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Cute Hoor

garrettod wrote: »

It might be no harm to keep a bit of pressure on Linked Finance, pressing them for updates on the action being taken.

If it were me, I'd want to see this particular loan being discussed in a courtroom asap.

Fully agree, LF have been awful at keeping their lenders informed on what's going on, months on end without update or explanation, explanations bland and meaningless in a lot of cases when they do arrive. Affected lenders should be pressurising LF for meaningful updates and actions.

Krusty_Clown

Cute Hoor wrote: »

Farm have 2 very popular restaurants in Dublin, in Dawson Street and Upper Leeson Street, both trading very well as far as I can see.

They have been casual at best with their payments to LF since last March. In August LF advised that they had been continually trying to contact Farm Foods receiving just one email in response with no reason or explanation for missed repayments, is this the way for a responsible business to deal with it's lender. Since then they have made one casual payment, without explanation it would appear. Since then the Luas works have been completed, thousands per day are being ferried down their street, they have just come through what is in Dublin city centre a goldmine Christmas period and they are presumably continuing to refuse to engage with LF. IMO LF need to go after them, and be seen publicly to go after them. I see nothing wrong with LF lenders going into their restaurants and having a free meal in compensation for their wait for/loss of their money, and doing it publicly.

I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with any business that I have lent to failing and thereby losing me money, none whatsoever, and that was the risk I knew I was taking when I lent that money in the first place. Indeed I have a lot of sympathy for them, they gave it a lash and it didn't work out, they opened up to LF, and good luck to them with whatever business venture they may undertake in the future. At the end of the day they are losing their business, maybe close enough to losing everything, I am losing a few bob that I knew I could afford to lose in the first place.

I have no sympathy for them either, but a couple of self- righteous individuals going in and stealing food is not going to help me get my money back. Would you consider the same tactics if it were a bike shop? A brewery? A nursing home? Your business?

Cute Hoor

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

I have no sympathy for them either, but a couple of self- righteous individuals going in and stealing food is not going to help me get my money back. Would you consider the same tactics if it were a bike shop? A brewery? A nursing home? Your business?

Yea!! Although obviously easier to implement in a restaurant than a bike shop, the food has been consumed so difficult to get back unless regurgitated, easier for an owner to get the bicycle back that you are carrying out under your arm.
It wouldn't be my business, because I would be engaging and open with the lender

Krusty_Clown

Cute Hoor wrote: »

Yea!! Although obviously easier to implement in a restaurant than a bike shop, the food has been consumed so difficult to get back unless regurgitated, easier for an owner to get the bicycle back that you are carrying out under your arm.
It wouldn't be my business, because I would be engaging and open with the lender

1) Did you lend to Farm Foods, and if so, why are you advocating that others (instead of you) carry out a criminal activity? Is it only a good idea if someone else is doing it?
2) If said individuals do eat a meal and leave without paying, and as a direct consequence, you don't get any further payments from the 3rd party collection agency - are you ok with that?
3) Do you believe you have been party to all of the communications between Farm Foods and Linked Finance?

At the end of the day, people have free-will and can do what they like. Farm Foods owe me €67.98 out of my original €150 investment, so in my case, it's not worth considering criminal activity for that kind of sum. I'd prefer to get the sum of money (or a portion of it) back though, and don't feel that lynching mob type mentality is going to do my cause (or the cause of any other lenders) any good.

Cute Hoor

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

1) Did you lend to Farm Foods, and if so, why are you advocating that others (instead of you) carry out a criminal activity? Is it only a good idea if someone else is doing it?
2) If said individuals do eat a meal and leave without paying, and as a direct consequence, you don't get any further payments from the 3rd party collection agency - are you ok with that?
3) Do you believe you have been party to all of the communications between Farm Foods and Linked Finance?

At the end of the day, people have free-will and can do what they like. Farm Foods owe me €67.98 out of my original €150 investment, so in my case, it's not worth considering criminal activity for that kind of sum. I'd prefer to get the sum of money (or a portion of it) back though, and don't feel that lynching mob type mentality is going to do my cause (or the cause of any other lenders) any good.

