There's no such thing as Santa Claus!!!

Fluffy Cat 88

The parents in my workplace were having a wee chat today about one of their 6 year olds classmates in school. One child's Mammy decided not to live the Christmas lie and told her kid there's no such thing as the ould fat red-suited annual visitor.

So word spread amongst the little ones, tears, howling outrage etc (amongs the parent's that is). Got child-free me thinking, wondering if...

Is it fair to lie to kids? Is lying ever ok? Is it fair to tell them the truth? Did that parent ruin the "magic" of Christmas for all? Should "Santa" be a tradition, but the children would be told the truth - it's really the parents buying the surprise gifts?

Thoughts?

Benteke

She is a 100% right, To much pressure on parents these days when it comes to xmas, Just look at what is happening around the world with religion, Lies and imaginary friends at the heart of it, Kids are best to know the truth

fergiesfolly

Real life is hard enough for long enough.
Let them enjoy a little fantasy while its going
Still remember when I was told. Mam thought I was old enough to handle it.
Ruined my 21st, I can tell you.

Alf Veedersane

Benteke wrote: »

She is a 100% right, To much pressure on parents these days when it comes to xmas, Just look at what is happening around the world with religion, Lies and imaginary friends at the heart of it, Kids are best to know the truth

Yeah. That's comparable to a fat kindly man bringing gifts once a year.

The_Valeyard

That parent is a right cnut. Let kids be kids and see the world as a magical place, before reality and adulthood kicks in.

stimpson

You need to up the ante. Tell your kids there's no god. See how the bitch likes that.

Lights On

The look of joy on my 4 year old nephews face after he went to visit "Santa" over the weekend and got a toy tractor was priceless. Let kids be kids.

John_D80

Mother who blabbed to her kid should have had more cop-on. Let kids be kids for as long as possible. Some of 'em will spend long enough being miserable in their adult lives.

IvaBigWun

The_Valeyard wrote: »

That parent is a right cnut. Let kids be kids and see the world as a magical place, before reality and adulthood kicks in.

This.

Also the thread title should be edited. 8 and 9 year olds use tablets a lot these days online and ya never know, this could pop up. Or that scenario aside they could be reading this over their parent's shoulder while at the PC.













Or that scenario aside, this is how I just found out.

trixychic

Benteke wrote: »

To much pressure on parents these days when it comes to xmas,

I think that comes down to the actual parents!!!! Some people just give their kids the toy book and keep saying yes. They give way too much and the magic isn't focused on.

My boys get what I got. A present and a stocking filler. We focus as much on the magic as possible. There is only pressure when you make it. Kids don't need a brand new tablet and a doll and a bike and all the rest. They are happy with a cardboard box and markers.

The Backwards Man

I'll never forget how devastated I was when my Manny told me my presents came from the coalman, not from Santa.

c_man

Fluffy Cat 88 wrote: »

Should "Santa" be a tradition, but the children would be told the truth - it's really the parents buying the surprise gifts?

No offence OP, but you're a dirty rotten liar.

rafatoni

Her and gabriel byrne would get on like a house on fire. Two grim *****..

Alf Veedersane

I wonder if she ruins the oul bedtime stories as well.

Does Goldilocks get mauled to death by grizzlies?

Do Snow White and the Prince end up going through an acrimonious divorce?

The_Valeyard

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I'll never forget how devastated I was when my Manny told me my presents came from the coalman, not from Santa.

You ungrateful sod, you know how much a bag of coal is worth!!!!

Diabhal Beag

You've made an absolute mockery of the spelling of Santy so far.

Summer wind

What a complete bitch. How dare she ruin all the children's Christmas time. She should be so ashamed of herself.

GardeningGirl

Hiya, nope, I'd be honest from the beginning. Why intentionally tell fictitious stuff?! Enough fibs flying around out there as it is
Truth prevails!

