Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 **MOD NOTE POST 1***

dirkmeister

brookville wrote: »

Who was he full foward?

Liam Fennelly,he gave Joey Holden a tough time.

unrealtime

I wouldn't worry about Joey the All Star. Think of a back line of Paul Joey and Shane with Padraig Kieran and Cilian on the half line and Michael F and Conor midfield. If that's a worry then every other team can sing Dixie.

Cornerback1

unrealtime wrote: »

I wouldn't worry about Joey the All Star. Think of a back line of Paul Joey and Shane with Padraig Kieran and Cilian on the half line and Michael F and Conor midfield. If that's a worry then every other team can sing Dixie.

Lads have good and bad games. They can't be good all the time. All long as they are consistent during the summer months, that's the most important thing!!

Realt Dearg Sec

Cornerback1 wrote: »

Lads have good and bad games. They can't be good all the time. All long as they are consistent during the summer months, that's the most important thing!!

Yeah true but the pattern is there with Holden, and while he's not always going to get roasted, he is not at all in the same league as his two predecessors in the position. I think it's fair to say that Murphy has been holding the full back line together. We are susceptible to goal-hawking full forwards these days.

Cornerback1

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Cornerback1 wrote: »

Lads have good and bad games. They can't be good all the time. All long as they are consistent during the summer months, that's the most important thing!!

Yeah true but the pattern is there with Holden, and while he's not always going to get roasted, he is not at all in the same league as his two predecessors in the position. I think it's fair to say that Murphy has been holding the full back line together. We are susceptible to goal-hawking full forwards these days.

I also agree with that but i'd prefix that statement with looking the 2 players before Joey at fullback - JJ and NH. 2 superstars of the modern era and i think that's the way people look at it - comparing current players with giants of a recent era.

I think the Clare game has spooked us a bit esp. with the type of goals conceded in the first half.

My take on it is Clare won't score 2 goals like that again. Take them 2 defensive mistakes out of it and we were well in the game.

Realt Dearg Sec

Cornerback1 wrote: »

I also agree with that but i'd prefix that statement with looking the 2 players before Joey at fullback - JJ and NH. 2 superstars of the modern era and i think that's the way people look at it - comparing current players with giants of a recent era.

I think the Clare game has spooked us a bit esp. with the type of goals conceded in the first half.

My take on it is Clare won't score 2 goals like that again. Take them 2 defensive mistakes out of it and we were well in the game.

I wouldn't have expected anyone to match up to Hickey and JJ but we aren't getting solid, reliable full back play. That isn't to beat up on Holden, it seems to be a fact that we have no natural full back. I've been talking to people on here about this in the past, general consensus is that this is the case for most counties nowadays. The art of full back play is at a low ebb.

Cornerback1

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Cornerback1 wrote: »

I also agree with that but i'd prefix that statement with looking the 2 players before Joey at fullback - JJ and NH. 2 superstars of the modern era and i think that's the way people look at it - comparing current players with giants of a recent era.

I think the Clare game has spooked us a bit esp. with the type of goals conceded in the first half.

My take on it is Clare won't score 2 goals like that again. Take them 2 defensive mistakes out of it and we were well in the game.

I wouldn't have expected anyone to match up to Hickey and JJ but we aren't getting solid, reliable full back play. That isn't to beat up on Holden, it seems to be a fact that we have no natural full back. I've been talking to people on here about this in the past, general consensus is that this is the case for most counties nowadays. The art of full back play is at a low ebb.

True. It's all about systems now and full back play, in the traditional sense is being left behind. Some teams play 2 up front and bring other lad out to midfield. The full backs are then pulled over the place to create space. Do then go or sit?

Some 'target men' at 14 are now speed merchants who want to exploit space and the full back's perceived lack of pace.

Even look at Galway with Canning, a full back's nightmare would be Canning on the edge of the square for 72 or 73 mins but seldom does it happen.

Cornerback1

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Cornerback1 wrote: »

I also agree with that but i'd prefix that statement with looking the 2 players before Joey at fullback - JJ and NH. 2 superstars of the modern era and i think that's the way people look at it - comparing current players with giants of a recent era.

I think the Clare game has spooked us a bit esp. with the type of goals conceded in the first half.

My take on it is Clare won't score 2 goals like that again. Take them 2 defensive mistakes out of it and we were well in the game.

I wouldn't have expected anyone to match up to Hickey and JJ but we aren't getting solid, reliable full back play. That isn't to beat up on Holden, it seems to be a fact that we have no natural full back. I've been talking to people on here about this in the past, general consensus is that this is the case for most counties nowadays. The art of full back play is at a low ebb.

I think we tried to seal the middle up after the replay in 2014 and try not to concede many goal chances. With Conor Fogarty in midfield, he protects the central pocket well and with this, it's prob the best way we can seal up the full back line - by weight of numbers.

