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Collecting feedback on the Dispute Resolution Process

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12467…11

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    #92
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    Buona Fortuna wrote: »
    @Kersplat - I see that we can now "thank" posts in the archive is that a hiccup?

    I'm not sure. Saw it mentioned somewhere and would assume it's a bug and won't be left like that but for now you can thank away!!


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    #93
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,331 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Buona Fortuna wrote: »
    @Kersplat - I see that we can now "thank" posts in the archive is that a hiccup?
    It was a new forum and I suspect someone pressed the wrong button on that particular "option" when setting it up


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    #94
    Buona Fortuna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,507 ✭✭✭Buona Fortuna


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    I'm not sure. Saw it mentioned somewhere and would assume it's a bug and won't be left like that but for now you can thank away!!

    Well I'm just knock myself out with Thanks :D


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    #95
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,305 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    Buona Fortuna wrote: »
    @Kersplat - I see that we can now "thank" posts in the archive is that a hiccup?

    It's a hiccup that hasn't been corrected yet.


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    #96
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,305 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    Spear wrote: »
    It's a hiccup that hasn't been corrected yet.

    I've given the admins a nudge about correcting that. It's too easy for that to be abused to turn DRP into a public stocks instead.


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    #97
    Taltos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,830 ✭✭✭✭Taltos


    Niamh kindly took care of this for us. Thanks for the heads up


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    #98
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,305 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    Taltos wrote: »
    Niamh kindly took care of this for us. Thanks for the heads up

    Yup, the option is indeed gone, that was prompt.


    Back to the subject at hand:

    the most fundamental question then, are people confident that DRP is a mechanism to get issues addressed, even if it doesn't necessarily give the answer they may want/agree with?


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    #99
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,624 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Spear wrote: »
    are people confident that DRP is a mechanism to get issues addressed, even if it doesn't necessarily give the answer they may want/agree with?
    Yes, as long as the stages of appeal are applied (mod - cmod - admin) if the process says that they will be applied, which it currently does say.

    In the most recent thread in the DRP archive, this wasn't applied - admin just stepped in and removed one of the stages of appeal.

    Kind of ironic that they did this while there was a thread with some mods and admin alike discussing the merits of this.


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    #100
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,331 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    osarusan wrote: »
    Yes, as long as the stages of appeal are applied (mod - cmod - admin) if the process says that they will be applied, which it currently does say.

    In the most recent thread in the DRP archive, this wasn't applied - admin just stepped in and removed one of the stages of appeal.

    Kind of ironic that they did this while there was a thread with some mods and admin alike discussing the merits of this.
    In that particular case there is only one CMod and that CMod issued the ban, so it was not possible for an independent CMod review anyway (and to be clear there would be little point in asking a CMod from another category to step in as they would not have access to deleted posts/text or relevant Mod forums)

    Hence that one had to go straight to an Admin - I guess the question then would be should there have been 2 separate Admins involved within the dispute thread.


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    #101
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,624 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Beasty wrote: »
    Hence that one had to go straight to an Admin - I guess the question then would be should there have been 2 separate Admins involved within the dispute thread.
    That would be fair enough too.

    My point is that it should follow the diagram at the top of the DRP as much as possible. If there are supposed to be three stages of appeal, there should be three stages of appeal.

    It does happen occasionally that an admin steps in and say something along the lines of 'ok, I'm going to put an end to this, the poster has X infractions and X bans and has wasted enough of our time.'

    If that is going to happen, and admin are all happy for that to happen, then write it into the DR process.


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    #102
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,305 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    osarusan wrote: »
    That would be fair enough too.

    My point is that it should follow the diagram at the top of the DRP as much as possible. If there are supposed to be three stages of appeal, there should be three stages of appeal.

    It does happen occasionally that an admin steps in and say something along the lines of 'ok, I'm going to put an end to this, the poster has X infractions and X bans and has wasted enough of our time.'

    If that is going to happen, and admin are all happy for that to happen, then write it into the DR process.

    Equally we need to avoid a conflict of interest, so it's either have an admin look at it straight away in that case, or no review at all. The ideal case of course would be to have more cmods assigned, but that was the option in that instance to get someone's case heard out.


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    #103
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,624 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    I don't really have any problem with it, as long as it applies the process as consistently as possible. If there aren't enough CMods for a particular appeal, bring in another admin to have a look, so the three stages of appeal are kept.

    If the three stages of appeal aren't that important or are unnecessary, then alter the process to reflect it. If the CMods are trusted to come to the right decisions, maybe there shouldn't be an automatic right of appeal to admin. Perhaps it should the CMod, rather than the poster, who decides whether to flag something for admin to look at (only when there is a lingering doubt in their minds about the decision).


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    #104
    blackwhite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,820 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    EDIT - ignore that - just realised I was reading the flowchart incorrectly!


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    #105
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,726 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    What? There are two arrows!? Maybe the other arrow is only available to Mods to fuel our paranoia?


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    #106
    blackwhite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,820 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    hullaballoo wrote: »
    What? There are two arrows!? Maybe the other arrow is only available to Mods to fuel our paranoia?

    I was reading it on iPad and clearly looking at it wrong!

    Only when I posted the image that I saw it there!


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    #107
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,726 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    Oh right, well iPad users don't deserve any second chances. Smug gits.


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    #108
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,305 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    Now that everyone is back to work/school.

    Are there any more off-beat suggestions? Throw out the entire thing or radically alter it?


