The Tipperary GAA (Club and Intercounty) Thread

evolving tipperary

Brave effort from Loughmore

Nenagh Eire Og 2-17 Loughmore/Castleiney 0-18

Mantis Toboggan

https://twitter.com/BrophShane/status/1046436066113269761?s=19

Tally Wager

County SFC Semi Finals :

Moyle Rovers v Commercials

Ardfinnan v Loughmore/C

Rovers and Commercials should be a cracker . John Evans has done some job with Ardfinnan , hammered in their first game by Moyle Rovers and now in a County Semi after a massive win over Ballyporeen . Hopefully a double header , both Quarters today involved 4 South Clubs but went ahead at different venues :rolleyes: !

evolving tipperary

I know Sars have played a lot of games recently and are looking tired. But hard to see them being beaten at home now. But, freshness might play a part for the sides left in it.

I hope Sheedy rests the Mahers and Noel and John for most of the Tipp league games. But he certainly needs to settle their positions - he can do that in training. We don't need to find out anything about those players. But Tipp need to find out who leads when their not on the field.

shmeee

And we end up with a Cashel v Thurles Sarsfields intermediate final.

Thurles winning today against Shannon Rovers by 1-17 to 0-12.

Final fixed for the 14th of October.

The Lost Sheep

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I know Sars have played a lot of games recently and are looking tired. But hard to see them being beaten at home now. But, freshness might play a part for the sides left in it.

I hope Sheedy rests the Mahers and Noel and John for most of the Tipp league games. But he certainly needs to settle their positions - he can do that in training. We don't need to find out anything about those players. But Tipp need to find out who leads when their not on the field.

I doubt Sheedy will rest them. League games are not just about finding out about players. They can be used to build momentum/form etc ahead of the Munster championship

Rasputin11

Any word on the chap that went off after a huge collision in Dolla today?

michaelm

shmeee wrote: »

And we end up with a Cashel v Thurles Sarsfields intermediate final.

Thurles winning today against Shannon Rovers by 1-17 to 0-12.

Final fixed for the 14th of October.

So what happens now as regards promotion to Senior grade for next year - Sarsfields having 2 teams?

The Lost Sheep

michaelm wrote: »

So what happens now as regards promotion to Senior grade for next year - Sarsfields having 2 teams?

No club would be allowed 2 teams at senior. Never has been allowed. Too open to abuse.
If sarsfields win nobody gets promoted afaik

digzy

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

I doubt Sheedy will rest them. League games are not just about finding out about players. They can be used to build momentum/form etc ahead of the Munster championship

Yep, cos it worked out so well last season

The Lost Sheep

digzy wrote: »

Yep, cos it worked out so well last season

So not playing the top players and just fringe guys will work so much better then?

giveitholly

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No club would be allowed 2 teams at senior. Never has been allowed. Too open to abuse.
If sarsfields win nobody gets promoted afaik

Two teams going up,Cashel already promoted,don't know what they will do with sars,won't affect the county championship because they will be in different competitions but don't know how they will run the mid

The Lost Sheep

giveitholly wrote: »

Two teams going up,Cashel already promoted,don't know what they will do with sars,won't affect the county championship because they will be in different competitions but don't know how they will run the mid

Keep forgetting its 2 going up though dont agree with that.
Think there needs to be reduction in big way of senior clubs even with way they split between dan breen cup and next tier.
No way would you be allowed 2 clubs in senior. Too open to abuse by the one club around players and competition.

michaelm

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No club would be allowed 2 teams at senior. Never has been allowed. Too open to abuse.
If sarsfields win nobody gets promoted afaik

My understanding is that this year both finalists are promoted so I presume that means just Cashel then.

digzy

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

So not playing the top players and just fringe guys will work so much better then?

That’s not what I said and you know it. You’re been selective cos you’d argue about 2 flies going up a wall( case in point your endless droning on about the structure of the club championship). Using your logic every side should play their best 15 each week to win the league. Maybe you know something every other inter county manager doesn’t!!!

The priority of the league is to unearth some new players/ fringe players who can force their way into the championship 15. Flogging players like paudie was in this league is pointless. Taking hammerings in the last 2 league finals hasn’t been beneficial either. Shefflin didn’t play much league in his final few years. Don’t think it did him much harm come summertime.