If Padr ig, KJ and Cillian can sit a little deeper also, it may help.

phkk

Was at the Graigue/Ballycallan vs St Patrick's match, good game with Ballycallan doing most of the pressing. Standout performers on the day were Billy Ryan, Ger Teehan and James Gannon with flashes of brilliance from Joe Brennan and Kevin Kelly(who needs to get involved more)

blackcard

Did Michael Fennelly or Richie Hogan play over the weekend?

brookville

Hogan wasn't listed to play on the programme over the weekend michael fenneley was listed at sixbut I don't know if he played.the u21 play westmeath next wednesday way it's a huge year for us at this level imo,westmeath are flying high at the moment so this might not be as straight foward as some think.Jimmy maher will be a big loss and luke scanlon hasn't played much for the club.hopefully the experience of training with the seniors will bring on conor delaney,liam blanchfield,alan murphy

Nedflanders02

brookville wrote: »

Hogan wasn't listed to play on the programme over the weekend michael fenneley was listed at sixbut I don't know if he played.the u21 play westmeath next wednesday way it's a huge year for us at this level imo,westmeath are flying high at the moment so this might not be as straight foward as some think.Jimmy maher will be a big loss and luke scanlon hasn't played much for the club.hopefully the experience of training with the seniors will bring on conor delaney,liam blanchfield,alan murphy

Yeah it's a big year for the U-21's especially after the way we went out the last couple for years. I think with the talent available this year we should go well. Hopefully no one picks up any injuries with the clubs next weekend and they have a full panel to pick from. It'll be interesting to see what team they go with, I think they have plenty of options and a lot of players are coming into form at the right time.

WhatsGoingOn2

blackcard wrote: »

Did Michael Fennelly or Richie Hogan play over the weekend?

Richie Hogan didn't play.
He was togged out, wearing number 8 and was fully involved in the warm up, but put his tracksuit backbone after it.

Hawkeye6

MfMan wrote: »

KK minors out now? If so, bit surprising considering their dominance at colleges level.

Surprise? Kilkenny Minors was an accident waiting to happen and sadly I was proven correct when dropping hints in previous posts. The obsession with Colleges hurling, driven by media frenzy and blind loyalty in the county are both factors. Firstly, as one poster pointed out colleges hurling is under-18 and a half. Though this was not a big factor for SKC this year, the MoM forward in the final was Not a minor. Secondly, the senior A colleges competition is seriously Overrated with only three colleges really being genuine contenders, Kierans, Kilkenny CBS and Ard Scoil Ris, Due to the effective packing of the Kilkenny colleges, they are and will be assured of many wins for the foreseeable future. Geographic issues and the interest by Colleges in hurling mean that the spread in other colleges of the top minors is much greater. There is zero competition in Leinster for the two schools. For example, where is the might of Dublin Senior Colleges hurling or indeed Wexford colleges who beat Dublin in the first round of the minor???

While the colleges hurling is in progress for SKC and CBS (with added 18+ players) many minors are not getting serious game time. Internal training is not as good as real match time. Meanwhile KK minors are preparing with what they have as are all the other counties who never have more than a handful of players with any individual college. A lot of these KK minors from non-city colleges feel under unwarranted pressure based now on several years of evidence that they are only making up numbers until the City-Colleges lads are back. This means the city college lads get an easy passage back into the squad and do not have to push themselves that extra mile for the cause and that was evident on the pitch at the weekend. After getting their AI, they lack the required motivation and drive for this reason. The significance of the Offaly challenge versus the Offaly championship game was dismissed by all, but if you discard a number of the squad you were preparing with, it does affect moral, let alone work already done.

Anyone who was at the Leinster senior colleges final in Nowlan Park, would have seen the level that Kilkenny hurling colleges is really at. The signs were there then that the college teams in Kilkenny had not enough hard working forwards. Maybe they don’t have to work hard to make minor selection if you’re a city college player and while it is important not to name individual players, was the squad in a good place? Judge for yourself…

18 out the 24 named players were SKC/CBS, 11 of the starting team were either SKC/CBS, ALL Subs introduced were either SKC/CBS. Result: ONLY 2 of the starting forwards SCORED FROM PLAY – (Only one of them was from a city college) and DEFEAT! In 2015, Kilkenny beat Dublin in the Under-17 Eugene Carey tournament shield final by 10 Points, Several of those key players who were not with City colleges were completely omitted from the minor panel this year. In fact less that 50% even made the extended panel. That’s a big “ignoring” of the Development Squad system in favour of the colleges. Of those that did. Two-thirds were from City colleges. The concern now is how those players can get back into the system. There is no under-19 development squad. One might also point to the scores being achieved by the Under-17 South squad in the Celtic Challenge games to date as a further question mark on the colleges approach.

Behind the facts is also the spirit of the squad. One player from SKC was started after a Self imposed 6-week break. He was needed you say?? What does that do for team spirit? Would that happen at senior? Another SKC lad played having hardly hurled for last two years. As previously stated, players from non-City colleges were dropped within hours of SKC winning the All-Ireland title. Others who remained, do not feel integrated with the City college players. Development squad coaches report that from U14 it is a frequent occurrence that players from the city colleges are requested by the college coaches that they sit out development squad sessions. The school coach takes priority but this adds to a two tier system. The team manager has a blind loyalty to SKC probably given that a family member is a student there. Two other members of the panel have parents involved as selectors or backroom. The team manager has been there for three years and was described by a poster as ambitious. In Year 1, KK got away with an embarrassing defeat thanks to the back door, yes they did come good. Year 2 KK possibly got so far thanks to avoiding major opposition in Leinster but in Year 3 KK have been caught again and will not even be the curtain raiser for the Leinster Final despite KK having hugely talented players from city colleges AND non-city colleges.

Believe it or not, we are in a potentially prosperous era of underage players aged between 15 and 20, yet KK has under achieved so far at minor with the county board investing huge resources in S&C. An attitude and culture which would not be tolerated by senior management has been allowed develop starting at minor. Further evidence of it creeping into U21 has already resulted in a strong reaction from their newly appointed manager. The culture issue with the colleges needs to be addressed as KK have potentially more very good years (subject to the effects of the new rules -another discussion)

Maybe this defeat will help dispel the myth of the might of colleges hurling in relation minor. I doubt it in Kilkenny, given that there was not one post supporting my earlier posts. Everyone cares about KK Minor in the county, but not everyone cares about SKC/CBS. There are steps which need to happen. However, the first step on the road to any recovery is to admit there is an issue which needs to be addressed.

northern lad

It was Pat's fourth year in charge. Unlucky in 2015. Which non city colleges players should have started last Saturday????

citykat

Hawkeye6 wrote: »

MfMan wrote: »

KK minors out now? If so, bit surprising considering their dominance at colleges level.

