Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note Post #2331

Lord TSC

https://twitter.com/samuelluckhurst/status/681173736406532097

Forget the rumours. Van Gaal will be managing United tomorrow. He's at The Lowry.

The "rumours" were nowhere near as strong today than after the Norwich game, and I'd imagine the journalists already have the "United lose again" articles written up for after the Chelsea game.

BBC reporting he was at Carrington today, but the training by the players was just a gentle warm-down in between games; the two games in quick succession means there's not much time to talk tactics.

Discodog

I am going to go against the grain but I have a gut feeling that if Jose was appointed & got us out of the mess, he could stay for 10 years. Everything that I have ever heard suggests that he has always wanted the job & hugely admired SAF.

In any career you move jobs to gain knowledge, have new challenges etc but then people often find the one that sticks. I think that Jose might like to be settled & if he were who knows if he might bring on new young players.

Drumpot

StringerBell wrote: »

Cause he said it.

Woodward is very good at his job.

That's nice.

Yes Woodward is given a target and he more often then not delivers.

(I'm going to be wasting my time here aren't I)

Cause he said it?! Im gonna not argue with what he said, more so question its validity.

It's a bold statement to say that he's good at his job when we don't really know for sure. How frequently has United lost priority targets because of him? Remember fabrecas? We're united ever serious about Pedro? Have they gotten value for money?

No doubt supporters of Woodward will say hindsight and time will prove the transfer strategy a success. But nobody can tell me that players weren't targeted and signed irrespective of manager.

Shaw and Herrera were supposed to be signed when moyes arrived. Fabrecas was our priority target and Woodward got us fellani. People presumed it was moyes without any factual evidence to back it up. Fellani was well down the pecking order of targets, the problem was our virgin Woodward.

I think you are right on this one. You are allowed to believe whatever Woodward says and I am allowed to question his competency. Neither of us has irrefutably factual information to confirm our thoughts.

Lord TSC

Discodog wrote: »

I am going to go against the grain but I have a gut feeling that if Jose was appointed & got us out of the mess, he could stay for 10 years. Everything that I have ever heard suggests that he has always wanted the job & hugely admired SAF.

In any career you move jobs to gain knowledge, have new challenges etc but then people often find the one that sticks. I think that Jose might like to be settled & if he were who knows if he might bring on new young players.

I'd like to think so too; Chelsea and Real are held against him, but neither club ever give managers much time. Would be interesting to see how he gets on if let build his own team and see if he could forge a legacy.

StringerBell

I think that's probably the best solution alright Drumpot.

irishfeen

Discodog wrote: »

I am going to go against the grain but I have a gut feeling that if Jose was appointed & got us out of the mess, he could stay for 10 years. Everything that I have ever heard suggests that he has always wanted the job & hugely admired SAF.

In any career you move jobs to gain knowledge, have new challenges etc but then people often find the one that sticks. I think that Jose might like to be settled & if he were who knows if he might bring on new young players.

I actually agree too, SAF is his absolute idol .... What would be better for him personally if he could stand in the great mans shoes and continue the success of Man United.

Going back to Chelsea was apparently a long term thing for Jose but it ended very quick.

StringerBell

Lord TSC wrote: »

I'd like to think so too; Chelsea and Real are held against him, but neither club ever give managers much time. Would be interesting to see how he gets on if let build his own team and see if he could forge a legacy.

I just don't think his style lends itself to long term management. Too confrontational, not just with people outside the club, too confrontational with those in the club.

Maximus Alexander

Drumpot wrote: »

I find it odd that most people presume most of the signings have been van gaal. Shaw and Herrera were signed before he even joined. I'm not convinced the majority of players signed in his first season were hand picked by him.

I'm also not convinced United don't have a sort of DOF system behind the scenes. It's a dirty word in England and it would make more sense to not telegraph it. If you think about it, it also means less anger towards the owners and more focused on the manager if things go wrong.

With that in mind, does anybody think this squad of players is good enough for uniteds supposed high targets? Could any manager make this squad successful? I don't think LVG decided on many of these players. itd not like football manager where you pick and choose any player you want.

I believe Woodward has huge question marks over his competency. But as usual he gets a pass because the book stops at LVG. Like the asshole in your office that always seems to get away with murder while you get pulled up on every little thing, Teflon Woodward is exempt and protected from criticism.

This is an interesting perspective and something that has crossed my mind, but the problem is that there is just no evidence for it.

If another manager comes in and also fails though, you have to serious question is it the fault of all these consecutive managers, or what has been the constant at the club while all the other changes were happening for the cameras?

