Formula 1 2016: General Discussion Thread

Harika

Seems like Wehrlein was confirmed for Manor. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122751

flazio

Eddie Jordan confirmed as part of the new Top Gear posse. However with 6 presenters and a Stig, I think he'd still have enough time off to continue making appearances in the F1 paddock if he chooses.

Zcott

flazio wrote: »

Eddie Jordan confirmed as part of the new Top Gear posse. However with 6 presenters and a Stig, I think he'd still have enough time off to continue making appearances in the F1 paddock if he chooses.

Have Channel 4 announced any of their presenters yet? I know DC is involved, but anyone else?

eviltimeban

Jordan not going to be involved in F1 coverage:

http://planetf1.com/news/jordan-giddy-after-bagging-top-gear-role/

Wasn't Jake whathisname confirmed recently? Or rumoured to be going to Channel 4? I know he does "the" football now, so I'm not sure. A quick Google would help.

I watch the races on Sky anyway.

mickdw

eviltimeban wrote: »

Jordan not going to be involved in F1 coverage:

http://planetf1.com/news/jordan-giddy-after-bagging-top-gear-role/

Wasn't Jake whathisname confirmed recently? Or rumoured to be going to Channel 4? I know he does "the" football now, so I'm not sure. A quick Google would help.

I watch the races on Sky anyway.

Don't think jake is going back to f1. He is a share holder in the production company doing it for c4 as is coultard.

F1 fanatic

Back to the good old days.

Channel 4 has announced its bringing back Fleetwoods macs "The Chain" as the theme.

F1 fanatic

Back to the good old days.

Channel 4 has announced its bringing back Fleetwoods macs "The Chain" as the theme.

muckwarrior

F1 fanatic wrote: »

Back to the good old days.

Channel 4 has announced its bringing back Fleetwoods macs "The Chain" as the theme.

How is it bringing it back? That's the current BBC theme.

eviltimeban

I got to like the "just drive" song on Sky, though not since they've changed it from the actual song to just bits of the song with bits of speech as well.

Jordan 199

Zcott wrote: »

Have Channel 4 announced any of their presenters yet? I know DC is involved, but anyone else?

No mention of anyone else yet, but I do hope Ben Edwards joins him.

Zcott

eviltimeban wrote: »

I got to like the "just drive" song on Sky, though not since they've changed it from the actual song to just bits of the song with bits of speech as well.

I thought that particular theme was really terrible. As was the old ITV one.

flazio

Zcott wrote: »

I thought that particular theme was really terrible. As was the old ITV one.

Itv went through a few of them, all were decent in my opinion except for the last one, Moby's Lift Me Up.
I still associate Fatboy Slims Right Here, Right Now as a Formula 1 theme tune. Hate that Setanta You can push but it got no brakes thing though.

Ghost Train

Would prefer if C4 picked a new song and left the BBC one to the BBC to use if they ever come back to F1

The Sky song is okay but does sound a bit awkward when they get rid of some lyrics or remix it

eviltimeban

Ghost Train wrote: »

Would prefer if C4 picked a new song and left the BBC one to the BBC to use if they ever come back to F1

The Sky song is okay but does sound a bit awkward when they get rid of some lyrics or remix it

At first I thought the just drive song was ridiculous, but then I found singing along with it sort of ironically as the weeks went on, and then with full conviction about halfway through the season!

Jamiroquai did one for ITV in 1997 - was pretty good as an intro, even though they never played more than that of the track.

Cookie_Monster

flazio wrote: »

Itv went through a few of them, all were decent in my opinion except for the last one, Moby's Lift Me Up.

I actually love that moby song.

Jordan 199

The off-season is such a fcuking drag so far :mad:

g1983d

I used always think the Firestarter intro on the RTE coverage was class

Jordan 199

The 20 Formula 1 cars Michael Schumacher drove.

Ghost Train

Motorsport Calendars, select the series you want to follow and download to what ever device you have

ro_chez

Jordan 191 wrote: »

The 20 Formula 1 cars Michael Schumacher drove.

Wow, I never knew he tested a Ligier in 94

Edit: Or a Sauber in 97!