Barring injuries I’d like to see plenty rotation with at least half of your ‘first 15’ playing each game.
Think ryan did that in the 2017 league. My best recollection of the last league was that sides tended to win the home games and lose away. They were very inconsistent. Which is what you’d expect.

evolving tipperary

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

I doubt Sheedy will rest them. League games are not just about finding out about players. They can be used to build momentum/form etc ahead of the Munster championship

No, that's wrong. It's completely outdated and erroneous view. So wrong that the current league format will change for that very reason. Proposals are being put in place and will be ratified in 2020.

Overwhelming evidence has shown that 1A is too competitive and taxing - to the point that teams cannot develop and build momentum - they are too tired by the end of the league.

Furthermore, given the hurling profile of Tipp's more senior players they need the rest.

So, Sheedy will have learned from Ryan's mistake. It was ludicrous going for the league. Ryan admitted it was a mistake too.

The Lost Sheep

digzy wrote: »

That’s not what I said and you know it. You’re been selective cos you’d argue about 2 flies going up a wall( case in point your endless droning on about the structure of the club championship). Using your logic every side should play their best 15 each week to win the league. Maybe you know something every other inter county manager doesn’t!!!

The priority of the league is to unearth some new players/ fringe players who can force their way into the championship 15. Flogging players like paudie was in this league is pointless. Taking hammerings in the last 2 league finals hasn’t been beneficial either. Shefflin didn’t play much league in his final few years. Don’t think it did him much harm come summertime.

Barring injuries I’d like to see plenty rotation with at least half of your ‘first 15’ playing each game.
Think ryan did that in the 2017 league. My best recollection of the last league was that sides tended to win the home games and lose away. They were very inconsistent. Which is what you’d expect.

Im not being selective at all. No need for the potshot at me.
Ive never said anything like using just the best 15 to win the league and feck everyone else in the squad. Show me where ive said anything like that?
Getting to a league final is far better than losing out in semis/or earlier.

evolving tipperary wrote: »

No, that's wrong. It's completely outdated and erroneous view. So wrong that the current league format will change for that very reason. Proposals are being put in place and will be ratified in 2020.

Overwhelming evidence has shown that 1A is too competitive and taxing - to the point that teams cannot develop and build momentum - they are too tired by the end of the league.

Furthermore, given the hurling profile of Tipp's more senior players they need the rest.

So, Sheedy will have learned from Ryan's mistake. It was ludicrous going for the league. Ryan admitted it was a mistake too.

Care to show how its either outdated or incorrect?
The changes to the league just show that the league is even more important for building form and a squad ahead of the provincial competition.

robbiezero

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No club would be allowed 2 teams at senior. Never has been allowed. Too open to abuse.
If sarsfields win nobody gets promoted afaik

It should be allowed really. I can't see why not.

Tally Wager

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Keep forgetting its 2 going up though dont agree withouthat.
Think there needs to be reduction in big way of senior clubs even with way they split between dan breen cup and next tier.
No way would you be allowed 2 clubs in senior. Too open to abuse by the one club around players and competition.

What would Ewe , the lost Sheep do to reduce the number of Senior Clubs ?

And what remedies are out there to stop Ewe from forgetting that there are 2 going up even if Ewe don't agree withouthat ? ?

evolving tipperary

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Im not being selective at all. No need for the potshot at me.
Ive never said anything like using just the best 15 to win the league and feck everyone else in the squad. Show me where ive said anything like that?
Getting to a league final is far better than losing out in semis/or earlier.

Care to show how its either outdated or incorrect?
The changes to the league just show that the league is even more important for building form and a squad ahead of the provincial competition.

Your point that winning or going far in the league is important is outdated. And, just plain wrong.

There's been winners from 1b...

'GAA president John Horan says that the National Hurling League will undergo further change in 2020, with the return to two equal divisions instead of first and second tier groupings.

With the condensed nature of the round-robin hurling championships in 2018, the suggested NHL changes would mean that the league would take on more of a developmental outlook.

