Connacht Rugby Thread - Part III - The Violence of the Lams

Bridge93

While not ideal I would be sure the timing of this is not Pat's doing or Connachts doing but Bristol.
Bristol sacked their coach a few weeks ago yet Lam isn't going to be arriving until next season. That really sounds like they're throwing in the towel on this season and looking to build again from the summer.
Now no action may not sit well with stakeholders at Bristol so they would have needed an announcement of some sort of intent to keep people happy and that the club aren't just meandering to nowhere hence why they were always going to announce asap.
Once Bristol announce Connachts hands are fairly tied, it's just unfortunate it's this week

connemara man

This might sound odd and I know Pat Lam has been great for Connacht but if Nigel Carolan takes over I'd be more worried about finding someone as competent at scouting and spotting talented players and young player development.

freyners

I see we are now in the 5th reincarnation of the same account

irishbucsfan

connachta wrote: »

Ok Zippy, here are my 10 names at once inside a table with order of preference

Mark McCall[/td]
Saracencs Irish head coach, out of contract after a renewal in 2014[/td]
[/tr]
Nigel Carolan[/td]
Ireland U20 coach, ex Connacht Academy having raised Henshaw, Bealham, Marmion etc..[/td]
[/tr]
Sean Holley[/td]
Approached in 2013, ex Ospreys and Bristol successful coach[/td]
[/tr]
Jack White[/td]
Released by Montpellier this spring[/td]
[/tr]
Mike Ruddock[/td]
Ex Wales and Ireland U20 coach[/td]
[/tr]
Jason Holland[/td]
Hurricanes assistant coach, Irish head coach of the New Zealand Schools side[/td]
[/tr]
Rob Penney[/td]
Ex Munster, Canterbury coach[/td]
[/tr]
Bernard Jackman[/td]
Nearly relegated Grenoble coach, Connacht style[/td]
[/tr]
Andy Farrell[/td]
Defence coach for the 2013 Lions tour to Australia, contracted with IRFU until RWC.[/td]
[/tr]
Jeremy Davidson[/td]
Aurillac coach, great balence of play, but contracted until 2022 in theory[/td]
[/tr]

Table didn't resit to edit

Does this mean Sean Holley is 3rd on your list? That's mad

connachta

He's the most available so it makes him realistic, and acheived ok where others failed : Ospreys and Bristol
But he seems attached to Wales and turned the job down once... Connacht is pretty different from what it was 3 years ago though

connachta

When things go bad... http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/rugby/wasps-marquee-signing-line-make-12277087

irishbucsfan

connachta wrote: »

He's the most available so it makes him realistic, and acheived ok where others failed : Ospreys and Bristol
But he seems attached to Wales and turned the job down once... Connacht is pretty different from what it was 3 years ago though

What has he achieved where others have failed exactly?

thomond2006

I'd take Jackman over Holley tbh. Holley underachieved with a brilliant Ospreys squad, they made zero impact in Europe.

connachta

irishbucsfan wrote: »

connachta wrote: »

He's the most available so it makes him realistic, and acheived ok where others failed : Ospreys and Bristol
But he seems attached to Wales and turned the job down once... Connacht is pretty different from what it was 3 years ago though

What has he achieved where others have failed exactly?

Bristol promotion with a brillant style of play last season, more dominant than the seasons before with pretty much the same squad, I'm convinced the relagation wouldn't have been so likely with him kept in charge. Just ok with Ospreys, but still great European wins during his period.

McCall should be 1st target, even with slim chances. He knows the quality of our squad  : quote from the Indo in May

Saracens' Champions Cup-winning coach Mark McCall believes Connacht have been one of the stories of the year.

And the former Irish centre, who masterminded Saracens' 21-9 win over Racing 92 in Lyon last weekend, has paid Pat Lam's men the highest compliment by stating that no team will want to meet them in the Champions Cup next season.

"Of all the Irish provinces, Connacht are the team that nobody wants to get in their group next year.
"What a success story that has been, and Pat Lam deserves so much credit for achieving what he has achieved," said McCall.

ClanofLams

McCall isn't happening. Don't think Jackman or Holley are up to standard.