Jordan 199

ro_chez wrote: »

Wow, I never knew he tested a Ligier in 94

Edit: Or a Sauber in 97!

He tested the Ligier in 94 so he could get a feel for the Renault engines which powered him to his second championship in 95.

TheDoctor

Amazing how exposed the drivers neck was at the side back 20 yrs ago. Can nearly see his shoulders.

Frank Bullitt

Here he is in the Sauber.

Cookie_Monster

Jordan 191 wrote: »

He tested the Ligier in 94 so he could get a feel for the Renault engines which powered him to his second championship in 95.

why can't the cars look that good anymore

driver area over exposure aside.

Spudman_20000

Jordan 191 wrote: »

He tested the Ligier in 94 so he could get a feel for the Renault engines which powered him to his second championship in 95.

Just one of things that made Schumacher one of the greats. Leaving no stone unturned.

Interesting that F1's popularity didn't suffer too badly during Schumacher's dominance with Ferrari. Compare that now to Mercedes' dominance.

The fault would therefore appear to be with the sport's rules and path it has taken, in terms of the speed of the cars, sound and driver grumblings about not being able to push.

At least when Schumacher was out in front, he wasn't coasting. It always felt like he was close to the limit with the car most of the time.

ScumLord

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

Interesting that F1's popularity didn't suffer too badly during Schumacher's dominance with Ferrari. Compare that now to Mercedes' dominance.

Well there's probably a number of reasons for that. The first one was anyone could watch F1 without paying for it back then, most countries showed it for free on the national broadcaster. Another reason would be the technology was new and developing, there were new technologies coming and going and a team could show up at a track with something completely new that no one had seen before.

I do remember people complaining about Schumacher's dominance, most people described the sport as watching the red car go around in circles. It certainly contributed to the current problem of rules and regulations.

The bottom line is those days are gone, we can't forget everything we know and will never see those days again. It's gone from being a sport where anything can happen, to a sport that needs some definitive rules and regulations.

El_Duderino 09

ScumLord wrote:

Well there's probably a number of reasons for that. The first one was anyone could watch F1 without paying for it back then, most countries showed it for free on the national broadcaster. Another reason would be the technology was new and developing, there were new technologies coming and going and a team could show up at a track with something completely new that no one had seen before.

I imagine that losing fan base is a long term thing. A sport needs a flow of young fans. F1 is geared up to be a sport for middle aged, reasonably walthy, men. Look at the sponsors and their target market. F1 isn't like football which can be played by a child with only a ball.

The Schumacher era was a big problem for fans. I have no figures for viewership but I imagine they suffered during Schumacher dominance. And also imagine the biggest problem was with getting new fans during that time.

Then add to that the pay wall, the complexity of the rules, the fact that drivers are driving within the car's performance to save tyres. No normal fan understands the aerodynamic updates and they are almost completely non transferable technology and make it difficult to follow a car which limits overtaking.

F1's aging fan profile also means there's more likelihood of giving in to the 'good old days' nostalgia, chanting 'backwards is the way forward'. If f1 listens to those people, it will paint itself into a corner by ignoring the needs of the modem world, with an ever shrinking fan base.

ScumLord

F1 was a bit of a spectacle back in the day, the cars were unique machines that you just wouldn't see anywhere else. I'm also fairly sure people went to see the danger, now the sport is safe and accidents just don't happen all that often, you have to be in to motorsport to appreciate whats happening on screen.

I think motorsport has become more accessible. Virtual motorsport could take off in a big way over the coming years with VR, but even if that market tripled, it's still a niche market.

I don't see how they can reintroduce the spectacle, they can' make it dangerous or hazardous for the drivers so the organisers have to accept those types of fans are a lost cause, forget about trying to appease them.

I think all they can really do is make it a fair sport, even if it means becoming a smaller organisation.

eviltimeban

I still like the spectacle. I've followed F1 since the 80s, so I know all about the "good old days", but I'm still entranced by the spectacle that is an F1 race. I don't really watch it for the danger, and I think people are obviously happy that F1 is safer.

