LinkedFinance - new website

Dream123

Underground wrote: »

On the face of it, these new fixed rate loans seem to be getting funded at some pace. Scary that people seem to have actually complied with the CEO's orders in that farcical email and switched their autobid settings on. Why would you be so loose with your money like that?

Seems to be plenty of people willing to snap up loans now, despite what seems to be the general opinion on here that the process is getting less transparent, with not even an indication of what goes into the grading / pricing modelling? Is it purely a formula based on accounts? Can the result be adjusted based on the borrower saying they expect a better rate? How much LF judgement goes into the grading? Does it have to be audited accounts used?

The returns from LF to date have been very good (in my experience anyway) and I guess rates of c. 13% couldn't last forever. Rates for equivalent businesses from banks are more like 5-8% - it is one of the things that has puzzled me about LF as a lender ... Why don't these businesses get significantly cheaper loans from banks? Unfortunately I'm of the opinion that the standard of borrower looks lower in more recent months, just my sense of it but I think I've decided to stay away from more loans recently (or at least wasn't interested in the risk based on the rate I would have to bid to get in)

Whatever choices people make with their savings is there own business but from my perspective LF is getting less and less attractive ... But it looks like others disagree based on the pace loans are filling up at!

losttheplot74

I think some people see investing in ALL the loans that come up as diversification and accept that some will default, but that most won't. Up to now I'd invested in most, always aimed for >13% rate. In the beginning this was easy. It became tougher more recently. My average rate is 11%. My opinion was that anything below 13% wasn't viable when tax was taken into account (return too low for risk).

I've no problem with the fixed rate but feel like lenders are being played for fools now. For this reason I've stopped investing in loans and like others here will start to withdraw and send to Mintos or Twino. Unfortunately, this will take up to 3 years. I believe the lack of a secondary market is deliberate as is the restrictions on withdrawals. It encourages continued investment, other wise you watch your money just sitting there earning LF interest.

m320325

There's a new loan for Kevin Condon financial brokers, the last time they were on LF (April 2015) I think they had a different name and loan didn't reach 100%

"Today Kevin Condon Auctioneers and Lettings who are part of the DNG network just went live on our site. The business which has been based in Blackpool, Co. Cork for over 16 years is looking to upgrade their offices and employ an extra staff member to meet local demand."

https://www.linkedfinance.com/loan/2291 (business name appears to have been changed here but in LF emails from last year it states Kevin Condon Auctioneers'

https://www.linkedfinance.com/loan/3654

I think the new loan isn't clear about this, after my bid I noticed "Bid €XX on the loan by DNG Kevin Condon" on my account, so realised I was lending to an Auctioneer

m320325

traprunner wrote: »

I think the solution to that is to post the questions asked here with the name of the loan. Slowly more investors are finding this thread and it's a vital source of information. LF are well aware of this thread. They should be ashamed of the the flaws and faults that are highlighted here. Making people aware is vital in improving LF for all investors.

I think this is great idea, because lender questions are disappearing now as soon as a loan is 100% funded, also lenders can see any questions LF don't want us to see. They can leave a question as awaiting moderation for a few hours, and once loan is funded, they approve it but nobody else sees it

BrokenArrows

m320325 wrote: »

I think this is great idea, because lender questions are disappearing now as soon as a loan is 100% funded, also lenders can see any questions LF don't want us to see. They can leave a question as awaiting moderation for a few hours, and once loan is funded, they approve it but nobody else sees it

Alternatively the company shouldn't actually receive the financing until all questions have been answered and a lender has a grace period to withdraw their funding if they dont like the answer.

m320325

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Alternatively the company shouldn't actually receive the financing until all questions have been answered and a lender has a grace period to withdraw their funding if they dont like the answer.

At the moment they appear to have no problem getting loans 100% funded so they are unlikely to change

lcwill

I'm going to say it - I like the new system.