Surprise? Kilkenny Minors was an accident waiting to happen and sadly I was proven correct when dropping hints in previous posts. The obsession with Colleges hurling, driven by media frenzy and blind loyalty in the county are both factors. Firstly, as one poster pointed out colleges hurling is under-18 and a half. Though this was not a big factor for SKC this year, the MoM forward in the final was Not a minor. Secondly, the senior A colleges competition is seriously Overrated with only three colleges really being genuine contenders, Kierans, Kilkenny CBS and Ard Scoil Ris, Due to the effective packing of the Kilkenny colleges, they are and will be assured of many wins for the foreseeable future. Geographic issues and the interest by Colleges in hurling mean that the spread in other colleges of the top minors is much greater. There is zero competition in Leinster for the two schools. For example, where is the might of Dublin Senior Colleges hurling or indeed Wexford colleges who beat Dublin in the first round of the minor???

While the colleges hurling is in progress for SKC and CBS (with added 18+ players) many minors are not getting serious game time. Internal training is not as good as real match time. Meanwhile KK minors are preparing with what they have as are all the other counties who never have more than a handful of players with any individual college. A lot of these KK minors from non-city colleges feel under unwarranted pressure based now on several years of evidence that they are only making up numbers until the City-Colleges lads are back. This means the city college lads get an easy passage back into the squad and do not have to push themselves that extra mile for the cause and that was evident on the pitch at the weekend. After getting their AI, they lack the required motivation and drive for this reason. The significance of the Offaly challenge versus the Offaly championship game was dismissed by all, but if you discard a number of the squad you were preparing with, it does affect moral, let alone work already done.

Anyone who was at the Leinster senior colleges final in Nowlan Park, would have seen the level that Kilkenny hurling colleges is really at. The signs were there then that the college teams in Kilkenny had not enough hard working forwards. Maybe they don’t have to work hard to make minor selection if you’re a city college player and while it is important not to name individual players, was the squad in a good place? Judge for yourself…

18 out the 24 named players were SKC/CBS, 11 of the starting team were either SKC/CBS, ALL Subs introduced were either SKC/CBS. Result: ONLY 2 of the starting forwards SCORED FROM PLAY – (Only one of them was from a city college) and DEFEAT! In 2015, Kilkenny beat Dublin in the Under-17 Eugene Carey tournament shield final by 10 Points, Several of those key players who were not with City colleges were completely omitted from the minor panel this year. In fact less that 50% even made the extended panel. That’s a big “ignoring” of the Development Squad system in favour of the colleges. Of those that did. Two-thirds were from City colleges. The concern now is how those players can get back into the system. There is no under-19 development squad. One might also point to the scores being achieved by the Under-17 South squad in the Celtic Challenge games to date as a further question mark on the colleges approach.

Behind the facts is also the spirit of the squad. One player from SKC was started after a Self imposed 6-week break. He was needed you say?? What does that do for team spirit? Would that happen at senior? Another SKC lad played having hardly hurled for last two years. As previously stated, players from non-City colleges were dropped within hours of SKC winning the All-Ireland title. Others who remained, do not feel integrated with the City college players. Development squad coaches report that from U14 it is a frequent occurrence that players from the city colleges are requested by the college coaches that they sit out development squad sessions. The school coach takes priority but this adds to a two tier system. The team manager has a blind loyalty to SKC probably given that a family member is a student there. Two other members of the panel have parents involved as selectors or backroom. The team manager has been there for three years and was described by a poster as ambitious. In Year 1, KK got away with an embarrassing defeat thanks to the back door, yes they did come good. Year 2 KK possibly got so far thanks to avoiding major opposition in Leinster but in Year 3 KK have been caught again and will not even be the curtain raiser for the Leinster Final despite KK having hugely talented players from city colleges AND non-city colleges.

Believe it or not, we are in a potentially prosperous era of underage players aged between 15 and 20, yet KK has under achieved so far at minor with the county board investing huge resources in S&C. An attitude and culture which would not be tolerated by senior management has been allowed develop starting at minor. Further evidence of it creeping into U21 has already resulted in a strong reaction from their newly appointed manager. The culture issue with the colleges needs to be addressed as KK have potentially more very good years (subject to the effects of the new rules -another discussion)

Maybe this defeat will help dispel the myth of the might of colleges hurling in relation minor. I doubt it in Kilkenny, given that there was not one post supporting my earlier posts. Everyone cares about KK Minor in the county, but not everyone cares about SKC/CBS. There are steps which need to happen. However, the first step on the road to any recovery is to admit there is an issue which needs to be addressed.

It really is a tad disingenuous for somebody to come on and say I told you so when they never said any such thing in the first place. By all accounts the Dublin minor team were the better team on the day. Kilkenny lead that game pretty much from the start and were only caught out by a late goal for Dublin to level it.

To argue that success at Colleges level is somehow a hindrance to success at minor inter county is surely a first. It's an argument I haven't heard before. The argument that I frequently read and hear is that lack of success at schools level in other counties is an impediment to success at underage inter county level.

One point I would agree with you on was the quality of forward on view in the Kierans/CBS Leinster final. Practically all the scoring that day, for each team, was done by one player. In that context, it should have been relatively easy for all these hidden gems in country schools to shine and put their hands up for consideration. Why did they not so do?