“It was felt the winners of the All-Ireland were coming out of Division 1B and 1A seemed to be extremely competitive,” Horan said.

“There was a feeling that [the league] wasn’t giving managers an opportunity to play players in a developmental manner because results were key, particularly in 1A, and even in 1B because they were all trying to get out of it.'


'Waterford manager Derek McGrath said that he felt the competition was “too serious” and expressed a preference for a top flight of 12, divided into two ‘mixed-ability’ groups of six counties, as was the case most recently in 2008.

McGrath’s point was that, with the tight schedule and ultra-competitiveness of Division One A, it was nearly impossible to trial players during the competition in the way he and others had been able to do in Division One B.'

Stop flip flopping on your points. Keep asking your questions though and I'll do my best to keep you up to speed.

These players are amateurs. Two strong competitions doesn't fly. Especially if you want to do well in both. Form and building momentum in the league for championship just doesn't work or make sense. But, you can certainly develop tactics, find players, and develop systems. Without adequate break between competitions in the year - teams can't go all out for both. And, if you put in an adequate break the clubs suffer. It's a development competition.

The Lost Sheep

robbiezero wrote: »

It should be allowed really. I can't see why not.

Because its open to manipulation and one Thurles side throwing game etc in game that affects progress of the other.
Would you allow a second Kilkenny side compete in all ireland hurling championship?

robbiezero

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Because its open to manipulation and one Thurles side throwing game etc in game that affects progress of the other.
Would you allow a second Kilkenny side compete in all ireland hurling championship?

Yes I would.
Should be a simple matter to ensure the two Thurles sides cannot be drawn in the same group in the championship.

The Lost Sheep

Tally Wager wrote: »

What would Ewe , the lost Sheep do to reduce the number of Senior Clubs ?

And what remedies are out there to stop Ewe from forgetting that there are 2 going up even if Ewe don't agree withouthat ? ?

I would simply put a number on the senior championship at 12/16 and either put in a new grade ie premier intermediate or continue to relegate clubs to intermediate every year until you get to 16 senior clubs.
The north intermediate hurling championship used to be a seriously competitive competition but is now a joke with so few competing in it.

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Your point that winning or going far in the league is important is outdated. And, just plain wrong.

There's been winners from 1b...

'GAA president John Horan says that the National Hurling League will undergo further change in 2020, with the return to two equal divisions instead of first and second tier groupings.

With the condensed nature of the round-robin hurling championships in 2018, the suggested NHL changes would mean that the league would take on more of a developmental outlook.

“It was felt the winners of the All-Ireland were coming out of Division 1B and 1A seemed to be extremely competitive,” Horan said.

“There was a feeling that [the league] wasn’t giving managers an opportunity to play players in a developmental manner because results were key, particularly in 1A, and even in 1B because they were all trying to get out of it.'


'Waterford manager Derek McGrath said that he felt the competition was “too serious” and expressed a preference for a top flight of 12, divided into two ‘mixed-ability’ groups of six counties, as was the case most recently in 2008.

McGrath’s point was that, with the tight schedule and ultra-competitiveness of Division One A, it was nearly impossible to trial players during the competition in the way he and others had been able to do in Division One B.'

Stop flip flopping on your points. Keep asking your questions though and I'll do my best to keep you up to speed.

My point on winning the league isnt outdated at all and not wrong at all. That there has been some winners from 1B doesnt make that point invalid.
And im not in any way flip flopping on any points. And drop the condescending nature. Its a discussion forum. I disagree with you and have backed up points so leave it at that.

digzy

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

I would simply put a number on the senior championship at 12/16 and either put in a new grade ie premier intermediate or continue to relegate clubs to intermediate every year until you get to 16 senior clubs.
The north intermediate hurling championship used to be a seriously competitive competition but is now a joke with so few competing in it.

My point on winning the league isnt outdated at all and not wrong at all. That there has been some winners from 1B doesnt make that point invalid.
And im not in any way flip flopping on any points. And drop the condescending nature. Its a discussion forum. I disagree with you and have backed up points so leave it at that.