1) Yes, I wouldn't say 'advocating' but as already said I have no problem with it. How do you know that I haven't done it or wouldn't be prepared to do it?

2) Yea

3) I don't know, but unless LF are telling me porkies I am party to sufficient communication to let me make my own mind up about Farm Foods.

I couldn't give a toss whether I get any more money back on this loan or not, I think, based on the information available to me, that LF should go bald headed after them and make an example of them publicly, if the rest of my money went towards that effort then I would be happy enough.

I don't think we're going to see eye to eye on this one, which is fair enough, I respect your view and position.

Krusty_Clown

Cute Hoor wrote: »

I think, based on the information available to me, that LF should go bald headed after them and make an example of them publicly, if the rest of my money went towards that effort then I would be happy enough.
I don't think we're going to see eye to eye on this one.

Well, we both firmly agree on your first point!

Wheety

I didn't lend them too much although I did tend to lend more to businesses like this that I know. These and Lolly and Cooks, Whitefriar Grill etc. Places that I have been to and seem to do good business. As well as knowing of the business it also felt like lower risk.

It would be different if they were in trouble. The fact both restaurants are trading well is the most annoying aspect. Seem to have just taken the decision to stop paying back. Probably see no consequences. I'm sure they won't be back to LF for more so what do they care.

I have eaten at both over the years. I can safely say I'll never eat in one of their restaurants again.

sceach16

On a practical point, I would not eat alone and would not embarrass my guest (likely my wife...I better say that) with a theatrical performance. So direct action is out. :mad:

I do share the frustration of having lent and seeing what is obviously a most unsatisfactory process.

It is Linked who are responsible for inducing us to lend. Pressure should be placed on them.

I suspect that this is one of a number of loans where borrowers have other lenders and simply reckon that we are a softer touch hence no cash. This is something to be aware of. Bank lending has improved recently compared to 3 years ago. this raises the possibility that those borrowing from Linked may have other secured borrowings....in this case ,linked come last....We come last.

garrettod

Cute Hoor wrote: »

Fully agree, LF have been awful at keeping their lenders informed on what's going on, months on end without update or explanation, explanations bland and meaningless in a lot of cases when they do arrive. Affected lenders should be pressurising LF for meaningful updates and actions.

Yup, and the obligation is on each and every one of us to keep pressing Linked Finance for progress and updates.

It's not easy work to chase up and collect an unpaid loan, so if someone is not being pressurised to do it and make visible progress, they well let it slip down the priority list in favor of other things that they may need to do.

There are key differences between how you deal with a loan in arrears or default, where there is legitimate reasons for the financial problems, full engagement and transparency with the borrower etc. (and you work together to try to restructure the debt, or arrange some alternative reasonable method of trying to see the debt repaid), and then those borrowers who simply are not making any effort to pay, and appear to be ignoring their responsibilities. Each case needs to be handled proactively, but very differently, depending on the circumstances of that case. As a rule of thumb, if it's a cash based business and the doors of that business are open, then some form of payment can be made.

.

Bogwoppit

Just made my first deposit on LF, looks like a great way to earn a few quid instead of letting it sit in a bank account.

garrettod

Bogwoppit wrote: »

Just made my first deposit on LF, looks like a great way to earn a few quid instead of letting it sit in a bank account.

Make sure you are aware of the risks, which include:

• Linked Finance (like other Irish P2Ps) is not regulated by the Irish Central Bank
  
• You can lose all of your money, if you lend to businesses that default. I don't think these losses are allowable against other income / gains, for tax purposes.
  
• Many have expressed concerns here about the Linked Finance Credit Rating system, so you may be best to form your own view on each business before lending to it
  
• The Linked Finance Auto Bid system relies on the Linked Finance internal Credit Rating system.

Once you are aware of the risks, then very best of luck and remember, don't go putting all of your eggs in one basket

Strettie11

garrettod wrote: »

Make sure you are aware of the risks, which include:

• Linked Finance (like other Irish P2Ps) is not regulated by the Irish Central Bank
  
• You can lose all of your money, if you lend to businesses that default. I don't think these losses are allowable against other income / gains, for tax purposes.
  