One eyed Jack

Fluffy Cat 88 wrote: »

Is it fair to lie to kids? Is lying ever ok? Is it fair to tell them the truth? Did that parent ruin the "magic" of Christmas for all? Should "Santa" be a tradition, but the children would be told the truth - it's really the parents buying the surprise gifts?

Thoughts?

I think when it comes to children, it's no harm to indulge their imaginations. I think it's very harsh and frankly I'd consider it a bit silly for an adult to ruin the spirit of Christmas for a child. I wouldn't be Christmas' biggest fan, but I wouldn't go telling my child Santa isn't real or anything else, let him indulge his imagination for another while and he'll discover for himself eventually.

cassid

I have a 6 year old and he started writing his letter in August, to date we got about 20 versions. On each letter, he makes the point (with some bad spelling) that Santa is the best and he loves him with all his heart and soul.

Was in Dunnes shopping a few weeks back, and the youngest had run off and I was calling him back, this man said to him I hope you are being a good boy and used his name, he had white hair and a beard. The wee fella nearly passed out and immediately told me the Santa was shopping with Mrs Claus in Dunnes. The fact he lives in the North pole was not an issue, Santa was just shopping in Dublin.

Nobody knows if God exists, and yet millions worship different ones, whats so wrong with a child believing in Santa or fairies or Easter Bunny. As a parent its one of the most wonderful times when you see the excitement on their face, memories I will carry to the grave.

trixychic

cassid wrote: »

Nobody knows if God exists, and yet millions worship different ones, whats so wrong with a child believing in Santa or fairies or Easter Bunny. As a parent its one of the most wonderful times when you see the excitement on their face, memories I will carry to the grave.

Can't agree with this any more. Kids need imagination. I love the the excitement on their faces. Kids need magic

Fluffy Cat 88

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I think when it comes to children, it's no harm to indulge their imaginations. I think it's very harsh and frankly I'd consider it a bit silly for an adult to ruin the spirit of Christmas for a child. I wouldn't be Christmas' biggest fan, but I wouldn't go telling my child Santa isn't real or anything else, let him indulge his imagination for another while and he'll discover for himself eventually.

This was the general consensus amongst my colleagues. I don't know the person, their financial situation etc though.

Into The Blue

I'm amazed people believe this shïte

The Randy Riverbeast

stimpson wrote: »

You need to up the ante. Tell your kids there's no god. See how the bitch likes that.

I'd say the santa thing would get a bigger reaction.


Santa the bastard stealing credit for the presents.

trixychic

Into The Blue wrote: »

I'm amazed people believe this shïte

Believe what ****e? ???

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I deal with a lot of women in my job. Women like to talk about their kids. I have the same conversation 10 times a day, with different people. A few years ago, about this time of year I'm working with this lady and the subject of her kids come up. I say "are they excited for Santa?" To which she replies "I don't believe in lying to my children". Wtf, they were young enough to believe but she was an outrageous gowl anyway

RobertKK

Santa Claus is based on Saint Nicholas, who as the Bishop of Myra gave presents to the children, during the times of the crusades and wars between the Christians and Muslims, the body remains of St Nicholas were brought to Kilkenny and buried near Jerpoint in Thomastown. There is an old ruined church beside where he is buried, the ruined church was the church of St Nicholas, and a large slab with a carved figure of a man on it.

There were headlines in newspapers here and abroad - Santa Claus buried in Ireland.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/christmas/6808138/Father-Christmas-buried-in-Ireland.html

kfallon

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I deal with a lot of women in my job. Women like to talk about their kids. I have the same conversation 10 times a day, with different people. A few years ago, about this time of year I'm working with this lady and the subject of her kids come up. I say "are they excited for Santa?" To which she replies "I don't believe in lying to my children". Wtf, they were young enough to believe but she was an outrageous gowl anyway

Bet she didn't tell the whole truth about their conception......

uck51js9zml2yt

I always swore I wouldn't tell my kids about Santa when I had some.