As for the lad selected after a self imposed break, in any normal situation he wouldn't have been selected. It was unusual for a manager that has played hardball with other lads for less. The fact that he was selected speaks volumes especially as he'll be underage again next year. To his credit he scored 4 pts from play, 8 in total. I could be a bollix and say that's 8 more than his two country schooled colleagues in the full forward line managed but that would be ridiculous.

I'm sure after this result there'll be questions asked of the management. The fact that there was no back door at this stage was unusual and must make the defeat hard to swallow. If you look at his record though, this manager won an AI in 2104 and was a blatant square ball away from an AI appearance in 2015. In any other county, that rate of return would be deemed a success.

Formosa

Good post Hawkeye, just to note that this is not a new phenomenon in Kilkenny and has been an issue for at least 25 years, I don't know about prior to that but it's probably going back 60 years in reality.

Your valid concerns won't go down well with the county board cheerleaders that dominate around here, but real hurling people know what you're talking about.

SanPel2016

how do people see the third round of club games going at the weekend?

Kenajonn

Formosa wrote: »

Your valid concerns won't go down well with the county board cheerleaders that dominate around here, but real hurling people know what you're talking about.

I must say I was not impressed with the management. Spent most of his time moaning to the linesman. Then when extra time came instead of going straight into the dressing room with the team he stayed on the pitch for at least five minuets to moan to the referee.

JJs Left Hand

Anyone who thinks the minor management did a good job last year wasn't paying attention. No way in hell we should have let Galway back into those 2 games. We had both won and threw away both of them. That's on the management.

Re: the club games this weekend; St. Martins to continue our unrelenting march to glory by sweeping aside Johnstown. In reality, the game is in Ballyragget which is a nightmare for us when playing Johnstown.

unrealtime

OMG - such an easy way to slag minors and those in charge. Minor's performances are always dicy. They played Dublin and lost in extra time. The record in recent years is not good and neither is that at under-21.

I think that the success of the seniors has brought complacency to our under-age teams. I don't believe we are getting full effort from everyone. However if we could get over early hurdles we might prosper later on but that early exit has been a problem for years now. The players need to take a good look at themselves and start performing. It is not only this year that we have a problem and I think a change in attitude rather than personnel is the major need.

Realt Dearg Sec

unrealtime wrote: »

OMG - such an easy way to slag minors and those in charge. Minor's performances are always dicy. They played Dublin and lost in extra time. The record in recent years is not good and neither is that at under-21.

I think that the success of the seniors has brought complacency to our under-age teams. I don't believe we are getting full effort from everyone. However if we could get over early hurdles we might prosper later on but that early exit has been a problem for years now. The players need to take a good look at themselves and start performing. It is not only this year that we have a problem and I think a change in attitude rather than personnel is the major need.

Who is slagging minors? Hawkeye has a viewpoint, most don't agree with him but I don't think he's just taking cheap shots.

Topcat32

unrealtime wrote: »

OMG - such an easy way to slag minors and those in charge. Minor's performances are always dicy. They played Dublin and lost in extra time. The record in recent years is not good and neither is that at under-21.

I think that the success of the seniors has brought complacency to our under-age teams. I don't believe we are getting full effort from everyone. However if we could get over early hurdles we might prosper later on but that early exit has been a problem for years now. The players need to take a good look at themselves and start performing. It is not only this year that we have a problem and I think a change in attitude rather than personnel is the major need.

So the record in recent years is not good?? They won the All Ireland 2 years ago, were beaten narrowly in a semi final replay to the eventual champions last year and in 2013 lost narrowly to a very good Waterford team. Whats your definition of a good record?

PáircLife

phkk wrote: »

Was at the Graigue/Ballycallan vs St Patrick's match, good game with Ballycallan doing most of the pressing. Standout performers on the day were Billy Ryan, Ger Teehan and James Gannon with flashes of brilliance from Joe Brennan and Kevin Kelly(who needs to get involved more)

Must disagree with you here. Kevin Kelly with Ballyragget is consistently involved and is their go-to-man match after match. Have been to a lot of Ballyragget's games the last few years and he must be averaging 5/6 points from play the last few years. He is one of the best club hurlers in the county without doubt. Doesn't always happen for him when he's wearing black and amber but I think this could a big year for him. He is gifted and his striking is always a joy to watch.

JJs Left Hand

At Intermediate Club level it might be but there's undoubtedly a bit of the Pa Bourke about his swing. Lovely to watch in isolation but a bit long and slow

PáircLife

That's true. He seems to get acres of space playing for Bally, he can do as he likes then.. Intercounty is a different ball game altogether and I feel he has struggled but saying he needs to get involved more for Bally is ridiculous.

unrealtime

3 wins for minors and for under-21s over last 13 seasons - in contrast 9 for the seniors.

kksaints

unrealtime wrote: »

3 wins for minors and for under-21s over last 13 seasons - in contrast 9 for the seniors.

Which is the more important number. The Minors and U-21 are really only supply lines to the Seniors imo. As long as they keep producing enough players to fill the gaps that are left by retirements in the seniors then it really doesnt matter if they win All-Irelands or not.

unrealtime

agree largely with that but not the point or context of my post. Offaly had the best young hurlers in the country in the Noughties but they sunk without trace.

randd1

unrealtime wrote: »

agree largely with that but not the point or context of my post. Offaly had the best young hurlers in the country in the Noughties but they sunk without trace.

They did in their f**k. Won a Leinster minor and U21 and that was it. It was no surprise they made no impact at senior.