Its Carolan v External candidates I reckon. Connacht in a better place than ever before so should hopefully attract high calibre applications.

External candidates likely to bring greater experience but would likely want to transform style of play whilst Carolan would offer a much smoother transition with his knowledge of players and also favouring an expansive gameplan.

Hopefully they make the right call, I'd say it will be February at least before it's announced.

CMOTDibbler

thomond2006 wrote: »

No betting available on PP anymore.

Seems ok now.

former total

Ahhhh jaysus.

Am I really reading suggestions that Mark McCall would leave the current European and English champions, top of the Premiership table, for Connacht??

Ridiculous. I'm sorry to be a dick but there's no other word for it. You might as well say that Steve Hansen should be the target, or maybe that Eddie Jones guy, do you think he'd be interested?

b.gud

former total wrote: »

Ahhhh jaysus.

Am I really reading suggestions that Mark McCall would leave the current European and English champions, top of the Premiership table, for Connacht??

Ridiculous. I'm sorry to be a dick but there's no other word for it. You might as well say that Steve Hansen should be the target, or maybe that Eddie Jones guy, do you think he'd be interested?

I hear what you're saying but O'Connells is great for a few pints, plus if he comes over for the interview now we've got the beer tent so I don't see how he couldn't take the job

irishbucsfan

former total wrote: »

Ahhhh jaysus.

Am I really reading suggestions that Mark McCall would leave the current European and English champions, top of the Premiership table, for Connacht??

Ridiculous. I'm sorry to be a dick but there's no other word for it. You might as well say that Steve Hansen should be the target, or maybe that Eddie Jones guy, do you think he'd be interested?

If Pat Lam is willing to take a humungous backwards step from "Pro 12 Champions and possibly best team in Europe" Connacht down to lowly "sure noone has actually ever heard of them do they even exist" Bristol then surely Mark McCall, failed Ulster coach and probable bastard, would be willing to do the same?

stephen_n

I think Leinsters last search for a manager and how it panned out, would be a guideline of the caliber of manager a PRO 12 team can attract. Anyone who is good enough for premiership or top 14, simply isn't going to be interested. Carolan is probably the best choice, given what he knows of the setup. I'm not sure saying Jackman isn't good enough is fair comment, given his experience, not sure about his style of play though. At least Connacht have a bit more time to look around though, so I would think it might be towards the end of the season, by the time a decision is made.

Robbo

stephen_n wrote: »

I think Leinsters last search for a manager and how it panned out, would be a guideline of the caliber of manager a PRO 12 team can attract. Anyone who is good enough for premiership or top 14, simply isn't going to be interested. Carolan is probably the best choice, given what he knows of the setup. I'm not sure saying Jackman isn't good enough is fair comment, given his experience, not sure about his style of play though. At least Connacht have a bit more time to look around though, so I would think it might be towards the end of the season, by the time a decision is made.

But we the "How do you solve a problem like Leo?" aspect to the replacement process.

stephen_n

Robbo wrote: »

But we the "How do you solve a problem like Leo?" aspect to the replacement process.

It was Leo's appointment I was referring too, that occurred because of a lack of viable candidates. Which is why I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Carolan get it. Though you have much longer to sort it than we did. Maybe there's an assistant in super rugby looking to step up, but it's not going to be a current premiership or T14 manager, I'd imagine.

ClanofLams

stephen_n wrote: »

I think Leinsters last search for a manager and how it panned out, would be a guideline of the caliber of manager a PRO 12 team can attract. Anyone who is good enough for premiership or top 14, simply isn't going to be interested. Carolan is probably the best choice, given what he knows of the setup. I'm not sure saying Jackman isn't good enough is fair comment, given his experience, not sure about his style of play though. At least Connacht have a bit more time to look around though, so I would think it might be towards the end of the season, by the time a decision is made.

stephen_n wrote: »

I think Leinsters last search for a manager and how it panned out, would be a guideline of the caliber of manager a PRO 12 team can attract. Anyone who is good enough for premiership or top 14, simply isn't going to be interested. Carolan is probably the best choice, given what he knows of the setup. I'm not sure saying Jackman isn't good enough is fair comment, given his experience, not sure about his style of play though. At least Connacht have a bit more time to look around though, so I would think it might be towards the end of the season, by the time a decision is made.