Korat

If Woodward was good at his job Utd wouldn't be looking at sacking a 2nd manager in less than two years.

Definitely wouldn't have been a laughing stock every other transfer window.

You couldn't give me enough hospitality concessions to ignore the utter disaster he has been for the football side of Manchester United.

Lord TSC

StringerBell wrote: »

I just don't think his style lends itself to long term management. Too confrontational, not just with people outside the club, too confrontational with those in the club.

Yeah, though it was probably a massive clash in that he was at a confrontational club surrounded by confrontational people. At United, I think there'd be less of that behind the scenes. He'd pretty much be able to stock the backroom, the players, everything, with people of his choosing.

And Giggs.


:P

Saw this over on Reddit: https://vimeo.com/150094417
Jose talking about LVG, United and Man United a few months back.

Drumpot

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

This is an interesting perspective and something that has crossed my mind, but the problem is that there is just no evidence for it.

If another manager comes in and also fails though, you have to serious question is it the fault of all these consecutive managers, or what has been the constant at the club while all the other changes were happening for the cameras?

I'm not completely blaming only Woodward but do think there are bigger questions then just manager issues.

I would go further and say that the club owners have shown an amazing ability to market the club (Woodwards brilliance I believe) but as soon as gill and Ferguson left, they struggled to find appropriate replacements in both roles.

In defence of Woodward, he did take up the post at an awful time of huge change. But I don't believe that should shield him from speculative debate on his competency.

Worse so, it would be even more concerning if the problems were even deeper. I have this fear that the only thing the owners really know what to do is how to market the club. In short, did Gill and Fergie make their jobs easy and now that they actually have to get involved in running the club it's the owners (not managers) who are rabbits in the headlights!

Maximus Alexander

Lord TSC wrote: »

I'd like to think so too; Chelsea and Real are held against him, but neither club ever give managers much time.

Nor do United...

bucketybuck

Korat wrote: »

If Woodward was good at his job Utd wouldn't be looking at sacking a 2nd manager in less than two years.

What utter rubbish. I don't even need to rate Woodward to see how illogical that statement is.

Its not Woodwards fault that Moyes and Van Gaal made so many mistakes. The only way he can be blamed for the manager is if they were both the wrong choices in the first place and thats not a given at all. There were good, solid reasons for going for Moyes and Van Gaal both, that they failed doesn't change those reasons at all.

If David Gill had remained in charge I think we would still have had Moyes and Van Gaal as managers, so its just crappy hindsight to blame Woodward for them failing as managers.

StringerBell

Korat wrote: »

If Woodward was good at his job Utd wouldn't be looking at sacking a 2nd manager in less than two years.

Definitely wouldn't have been a laughing stock every other transfer window.

You couldn't give me enough hospitality concessions to ignore the utter disaster he has been for the football side of Manchester United.

You almost made it a full day without the daily Woodward is the root of all evil rant

StringerBell

Lord TSC wrote: »

Saw this over on Reddit: https://vimeo.com/150094417
Jose talking about LVG, United and Man United a few months back.

Yeah I remember that interview, I wish that side of Jose was more prevalent.

Liam O

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Maybe Utd need a DOF. I'd question a lot of Lvg's transfer activity. Signing Depay, letting the forwards go, buying an out-of-date German. Hmm.

Hmm indeed. Complete shíte talk out of you.

Korat

StringerBell wrote: »

You almost made it a full day without the daily Woodward is the root of all evil rant

The Glazers are the root of all evil. Woodward is their Mancunian Candidate.

Seriously he must be stopped before it's too late. :eek:

Cantona's Collars

FWIW I stuck up a match thread,it could be the last one to feature LVG as United manager. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=98207845#post98207845

Mitch Connor

I think there are failures all around.

LVG can't really blame Woodward, imo, though I do blame woodward for a number of issues.

Even if you accept Woodward promised players like Ronaldo, Bale or Fabregas to Moyes or LVG - the simple fact is the United squad is not terrible. It is fairly average, but neither Moyes nor LVG have gotten the best out of the squads they have had. The number of players you could say have played to their best under either manager is very small. Woodward isn't to blame for the poor level of performance of the squad that is there. Who is to say that if he had got the superstars he promised that either manager would have done any better with them?

While I do think the squad is a lot poorer than you could reasonably expect given the money spent, and I think Woodward has failed to secure primary targets a number of times, it isn't why we drew at home to West Ham, lost to Norwich and Southampton etc.

As for a director of football, its a tricky one to call. I have said earlier today that we need someone to run the football club side of the business - but their responsibilites would need to be well defined.