As for the general theme of Kilkenny underage, my own view is that our minors have lacked a cutting edge in front of goal, but even allowing for that we won 3 Leinsters in a row, 1 AI, and but for a tit for tat sending off against Waterford in '13 and a square ball last year, we could have had 3 in a row at minor given how easily both won their finals.

This year we were beaten by a Dublin team we've struggled to beat recently, who have beaten us recently, who got to the same stage as us last year and who they reckon could win it out this year given their talent.

As for our schools, Kieran's and the CBS together probably have the same pick of boys as the rest of the schools in the county combined. Of course they're going to be strong because of it. But they're valuable nurseries other counties would kill for. And the other schools do alright enough at their level (though I think more could be done like having a South Selection and a North Selection and have a home/away league with Kieran's and CBS).

U21 has not been good, but Clare are mentioned left right and centre for their four U21 wins yet Kilkenny could easily have won the first one, were as good as them only they ran out of steam in 2012. Also it should be noted that the recent winners at U21 have been ladled with senior hurlers, there's a difference in teams that have a lot of senior trained players playing U21 and those that don't, and we don't tend to have many seniors on our U21 teams.

We could be doing better, particularly in our forward coaching at underage, but all things considered I'd take our current situation over anyone else's.

darsheblows

''We could be doing better, particularly in our forward coaching at underage, but all things considered I'd take our current situation over anyone else's. ''

I'm not sure is it better coaching or the fact that they are over coached. The bit of "devilment" or eye for a goal is being coached out of youngsters before they reach minor. Too much "take your points". Not enough "take a chance". I reckon if DJ had been coached like the youngsters are now he would have been told not to pick the ball and run at the opposition, not to take a risk. There's none of that excitement in Kilkenny hurlers anymore. We have brilliant, athletic, super dedicated, super skilful machines, but no "Maverick".
DJ had it in spades, Eddie Brennan had it, Richie Power had it, who has it now??

Nedflanders02

darsheblows wrote: »

''We could be doing better, particularly in our forward coaching at underage, but all things considered I'd take our current situation over anyone else's. ''

I'm not sure is it better coaching or the fact that they are over coached. The bit of "devilment" or eye for a goal is being coached out of youngsters before they reach minor. Too much "take your points". Not enough "take a chance". I reckon if DJ had been coached like the youngsters are now he would have been told not to pick the ball and run at the opposition, not to take a risk. There's none of that excitement in Kilkenny hurlers anymore. We have brilliant, athletic, super dedicated, super skilful machines, but no "Maverick".
DJ had it in spades, Eddie Brennan had it, Richie Power had it, who has it now??

In fairness I think the likes of Chris Bolger, Liam Blanchfield and John Walsh do have that, Ger Alyward had a good eye for goal as well in fairness.

I would agree with a lot of what you say though and at underage especially lads are happy to tap over a few points rather than take a chance at a goal.

kkclubhurling

Some good club games across both grades this weekend, particular ones to look out for IMO

Tullaroan vs Ballycallan- Nowlan Park, Friday 7.30

Obviously a local rivalry but also a big game in terms of the group. A Tullaroan win will see them on 6 points and you'd have to assume through to a league shield final at the very least, they're putting in huge effort out there to get back to senior again this year and in fairness they do have a good team of players out there. Padraig and Shane Walsh are both well able to get a score and at the back they've good young hurlers like Diarmuid Doheny and Tommy Walsh along with a bit of experience in Martin Walsh. Tommy is still playing too and can have a huge impact on any game.

For Ballycallan a win will put them right in the mix up for the top 2 after last weeks win over Ballyragget, they've actually got a good blend of youth and experience in the team with the likes of Billy Ryan and Conor Murphy doing plenty of scoring, other relative young lads like Vinny Teehan and Shane Butler are good club hurlers too, while at the back Darragh Egan is a clever, tidy hurler and Ger Teehan is a very strong defender, James Ryall got injured the last day so I don't know if he's around for this one but he'd be a right man for a local derby tonight if he is around.

O'Loughlins vs Mullinavat- Friday, Ballyhale, 7.30

Bookies have OLG as fairly strong favorites for this one after last weeks win over Clara, they've a strong team and if they've the likes of Paddy Deegan back available tonight it'll only make them stronger. Huw Lawlor is a strong wing back or centre back and has been hurling all year with UCD in Fitzgibbon. In the forwards Mark Bergin really produced against Clara as did Mark Kelly, Sammy Johnston is a good man to take a score and Alan Geoghegan is looking sharp as ever. They really put a huge emphasis on the Clara game and its hard to know if the same intensity will be there again this time.

Mullinavat have looked very sharp in the forwards so far in the league, the returning John Walsh is a massive boost of course while Willie O'Dwyer is a beast no matter where he plays, they really could have put Danesfort to the sword the first day and will be disappointed not to have done better in the second half last weekend. The two Malones are good operators for them too and if they can keep O'Loughlins out at the back they've a serious chance tonight.

Dicksboro vs James Stephens- Saturday, Nowlan Park 7.30

Dicksboro lost to Martins with a last minute goal on the first day and replied with a fairly convincing win over Fenians last weekend. They've a maturing team and a lot of their 20 and 21 year olds have 4 years under the belt at senior hurling. Other young lads like Andy Gaffney and Robbie Murphy in the forwards have only come through in the last few years but are serious talents. The eldest Gaffney scored 3 last week and when he's fit he is a dangerous forward. They've a few lads in and around returning like Stephen Farrell and Kevin Kenny who'd obviously both be big boosts. They played Cillian Buckley centre forward vs Fenians but he excelled vs the Village at midfield last year and could play anywhere really. At the back they're anchored by Evan Cody who is a serious athlete, Robbie Fitzpatrick can play anywhere from 2-9 and is again a good hurler.

