Issue with tenant

Arbiter of Good Taste

Ah, OP, you see your mistake wasn't advising us exactly what advice you wanted everyone to give. Our bad for telling you something you didn't want to hear.

Aye Bosun

You can't legally hold onto the deposit as there has been no damage done. What I would suggest you do is withhold a portion of the deposit until all the bills have been issues, as gas is 2 monthly bill this can take some time. This avoids you having to chase her up for her share. I generally withhold €120 of a licensee's deposit to accommodate this and then return what is not used once all the bill are in.

As for notice there is not really much you can do I'm afraid, as a licensee she can leave with 1hrs notice if she wants and zero repercussion on her part, with that said, you can also kick her out at a moments notice.

I suggest you have a read of the following for info on the Rent-a-room scheme
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/home_owners/rent_a_room_scheme.html

Greenmachine

Not aware of any abusive post OP. If any posters have been abusive use the report button.

Aye Bosun

I'd also advise adding the following to any licensee agreement use in future..



'The licensee will pay for any of the Landlord’s excesses or no claims bonuses that affect the insurance premiums, of the buildings and contents insurance due to any acts or omissions by the Licensee, his visitors or guests'


A lot of people on here will disagree with a licensee agreement but as an owner occupier under the rent a room scheme for a good few years now it has never failed me. To be honest it has been a very handy document to have if any issue arise. Not sure if I can offer a copy but pm me if you want one.

FortySeven

Brutal2015 wrote: »

Wow... I am really sorry I asked for advice with this. I deleted the account I had used, but thought some context might downgrade some of the nasty comments - this was a friend of a friend situation, where we took in someone from overseas who was moving to Dublin and was having trouble finding affordable accommodation. It has turned into a nightmare. So, you are correct - I don't know the intricacies of the law surrounding this... we just took someone in who was vouched for by a friend and have actually paying loads of money because she leaves everything on... we are not horrible people and we are not money-grubbers. We are just in a difficult spot and I thought I might get some advice. But clearly not.

Wow. The charm is strong in this one.
Not money grubber >>
Stealing deposit<<
Stealing _<>

Butters1979

Brutal2015 wrote: »

Wow... I am really sorry I asked for advice with this. I deleted the account I had used, but thought some context might downgrade some of the nasty comments - this was a friend of a friend situation, where we took in someone from overseas who was moving to Dublin and was having trouble finding affordable accommodation. It has turned into a nightmare. So, you are correct - I don't know the intricacies of the law surrounding this... we just took someone in who was vouched for by a friend and have actually paying loads of money because she leaves everything on... we are not horrible people and we are not money-grubbers. We are just in a difficult spot and I thought I might get some advice. But clearly not.

Nasty comments? Please explain to us how you feel when both of you agree that she move out constitutes her breaching the 28 day notice in the contract and not you?
You didn't ask for advice, you were checking if your *ss was covered when you hold on to her deposit for frivolous reasons.

Let's break down your OP.

HelpWithTenant wrote: »

both parties (landlord and tenant) are required to give minimum 28 days notice to before leaving, but a shorter amount of time can be agreed upon if both parties are on board.

And you already said:

HelpWithTenant wrote: »

She said she would be moving out, and he agreed that that was the best idea.

So for your question, about a contract neither of you signed anyway:

HelpWithTenant wrote: »

which trickily isn't actually signed

HelpWithTenant wrote: »

Are we entitled to keep the deposit? This notice requirement is in her contract

The answer is no, and you know the answer is no. You always knew. You’re checking you're covered.
What you are entitled to and what you could get a way with are 2 different things.

lawred2

intheclouds wrote: »

If she lives with you she isnt a tenant, she is a licensee and has no rights at all.

Not clear why you want to keep her deposit though, you are getting what you want, she is leaving and no actual damage has been done? Why wouldnt you give her back her deposit?

exactly

take 50 quid for the gas and say best of luck..

lawred2

HelpWithTenant wrote: »

I didn't realize she was not an actual tenant, but a licensee. I want her out immediately - with regards to the deposit, we had agreed that we needed certain notice before she leaves. Keeping the deposit is not so much about the cost of gas (which she has agreed to repay), but about the lack of notice. Just wondering if we have a leg to stand on? We have a contract that says failure to give notice = no deposit, but it seems the contract might not hold up? Just wondering. All the feedback is really appreciated.

but your husband asked her to leave no? and you all agreed that end of month would be best?

so why would you expect notice?

sounds like a case of having your cake and eating it too.

Not returning her deposit is an old fashioned case of thievery. I don't buy this friend of a friend thing. Because I certainly wouldn't risk upsetting a friend by treating one of their friends so shabbily.

But then again; I wouldn't countenance stealing a lodger's deposit in the first place.

Dial Hard

The OP has closed both of her accounts so I'm not sure there's much point in continued appeals for her to see reason.

esforum

Your kicking her out OP, why in hells name would you keep a deposit for lack of notice?

Emme

OP, ask your lodger to leave and return her deposit so she can find somewhere else. Just say the arrangement isn't working out and you're not compatible.

The same day you ask her to leave change the locks.

She may be scatterbrained but she sounds like a bit of a nutter so stay on her right side especially as she works very close by.

lawred2

esforum wrote: »

7 hours of gas isnt free

poster didn't say anything about anything being free

just that no damage was done

Butters1979

esforum wrote: »

7 hours of gas isnt free

It's also not the cost of a full deposit. The lodger already agreed to pay for the gas.

OP already said she wanted to keep the deposit because of the lack of 28 days notice. Despite admitting they agreed to shorter notice.

OP is trying to keep some poor girls deposit for frivolous reasons, I suspect they already decided to do so, but were checking here under anonymity could they get a way with it.

mattaiuseire

I note the OP has closed her second account and clearly didn't receive the 'advice' they were hoping to receive.

It would a silly thing to do, to withhold a full deposit. I can assure the OP this would not be looked upon favourably if they were to face the civil courts.

A contract was formed and agreed whether or not the licensee signed it can be irrelevant, as long as it can be shown that it was agreed by both parties.
Certain terms of the agreement however may be frowned upon if they are unreasonable. This will include a 28 day retainer term if <28 days notice is provided when the tenant vacates.
It is wholly reasonable to retain part of a deposit if bills are found to be unpaid, if damage is caused to any fixtures, fittings and furnishings that are in excess of normal wear and tear; but it is wholly unreasonable to retain the full amount for your reasons stated.

Although the girl sounds like a half-wit with little consideration for others, the OP would be wise to hand the deposit back and move on with their life.

athtrasna

As the OP has closed their accounts there is no point in the thread remaining open.

Mod