• Many have expressed concerns here about the Linked Finance Credit Rating system, so you may be best to form your own view on each business before lending to it
  
• The Linked Finance Auto Bid system relies on the Linked Finance internal Credit Rating system.

Once you are aware of the risks, then very best of luck and remember, don't go putting all of your eggs in one basket

I would add :

- you will pay tax on the interest at your marginal rate plus PRSI plus USC
- You cannot reduce your interest on which you pay tax with bad debts sufferred e.g €100 interest earned in tax year, €50 of bad debts you pay tax on the €100
- you may suffer periods of intense frustration as you watch a business that defaults on one of your loans trading away
- lots of knowledgeable LF lenders on here so always ask a question if not sure about LF

TheSheriff

Bogwoppit wrote: »

Just made my first deposit on LF, looks like a great way to earn a few quid instead of letting it sit in a bank account.

As someone who has been on LF for a number of years, I would seriously consider alternatives. There are far better options out there with the same risk/reward.

It's your money and all that, but you are jumping abroad a ship that many people here are trying to quickly get off!

Bogwoppit

Thanks for the advice guys, I'm just playing around with small amounts for now to get a feel for it.
TheSherriff; What alternatives are you talking about out of interest?

Kuva

Bogwoppit wrote: »

Thanks for the advice guys, I'm just playing around with small amounts for now to get a feel for it.
TheSherriff; What alternatives are you talking about out of interest?

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057591343/29/#post106219441

garrettod

Hi,

I'd also put Grid Finance on my list of preferred alternatives - simply because you get to decide what rate you lend at.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=106146984

lad6w

Status Updates
28 February 2018, 12:27
In Arrears NEW

In Arrears - We have been unable to contact the borrower for a month. We have sent communication in all channels possible making him aware if this continues any longer with no payment we will have to move them over to our third party collections agency to legally enforce the loan contract and personal guarantee provided. Last payment received: 20/12/2017


Made 4 payments on a 36 month loan. Graded C.

NellyJelly

garrettod wrote: »

Hi,

I'd also put Grid Finance on my list of preferred alternatives - simply because you get to decide what rate you lend at.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=106146984

I've been watching Grid for a while now and have an account with no money in it. In your link you say that the grading system is more in line with what you reckon yourself compared to LF.

I can never see any financials. Do they post financial info? Do you have to lodge funds before you can see the accounts and balance sheet that you usually see on LF?

That was one of the reasons I haven't lodged funds. I wouldn't know how to check their risk rating if you can't see numbers. Maybe they are there somewhere I just can't see any on the three loans that are live at the minute.

Also I just noticed that there is a loan on there which is a B. It was up on LF before and was a C.

Biketourer

There are no financial statements on Grid Finance. I think this is a massive disadvantage and puts me off lending with them.

I have a small few loans to companies I know personally and was able to get a couple of % higher than the average lending rate which made it worthwhile for me.

garrettod

Hi,

Probably best discussed on the Grid thread, but in short:

Most important for me is that I can decide what price I will lend at on Grid, it's not decided by the site (as it is on LF, based on their grading system).

It's also nice to be able to edit your bid (or simply withdraw it), prior to the loan closing. Again, available on Grid, but not LF.

Agree that the financials would be a welcome addition on Grid (but for any financials to be very useful, we also need to see up to date management figures etc.)

SeanPammer

Alana Creations
Grade C
9/12 instalments

Status update on loan 4278

We have shared a new status update for this loan. The update is as follows:

We have not received the most recent repayment for this loan, we are in contact with the borrower and will inform you of any updates.

You can now view the most recent status for non-performing loans, at any time, in your account. Click on any late loan in the 'Lent' section to view the latest update.

When we have new information to share, we will add an update and you will receive an automatic notification like this.

Best regards,

The Linked Finance Team

Wheety

BGRSB Limited/Just Baked also in default now and trading away. If they stopped giving away free cakes on Facebook maybe they could service their loan.

sceach16

JK Engineering supplies 3458

Payment 21/36 due today 7/03 has not arrived. Third time this has been slow to pay but previous payments have been made.

coa000

Missed payments this week:

Glynn Organic Farm - Payment 30 of 36 missed
Mossfield Organic Farm - Payment 3 of 24 missed - Grade C
Boston Access - Payment 9 of 12 missed - Grade B

Cute Hoor

Some stats on my loans to date.