I now have some........I lied

dubscottie

There must be more than one..

Guy I was at school with swore he shot him down in 1992, 1997 and 1999 using the anti-aircraft gun on his gaff. (he did have one.. WW2 leftover)

PARlance

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I deal with a lot of women in my job. Women like to talk about their kids. I have the same conversation 10 times a day, with different people. A few years ago, about this time of year I'm working with this lady and the subject of her kids come up. I say "are they excited for Santa?" To which she replies "I don't believe in lying to my children". Wtf, they were young enough to believe but she was an outrageous gowl anyway

You should have picked out a few of her flaws and given her a dose of her own medicine, given her love of brutal honesty.

RobertKK

I stopped believing when I was 7 years old, my sister was 8. No big deal, as long as we got presents we didn't care. We were told to say nothing to other children.
It was due to a Santa Claus in a shop in Kilkenny, who was rather creepy as he had a very bad mask on and we just couldn't believe it was Santa, so we aired our suspicions with our parents and they told us the truth, and that was that.

Richard Dawkins said he was wrong to let his child believe in Santa Claus, but he did, maybe the link to a saint was an issue for him.

I just think parents should be responsible as it is not up to one parent to tell her child the truth then allow the child to tell all. A parent should know how their child will react, some children will do what the parent ask if told not to tell other children, others are not capable and will tell all.
Poor parenting is the problem with the child that told all.

uck51js9zml2yt

My 5 year olds not stupid.he knows the Santa in the shops isn't the real one.
The real one is in the north pole making his" 2 big guns"

TheChizler

If you tell your kids a nice pretend story that they're going to invest serious emotional energy into then you're going to have to be prepared for them finding out the truth before they figure it out for themselves.

I think if a child asked me directly was it pretend and not to lie, and I wasn't able to run away or avoid the question or defer to their parents (i.e. if they were my own!) that I wouldn't be able to lie. You lead by example with kids, and if I remember correctly the importance of telling the truth is one thing adults are always drilling into kids.

I imagine I'd try to not make a big thing of it and stress that they don't tell classmates but I don't think that you can expect a parent to lie to kids if they feel strongly about it.

PARlance

TheChizler wrote: »

If you tell your kids a nice pretend story that they're going to invest serious emotional energy into then you're going to have to be prepared for them finding out the truth before they figure it out for themselves.

I think if a child asked me directly was it pretend and not to lie, and I wasn't able to run away or avoid the question or defer to their parents (i.e. if they were my own!) that I wouldn't be able to lie. You lead by example with kids, and if I remember correctly the importance of telling the truth is one thing adults are always drilling into kids.

I imagine I'd try to not make a big thing of it and stress that they don't tell classmates but I don't think that you can expect a parent to lie to kids if they feel strongly about it.

Look at you channelling you inner kid and creating imaginary scenarios. Never let them knock that out of you.

lolokeogh

lol..realy?folks telling kids at 6.miserable ole gits,its one of the best parts of growing up,and if they do suss the "lie" early well ya try to convince them.im glad i dont have the mind set to tell my kids,and i look forward to seeing there faces light up come christmas morning,ill worry about the lie having deep effect on them in latter years in january,or the fact that imaginary people are the cause the world been on brink off all out war..somehow i dont think santy is included in that list,its a "white" lie folks,out of the many many people i know having a visit from santy every year never done them damage...lol..but it did leave great memorys,hopfully my kids will have the same..

Vitriol towards this lady a bit much

She didn't want her kids thinking there was a Santa. No big deal. Those kids told some other kids. No big deal.

Pretending like its spoiled Christmas is a bit much, or you're all relying on the big fella overmuch. The toys will still be the star of the show on the day and the panto can still carry on.

It's not like they don't know a good deal earlier than people are pretending in here either. Some people saying eleven. Eleven!

They'll be riding at eleven ye poor deluded stooges.