I like having an autobid that actually works, I like that half my bids are no longer rejected, I like that my money is not waiting around for 3 weeks for the loan to close, and I like knowing what interest rate I will get.

For me peer lending / marketplace lending has to be easy. I have a job and don't want another one - I don't want to to have to log in all the time to see if my bids have been rejected.

I also don't want to have to ask questions to the borrowers or try to examine the details of their financial situation. If I need to do this then Linked Finance aren't doing their job. I know this is a popular subject of complaint on this thread but I am not looking to get into these details. On Bondora or Mintos where I only invest 5 or 10 euro per loan it would be impossible to do this kind of analysis for every loan and I don't want to do it on LF either.

There are still issues regarding transparency and data but I think this is a step in a better direction. Let's see how the default rates evolve for the different grades of loan but I am no longer thinking of pulling my money out as I had been previously (also not putting more in until there is a secondary market).

Squall Leonhart

lcwill wrote:

I like that half my bids are no longer rejected, I like that my money is not waiting around for 3 weeks for the loan to close, and I like knowing what interest rate I will get.

I completely understand this. It was frustrating as hell to have bids open for weeks only to be outbid on the closing 10 minutes.

lcwill wrote:

There are still issues regarding transparency and data but I think this is a step in a better direction. Let's see how the default rates evolve for the different grades of loan but I am no longer thinking of pulling my money out as I had been previously (also not putting more in until there is a secondary market).

I'm not so sure the rates will improve for the loans, they're filling very fast at present. I know you said evolve but presumably you're being optimistic I would also be amazed if a secondary market is introduced.

I understand what you're saying about not wanting to have to evaluate each loan, and make the comparison to mintos where you're putting 10 euro bids on, but LF's minimum is 5x that, with no buyback guarantee, minimum loans of 12mths, no secondary market and interest rates aren't good.

I will likely keep reinvesting but not add new money to my LinkedFinance account. Next deposit I make will probably be to Mintos where I have already a very small sum invested.

Dream123

lcwill wrote: »

I'm going to say it - I like the new system.

I like having an autobid that actually works, I like that half my bids are no longer rejected, I like that my money is not waiting around for 3 weeks for the loan to close, and I like knowing what interest rate I will get.

For me peer lending / marketplace lending has to be easy. I have a job and don't want another one - I don't want to to have to log in all the time to see if my bids have been rejected.

I also don't want to have to ask questions to the borrowers or try to examine the details of their financial situation. If I need to do this then Linked Finance aren't doing their job. I know this is a popular subject of complaint on this thread but I am not looking to get into these details. On Bondora or Mintos where I only invest 5 or 10 euro per loan it would be impossible to do this kind of analysis for every loan and I don't want to do it on LF either.

There are still issues regarding transparency and data but I think this is a step in a better direction. Let's see how the default rates evolve for the different grades of loan but I am no longer thinking of pulling my money out as I had been previously (also not putting more in until there is a secondary market).

To be fair a lot of positives in using autobid, I think to use a portfolio approach as seems to available via mintos for example there needs to be a larger pool of loans to choose from so I can set it up to lend a little to a lot of borrowers based on whatever criteria im comfortable with.

It definitely would be preferable to be able to let an autobid process run and just check in every so often to check its all going to plan

Strettie11

lcwill wrote: »

For me peer lending / marketplace lending has to be easy. I have a job and don't want another one - I don't want to to have to log in all the time to see if my bids have been rejected.

I also don't want to have to ask questions to the borrowers or try to examine the details of their financial situation. If I need to do this then Linked Finance aren't doing their job. I know this is a popular subject of complaint on this thread but I am not looking to get into these details. .

Totally agree with you I also do not want to put any work if possible into looking at loans but after everything that has happened with financial institutions in Ireland and especially in an unregulated area I want LF to give me confidence in their borrower assessment and what is the difference in the grading. Yesterday in fact I was talking to a lf lender who was setting up their autbid for A&B loans because they were more secure! But when I asked how he knew that he realised he had no answer.

lcwill wrote: »

On Bondora or Mintos where I only invest 5 or 10 euro per loan it would be impossible to do this kind of analysis for every loan and I don't want to do it on LF either.