I think the club needs to improve in a number of areas, and having an experienced football person involved in some of them would be a big asset - given the club are being criticised for having an archaic approach to youth football, scouting and transfers - with one agent saying unless you have a direct line to Woodward, you don't know who to talk to at United about prospects or potential transfers.

Not having any full time scouts seems an amazing issue to me - and only having one person nominally in charge of scouting seems odd too. A Football Exec could be in charge of administration and organization of key full time scouts and compilation of reports and video to be discussed with the manager as appropriate.

Not having a head of the academy for near a year now is another massive indictment of United imo. How can a club whose identity is built on a tradition of youth have no one overseeing the academy and driving recruitment? A football Exec should be working with a head of youth football in the recruitment and scouting of youth players domestically and foreign. Head of Youh in charge of training and player development, Football Exec in charge of bringing youth prospects to the club - the youth vision of the club needs to be long term; so I don't see this as an area the First Team manager should be overly involved in. The first team manager should be evaluating youth products at the club with a view to first team exposure or promotion; but the recruiting of these players isn't a requirement of the manager, imo.

A Football Exec, with experience in the transfer market could also be in charge of negotiating transfers into the club for the first team. ALL these transfers should be with the agreement of the First Team manager - the first team manager should not be handed new signings against their need or wishes, but they also shouldn't need to be involved in the financial discussions for the player signings.

Woodward does a fantastic job commerically and is well respected for that role - but there are question marks over his football actions. Given the rise of United as a commercial entity in the last few years, it can be easily argued that running the business of United and the footballing requirements of the football club are too much for one man, irrespective of his talents.

There is also the possibility that if Mourinho comes in, Mendes will effectively take charge of the transfers (incoming) for United.

Lord TSC

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Nor do United...

In fairness, we gave Moyes far more time than he deserved, and there will be people who arguing LVG has gotten more time too. To argue United don't give managers time and support is simply not true based on recent examples.

gosplan

Not going to quote the piece above by Mitch but I think he's right about the players.

A midfield of Schneiderlin and Schwein?

Attacking players like Depay, Mata, Martial, Rooney.

Jesus any manager able to inspire players a bit could go 4-5-1 with that and get much much better out of them.

It could be LVG and it could be just the biggest slump post Fergie but the players are fine, they're just not motivated.

Alex Meier

Woodward wants Van Gaal in the job.
Fergie wants Giggs.

Rossi IRL

Alex Meier wrote: »

Woodward wants Van Gaal in the job.
Fergie wants Giggs.

Its like your on speaking terms with Woodward and Fergie.

StringerBell

Alex Meier wrote: »

Woodward wants Van Gaal in the job.
Fergie wants Giggs.

I love to love, but my baby just loves to dance.

StringerBell

Rossi IRL wrote: »

Its like your on speaking terms with Woodward and Fergie.

Its his thing, wander in - make some statement as fact - have nothing to back it up - leave - rinse - repeat

LeeJM

Charlton wants Steve Bruce in the job.
Bruce wants William Prunier.

This is fun we should all just put random names together with wants in the middle

Alex Meier

Anyone think Van Gaal will survive if United are beaten tomorrow?

It's bad management at this stage... Woodward should either back or sack

Alex Meier

StringerBell wrote: »

Its his thing, wander in - make some statement as fact - have nothing to back it up - leave - rinse - repeat

The stuff you produce is nonsense and not backed up at all

You going tomorrow?

Santa bring you some tickets?

LeeJM

Alex Meier wrote: »

Anyone think Van Gaal will survive if United are beaten tomorrow?

It's bad management at this stage... Woodward should either back or sack

What about crack? He cant just do 2 of the 3, thats just weird

secman

Alex Meier wrote: »

Anyone think Van Gaal will survive if United are beaten tomorrow?

It's bad management at this stage... Woodward should either back or sack

Won't be Woodies call..... Glazers call the shots.... all about the value of the balance sheet.. will do what it takes to increase the value.... will always take action to stop a slide in value.

StringerBell

Alex Meier wrote: »

The stuff you produce is nonsense and not backed up at all

You going tomorrow?

Santa bring you some tickets?

Why thank you

That's none of your business.

Discodog

Alex Meier wrote: »

Woodward wants Van Gaal in the job.
Fergie wants Giggs.

I seem to recall reading that LvG was all lined up to take over from SAF when he announced his first retirement. But then SAF changed his mind.

Alex Meier

StringerBell wrote: »

Why thank you

That's none of your business.