The fact that teams from 1b have won the league shows that the thing needs to be restructured.
Every 1a game is a battle. Galway and limerick could play within themselves for most of their games and therefore try more players.

digzy

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Im not being selective at all. No need for the potshot at me.
Ive never said anything like using just the best 15 to win the league and feck everyone else in the squad. Show me where ive said anything like that?
Getting to a league final is far better than losing out in semis/or earlier.

competition.

How about you read your own post and mine given you quoted it and misquoted me?

You made out I suggested 'playing just fringe players'....NOPE.

I suggested a mix of both.

You're on about how you've shown a good league builds momentum for the championship.....where?

If anything teams that do well in the league peter out a bit in championship.
Galway didn't shoot the lights out in this league, limerick lost to us in a semi (I think). The teams tend to use it as a prep for the championship as opposed to it being a "must win " competition.

shmeee

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Keep forgetting its 2 going up though dont agree with that.
Think there needs to be reduction in big way of senior clubs even with way they split between dan breen cup and next tier.
No way would you be allowed 2 clubs in senior. Too open to abuse by the one club around players and competition.

Eventually which could be next year, Senior B will be just like premier intermediate. Once the divisional link goes that will be it.

Sarsfields had 2 teams at junior A this year in the same competition.

No reason why they can’t have 2 at “senior” level. They will have earned the right on the field of play unlike other teams over the years.

evolving tipperary

If a club is good enough and well-run enough to have two teams capable of playing 'senior' let them play.

But, perhaps, CB need to take a good long look at a competition that has so many slots for senior clubs that one strong club can produce two teams capable of 'senior'...

I wonder if Thurles could do it in a rejigged competition with less slots for senior clubs.

The Lost Sheep

shmeee wrote: »

Eventually which could be next year, Senior B will be just like premier intermediate. Once the divisional link goes that will be it.

Sarsfields had 2 teams at junior A this year in the same competition.

No reason why they can’t have 2 at “senior” level. They will have earned the right on the field of play unlike other teams over the years.

I think separating the divisions from the county or least narrowing the influence the divisions play on the county. No reason 10 or so clubs compete for north senior title but we certainly dont need so many north clubs competing in senior
Thurles will still have 2 sides in mid championship if their second side goes senior. There's a conflict there and it shouldnt happen.
Is there any clubs anywhere in the country with 2 sides competing in their counties senior championship.

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Full time
MacDonaghs: 1-16(19)
Thurles: 2-14(20)

THurles win with the last puck of a game... horrendous for MacDonaghs.

The last puck of the game was the only time Thurles led in the game!

Hard luck on Mcdonaghs. Ronans catch and strike though was outstanding. Sars have been at the very least been made to work for it this year which is a positive.

evolving tipperary

Word is Tommy Dunne is set to be senior coach. Darragh Egan to become minor manager.

Brian Horgan will come back as goalkeeping coach.

Eamon Corcoran is being mentioned as a selector.

Bubbles went under the knife recently - set to be out a long time.

No word on who will be strength and conditioning coach.

Amprodude

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Bubbles went under the knife recently - set to be out a long time

.

he is a liability anyway. Poor head on good shoulders.

shmeee

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Word is Tommy Dunne is set to be senior coach.

Correct.

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Eamon Corcoran is being mentioned as a selector.

Eamon isn't involved.

evolving tipperary wrote: »

No word on who will be strength and conditioning coach.

Gary Keegan is the name on peoples lips.

big_drive

shmeee wrote: »

Correct.



Eamon isn't involved.



Gary Keegan is the name on peoples lips.

I didn't think Keegan was a S&C man.

Joe_ Public

Not surprised that Gary Keegan’s name would be mentioned given Sheedy would almost certainly be acquainted with him given his role in Sport Ireland. Very much doubt it would be a specific s&c position though, more a consultant thing. He was involved with Cork this year so not sure if that is still ongoing. Would be a welcome addition for sure.

seligehgit

Not sure if any of you guys are interested but here's the link to an interview Liam Sheedy did on OTB.

"Sheedy: I'm doing this for the love of my county."

https://cdn.radiocms.net/media/012/audio/000002/64788_media_player_audio_file.mp3

evolving tipperary

seligehgit wrote: »

Not sure if any of you guys are interested but here's the link to an interview Liam Sheedy did on OTB.