But this is not really a direct comparison you only are investing in guaranteed buy back loans so there is no requirement to analyse any of the loans just 1 piece of initial homework to make sure financial body providing guarantee is well resourced. Also With Mintos you are not providing money directly to borrower but to the banks who originated the loan and depending on the originating bank they still retain a minimum portion of loan (between 2 and 15%) so they have skin in the game to ensure loan keeps paying something LF does not

lcwill wrote: »

Their are still issues regarding transparency and data but I think this is a step in a better direction. Let's see how the default rates evolve for the different grades of loan but I am no longer thinking of pulling my money out as I had been previously (also not putting more in until there is a secondary market).

Yes I like the new bid system also but they need to be upfront with lenders on a whole host of issues. I see in the UK in July the FCA have become concerned that lenders are not fully aware of what they are getting into and this despite a number of lender information requirements that P2P in the UK must adhere to when a lender signs up which are not in place here.

spudwould

Portfolio.png

lcwill wrote: »

I'm going to say it - I like the new system.

I like having an autobid that actually works, I like that half my bids are no longer rejected, I like that my money is not waiting around for 3 weeks for the loan to close, and I like knowing what interest rate I will get.

For me peer lending / marketplace lending has to be easy. I have a job and don't want another one - I don't want to to have to log in all the time to see if my bids have been rejected.

I also don't want to have to ask questions to the borrowers or try to examine the details of their financial situation. If I need to do this then Linked Finance aren't doing their job. I know this is a popular subject of complaint on this thread but I am not looking to get into these details. On Bondora or Mintos where I only invest 5 or 10 euro per loan it would be impossible to do this kind of analysis for every loan and I don't want to do it on LF either.

There are still issues regarding transparency and data but I think this is a step in a better direction. Let's see how the default rates evolve for the different grades of loan but I am no longer thinking of pulling my money out as I had been previously (also not putting more in until there is a secondary market).

Portfolio.png

The reason I am not happy is as above.
I spend time checking out the loans and try to get the highest percentage as I can as I think unsecured loans that I have to pay tax, USC and fees on should give a better than average return.
As you can see form my portfolio it graduates upwards from 9-10% up to 15%.

The NEW systems this will reverse and steady out at 9.2% to 10.2% (If I continue to invest) as ALL investments would be on Grade B loans.
Grade A @ 8.2% is ridiculously low and any other grade is reckless(in my opinion).
So now I am being TOLD(yes TOLD) what rate I can lend at ... and also I get no reply's from LF or investors. This to me STINKS to high heaven ... ONLY in Ireland would you get away with it. :mad::mad::mad:

A company starts up and has a super platform that was working for both the lender and borrower as a fair rate.
Then changes how the platform works and all I can see is it is a great deal for the borrowers and a great loss for the investors.

Also there is a huge difference between LF and Mintos ... Mintos GUARANTEE your money!
I have 5 bad loans on LF and I am lucky if I get an update once every few months.
So it is unfair if we compare the two platforms.

@ lcwill .. apologies I am not getting at you ... just pointing out facts and figures on my own investments and how I think I am being treated.

Squall Leonhart

Yours looks a lot better than mine :pac:;)

spudwould

Squall Leonhart wrote: »

Yours looks a lot better than mine :pac:;)

Are we still talking graphs :eek::P;):D

lcwill

@spudwould No problem! I wish my graph looked like yours but it is much more like Squall Leonhart and my average rate is 12.4% so if I go mainly for Grade C and D loans I should be able to roughly maintain it even with the new system and with much less work on my part. My terrible Bondora experience with HR loans means I'm not going near E or Y.