Another point to consider- its impossible for a parent to decide not to go along with the Santa conspiracy and for the kids not to blare it out all over scheeol- even if they were warned not to they'd have it wriggled out of them soon enough with other kids refusing to let it drop (kids at 6 don't believe in agreeing to disagree as a general rule)

Therefore everyone here dumping on this parent is essentially demanding that she be forced to raise her kids their way. At least she's got the facts on her side.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I'd be the first to admit I dislike pretty much all kids. I don't find kids cute. I have no interest in other people's kids. I don't fuss over kids. I have no interest in anyone's kids.

But even me - miserable and all as I am - couldn't find it in me to ruin a kids Christmas by saying Santa is not real. Yesterday myself and my cousin were out for dinner and talking about what her daughter was getting for Christmas, and for the benefit of the two small kids eavesdropping at the table next to us, we talked about "what's Santa bringing?" "Did she tell Santa to drop some presents at her dads house too?" "Do you think Santa will take her soother in exchange for her toys Xmas morning" etc

It's quite grim knowing there's people out there who'd gladly ruin that on a bunch of kids -- how miserable would you need to be, I wonder?

IvaBigWun

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I'd be the first to admit I dislike pretty much all kids. I don't find kids cute. I have no interest in other people's kids. I don't fuss over kids. I have no interest in anyone's kids.

Ya know the way some people dont trust people who dont like pets? Well Ive a serious distrust for anyone who doesnt like kids.

Horrible, constantly bold kids? Sure, no one likes them if they're not their own. But nice, happy, funny kids? Seriously? Who doesnt like them?

Whats worse is that you're a woman and you're rejecting one of your most basic primal instincts.

Something isnt right there.

uck51js9zml2yt

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I'd be the first to admit I dislike pretty much all kids. I don't find kids cute. I have no interest in other people's kids. I don't fuss over kids. I have no interest in anyone's kids.

But even me - miserable and all as I am - couldn't find it in me to ruin a kids Christmas by saying Santa is not real. Yesterday myself and my cousin were out for dinner and talking about what her daughter was getting for Christmas, and for the benefit of the two small kids eavesdropping at the table next to us, we talked about "what's Santa bringing?" "Did she tell Santa to drop some presents at her dads house too?" "Do you think Santa will take her soother in exchange for her toys Xmas morning" etc

It's quite grim knowing there's people out there who'd gladly ruin that on a bunch of kids -- how miserable would you need to be, I wonder?

So you really DO like kids but won't admit it

the_pen_turner

i wouldn't want to ruin anyones chrismass

but on the other hand if I had children I would not start this delusion.

TheChizler

Sam Rapping Huntsman wrote: »

So you really DO like kids but won't admit it

A Christmas miracle!

the_pen_turner

whats wrong with kids seening that mammy and daddy has to work hard all year to pay for their christmass morning and that those toys don't just appear out of the blue

Neamhshuntasach

I figured it out myself from watching the very Christmas films that added to the magic. Well it at least aroused my suspicions.

So take the Santa Clause with Tim Allen for example. He is fighting to prove he is Santa Claus while all the parents are like, there's no such thing ya lunatic. But the kids believe him as they still think he's real. But then it gets proved in the end that he is actually Santa Claus and he exists.

What always got me is, where did the parents think the presents came from all the years? Did they not wonder where all the additional or duplicate presents came from? And if no presents were left. Were they entitled to be back-dated?

robindch

Fluffy Cat 88 wrote: »

Is it fair to lie to kids? Is lying ever ok? Is it fair to tell them the truth? Did that parent ruin the "magic" of Christmas for all?

I don't see anything "magic" about filling my kid's head with Santa-related stories, especially since she figured out that it was an adult conjob when she was, AFAIR, four. I can make her smile by telling her lots of other false stories too - she's a kid - why would I abuse her trust?