Leinsters search was very hurried though whereas Connacht obviously have plenty of time. And since then, Dave Rennie has agreed to join Glasgow. So I think the Pro12 can attract a good level of coaches, albeit if it comes down to pro/England/France the money of the latter two will obviously win out.

Buer

CatFromHue wrote: »

Willie Ruane on Off The Ball said he only found out about it on Friday so it would be amazing for them to have found someone so soon.

Unless it's Eddie O'Sullivan, he only lives down the road after all.

Was only able to catch snippets but very interesting interview. He gave a decent insight into the process of recruiting a replacement.

It won't be a Connacht decision or an IRFU one but a collective one to best identify the right candidate. Nucifora will sit down with Connacht to review. Ruane said that Nucifora has been massively supportive of all Connacht's efforts since arriving. Nucifora could do with some good PR from someone who has actually dealt with him regularly.

EOS was quite non-committal on whether he'd apply or not but seemed resigned to him being an unlikely appointment. He was quite candid in his comments. He was asked if he'd spoken to IRFU brass in relation to him being stonewalled and admitted he had and that he was told that he was in good standing with them but simply wasn't the man they were looking for when he sought the Munster and Connacht jobs in the past. I get the impression he's accepting he'll never work in Ireland again.

Buer

ClanofLams wrote: »

Leinsters search was very hurried though whereas Connacht obviously have plenty of time. And since then, Dave Rennie has agreed to join Glasgow. So I think the Pro12 can attract a good level of coaches, albeit if it comes down to pro/England/France the money of the latter two will obviously win out.

I'm still in shock at that coup for Glasgow.

I can only assume that, with a name like Rennie, he has family in the area. Because otherwise that hire gives me indigestion.

Robbo

Buer wrote: »

I'm still in shock at that coup for Glasgow.

I can only assume that, with a name like Rennie, he has family in the area. Because otherwise that hire gives me indigestion.

Closely pipped John Gaviscon to the post.

ClanofLams

Buer wrote: »

ClanofLams wrote: »

Leinsters search was very hurried though whereas Connacht obviously have plenty of time. And since then, Dave Rennie has agreed to join Glasgow. So I think the Pro12 can attract a good level of coaches, albeit if it comes down to pro/England/France the money of the latter two will obviously win out.

I'm still in shock at that coup for Glasgow.

I can only assume that, with a name like Rennie, he has family in the area. Because otherwise that hire gives me indigestion.

Buer wrote: »

I'm still in shock at that coup for Glasgow.

I can only assume that, with a name like Rennie, he has family in the area. Because otherwise that hire gives me indigestion.

Yeah quite possibly, being able to make appointments early obviously helps too, some guys just like to have things sorted.

I know Lam said in an interview that was a factor for him, he was in the mix for other positions too but Connacht were able to make an offer in January IIRC.

Buer

I'm surprised he hasn't been mentioned as a contender but.....there's a RWC and HEC winning coach who is very much available. He is hugely experienced and has had a successful stint with a less fashionable Pro12 club in the past that saw them punch above their weight.

In fact, there's a lovely symmetry involved if Connacht were to appoint him...

molloyjh

ClanofLams wrote: »

Leinsters search was very hurried though whereas Connacht obviously have plenty of time. And since then, Dave Rennie has agreed to join Glasgow. So I think the Pro12 can attract a good level of coaches, albeit if it comes down to pro/England/France the money of the latter two will obviously win out.

This. Leinster literally a couple of months to find a replacement, i.e. June and July. Connacht have time to go and find the right coach now which would make all the difference.

Not only that but the circumstances are quite different too. Lam got a lot of really positive recognition for his work that led to him getting a new job with big money. That in itself would draw interest from certain coaches. As opposed to a guy who was basically sacked from a club with high expectations when he couldn't meet them.

b.gud

Buer wrote: »

I'm surprised he hasn't been mentioned as a contender but.....there's a RWC and HEC winning coach who is very much available. He is hugely experienced and has had a successful stint with a less fashionable Pro12 club in the past that saw them punch above their weight.