I know the final average rates of loans on Linked Finance were often pretty disconnected from the quality of the borrower but don't you think it is likely that some of the loans you got high interest rates on in the past would probably fall into the lower categories if they were evaluated in the same way?

sceach16

See other Q/A about balance sheet misclassification.....

"Have you made any errors which might indicate that this or any other loan is less attractive or do you only make errors which might improve the presentation? sceach (placed 0 bids for €0.00 on this loan) • Waiting for moderation"

I just posted this question on the loan. Note that it is awaiting moderation (by linked finance who have a financial interest in the success of the loan).....this is a wonderful example of moderation!

sceach16

sceach16 wrote: »

See other Q/A about balance sheet misclassification.....

"Have you made any errors which might indicate that this or any other loan is less attractive or do you only make errors which might improve the presentation? sceach (placed 0 bids for €0.00 on this loan) • Waiting for moderation"

I just posted this question on the loan. Note that it is awaiting moderation (by linked finance who have a financial interest in the success of the loan).....this is a wonderful example of moderation!

I got a private answer which means the response and, I reckon, the question have not been published

Strettie11

What was the answer you got

sceach16

Strettie11 wrote: »

What was the answer you got

"Morning Sceach, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. We have made some presentation errors in the past, never with a view to affecting the strength of a loan application. If there is something in particular you'd like to discuss please do get in touch. Thanks,"

Krusty_Clown

Earlier, we put The Food Village live on the marketplace as a 36-month loan, this was a mistake and should of been added to the marketplace as a 24-month loan.

Mistakes are forgivable. Using 'should of' in a sentence is not. I'm out.

PanAC

Just see the new offering in LF. Their Business Profile makes no mention of the loan they got a couple of months ago. They seem to have just "cut & pasted" their old profile onto this new offering. Is this just sloppiness on LF's part? Pretending they only have one past loan.

I posted the question below, interesting to see any reply before bidding closes and the Qs are removed! Beware low flying pigs!

"Hi, el Gringo is paying me back on TWO previous loans, one with 34 months to run, and a second with 14 months still left. Which on have you forgotten in your business profile? I'm sure you wouldn't want to mislead any borrowers!"

PanAC

Just see the new offering in LF. Their Business Profile makes no mention of the loan they got a couple of months ago. They seem to have just "cut & pasted" their old profile onto this new offering. Is this just sloppiness on LF's part? Pretending they only have one past loan.

I posted the question below, interesting to see any reply before bidding closes and the Qs are removed! Beware low flying pigs!

"Hi, el Gringo is paying me back on TWO previous loans, one with 34 months to run, and a second with 14 months still left. Which on have you forgotten in your business profile? I'm sure you wouldn't want to mislead any Lenders!"

sceach16

PanAC wrote: »

Just see the new offering in LF. Their Business Profile makes no mention of the loan they got a couple of months ago. They seem to have just "cut & pasted" their old profile onto this new offering. Is this just sloppiness on LF's part? Pretending they only have one past loan.

I posted the question below, interesting to see any reply before bidding closes and the Qs are removed! Beware low flying pigs!

"Hi, el Gringo is paying me back on TWO previous loans, one with 34 months to run, and a second with 14 months still left. Which on have you forgotten in your business profile? I'm sure you wouldn't want to mislead any borrowers!"

I thought I as the only grump who keeps noticing their sloppiness! Their email did say it was their third loan. Incidentally as at 18.40, your question has not appeared in the Q/A

Dream123

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Mistakes are forgivable. Using 'should of' in a sentence is not. I'm out.

Ha ha fully agree!!

I'm clearly a crank as that kind of spelling and grammar sloppiness Annoys me.

lawred2

Strettie11 wrote: »

Little Strettie arrived a week early so as I struggle with some of the night feeds I can only use an excuse of sleep deprivation that resulted in me clicking to read the new LF terms & conditions when the message came up to accept them

Anyway there are a few strange clauses in there


10.0 The role of Linked Finance
10.1 Our role is to facilitate prospective Borrowers and Lenders in negotiating, concluding and completing Loans via Linked Finance in accordance with the terms of this Agreement. We are not a party to any Loan Contracts or Loan Parts (save where we act as a Lender in our own right, in which case we are only a party to the Loan Contracts or Loan Parts we enter into as a Lender in accordance with Section 4).

