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Geographic addresses vs Postal addresses
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Mountainsandh wrote: »a) I have 2 addresses. Eircode uses one address only, postal. At some stage recently, when postal addresses were transferred to Eircode, the county in my postal address has been amended to the postal town county. My address has changed as a result to a Via Town + new county address. I reckon Eircode has effected a change of address for me, you reckon it hasn't, because there is a shadow database with my original county kept somewhere.
b) postal services started sporadically delaying my post because of "wrong address" shortly after introduction of Eircode. I make the link, and it's obvious to me that the development is due to Eircodes new address for me (antecedent : 12 years botherless service). You think this is coincidental and An Post workers had planned for years to amend practice, just came round to it this summer.
A) you've admitted yourself that it's only some an post workers and not others, yet you still claim it's some conspiracy
I've proven to you by way of evidence from a high court ruling, that An Post started imposing their version of addresses on people since 2011. 0 -
A) you've admitted yourself that it's only some an post workers and not others, yet you still claim it's some conspiracy
No, actual postal address online record used to be via town + my county, it is now via town + town's county. Separately from actual routing issues.
[/QUOTE] I've proven to you by way of evidence from a high court ruling, that An Post started imposing their version of addresses on people since 2011.
Must not be very intensive for them to take 4 years to reach me. Simultaneous to Eircodes being rolled out.
This high court ruling was not that clear cut by the way. It just so happens that this particular judge thought it was a small inconvenience rather than the culturally/historically significant change ComReg thought it was.
Like I said the debate should be out in the open, and such discussions should be pre-empted, rather than waiting and leaving it all to the justice system to decide.
The judge decided that commercial interests supersede cultural/historical ones. I don't think it's right that this should be left to a judge to decide.
I think this illustrates the manner in which a significant geopolitical change is forced on people, with no input from the public.0 -
Mountainsandh wrote: »This high court ruling was not that clear cut by the way. It just so happens that this particular judge thought it was a small inconvenience rather than the culturally/historically significant change ComReg thought it was.
The ruling was very clear. An Post may continue to use postal addresse. The judge's decision has legal authority. ComReg's opinion has none.Mountainsandh wrote: »Like I said the debate should be out in the open, and such discussions should be pre-empted, rather than waiting and leaving it all to the justice system to decide.
A bit late now, since the courts have already decided the issue, in public and in accordance with law.Mountainsandh wrote: »The judge decided that commercial interests supersede cultural/historical ones. I don't think it's right that this should be left to a judge to decide.
As the judge pointed out, historically the system of postal addresses being used by the postal service was in place long before the foundation of the state. You don't think it's right to let a judge decide disputes over law? Would you prefer to have a national referendum to decide the outcome every time Johnny sues Mickey because his toast was burnt?Mountainsandh wrote: »I think this illustrates the manner in which a significant geopolitical change is forced on people, with no input from the public.
There's no force involved at all. You can use whatever form of address you like and An Post will still deliver mail sent through their system or through the International Postal Union system. It may take slightly longer to deliver from time to time. If you're so attached to a system of counties imposed by the English on Ireland centuries ago, you can continue to use your geographical county name in your address and, from time to time, some of your mail will take a little longer to deliver than it would otherwise. If you're genuinely committed to what you perceive as your cultural/historical heritage then why make a big fuss over some slightly delayed mail? Isn't it a price worth paying?
<snip> Do not attack the poster. It does not improve your post. :Mod0 -
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marmurr1916 wrote: »The ruling was very clear. An Post may continue to use postal addresse. The judge's decision has legal authority. ComReg's opinion has none.
[...]
Does that mean An Post are allowed to enforce people to use so-called postal addresses? Not the ones people's houses are located at (in terms of geographical location)? Genuine question.
Personally I don't care what An Post (and other couriers) are going to use as long as I don't have to keep a number of addresses for them. Happily had no problems with An Post yet. Nor other couriers.
I live in remote area (in the middle of nowhere I'd say). Let's say An Post are annoying me (through their "wrong address" sticker) to amend my so-called postal address to go "via Sometown". Second address to remember (real, geographic address being the first one). Let's say other couriers would start doing the same thing - reality is, I buy alot of stuff online, all delivered by An Post or others. And reality is, couriers depots are nowhere near each other.
Pure facts: one courier has "my" local depot in Sligo (third address). One in Athlone (fourth address). One in Roscommon (fifth address) and one in Galway (sixth address). If I omitted any of couriers delivering stuff for me, please accept my apologies.
I know, it'd rather never happen to go so bad, but that's how entire thing would escalate. And now, you have to know what courier would other end of supply chain use, and (if foreign courier with no Irish branch) what courier here delivers on their behalf - all that to know which postal (pff...) address should be provided to have successful delivery.
Eircode, maybe, will sort that out one day, but not in a foreseeable future IMO (I hope I'm wrong). I spoke a lot to lads delivering stuff for me, and only ONE of them used eircode to locate me. And it was his own initiative - he used his private mobile + eircode finder + his own sat nav phone app to locate me.0 -
marmurr1916 wrote: »The ruling was very clear. An Post may continue to use postal addresse. The judge's decision has legal authority. ComReg's opinion has none.
A bit late now, since the courts have already decided the issue, in public and in accordance with law.
As the judge pointed out, historically the system of postal addresses being used by the postal service was in place long before the foundation of the state. You don't think it's right to let a judge decide disputes over law? Would you prefer to have a national referendum to decide the outcome every time Johnny sues Mickey because his toast was burnt?
There's no force involved at all. You can use whatever form of address you like and An Post will still deliver mail sent through their system or through the International Postal Union system. It may take slightly longer to deliver from time to time. If you're so attached to a system of counties imposed by the English on Ireland centuries ago, you can continue to use your geographical county name in your address and, from time to time, some of your mail will take a little longer to deliver than it would otherwise. If you're genuinely committed to what you perceive as your cultural/historical heritage then why make a big fuss over some slightly delayed mail? Isn't it a price worth paying?
<snip> Do not attack the poster. It does not improve your post. :Mod
It's great that I didn't see the personal attack. Thanks mod.
Marmurr I find this entire post appalling. It is great that not everybody thinks like you.
It means issues can be and are discussed, and the public can have their say in matters that concern them.
Thank goodness (or I should say, thank democracy) the judiciary system does not indeed govern or dictate the country, and most of these changes become political issues.0 -
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Mountainsandh wrote: »It's great that I didn't see the personal attack. Thanks mod.
Marmurr I find this entire post appalling. It is great that not everybody thinks like you.
It means issues can be and are discussed, and the public can have their say in matters that concern them.
Thank goodness (or I should say, thank democracy) the judiciary system does not indeed govern or dictate the country, and most of these changes become political issues.
So when should we have the referendum?
Judicial rulings are an essential part of our democracy.
Without them, contraception would not have been legalised in Ireland, gay men would have had continued fear of persecution and segregation in the USA would have carried on.
There is nothing wrong per se with making decisions through the courts.
As I pointed out, you can use any form of address you please and as long as you add an Eircode, your individual address can be identified by An Post.
This may on some occasions lead to some delay in the delivery of mail handled by An Post. Isn't that minor inconvenience a price paying for your loyalty to geographic counties?
IMO, you're making out of a molehill - use whatever address you like. If it means a few minor delays now and again so be it. Is it really that big a deal?
If it is, I'll leave you to it.0 -
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