In fact, there's a lovely symmetry involved if Connacht were to appoint him...

OK I can't think of who it is, care to tell us

sydthebeat

Buer wrote: »

I'm surprised he hasn't been mentioned as a contender but.....there's a RWC and HEC winning coach who is very much available. He is hugely experienced and has had a successful stint with a less fashionable Pro12 club in the past that saw them punch above their weight.

In fact, there's a lovely symmetry involved if Connacht were to appoint him...

are you talking about JD ?

Buer

b.gud wrote: »

OK I can't think of who it is, care to tell us

Oh, sorry...yeah that'd be handy. Andy Robinson.

its_phil

former total wrote: »

Ahhhh jaysus.

Am I really reading suggestions that Mark McCall would leave the current European and English champions, top of the Premiership table, for Connacht??

Ridiculous. I'm sorry to be a dick but there's no other word for it. You might as well say that Steve Hansen should be the target, or maybe that Eddie Jones guy, do you think he'd be interested?

One poster, but sure let's go off on one :rolleyes:

connachta

Got rid of one Englishman at least
http://www.dublinlive.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-coach-stuart-lancaster-dismisses-12279848

connachta

ClanofLams wrote: »

Yeah quite possibly, being able to make appointments early obviously helps too, some guys just like to have things sorted.

I know Lam said in an interview that was a factor for him, he was in the mix for other positions too but Connacht were able to make an offer in January IIRC.

This needed time was forseen by a clause inside Lam's contract : he had to make his departure call 6 months before he leaves

connachta

its_phil wrote: »

former total wrote: »

Ahhhh jaysus.

Am I really reading suggestions that Mark McCall would leave the current European and English champions, top of the Premiership table, for Connacht??

Ridiculous. I'm sorry to be a dick but there's no other word for it. You might as well say that Steve Hansen should be the target, or maybe that Eddie Jones guy, do you think he'd be interested?

One poster, but sure let's go off on one :rolleyes:

McCall could care about being Ireland coach in 2019, then 2 years back in the country, to prove his real value with a low budget skillful squad, would be the correct call. Could assist Joe before RWC as special advisor in the meantime too. I know chances are slim but not ridiculous

former total

Doesn't the existence of a six-month notice clause raise the possibility that Bristol wouldn't have had to buy him out?

testtech05

former total wrote: »

Doesn't the existence of a six-month notice clause raise the possibility that Bristol wouldn't have had to buy him out?

Still leaving contract a year early so I would imagine there would have to have been some compensation paid....

connachta

testtech05 wrote: »

former total wrote: »

Doesn't the existence of a six-month notice clause raise the possibility that Bristol wouldn't have had to buy him out?

Still leaving contract a year early so I would imagine there would have to have been some compensation paid....

Not if it was a 2+1 in option contract

connachta

2nd hand reports from the Bristol press said Lam rejected the contract-buying possibility, as he refuses to come with immediate effect

testtech05

connachta wrote: »

Not if it was a 2+1 in option contract

At the time it was reported he was to stay until at least 2018 but could have been the case I guess. http://www.connachtrugby.ie/connacht-confirm-new-three-year-deal-for-head-coach-pat-lam/#ConnachtNews

Anyway hopefully the board and irfu can get the decision as right this time as they did with Pat, that's the main thing for me right now.

Zzippy

irishbucsfan wrote: »

If Pat Lam is willing to take a humungous backwards step from "Pro 12 Champions and possibly best team in Europe" Connacht down to lowly "sure noone has actually ever heard of them do they even exist" Bristol then surely Mark McCall, failed Ulster coach and probable bastard, would be willing to do the same?

Oh come on, that's unfair. He's with Saracens, there's nothing "probable" about it...

connachta

Zzippy wrote: »

irishbucsfan wrote: »

If Pat Lam is willing to take a humungous backwards step from "Pro 12 Champions and possibly best team in Europe" Connacht down to lowly "sure noone has actually ever heard of them do they even exist" Bristol then surely Mark McCall, failed Ulster coach and probable bastard, would be willing to do the same?