Having cars that can't overtake is a big problem however. That's what'll baffle most people. I think the modern era started to go downhill around 1998, with the introduction of the grooved tyres and the push towards aero rather than mech grip. That took the power away from the drivers and into the hands of the designers.

Which worked fine for a while, we had some great battles - Schumi and Hakkinen, Montoya and Schumi (again), then Alonso, Kimi, and Hamilton coming through.

The other problem is the drivers - the younger they are being signed, the more like walking PR machines they become. People are tired of hearing a clean cut 20 year old say things like "yes this is great for the team for sure" and all that. They want people with personalities, and either the current crop of new F1 drivers have no personalities, or their PR people are telling them not to let anyone know they do!

And why would they do this? Sponsors. Sponsors are making or breaking teams and drivers at the moment. Really, bottom line is F1's problem is money. Spending it, earning it, saving it, bringing it. There's just too much money in play.

Anyway. I'm looking forward to this year. I'd like to see Rosberg win. I dearly hope Alonso does well. Generally a race weekend for me is watch all of the pre-show coverage, fast forward the first two qualifying sessions, and fall asleep during the actual race.

Jordan 199

2016 team launch dates so far:

Ferrari: 19th of February.

McLaren: 21st of February.

Haas: 21st of February.

Manor: 22nd of February.

Williams: 22nd of February.

Red Bull: 22nd of February.

Sauber: 1st of March.

Testing begins next week on the 22nd of February in Barcelona.

Spudman_20000

So this is the "new and improved" engine sound from Mercedes?

Sounds like a bloody leaf blower. No wonder most of the engineers standing around in the video don't have ear plugs in.

Frank Bullitt

They still sound like goats shouting through a traffic cone.

El_Duderino 09

ScumLord wrote:

I don't see how they can reintroduce the spectacle, they can' make it dangerous or hazardous for the drivers so the organisers have to accept those types of fans are a lost cause, forget about trying to appease them.

That might be what happened with the hybrid engines. They farted around for too long with the v8 that wasn't adding any value to the world. The move to hybrid was the first ight idea but it was too big too quick. It should have been done in at least 2 phases (besides KERS). We it's crucial to stay relevant to the world. The engine is a big problem for some people but I imagine it's not a problem for younger fans.

ScumLord wrote:

I think all they can really do is make it a fair sport, even if it means becoming a smaller organisation.

Exactly. At the moment it's a mix of sport and business marketing. Sport needs to be a meritocracy or else it might as well be a scripted soap opera. Teams who run as a long term business can't compete with the teams who run almost completely as a marketing exercise. The deal f1 has with ferrari suggests that the soap opera is of greater value than the sport.

eviltimeban wrote:

Having cars that can't overtake is a big problem however. That's what'll baffle most people. I think the modern era started to go downhill around 1998, with the introduction of the grooved tyres and the push towards aero rather than mech grip. That took the power away from the drivers and into the hands of the designers.

Completely agree. It won't be as simple as all that. I read about Adrian newey saying the sport should be MORE about aerodynamics agreed less about engine power. Ferrari have recently recalibrated their wind tunnel at cost of millions. There is definately a lobby preventing a move away from aero, towards mechanical grip. Just because it makes sense, doesn't mean it'll happen.

The crucial point is that fans want close, competitive racing that allows drivers to fight. Most of the main stakeholders are struggling to stay alive with no time to concentrating on providing a better product (teams and race venues). Meanwhile there is a group of investors who provide zero value but cream the profits off the top before those who provide the show, even get a penny. It ain't right and the sport is suffering as a result

HighLine

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

That might be what happened with the hybrid engines. They farted around for too long with the v8 that wasn't adding any value to the world. The move to hybrid was the first ight idea but it was too big too quick. It should have been done in at least 2 phases (besides KERS). We it's crucial to stay relevant to the world. The engine is a big problem for some people but I imagine it's not a problem for younger fans.

I would be more of the opinion that they farted around bringing in a hugely complex and massively priced "power unit" that does nothing for the benefit of the sport.

They had a perfectly usable and cost effective V8 which had the added bonus of not sounding like leaf blower.

