done?

robarmstrong

You're not understanding - the MCSA in O365 is two exams to estimate your knowledge in Office 365 which would be supplemented by these - https://mva.microsoft.com/product-training/office-365

You don't "start" an MCSA - you study the material related to it (o365 being a lot of o365 related material) then when you feel competent enough in your knowledge you book the exams off the Microsoft website.

I literally googled "server 2012 mva" and I was met with these links that are essentially study prep for server exams.

https://mva.microsoft.com/en-US/training-courses/windows-server-2012-technical-overview-8564?l=BpPnn410_6504984382
https://mva.microsoft.com/en-us/training-courses/windows-server-2012-first-look-14253?l=C9IKgOSfB_7200115888
https://mva.microsoft.com/en-us/training-courses/windows-server-2012-r2-essentials-8289?l=uPSRMJXy_2304984382
https://mva.microsoft.com/en-us/training-courses/what-s-new-in-windows-server-2012-r2-jump-start-8230?l=x5ymEDJy_5704984382
https://mva.microsoft.com/en-us/training-courses/windows-server-2012-essentials-8554?l=UME7Nl10_9304984382

You seem to be a little confused as to what it actually is? Would you like to pop me across a PM and I can go on further for any questions?

Reactor

But how do you know what you're studying will be in the exam? Is there no syllabus?

robarmstrong

I wouldn't really call it a syllabus but there's two exams which are two parts judged on the modules - first one is easier than the second.

Part 1: Managing Office 365 Identities and Requirements - https://www.cbtnuggets.com/it-training/microsoft-office-365-70-346

Part 2: Enabling Office 365 Services - https://www.cbtnuggets.com/it-training/microsoft-office-365-70-347

Each individual video is essentially a module on which the exam is pulled from, 46 questions relating to the first part, 46 to the second.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SKvVU2Fz10 is also stupidly helpful too.

EDIT: Pm me your e-mail address and I'll get the practice exams sent to you so you can see yourself what kind of questions are asked.

Reactor

Thanks for all your help, Ill download the training packages from the Pirate Bay tonight and have a look, Im worried this is the totally wrong approach now though, it seems like something you would do if you already had a job in IT that you got from your degree and wanted to move to something new?

robarmstrong

I didn't go to college, don't have a degree, my first job in IT was on an Office 365 helpdesk which I had already studied and completed the exams in my spare time whilst still in retail. I'm 22 now and have no want nor need to go to college.

It seems like it is, but it isn't, trust me, it all depends on your confidence and capabilities! Let me know how it goes with the training packages.

Reactor

Thanks a million Robert.

Musicman2000

robarmstrong wrote: »

I didn't go to college, don't have a degree, my first job in IT was on an Office 365 helpdesk which I had already studied and completed the exams in my spare time whilst still in retail. I'm 22 now and have no want nor need to go to college.

It seems like it is, but it isn't, trust me, it all depends on your confidence and capabilities! Let me know how it goes with the training packages.

Good cert to have Rob, plenty of work in that end.

robarmstrong

That's exactly it. I have the MCSA in Office 365 supplemented with an MCSE in Exchange 2013/MCSA in Server 2012 and an MCS in Azure - all ties in to my job and future positions for me to take. Highly recommend to take this exam path!

Asaiah

micosoft wrote: »

So making the assumption here that you want to work for a non-tech company in IT and that you are not a software developer.

So the question I have is whether you want to go down infrastructure or Enterprise Software (not development) route.

So I would suggest thinking strongly about not going down the infrastructure route. The shift to cloud is real and means that organisations simply don't need as many infrastructure people and promotional opportunities are drying up. You can get trapped on the helpdesk etc. If that's what you want fine, but it's hard to get out of and pay is static or declining. DevOp's and the likes of AWS/Azure do not need infrastructure guys, just Dev's that understand infrastructure.
Forget about Cisco and Juniper. It's a tiny market and getting smaller rapidly with the likes of Cisco Meraki. CCNA's roles are not being renewed when the helpdesk can use simple cloud configurable web interfaces. Unless you are really really good and get some of the advanced certification and get work in niche areas I'd forget about it.

On the other hand enterprise cloud software is doing very well.

For example - think about doing Salesforce Certification (admin and config rather then developer). Huge shortage and lots of opportunity.
Workday and plenty of others have decent certification programmes and you get a role with decent promotion opportunities (Business Analysis, Project Management, Consultant etc)

Sorry but you are way out of touch with the market, they are crying out for good Cisco people. It's all well and good to talk about "the cloud" but when it comes to large enterprise networks they rely on network engineers heavily.