For James Stephens they've 3 points on the board so far after a win vs the Rower last week and a draw vs the Bridge. Tomas Keogh has probably stood out from the backs so far this year, dealing well with Liam Blanchfield and Tom Murphy in the two games so far. Jack McGrath has played centre back and is a skillful player who can put over long range frees, he had Diarmuid Cody back beside him last week to shore up that line of the field. In the forwards obviously Eoin Larkin is the main man and he's still as classy as ever, he's ably assisted by Mullins who gets through a lot of work and has good legs and Matty Ruth who is a serious hardworker.

Not going to predict the winners of any games cos i'd get them wrong, last weekend of club hurling for a long while so i'd recommend ye get out and see a few games, games on Friday, Saturday and Sunday all over the county.

kkclubhurling

Went to the Tullaroan Ballycallan match after to try keep the head dry, the Tullaroan men won out comfortably 2-18 to 0-14.

Ballycallan will be really despondent with this performance especially after last week. The players never really showed the blood and thunder you'd expect from the underdogs in a local derby. Tactically they tried to match up at the back and it didn't really work out. The Walshs all had a massive influence, from Martin at Centre Back to Tommy the elder who roamed everywhere winning position right the way through to Padraig and Shane who both hit the back of the net. Ballycallan never got their puckouts going either, they just couldnt win the battle in the middle third, I thought young Prenderville tried hard for them and Egan was vocal at the back as his teammates just couldn't seem to get to grips with the Tullaroan forwards movement. All in all it was a poor game with a lot of bad wides but Tullaroan certainly look like contenders this year.

WhatsGoingOn2

Good win for Comer last night, beating Clara 1-12 to 1-09. Tough conditions with a lot of wind and rain meant both sets of backs were on top. Lester Ryan was sent off in the last minute with a second yellow card for abusing the ref.

Comerman

WhatsGoingOn2 wrote: »

Good win for Comer last night, beating Clara 1-12 to 1-09. Tough conditions with a lot of wind and rain meant both sets of backs were on top. Lester Ryan was sent off in the last minute with a second yellow card for abusing the ref.

Lester was quiet enough in the game anyway but let the team down by getting the two yellows for gobbing off, wouldn't of been so bad if it was for over zealous hurling or something like that.

Cornerback1

Comerman wrote: »

WhatsGoingOn2 wrote: »

Good win for Comer last night, beating Clara 1-12 to 1-09. Tough conditions with a lot of wind and rain meant both sets of backs were on top. Lester Ryan was sent off in the last minute with a second yellow card for abusing the ref.

Lester was quiet enough in the game anyway but let the team down by getting the two yellows for gobbing off, wouldn't of been so bad if it was for over zealous hurling or something like that.

Is Lester well out of contention to come into the fray with KK this summer? Obviously, he'll not start?

Hawkeye6

citykat wrote: »

As for the lad selected after a self imposed break, in any normal situation he wouldn't have been selected. It was unusual for a manager that has played hardball with other lads for less. The fact that he was selected speaks volumes especially as he'll be underage again next year. To his credit he scored 4 pts from play, 8 in total. I could be a bollix and say that's 8 more than his two country schooled colleagues in the full forward line managed but that would be ridiculous.

This guy really does not get it! He actual believe this was the right thing to do!
He thinks it is acceptable for Kilkenny, the greatest hurling county there is . I suppose his name gives away the city bias and it is in line with the city bias, which is festering to danger point. I tried to avoid identifying the player concerned but ccitykat had no such qualms by giving his score, Doesn’t deny it in fairness and Citykat is proud of it.. Absolutely does not see an issue.

He cannot see the affect on moral of the other young players. He just cannot see it.
He doesn’t see that the “two country schooled colleagues” as he patronisingly put it, actually scored 3-5 (3-3 from play) between them in the previous game when he wasn’t there as well as providing assists and winning frees that were scored. They were also scoring for fun in challenge games when he wasnt there and they didn’t have to contend with a centre back who had only one target in mind in those previous games. citykat, He or she does not see that changing the dynamic for one player can have a detrimental affect on the balance of the team. No, that doesn’t matter to Citykat. He’s like the teacher from SKC who commented “if we had all SKC lads, we would have won!” Even the CBS lads might want to have something to say on that. Or he could be he/she be like kksaints who says “it really doesn’t matter if they win All-Irelands or not”. Maybe that is the general consensus. Somehow I don’t think it is, but I’m open to correction.

Rumour has it that the same management team will be in place again next year… Anyone got thoughts, so far nobody had contradicted my previous revelations (obviously because I am well informed too); Here’s two more revelations to ponder regarding the merits of the current management team.
One player was included in the squad who was actually injured throughout preparations. Of course his father was a selector. Then again the manager will have a family member contending next year. Does anyone wonder why Sean Kelly and Jimmy Meagher, two very good coaches stepped away this year. Were they propping up the manager for the last few years. Hence such an easy exit this year. Unusual given that on paper Kilkenny had a huge chance of winning a Minor All-Ireland in 2016. Feel free to do your own investigations.

In my opinion this management is not good and do not look outside the city bias which is not good overall, particulalry for motivating our up and coming young players.