El_Duderino 09

HighLine wrote:

I would be more of the opinion that they farted around bringing in a hugely complex and massively priced "power unit" that does nothing for the benefit of the sport.

They had a perfectly usable and cost effective V8 which had the added bonus of not sounding like leaf blower.

I'm not sure if you're demonstrating my point on purpose or not. Thanks either way.

Don't you understand that the engines were hugely complex back in whenever you're rose tinted heyday was? That's almost certainly why it was cool to you in the first place. They were creating things that couldn't be seen anywhere else. It was a spectacle.

In 2014, the v8 was adding nothing to the world and only brought stagnation to the sport. It was a rehash of 20 year old technology. There was literally nothing remarkable about it.

You'll never get new people interested by telling them you have the finest of 80s engine technology on display. I was recently at a video games console exhibition. They had all the classic games consoles and arcade games for people to play. It was great fun for an hour but the fact is that there's no market for those games anymore. There were 30 year olds trying to convince their kids that 'pong' was a great game but the kids just wanted to go home and play call of duty on xbox live.

HighLine

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Don't you understand that the engines were hugely complex back in whenever you're rose tinted heyday was?

I stopped reading after this as you obviously don't have the ability to argue points constructively.

El_Duderino 09

HighLine wrote:

I stopped reading after this as you obviously don't have the ability to argue points constructively.

I thought you stopped reading circa 1980

El_Duderino 09

Roy Haryanto's £ 10 million will be driving for Manor this year. Does anyone know if he's good?

Can't post the link for some reason. It's on the telegraph site.

If he is confirmed it will complete the driver line up for the year. No drive for Will Stevens or Alex Rossi.

Harika

Rio won 3 GP2 races last year, so better already than Eriksson. Anyway I wouldn't expect much from him as he was four years in GP2, so he might be at best at the same level as Jolyon Palmer who won the GP2 series in his fourth year. Maldonado won it in his second year, to put both in perspective.

El_Duderino 09

Harika wrote:

Rio won 3 GP2 races last year, so better already than Eriksson. Anyway I wouldn't expect much from him as he was four years in GP2, so he might be at best at the same level as Jolyon Palmer who won the GP2 series in his fourth year. Maldonado won it in his second year, to put both in perspective.

Cheers. Hard to know much about him then. That would put 3 rookies on the grid. It seems that all the rookies are 'pay drivers' of one kind or another. Either by sponsorship directly or manufacture driver program. Let's hope the driver programmes are selecting the best drivers because the sponsors are more likely to select for marketability than driving ability.

Harika

I wouldn't expect a lot from Palmer or Haryanto and they might disappear soon anyway, but Wehrlein has an impressive racing record already.
2nd in the F3 Euro series in his first year. DTM Champion in his third year. So he has the potential to become a f1 champion, but this also depends on luck as you see with Hülkenberg who is without question a great talent, but missed out on a winning F1 car so far. I think anyway that Mercedes will park him at Manor and then put him into Mercedes as soon as Nico or Lewis leave. Same as Ferrari did with Bianchi.

Frank Bullitt

New RB livery.

Mike Litoris

I think that is awesome! Clean and bold.

El_Duderino 09

Looks good. I suspect there are no bells and whistles because they expect a lean year. Very like the traditional look of the Torro Rosso. I wonder what the TR will look like

Frank Bullitt

Its also a matte navy finish, saw some close ups of it. Quite nice.

Ghost Train

Gintonious wrote: »

Its also a matte navy finish, saw some close ups of it. Quite nice.

The matte finish is interesting, wonder what the aero performance is of matte vs glossy, they probably wouldn't use it if it was going to any sort of disadvantage

Wonder how it will look out on track

Cookie_Monster

looks dated already

Frank Bullitt

Ghost Train wrote: »

The matte finish is interesting, wonder what the aero performance is of matte vs glossy, they probably wouldn't use it if it was going to any sort of disadvantage

Wonder how it will look out on track

Newy has already said they tested it and there is no difference.

tripperman

I like the new red bull colour scheme reminds me a little of the early sauber they sponsored

Frank Bullitt

Any excuse to post an image of an F1 car like this. Sublime.