I find systems people tend to think of "the cloud" in abstract terms but what lies behind the Cloud? A network. Using Ethernet and other standard protocols. Who fixes it when it breaks? Service desk? Not a chance. The people who fix it are the people who understand these protocols in dept., ie Network engineers. There are plenty of jobs for good Cisco people.

I find the idea that infrastructure will be replaced by devops types amusing. In my experience in major multinationals, when all hell breaks loose and a customer facing service is impacted the devops, Unix and Microsoft people nearly always come crying to the networks team who usually end up being instrumental in fixing it. Networks either fix it directly, or use their packet mining skills to tell the others where their software or set up is going wrong.


The idea that hiding this behind a layer of software abstraction or a layer of cloud based separation will somehow make Network engineers obsolete is naive. If anything we will need more and more Network people to continue to implement it and fix it when it breaks.


The 'cloud' and easy to use GUI's are all well and good when they work, but when you get network anomalies and major incidents you better have some hard-core CLI guys on hand to fix it and restore the pretty gui for service desk.

I have found that many software Dev's think they understand networks but they really don't beyond the basics. I have never known a dev to be able to fix a complex enterprise network issue unless they also happened to be a network engineer.

A quick search on a UK jobs site reveals that right now there are 2,421 Cisco jobs available in the UK and 98 in Ireland. That's just on 2 websites.

L1011

I'd concur. The nice web config tools are only useful up to a point - they break, or aren't full featured, and you still need people who know what they're doing then

I, however, don't agree with the view some people have on here that you should go try force a CCNA through as your first cert. Had a few CCNA qualified "engineers" work under me in the past and they were clueless. Practical experience and knowledge from real world events is a lot more useful than knowing every Cisco command long enough to do an exam and forgetting the lot later. You're going to end up googling stuff regardless.

Asaiah

L1011 wrote: »

I'd concur. The nice web config tools are only useful up to a point - they break, or aren't full featured, and you still need people who know what they're doing then

I, however, don't agree with the view some people have on here that you should go try force a CCNA through as your first cert. Had a few CCNA qualified "engineers" work under me in the past and they were clueless. Practical experience and knowledge from real world events is a lot more useful than knowing every Cisco command long enough to do an exam and forgetting the lot later. You're going to end up googling stuff regardless.

True,

I think the CCNP is entry level for today's networks. The CCNA is a good cert to wet the appetite of potential network engineers but it really doesn't come close to preparing people for the real world.

Co. Clare Man

Most employers aren't excited 'bout seeing certifications from CompTIA (e.g. the A+ and the Network+) and Microsoft (e.g. the MTA and the MCA). Job-seekers certified as an MCSA or an MCSE are relatively rare, though and are held in much better regard by employers than those who are certified as an MCA or an MTA only. Relatively, few job applicants in IT have the CompTIA Linux+, however. The CompTIA Linux+ (as well as the certifications from the Linux Professional Institute) might prove useful to those job-seekers with no prior IT industry work experience and who wish to be differentiated from the many other job applicants who have no IT sector work experience.

Job-seekers holding certifications from CISCO are more appealing to IT employers. Quite a few computer networking personnel in Ireland don't hold even the CCNA, let alone the CCNP or the CCIE. Unless a person has used CISCO's products in previous employment, then he or she can totally forget about obtaining the CCNP or the CCIE.

The ICDL and the MOS are obviously only for those working with computers in non-technical roles. They might be useful for others, such as accounting technician apprentices and those who also have the IPASS.

I would definitely doubt the usefulness of a QQI Level 5 or 6 Major Award resulting from a Post Leaving Certificate (PLC) course in hardware or networking to those job candidates with little or no work experience in IT.

On an unrelated note, the Oracle Certified Foundations Associate, Java and the Oracle Certified Java Programmer (OCJP) are really only potentially useful for mature students who wish to study first-year software development or computer science at undergraduate level. The exam for the OCJP is really quite difficult to pass.

Griffith College have held in the past special-purpose-award part-time day & evening courses in coding/scripting/programming. Such courses would also be useful for the prospective mature students and would be much easier to complete than the exam for the OCJP.

However, the majority of prospective mature students would not have any of those certificates or courses. Another issue is that most course interviewers would not be familiar with what the certification exams from Oracle actually entail. They would better appreciate seeing a candidate having completed an entry-level coding/scripting/programming course from Griffith College.

tejula

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/98431213#Comment_98431213

CCNA is actually more difficult to pass and is a good funnel if someone wants to go into Networking. CCNP is next level, but you'll likely not pass CCNP from scratch and it is better to start of with CCNA..