Leaving work on time frowned upon. Mod warning post 1

C4Kid

Currently in a job on a trial basis for the last 3 weeks. It's a small organisation with about 15-20 people.

Since starting I work the full 8-4:30 day and I always leave on time along with a few others however some people always stay on. This morning one of the directors came out to me while sitting in my car before work and said people who do the 8-4:30 don't last long around here.

I was a little taken aback but I'm just wondering is this common place, should I just suck it up or as its only a trial keep applying for other jobs.I can't stand being looked down on just for leaving on time at this stage I'd rather find a job where 4:30 means 4:30 the day is long enough as it is.

Other jobs similar to this which I have worked in finished on time without issue, this is the first time I've had this said to me !!

Thanks !

//MOD

Only a reminder to keep things civil people; it's a very heated topic and there's a good discussion going on (even if both sides disagree with each other) and I'd hate to have to lock the thread.

//MOD

OriginV

Maybe it is because you are on a trial basis and they want you to show that you are willing to put in that extra effort?

GFT

OriginV wrote: »

Maybe it is because you are on a trial basis and they want you to show that you are willing to put in that extra effort?

Yet there will be no extra pay I bet.

Markcheese

Not much you can do as you're on a trial... presentisim where people do long hours often without any extra productivity is a bit daft but seems to be common enough .. I suppose be as effective as possible while in work... and dont neccesarily start and finish on the dot ...

ThisRegard

With many office jobs you don't get extra pay for the bit of time you stay outside of your contracted time. You may get time in leu or at quieter times be able to finish up early. Standard practice.

What's the role?

GFT

We are in serious danger of becoming an Americanised business society. If you want your employees to work extra hours then ****ing pay them. I doubt if any of these bosses work for free themselves.

C4Kid

OriginV wrote: »

Maybe it is because you are on a trial basis and they want you to show that you are willing to put in that extra effort?

Yes I would agree with you but as GFT has said they're not paying me extra for it as have been there after 4:30 already. The wages are not great let alone working for free!

ThisRegard

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

GFT

ThisRegard wrote: »

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

Ah right, wanting to get paid for the work you put in is union now. Christ.

catbear

If they're more interest in appearances than results then it will be no loss to you if you're not taken on permanently.

The problem with undefined expectations of employers is that once you've acquiesced to them all that been established is that your manager feels they can push you around regardless of how competently you complete your work.

The only question is if it grates with you now then how long do you think you can tolerate it before you start looking for another employer?

Atlantic Dawn

Pretend you have kids or have to make a train, no way I would stay around for free.

C4Kid

ThisRegard wrote: »

With many office jobs you don't get extra pay for the bit of time you stay outside of your contracted time. You may get time in leu or at quieter times be able to finish up early. Standard practice.

What's the role?

It's a marketing / sales role. Yes with Xmas coming up they are busier then normal however I still can't do much on my own. At the moment I feel like I'm holding up everyone else while asking questions etc...

catbear

ThisRegard wrote: »

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

Do you think getting paid anything is a union thing too?

blackcard

ThisRegard wrote: »

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

And some companies expect you to work for 10 extra hours a week for free

Eugene Norman

ThisRegard wrote: »

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

It's an americanised idea in fact. However lots of Ireland have been americanised.

ThisRegard

GFT wrote: »

Ah right, wanting to get paid for the work you put in is union now. Christ.

I guess you've never had an office job? If you read what I said it's often made up in time in leu, officially or unofficially. If it's an upcoming assignment in which you know will involve a lot of extra hours overtime or time in leu can be agreed upon on a formal basis.

Crimsonforce

8 to 4.30 working suits a lot of people who have longer commutes to and from work, so they miss the major traffic rush. Nothing worse than a gob****e boss though who says things like that. I've come across them... I would stand your ground and do what's necessary in your role of employee..

ThisRegard

Fact is people, and it's not some stupid American idea, is that most office workers fall into such a category without whinging(not talking about you OP) or militantly sticking to their contracted hours. In the vast majority of cases it's not abuse, just that the work needs to be done.

Some will get overtime, some recompensed in other ways. You won't get anywhere career wise by refusing too anyway, can you rely on an employee digging you out of something at short notice when there's a problem?

GFT

ThisRegard wrote: »

I guess you've never had an office job? If you read what I said it's often made up in time in leu

I have an office job that pays me for any extra work that I do fairly as they should. I wouldn't be working there if they didn't. Some companies foster these unhealthy habits of pretending that working 10 extra hours a week will get them far. All it will get them is very little social life and pure exhaustion.