Yes, it's lovely to see her smile and grin and giggle and be happy over the moon when she knows she's going to get a present - and we put one from Santa beneath the tree - but she knows quite well it's from her parents. And now at the age of nine, she's embarrassed for her classmates (all of them religious) who still believe in Santa. As a parent, I'd like her to be a little ahead of the curve in terms of maturity and knowing what's what, instead of being one of the kids that's being laughed at her behind their backs because they still believe in Santa, the tooth fairy or any other pious myth.

iguana

Different parents will tell their own kids different things based on their own research/feelings/beliefs. That's their prerogative. And kids will ultimately tell each other what their parents told them and kids will pick up ideas that are contrary to what they learned at home. That's life and to be accepted on every subject, including Santa and when that happens it's up to the parent to be prepared for it and talk to their child in a way that (at least temporarily) brings them back around to the parent's way of thinking or lets the child know that what they have heard from the other children is true/a valid perspective.

Personally I love the Santa myth and I think that the notion of Santa bringing the toys is more exciting than the knowledge that I put the presents out. I believe this because my son's birthday is in November and I do the the same thing the night before and leave all his gifts out in the same way as I do on Xmas eve, yet Christmas is just a whole different level of exciting because of Santa. However I won't ever tell my son that Santa only comes to good children. I don't like to threaten/bribe him into behaving as I want. And in time I'm pretty sure he'll tell his friends that Santa doesn't care if you aren't always 'good' and if his friend's parents later try to tell them tidy their room/eat all their dinner or Santa mightn't come those kids will probably retort that S's mammy says that's not true and that will piss them off. But I can't base my parenting decisions on how some people I don't even know yet will be annoyed when my son talks to their children about how things are in our house. That would be ridiculous. And the same is true for parents who just don't want to tell their children that Santa is real. It's not how I do things and may cause awkward conversations for me, but that's just life.

Mackman

the_pen_turner wrote: »

whats wrong with kids seening that mammy and daddy has to work hard all year to pay for their christmass morning and that those toys don't just appear out of the blue

Whats wrong is that kids shouldn't be subjected to the mysery and trudgery that is adult life for as long as possible. The should get to believe that the world is a magical place where faries, easter bunny, santa tooth fairy etc. all exist.

Seriously, they get like 10 years tops with this stuff, they will have 70 years of the rest. Give them the 10 years. (Although with smartphones and tablets now, they will probably only get 7-8 years)

trixychic

Both my boys believe and I would love to keep it that way. Many times they have heard someone in passing saying Santa's not real and they turn to me and laugh and say "he is real!!!!" To which i reply of course he is...

But. If they ever come to me and ask is he real I will simply ask "what do you think". I won't lie to them then. If they figure it out then that's fine. But if they come home crying saying such and such said he's not but he really is mammy. I'm not gonna ruin their magic.

Kids need magic and mystery and the ability to believe in stuff without seeing it for as long as possible imo.

namloc1980

robindch wrote: »

I don't see anything "magic" about filling my kid's head with Santa-related stories, especially since she figured out that it was an adult conjob when she was, AFAIR, four. I can make her smile by telling her lots of other false stories too - she's a kid - why would I abuse her trust?

Yes, it's lovely to see her smile and grin and giggle and be happy over the moon when she knows she's going to get a present - and we put one from Santa beneath the tree - but she knows quite well it's from her parents. And now at the age of nine, she's embarrassed for her classmates (all of them religious) who still believe in Santa. As a parent, I'd like her to be a little ahead of the curve in terms of maturity and knowing what's what, instead of being one of the kids that's being laughed at her behind their backs because they still believe in Santa, the tooth fairy or any other pious myth.

Must say that post is pretty sad IMHO.

StinkyMunkey

Stupid bint, sounds like a bitter old cow. I pity the child that has her as a parent, the world is a horrible nasty place full of hardship, I remember the magic that was Christmas when I was young. I'm thankful my parents didn't spoil my bubble of joy, some days I wish I wasn't privy to just what goes on in the world. I'm not worried about some nasty piece of work ruining Xmas for my boys.