From a positive overall point of view, the suggestion from rrand1, which has been around for a few years now, about the north colleges/south colleges/city colleges competition is essential going forward. It deserves more meat, but not at this point.

citykat

Got to the Village/Boro match this evening. Evenly matched for the first half with just the bare minimum separating the teams at half time. Village looked slightly stronger especially in the forwards with their half forward line of Larkin, Mullins & Browne causing havoc running at the Boro defence. But for the goal, the Village would have been deservedly ahead. Different story in the second half. Boro were by far the better team and but for some wastefulness in front of goal would have won by far more. Larkin along with the rest of his forward colleagues were anonymous. Ruth put over from about 6 yards out when it looked easier to goal. Bar that chance the village never really troubled the Boro defence in any meaningful way.
Buckley was back in familiar territory at CB and was motm. Larks had a good first half. Jackie played the whole game and played it well though he did get caught in possession a few times trying to run the ball out of defence. Cody was solid without being spectacular.

dobbs2210

citykat wrote: »

Got to the Village/Boro match this evening. Evenly matched for the first half with just the bare minimum separating the teams at half time. Village looked slightly stronger especially in the forwards with their half forward line of Larkin, Mullins & Browne causing havoc running at the Boro defence. But for the goal, the Village would have been deservedly ahead. Different story in the second half. Boro were by far the better team and but for some wastefulness in front of goal would have won by far more. Larkin along with the rest of his forward colleagues were anonymous. Ruth put over from about 6 yards out when it looked easier to goal. Bar that chance the village never really troubled the Boro defence in any meaningful way.
Buckley was back in familiar territory at CB and was motm. Larks had a good first half. Jackie played the whole game and played it well though he did get caught in possession a few times trying to run the ball out of defence. Cody was solid without being spectacular.

Thought it was a poor game. Boro were better team. Thought Village were hopeless up front. They look a very poor team. Scored 4 or 5 points from play in the whole game.

Buckley was dominant and Ollie Walsh hurled very well i thought.

Fenians scored a vital narrow win over Muckalee tonight.

dubcat51

Poor game dubs v wexford. Wexford were shocking.hope dubs turn in the same performance against us.anybody know what the 21st team might be for game v Westmeath

Realt Dearg Sec

Hawkeye6 wrote: »

This guy really does not get it! He actual believe this was the right thing to do!
He thinks it is acceptable for Kilkenny, the greatest hurling county there is . I suppose his name gives away the city bias and it is in line with the city bias, which is festering to danger point. I tried to avoid identifying the player concerned but ccitykat had no such qualms by giving his score, Doesn’t deny it in fairness and Citykat is proud of it.. Absolutely does not see an issue.

He cannot see the affect on moral of the other young players. He just cannot see it.
He doesn’t see that the “two country schooled colleagues” as he patronisingly put it, actually scored 3-5 (3-3 from play) between them in the previous game when he wasn’t there as well as providing assists and winning frees that were scored. They were also scoring for fun in challenge games when he wasnt there and they didn’t have to contend with a centre back who had only one target in mind in those previous games. citykat, He or she does not see that changing the dynamic for one player can have a detrimental affect on the balance of the team. No, that doesn’t matter to Citykat. He’s like the teacher from SKC who commented “if we had all SKC lads, we would have won!” Even the CBS lads might want to have something to say on that. Or he could be he/she be like kksaints who says “it really doesn’t matter if they win All-Irelands or not”. Maybe that is the general consensus. Somehow I don’t think it is, but I’m open to correction.

Rumour has it that the same management team will be in place again next year… Anyone got thoughts, so far nobody had contradicted my previous revelations (obviously because I am well informed too); Here’s two more revelations to ponder regarding the merits of the current management team.
One player was included in the squad who was actually injured throughout preparations. Of course his father was a selector. Then again the manager will have a family member contending next year. Does anyone wonder why Sean Kelly and Jimmy Meagher, two very good coaches stepped away this year. Were they propping up the manager for the last few years. Hence such an easy exit this year. Unusual given that on paper Kilkenny had a huge chance of winning a Minor All-Ireland in 2016. Feel free to do your own investigations.

In my opinion this management is not good and do not look outside the city bias which is not good overall, particulalry for motivating our up and coming young players.

From a positive overall point of view, the suggestion from rrand1, which has been around for a few years now, about the north colleges/south colleges/city colleges competition is essential going forward. It deserves more meat, but not at this point.

Could you not just address citykat directly instead of speaking about him or her in the third person like you're holding them up as an example of a bold child? It's hard to have a civilised discussion with you to be honest, when you're speaking past people instead of to them.

dastardly00

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Could you not just address citykat directly instead of speaking about him or her in the third person like you're holding them up as an example of a bold child? It's hard to have a civilised discussion with you to be honest, when you're speaking past people instead of to them.

+1

citykat

Hawkeye6 wrote: »

citykat wrote: »

As for the lad selected after a self imposed break, in any normal situation he wouldn't have been selected. It was unusual for a manager that has played hardball with other lads for less. The fact that he was selected speaks volumes especially as he'll be underage again next year. To his credit he scored 4 pts from play, 8 in total. I could be a bollix and say that's 8 more than his two country schooled colleagues in the full forward line managed but that would be ridiculous.

This guy really does not get it! He actual believe this was the right thing to do!
He thinks it is acceptable for Kilkenny, the greatest hurling county there is . I suppose his name gives away the city bias and it is in line with the city bias, which is festering to danger point. I tried to avoid identifying the player concerned but ccitykat had no such qualms by giving his score, Doesn t deny it in fairness and Citykat is proud of it.. Absolutely does not see an issue.