Of my current one year loans, 8.73% of them have had some repayment issue
Of my current two year loans (very few), 10% of them have had some repayment issue
Of my current three year loans, 13.27% of them have had some repayment issue.

Of my finished loans, 2.27% of them had a repayment issue

garrettod

Hi,

Some interesting, but concerning stats there Cute Hoor.

Anything near 10% is far too high in the current economic environment imho, even if we are including borrowers who just missed one payment and later brought it up to date (although granted, I'd make a special exception for people unable to lodge funds during the recent bad weather).

My own stats are thankfully better than that (they probably average 5% with most just the odd unpaid, that quickly gets resolved), but perhaps you take on loans with greater risk levels than I do, in return for greater potential returns ?

While I don't think much of Linked Finance's grading system, I only take on loans with their grades A-C (and rarely take on a 3-year loan, not alone a Grade C, 3 year loan). I am also selective with regards to industry sectors and simply won't lend to a couple of sectors, due to known repayment records across that sector, or my view of the sector itself.

.

Cute Hoor

garrettod wrote: »

Hi,

Some interesting, but concerning stats there Cute Hoor.

Anything near 10% is far too high in the current economic environment imho, even if we are including borrowers who just missed one payment and later brought it up to date (although granted, I'd make a special exception for people unable to lodge funds during the recent bad weather).

My own stats are thankfully better than that (they probably average 5% with most just the odd unpaid, that quickly gets resolved), but perhaps you take on loans with greater risk levels than I do, in return for greater potential returns ?

While I don't think much of Linked Finance's grading system, I only take on loans with their grades A-C (and rarely take on a 3-year loan, not alone a Grade C, 3 year loan). I am also selective with regards to industry sectors and simply won't lend to a couple of sectors, due to known repayment records across that sector, or my view of the sector itself.

.

That's interesting, I am obviously less risk averse than you and it is probably showing in the results, I have gone for B to Y loans, more risk, potentially more reward. I have long given up on 3 year loans although I have a significant legacy of loans from the early days.

Even though my stats look high, I have only given up on one loan, and would expect/hope most of the others to eventually come in even if some are decided by the wigs.

garrettod

Cute Hoor wrote: »

That's interesting, I am obviously less risk averse than you and it is probably showing in the results, I have gone for B to Y loans, more risk, potentially more reward....

Hi,

I'm all for risk -vs-return and do take risks myself, to try and get a higher return.

As you know from my previous posts here, I don't rate their risk grading system.

As such, every time I look at a borrower grade on Linked Finance, I reduce it by two letters (i.e. their Grade "C" is my Grade "E"). It's far from ideal, or a prefect science, but it works for me given the circumstances.

Thereafter, it's a judgement call as to whether you want to take on that perceived level of risk, at what appear to be overly generous interest rates.

It's not often that I find a 3 year loan that I am happy to support, as a result of the above.

Captainsatnav

When a loan offer is accepted, we enter into a loan agreement as the lender - I can't see anywhere on the website where these standard terms and conditions of the contract are set out? Has anyone ever asked Linked for them?

Also - do 6 month bids ever come up? 12 months alone are like hen's teeth. No interest in 36 month loans. Although I've a couple of hundred € tied up in them - mainly because I didn't fully grasp the concept when I registered!

garrettod

Hi,

6 month loans have popped up, but they have been very few and far between.

Like you, I have very little interest in lending for 3 years regularly on LF. For me, it's because I'm not happy with the risk premium that they offer, or level of security offered for longer term debt. That said, the fact that most of their loans appear to be for 3 years on their website these days, shows that the offer certainly appeals to potential borrowers !

If you are after loan terms shorter than 3 years, then maybe have a look at a couple of the other P2P websites such as Grid, they often have 12-24 month loans on offer.

As for the Loan terms, I doubt LF will give them to you, but would love to know if they do