"Sheedy: I'm doing this for the love of my county."

https://cdn.radiocms.net/media/012/audio/000002/64788_media_player_audio_file.mp3

Cheers

Eireog1

Anyone at the matches yesterday? Interesting County Final now I would say Nenagh will be hot favorites

robbiezero

Saw the second one. Nenagh good value for their win although had a hairy 10 minutes in the last quarter of the match. Went 10 points up, were reeled back to 4. Sars missed a sitter of a goal, great save from Nenagh goalie, but really should have been buried. Missed a point off the post straight after and their challenge fizzled out a bit after that.
Didn't see the first match, but you would think Nenagh should have too much for Clonoulty, they have a lot of quality all over the field.

From a Tipp point of view, a disappointing enough game. Michael Heffernan by a mile the best player on the pitch, gave Michael Cahill a torrid time. Looked like a bad injury for Cahill which is a pity for a great warrior.
Padraig Maher still looks well off form for me, not his usual dominant self at all. Hopefully a break will do him good.
I still think Ronan Maher is best in the half back line. Was ok yesterday, but again you would expect a bit more from someone of his class.
Barry Heffernan was ok, Jake Morris had a quiet game and missed two poor frees at a crucial time for Nenagh.

Fair play to Nenagh for their win and Sars have been great champions and have fought on their backs all year long and went down fighting hard(sometimes literally :-)) yesterday.

evolving tipperary

I wouldn't put up Nenagh as red hot faves. Nenagh have flattered to deceive on many occasions.

That was an exhausted Sars outfit.

Nenagh have a habit of getting caught and losing finals.

Clon seem to be hitting form at the right time.

I'd see it as a fifty fifty game.

If I was forced to put money on it, I'd put it on Clon. I think there is more togetherness and fight in Clon.

This is a huge chance for Nenagh - huge expectancy on them now and they usually don't deliver in such situations.

Both clubs have lost two county finals each within the last ten years.

Clon have won 3 of the 6 county finals they've made. Nenagh have won one of the five county finals they've been in.

As they say, maybe Nenagh are due one. I wouldn't put money on them anyway.

WuckingFanker

Liam Sheedy

Liam Sheedy

lonestar 74

After dethroning Sars, Nenagh will be made favourites which puts Clonoulty in the ideal position.
I was disappointed with the two semi finals considering all the good matches this year. Not that Nenagh or Clonoulty will be losing any sleep over it. Clonoulty were in control for the most part of the game. Tooms forwards were very poor. The moving of Joey McLoughney to centre back was robbing Peter to pay Paul. Clonoulty have some good hurlers and are playing as a team. Nenagh have some good hurlers and move the ball smartly. They fully deserved their victory but must remember that the cup is still up for grabs. It looked like all the matches caught up with Sars. Sars, Drom and Upperchurch can thank the Swans for that fiasco. Regards of the result hopefully from a neutral point of view the final will live up to expectations. The Dan Been will be most welcome in both clubs. There should be a fine attendance. So l'm hoping for a good contest.

robbiezero

lonestar 74 wrote: »

After dethroning Sars, Nenagh will be made favourites which puts Clonoulty in the ideal position.
I was disappointed with the two semi finals considering all the good matches this year. Not that Nenagh or Clonoulty will be losing any sleep over it. Clonoulty were in control for the most part of the game. Tooms forwards were very poor. The moving of Joey McLoughney to centre back was robbing Peter to pay Paul. Clonoulty have some good hurlers and are playing as a team. Nenagh have some good hurlers and move the ball smartly. They fully deserved their victory but must remember that the cup is still up for grabs. It looked like all the matches caught up with Sars. Sars, Drom and Upperchurch can thank the Swans for that fiasco. Regards of the result hopefully from a neutral point of view the final will live up to expectations. The Dan Been will be most welcome in both clubs. There should be a fine attendance. So l'm hoping for a good contest.

I'm not sure if it was tiredness or too many matches that caught up with Sars, they have come back to the pack a bit and have not been their normal force all year, obviously Billy McCarthy a massive loss to them.