He cannot see the affect on moral of the other young players. He just cannot see it.
He doesn t see that the two country schooled colleagues as he patronisingly put it, actually scored 3-5 (3-3 from play) between them in the previous game when he wasn t there as well as providing assists and winning frees that were scored. They were also scoring for fun in challenge games when he wasnt there and they didn t have to contend with a centre back who had only one target in mind in those previous games. citykat, He or she does not see that changing the dynamic for one player can have a detrimental affect on the balance of the team. No, that doesn t matter to Citykat. He s like the teacher from SKC who commented if we had all SKC lads, we would have won! Even the CBS lads might want to have something to say on that. Or he could be he/she be like kksaints who says it really doesn t matter if they win All-Irelands or not . Maybe that is the general consensus. Somehow I don t think it is, but I m open to correction.

Rumour has it that the same management team will be in place again next year Anyone got thoughts, so far nobody had contradicted my previous revelations (obviously because I am well informed too); Here s two more revelations to ponder regarding the merits of the current management team.
One player was included in the squad who was actually injured throughout preparations. Of course his father was a selector. Then again the manager will have a family member contending next year. Does anyone wonder why Sean Kelly and Jimmy Meagher, two very good coaches stepped away this year. Were they propping up the manager for the last few years. Hence such an easy exit this year. Unusual given that on paper Kilkenny had a huge chance of winning a Minor All-Ireland in 2016. Feel free to do your own investigations.

In my opinion this management is not good and do not look outside the city bias which is not good overall, particulalry for motivating our up and coming young players.

From a positive overall point of view, the suggestion from rrand1, which has been around for a few years now, about the north colleges/south colleges/city colleges competition is essential going forward. It deserves more meat, but not at this point.

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Let me clarify as you misread my post. I didn t approve of picking a player who had voluntarily signed himself off the panel. As I said, for a manager who played hardball with lads for less this year and previous years, it just indicated how desperate he was for decent forwards, especially given that this individual is underage again next year. FWIW the dogs in the street know about all this so wind your neck in. To be fair to the lad, at least he stood up when it counted.[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]There s a saying in sport, you re only as good as your last match . The facts are that in the last Kilkenny minor match of this year, when it really mattered, only two forwards scored. What the other four did in previous matches is immaterial. Bitching about ball being delivered from the centre back is just an excuse. DJ Carey was once asked what was his favourite type of delivery from the backs. He said he didn t have one. He said that once the ball was cleared by the backs, it was the forwards job to win it no matter what way it came.[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]You say that Kilkenny had a huge chance of winning a Minor All Ireland in 2016 . How do you make that out? What form line are you using? Could it be anything to do with a certain schools all Ireland that was won earlier this year?[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Dublin were by far the better team on the day. The Kilkenny goalkeeper made three excellent saves which kept them in the game. [/font][font=Arial, sans-serif]This year was unusual in that there was no back door at this stage of the competition. It ll be tough on the individuals involved, some of whom may never play for Kilkenny again. It s not though the end of the world. Plenty of Kilkenny players of recent vintage never won a minor All Ireland: Tommy, JJ, M Rice, Jackie to name a few. They turned out alright.[/font]

Bonniedog

Tell me this.

Will you be fielding in three weeks time :-)

Realt Dearg Sec

Bonniedog wrote: »

Tell me this.

Will you be fielding in three weeks time :-)

We'll see if we can get a few bob from the local creamery to send a bus up.

randd1

citykat wrote: »

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Let me clarify as you misread my post. I didn t approve of picking a player who had voluntarily signed himself off the panel. As I said, for a manager who played hardball with lads for less this year and previous years, it just indicated how desperate he was for decent forwards, especially given that this individual is underage again next year. FWIW the dogs in the street know about all this so wind your neck in. To be fair to the lad, at least he stood up when it counted.[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]There s a saying in sport, you re only as good as your last match . The facts are that in the last Kilkenny minor match of this year, when it really mattered, only two forwards scored. What the other four did in previous matches is immaterial. Bitching about ball being delivered from the centre back is just an excuse. DJ Carey was once asked what was his favourite type of delivery from the backs. He said he didn t have one. He said that once the ball was cleared by the backs, it was the forwards job to win it no matter what way it came.[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]You say that Kilkenny had a huge chance of winning a Minor All Ireland in 2016 . How do you make that out? What form line are you using? Could it be anything to do with a certain schools all Ireland that was won earlier this year?[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Dublin were by far the better team on the day. The Kilkenny goalkeeper made three excellent saves which kept them in the game. [/font][font=Arial, sans-serif]This year was unusual in that there was no back door at this stage of the competition. It ll be tough on the individuals involved, some of whom may never play for Kilkenny again. It s not though the end of the world. Plenty of Kilkenny players of recent vintage never won a minor All Ireland: Tommy, JJ, M Rice, Jackie to name a few. They turned out alright.[/font]

Michael Rice captained the Kilkenny minors to the AI in 2002; the first Shocks man to do so.

tcjimmy

randd1 wrote: »

Michael Rice captained the Kilkenny minors to the AI in 2002; the first Shocks man to do so.

And truly played a captain's part that day with a powerhouse performance in the second half to drag Kilkenny back into that final .

Bonniedog

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

We'll see if we can get a few bob from the local creamery to send a bus up.

Looking forward to it. Should be good game and glad it is out of Croker. Unfortunately not in Parnell!

Jury is still out on the Dublin puck out strategy. Can see it all going horribly badly on some day, but hopefully not against the stripey lads!

See you all then!

Formosa

tcjimmy wrote: »

randd1 wrote: »

Michael Rice captained the Kilkenny minors to the AI in 2002; the first Shocks man to do so.

And truly played a captain's part that day with a powerhouse performance in the second half to drag Kilkenny back into that final .

True for you, they'd probably only have won by 9 or 10 points without him....