Oh come on, that's unfair. He's with Saracens, there's nothing "probable" about it...

I'd love even more to have him now, just to see how furious all the other provincial fans are

ClanofLams

Listened back to Conor McGuinness (Chair of the Professional Game Board) on liveline yesterday there. He said Connacht were intent on keeping their current brand of rugby under new coach and that as part of contingency planning, they have a shortlist drawn up.

FACECUTTR

ClanofLams wrote: »

Listened back to Conor McGuinness (Chair of the Professional Game Board) on liveline yesterday there. He said Connacht were intent on keeping their current brand of rugby under new coach and that as part of contingency planning, they have a shortlist drawn up.

Good news. I wonder when we will see the shortlist ? Probably when all persons on the list are contacted to see if they are interested.

civis_liberalis

Might be of interest....

Johnny O'Connor joins Galway United backroom team as strength & conditioning coach

They had the squad and potential signings/re-signings in on Sunday doing preliminary fitness tests. Start as you mean to go on...

Pre-season proper doesn't start until the New Year more than likely. Great to see.

wp_rathead

ClanofLams wrote: »

Listened back to Conor McGuinness (Chair of the Professional Game Board) on liveline yesterday there. He said Connacht were intent on keeping their current brand of rugby under new coach and that as part of contingency planning, they have a shortlist drawn up.

Liveline as in Joe Duffy?

ClanofLams

wp_rathead wrote: »

ClanofLams wrote: »

Listened back to Conor McGuinness (Chair of the Professional Game Board) on liveline yesterday there. He said Connacht were intent on keeping their current brand of rugby under new coach and that as part of contingency planning, they have a shortlist drawn up.

Liveline as in Joe Duffy?

Oops sorry meant drivetime.

http://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/rteradiowebpage.html#!rii=9:10655883:83:05-12-2016
26 mins in

ClanofLams

FACECUTTR wrote: »

ClanofLams wrote: »

Listened back to Conor McGuinness (Chair of the Professional Game Board) on liveline yesterday there. He said Connacht were intent on keeping their current brand of rugby under new coach and that as part of contingency planning, they have a shortlist drawn up.

Good news. I wonder when we will see the shortlist ? Probably when all persons on the list are contacted to see if they are interested.

Doubt they'll make it public although it might leak like last time.

macslash

I blame myself. Was in Bristol over the weekend. It's a nice town and found myself thinking I wouldn't mind taking in a game if ever over again as the place just reminded me of home a bit. Never in a million years imagined the announcement on Monday morning...:/

Gutted to say the least. Hope the replacement is up to it. Full steam ahead for Wasps now!

connachta

David Humphreys not much mentioned here...

KBurke85

connachta wrote: »

David Humphreys not much mentioned here...

Isn't his role more behind the scenes than actual on the field coaching?

You'd be looking at having to hire him and a head coach.

Robbo

The Archives of Pain, Week 13. New information in bold.

Player|Injury|Date of Injury|Expected Return
Marnitz Boshoff|Shoulder|Treviso (H)|Scan Results Pending
Craig Ronaldson|Thigh|Cardiff (H)|Mid-January
Andrew Browne|Ankle-Surgery|Dragons (A)|February
Rory Moloney|Concussion|AIL|Protocols
Shane O'Leary|Concussion|Training|Protocols
Eoin Griffin|Chest|AIL (Early November)|March
Ivan Soroka|Foot|AIL|Mid January
Josh Rowland|Ankle - Surgery|Unknown|January
Ben Marshall|Concussion|Last Season|Unknown
Eoghan Masterson|Knee|Last Season|December
Darragh Leader|Hand|Pre-Season|February


Niyi, Dillane, Bealham and Marmion should all be back. Healy and Loughney have re-integrated into training.

I see the 750k p/a has more or less been confirmed.

Does anyone have a ball park figure for the roles in Ireland and in particular ours?.
100k?.

b.gud

Robbo wrote: »

The Archives of Pain, Week 13. New information in bold.


Niyi, Dillane, Bealham and Marmion should all be back. Healy and Loughney have re-integrated into training.

Here's the official update