They look to be in a small bit of transition for me where they need to get new young players into the team and up to the required level. they have some very promising young players who have seen plenty action this year so that team has a very bright future and will probably be favs to win it next year, although like this year, I anticipate another very competitive championship unlike recent years.

evolving tipperary

robbiezero wrote: »

I'm not sure if it was tiredness or too many matches that caught up with Sars, they have come back to the pack a bit and have not been their normal force all year, obviously Billy McCarthy a massive loss to them.

They look to be in a small bit of transition for me where they need to get new young players into the team and up to the required level. they have some very promising young players who have seen plenty action this year so that team has a very bright future and will probably be favs to win it next year, although like this year, I anticipate another very competitive championship unlike recent years.

Into the pack a bit? They were going for five in a row!!!

And of the four in a row - only one of the finals was close!

robbiezero

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Into the pack a bit? They were going for five in a row!!!

And of the four in a row - only one of the finals was close!

yes and this year they have come back to the pack a bit.

drew with loughmore.
beaten by drom
should have been beaten by kilruane
beaten by nenagh.

evolving tipperary

robbiezero wrote: »

yes and this year they have come back to the pack a bit.

drew with loughmore.
beaten by drom
should have been beaten by kilruane
beaten by nenagh.

I don't know lad - made a semi final.

Should've but weren't.

Fixtures were a mess this year.

Think you'd need a few years evidence to back that up.

The pack is the main body - there's a lot of clubs in Tipp. What is not the pack then? Sides that only make the final? The semis? The quarters? The top ten?

Sars have won four in a row... then made a semi-final. That's an insane level of dominance. A magnificent achievement. I think you're calling their decline into the pack way too early.

The Lost Sheep

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I don't know lad - made a semi final.

Should've but weren't.

Fixtures were a mess this year.

Think you'd need a few years evidence to back that up.

Made a semi final and werent as dominant as past few years. Theyve certainly came back into pack compared to the last few years and yes fixtures were a mess but that isnt a reason to say sars arent ahead of others
you dont at all need a few years to back that point up

lonestar 74

Upperchurch were another team that ran them close and with a little bit of.luck could have taken Sars. kilruane also ran them very close but for 1 or 2 debatable and scorable frees that were not given. They were no doubt cursing their bad luck when 2 points up a shot for a point came back off the post. Then Ronan performed heroics to nick it at the death with a super fetch
and a tremendous finish for a cracking goal. Buggy having to leave the field of play was nother nail in their coffin. Anyway that's a lot of ifs buts and might have beens.

westsidestory

lonestar 74 wrote: »

After dethroning Sars, Nenagh will be made favourites which puts Clonoulty in the ideal position.
I was disappointed with the two semi finals considering all the good matches this year. Not that Nenagh or Clonoulty will be losing any sleep over it. Clonoulty were in control for the most part of the game. Tooms forwards were very poor. The moving of Joey McLoughney to centre back was robbing Peter to pay Paul. Clonoulty have some good hurlers and are playing as a team. Nenagh have some good hurlers and move the ball smartly. They fully deserved their victory but must remember that the cup is still up for grabs. It looked like all the matches caught up with Sars. Sars, Drom and Upperchurch can thank the Swans for that fiasco. Regards of the result hopefully from a neutral point of view the final will live up to expectations. The Dan Been will be most welcome in both clubs. There should be a fine attendance. So l'm hoping for a good contest.

Can someone explain the Carrick Swans fiasco to me?

lonestar 74

Does anyone have an idea on which ref will get the SHC Final. One from the South or Mid? If Kevin Jordan gets the gig Clonoulty for one will be less than pleased to put it mildly. He was in charge of the group game between the two of them. There were times he didn't even look like giving them a free when they were entitled to one. At half time when a member of their backroom team went to question some of his decisions. Later in his match report he reported the backroom member for interference with a match official.

lonestar 74

Does anyone have an idea on which ref will get the SHC Final. One from the South or Mid? If Kevin Jordan gets the gig Clonoulty for one will be less than pleased to put it mildly. He was in charge of the group game between the two of them. There were times he didn't even look like giving them a free when they were entitled to one. At half time when a member of their backroom team went to question some of his decisions. Later in his match report he reported the backroom member for interference with a match official.