So LF can invest in their own loans but they have no clause in there that they must notify other lenders under what lender name they are investing or that lenders must be made aware they are investing in a loan

Also unlike other T&C's for UK P2P's they have no clauses relating to LF employees investing in loans, that they are indentified to other lenders if they do.

The other strange one is they outline 14 criteria that must be met by a Borrower to be approved for a loan. But 2 clauses later they state


Linked Finance at its sole discretion reserves the right to publish loan requests that do not meet all of the above criteria.

Basically LF can ignore all the borower criteria clauses so lenders have no idea which or how many of the criteria the borrower has passed, loans that did not meet these 14 criteria should be highlighted by LF so we are fully aware.

I checked a couple of UK P2P T&C's and they detail the strict circumstances under which loans that do not meet the main borrower criteria will be accepted so as a lender you know exactly where you stand.

Anyway back to sterlising bottles!!

Looks like Ireland' stellar reputation for fiscal propriety is being maintained

Dream123

LF allow up to 4 withdrawals per year for free and charge 10 euro a go after that ...

Does anyone know if they count the 4 free ones per calander year or with a continuous 365 days or some other way?

Basically wondering can I make 4 withdrawals up to the end of December and start with a clean slate again in January?

sceach16

Dream123 wrote: »

LF allow up to 4 withdrawals per year for free and charge 10 euro a go after that ...

Does anyone know if they count the 4 free ones per calander year or with a continuous 365 days or some other way?

Basically wondering can I make 4 withdrawals up to the end of December and start with a clean slate again in January?

Not a tosser but since its the weekend will worry Monday, will find out by:)end year! ;):pac::)

scheister

Just looking at Quinn computers.
3 different people have asked a question about stock and no answer from the borrower. This with stock being over 6 months turnover.

General rant
The lack of question getting answer or the people giving half answer is a joke. They are trying to get people to give you their hard earned money and yet they don't seem to wanna work with people to make sure were happy to lend rather us going in blind.

While i have not bid in a while atm i cant see myself using fresh money unless something changes

Strettie11

Fixed rate loans boost peer-to-peer lending

Peer-to-peer lending platform Linked Finance says 21 SMEs raised €600,000 in funding during the first two weeks of its new fixed rate loan offering.

The firm said that as part of its strategy to accelerate growth, it has moved from a model where lenders “bid” the interest rate they would offer to a company seeking funds, to one where a fixed-rate is set at the beginning of the process.

Linked Finance says the new approach reduces rate uncertainty for borrowers makes the funding process quicker, with the average loan closing in less than 30 hours.

A €40,000 loan for Tipperary stove suppliers, Ryan Stoves, was fully funded in just under eight hours, according to the company.

Companies who apply to borrow loans are given a credit rating based on Linked Finance’s proprietary system which looks at a business’s credit history, stability and ability to repay, and then approves a loan at an interest rate appropriate to the company’s rating.

Linked Finance CEO Niall Dorrian said: “The fixed rate loan launch has been a huge success, with both lenders and borrowers engaging enthusiastically with the new approach.”

He added: “With our ambitious plans to grow lending to over €350m by the end of 2019, we are now looking at the involvement of strategic partners on to the platform.

PanAC

Before the flood of messages pile in - Linked have just sent 'round an eMail telling all of us about the new Keogh's loan. Then they followed with the SAME eMail about Redcave Industries Limited loan. How they wish they checked the message before they sent it out to lenders!! They can't hold this one "under moderation"!! Just when I thought it was safe to get back in the water and bid.

sceach16

Did anyone keep count of the number of times this loan has been extended?