When you reach your 15th birthday perhaps Mummy will bring you over to OT again....

Alex Meier

Discodog wrote: »

I seem to recall reading that LvG was all lined up to take over from SAF when he announced his first retirement. But then SAF changed his mind.

That's exactly what VG himself said.... We could have all gone through this 13 years ago...

LeeJM

Alex Meier wrote: »

When you reach your 15th birthday perhaps Mummy will bring you over to OT again....

Quick somebody get Stringer to the hospital cos he just got BURNED :pac: :pac:

Really though thats just pathetic. At least put some effort in if you are gonna insult him

StringerBell

Alex Meier wrote: »

When you reach your 15th birthday perhaps Mummy will bring you over to OT again....

0o0o0o how exciting!

I guess we'll just have to wait and see

Alex Meier

LeeJM wrote: »

Quick somebody get Stringer to the hospital cos he just got BURNED :pac: :pac:

Really though thats just pathetic. At least put some effort in if you are gonna insult him

I don't insult posters... When you do that you lose.... I'll leave the insulting and tremendously witty comments to stringer

LeeJM

Alex Meier wrote: »

I don't insult posters... When you do that you lose.... I'll leave the insulting and tremendously witty comments to stringer

You just accused him of being a child! Or is that another one of your statements that we must all take as fact? I dont care if you insult other posters, just dont do it half heartedly.

DeanAustin

Alex Meier wrote: »

I don't insult posters... When you do that you lose.... I'll leave the insulting and tremendously witty comments to stringer

You're comedy gold pal. You tried to insult him and came up with one of the worst insults I've seen in some time.

I hope you're a WUM...for everyone's sake.

Bleating Lamb

Will LVG start Rooney tomorrow?

Might throw a fiver on him as first scorer.

Flint Fredstone

Alex Meier wrote: »

I don't insult posters...

But.

Alex Meier wrote: »

When you reach your 15th birthday perhaps Mummy will bring you over to OT again....

Alex Meier

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Will LVG start Rooney tomorrow?

Might throw a fiver on him as first scorer.

Put your fiver on Chelsea to win the match especially given the fact that Rooney has scored just two goals in the league this season

Lord TSC

Alex Meier wrote: »

When you reach your 15th birthday perhaps Mummy will bring you over to OT again....

Thats your second yellow in quick succession, and if you keep up this behavior in the thread, then a ban is in your future.

Meanwhile, lads, how often do I have to say "Report, don't engage"? Get back on topic, and if you think a user is trolling or causing trouble, report them and move on. Don't drag the entire thread off topic.

keeponhurling

Discodog wrote: »

I seem to recall reading that LvG was all lined up to take over from SAF when he announced his first retirement. But then SAF changed his mind.

Wasn't that Sven Eriksson who was lined up - or am I mistaken ?

StringerBell

LeeJM wrote: »

You just accused him of being a child! Or is that another one of your statements that we must all take as fact? I dont care if you insult other posters, just dont do it half heartedly.

Agreed, there are certain standards that must be maintained imo

Edit: Speaking of standards, has Smalling taken a couple of steps back the last few weeks or has the midfield left the defence too exposed at times?

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Mars Bar wrote: »

I got the ladies fit jersey from my sister. Definitely doesn't have as good a shape as the L.A. Galaxy jersey I have but it's alright.

Can I bring this back up. It's been the highlight of the thread so far this Christmas.

DM_7

ericzeking wrote: »

I can't believe that some people are saying the squad needs even more work for any new manager. We've done a clear out, spent a lot and have some very good players.

Our problems are tactical and psychological.

I would expect any potential new manager worth his salt to be able to fashion these players into a side capable of beating Norwich at home.

The first 11 was fine for the season ahead when the window ended. The squad was short though. Young and Blind at full back when Jones is just back from injury, lack of creative or goal threat wide players/forwards to change things late in games show the issues with the squad.

Another defender and an attacker at the very least are needed regardless of the manager. That can be short term signings or longer term plans like signing Martial in late August.

LeeJM

Does anybody else think Gary Pallister is/was severely under rated by alot of people?

StringerBell

keeponhurling wrote: »

Wasn't that Sven Eriksson who was lined up - or am I mistaken ?

2000-2001 whenever it was LVG was definitely in the mix to take over, I remember reading even recently it was all agreed etc but then Fergie changed his mind so it wasn't to be.

StringerBell

LeeJM wrote: »

Does anybody else think Gary Pallister is/was severely under rated by alot of people?

Like who? Bruce certainly was, but Pallister got his (deserved) plaudits didn't he?