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    #109
    Into The Blue
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,358 ✭✭✭Into The Blue


    Spear wrote: »
    Are there any more off-beat suggestions? Throw out the entire thing or radically alter it?

    Have one committee. Made up of a mod, cmod and an admin. No levels of appeal, committee decision is final.


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    #110
    bruno1x
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 182 ✭✭bruno1x


    As long as mods work for free the owners of boards will side with them, no matter how bad their decisions are.
    If boards undermines the mods and went against the mods decisions , the mods would most likely call it quits.
    Solution to this problem, have mods declare there interests, if the mod is a Man Utd fan, posters know not to post negative about Man Utd, if mod is a Fine Gael supporter, posters know not to post negative about Fine Gael.
    Many decisions by mods are made because they don't like the post, not that it has broken any rules
    (i most likely marked for a infraction or ban in any place i post now)


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    #111
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    bruno1x wrote: »
    As long as mods work for free the owners of boards will side with them, no matter how bad their decisions are.
    If boards undermines the mods and went against the mods decisions , the mods would most likely call it quits.
    Solution to this problem, have mods declare there interests, if the mod is a Man Utd fan, posters know not to post negative about Man Utd, if mod is a Fine Gael supporter, posters know not to post negative about Fine Gael.
    Many decisions by mods are made because they don't like the post, not that it has broken any rules
    (i most likely marked for a infraction or ban in any place i post now)

    Have to agree with this ........ is any poster ever actually successful when going through the "appeals" process on DRP???

    The Cmods and Admins just seem to go through the motions on there before declaring the inevitable "Ban/Warning Upheld" ......... what's the point?


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    #112
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    You could always look yourself instead of blindly agreeing with something that isn't true. Plenty of cards and bans are overturned in DRP, many more are overturned before it even reaches DRP

    Edit.

    http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057543184/1/#post98264892

    There's one that took 15 seconds to find.


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    #113
    Buona Fortuna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,507 ✭✭✭Buona Fortuna


    ^^^

    I agree and not to suck up to a mod.

    There is a significant percentage of stuff on DRP that you know from the first post is going nowhere.

    None of my "conduct awards" have gone anywhere near DRP - they were all deserved.;)


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    #114
    Taltos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,830 ✭✭✭✭Taltos


    Admin Note
    gallag - your DRP was just addressed. We will not be going back to it here.
    Post removed, I caution you though to think carefully before posting again here.


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    #115
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    You could always look yourself instead of blindly agreeing with something that isn't true. Plenty of cards and bans are overturned in DRP, many more are overturned before it even reaches DRP

    Edit.

    http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057543184/1/#post98264892

    There's one that took 15 seconds to find.

    That seems to a rare, and very welcome from me personally, example to be honest ........ I wonder what the percentage would be between success and failure for posters going through the DRP process currently?


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    #116
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    MadDog76 wrote: »
    That seems to a rare, and very welcome from me personally, example to be honest ........ I wonder what the percentage would be between success and failure for posters going through the DRP process currently?

    Why don't you look into it and let us know.


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    #117
    The Randy Riverbeast
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,770 ✭✭✭The Randy Riverbeast


    If a lot of mod actions were being undone in DR wouldn't it mean there was a problem with moderation?

    I received an infraction, messaged the mod and got it undone. No DR required. DR is for when the mod has looked at it again, decided that they made the right choice. People who have no chance are often seen disputing their bans and infractions because they have clearly broken the rules.


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    #118
    Peregrine
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,402 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    Less than 1% of mod actions I took (only counting cards and bans) ended up in DRP in 2015.

    They were more than welcome to go there but most of the few appeals I had were dealt with via PM between myself and the user.

    I don't think there's anything currently wrong with DRP.


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    #119
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    Why don't you look into it and let us know.

    Done ........ as suspected Cmods rarely ever go against Mods and Admins almost never go against Cmods ......... I say almost because it may have happened but I couldn't find any at all that weren't a case of mistaken identity or a glitch in the system.

    As another poster on here mentioned, Mods and Cmods "work" for free so an Admin would be very reluctant to over-rule (embarass, de-power etc.) a Mod/Cmod as all Mods/Cmods get in return from volunteering their time to Boards is a sense of authority ....... if you take that away from them and publicly embarrass them then, being human, they would be less likely to do the grunt work for the Admins.

    But there's no way of getting away from this fact ........ Mods/Cmods, being human afterall, make mistakes and errors in judgement which go unchecked more often than rectified.
    And that's without the instances were Mods/Cmods are biased by their own personal opinion of a topic/thread/post/poster and exercise (or abuse?) their power to force their own opinions to the foreground disguised (sometimes thinly) as "sticking to the Charter".

    Obviously I don't expect any Mod, Cmod or Admin to agree with of the above.


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    #120
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    MadDog76 wrote: »
    Obviously I don't expect any Mod, Cmod or Admin to agree with of the above.

    Only because you know you just typed a stream of nonsense.


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    #121
    MadDog76
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    Peregrine wrote: »
    Less than 1% of mod actions I took (only counting cards and bans) ended up in DRP in 2015.

    They were more than welcome to go there but most of the few appeals I had were dealt with via PM between myself and the user.

    Maybe, like myself, they were reluctant to take it to DRP as they saw it as a pointless waste of time with an inevitable outcome ........... I myself have received unfair and unjustified warnings/infractions in the past but decided not to waste my time in DRP until recently .......... and my recent venture into DRP was just to prove a point to myself personally to be honest.


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