I can only imagine getting a ****ty paycheque after all those extra hours would be very rewarding...

GFT

ThisRegard wrote: »

Fact is people, and it's not some stupid American idea

Agree to disagree. I prefer not to work for free thanks.

hardCopy

C4Kid wrote: »

It's a marketing / sales role. Yes with Xmas coming up they are busier then normal however I still can't do much on my own. At the moment I feel like I'm holding up everyone else while asking questions etc...

It's all about appearances. If it pisses you off you may as well start looking for an alternative, you won't change the managers preconceptions.

Even in the most tolerant places I've worked you were expected to be logged in to your pc and ready to answer your phone from start to finish. Coats on and off, pc starting up and shutting down etc would be on your own time. Although most of my experience was as an outside consultant.

Vexed

I had this in the last place i worked, peaks and throughs they said. Funny how my wages never peaked while the managers fed from the through. Others in the place would say the same thing, we all have to row in when times are busy, it'll be noticed by those above. No probs I'd say, if they want me to work late, just pay me to work late.

When I'm on my deathbed, my employers won't be there thanking me for all the effort I put in over the years, my children will hopefully be happy with all the time I spent with them instead.

We work to live....

GFT

Also, half threatening to fire someone for not working for free is utterly reprehensible. How some people find this acceptable is baffling.

C4Kid

hardCopy wrote: »

It's all about appearances. If it pisses you off you may as well start looking for an alternative, you won't change the managers preconceptions.

I have been applying for jobs throughout, you are right after 3 weeks at this stage he's probably made his mind up at this stage...

catbear

GFT wrote: »

Some companies foster these unhealthy habits of pretending that working 10 extra hours a week will get them far. All it will get them is very little social life and pure exhaustion.

Totally agree. After a few decades working with different companies the only thing working overtime for nothing fosters is an unhealthy disrespect on the employers behalf.
I remember once being expected to do a weekend at extremely short notice but I said I couldn't as I had an interview, never got hassle in that job again.

andekwarhola

ThisRegard wrote: »

Nothing to do with America, it's standard practice. It's a very union idea that you don't work one second outside of your contracted time without recompense.

Like your toadying and conspicuous overwork will stop them canning you in a millisecond if the opportunity presented itself to save money.

chewed

If most of the people are staying late then the company is understaffed or they are all useless at their jobs!

GFT

andekwarhola wrote: »

Like your toadying and conspicuous overwork will stop them canning you in a millisecond if the opportunity presented itself to save money.

Plenty of whinging done then.

syklops

Ive worked in a few places where people stayed on later "working". How much actual work got done is anyone's guess. If they've been working hard all day, I also can't see how productive they would actually be.

Its funny, in 2015 with all the automation and computer access we have employers don't seem to have accurate ways of measuring performance, and so some employers seem to equate time spent to more productive which IMO is silly.

One place I worked they didnt like people working from home, even though the work could easily be performed from home, because "we like to keep an eye on what people are doing", which is another way of saying "we don't know what your doing unless we can see it". Some employers think their staff are under-utilised if they are not all swamped.

As for advice, I'm not sure what to say. If you like the job in other ways, maybe stick around for a bit in the evening. Or if you are already doing the work you have been given, maybe ask for more duties? Say to the director, that you leave when you do because you don't faff around on social media all day like some people do, and if there is more workhe wants to send your way, you'd be happy to work on it.

quarefarmers

Vexed wrote: »

I had this in the last place i worked, peaks and throughs they said. Funny how my wages never peaked while the managers fed from the through. Others in the place would say the same thing, we all have to row in when times are busy, it'll be noticed by those above. No probs I'd say, if they want me to work late, just pay me to work late.

When I'm on my deathbed, my employers won't be there thanking me for all the effort I put in over the years, my children will hopefully be happy with all the time I spent with them instead.

We work to live....

Nail on the head

Kirk Van Houten

GFT wrote:

Ah right, wanting to get paid for the work you put in is union now. Christ.

Depends if you are on a salary or get paid by the hour. Paid by the hour you should get compensated for it, salary its part of the job/package.

What bugs me is the self righteousness and self importance of those who offer advice to just walk out without having all the facts or details of what's involved. The level of self worth, self importance and unjustified expectation in this country is something else.