Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note Post #2331

how.gareth

Lads no way has pep agreed to anything with anyone yet, city are within easy reach of winning the league and should be favourites, they have also won their champions league group and should progress in it. They would be ridiculed if they sacked their manager after that. I think we have a real chance of getting pep in the summer if he thinks he has full control of football matters and a sizeable budget, we do need to get top 4 though and that's the biggest worry.

Canadel

bangkok wrote: »

who?!

Marko

Hococop

bangkok wrote: »

who?!

I'm guessing zlatan or aronautovic for stoke

Canadel

how.gareth wrote: »

Lads no way has pep agreed to anything with anyone yet, city are within easy reach of winning the league and should be favourites, they have also won their champions league group and should progress in it. They would be ridiculed if they sacked their manager after that. I think we have a real chance of getting pep in the summer if he thinks he has full control of football matters and a sizeable budget, we do need to get top 4 though and that's the biggest worry.

Sensible post. City are clear favourites for the title and have been for weeks now. Hopefully you're correct about the second part.

Brendan Flowers

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Would I be right in saying this has never happened in PL history?

Shocking. Yet our CE still sees nothing wrong.

Does he? Has he come out and said he's happy with the situation at the moment?

bangkok

Canadel wrote: »

Marko

marko ARNAUTOVIC from stoke?

Nalz

beno619 wrote: »

Thought CBJ did well today.

I think were stuck with Van Gael, so ill just be crossing my fingers he's seen the light with regards to Ander and Morgan.

Cbj?

0gac3yjefb5sv7

On the most positive note we are still only 5 points off City who everyone says will win the league!

bangkok

Nalz wrote: »

Cbj?

borthwick jackson

Flint Fredstone

Nalz wrote: »

Cbj?

Borthwick Jackson

bangkok

Pheonix10 wrote: »

On the most positive note we are still only 5 points off City who everyone says will win the league!

everyone? loads say arsenal will, they are also the bookies favourites

Discodog

xtal191 wrote: »

He prob wont be sacked until 4th is mathematically impossible

You could be right. Maybe it alters the terms of his payoff etc.

So the difference with LvG between now & Stoke are that the players are really trying for him. He is a World class manager but he takes 18 months to know his best team & get them to really try ?

The joke about the SAF pep talk might be close to the truth :pac:

The next few games will tell but if we continue to play free flowing football then either the players were ignoring LvG for 18 months or LvG has finally realised that he has been wrong for 18 months. Either doesn't paint him in a good light.

Discodog

bangkok wrote: »

everyone? loads say arsenal will, they are also the bookies favourites

Funnily enough every Arsenal fan I know is convinced that they won't win. My neighbour has close, lifetime associations with the club & he is convinced that it will all go "tits up"

jayo26

Discodog wrote: »

Funnily enough every Arsenal fan I know is convinced that they won't win. My neighbour has close, lifetime associations with the club & he is convinced that it will all go "tits up"

Thats because it usually does.

If lvg stays they have to back him with money again and we need new players in January to give the team a lift and seen as we have Thursday night football too the squad is very bare.

user2011

I'm well on the side of we are in a serious fight for 4th this title talk for me is lol. I know this season is crazy but how anyone see's us hanging in, to fight for the title is more crazy. The longer things go on the more I think the teams with more on the performance side will pull away we've yet to string performances together and even after today's 25min performance doesn't change a whole lot after months of poor stuff.

Was watching this on a premier league pass stream on kodi, beglin mentioned about the fitness the players seem to be lacking, kinda agree with him its been along time since I remember a 90min performance out of us.

beno619

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Wilson looks every bit the boy against men when he has played. Fellaini offers you something, it's an easy choice for me anyway. I say leave him where he is and let him get the experience.

So have countless forwards under LVG. Put him in a team that plays decent football and I'm sure he'd look more useful.

bangkok

Discodog wrote: »

Funnily enough every Arsenal fan I know is convinced that they won't win. My neighbour has close, lifetime associations with the club & he is convinced that it will all go "tits up"

they will never have a better chance to win in this year, Utd, Liverpool and Chelsea not in the race, only have city and maybe spurs, i think leicester will drop off.

dixiefly

I have said it here before and received the usual knockbacks but Mark Hughes deserves serious consideration for the position of next United manager. Absolutely fantastic performance as Stoke manager and he is a United legend.

After Carlo Ancelotti I am finding it difficult to identify a really good alternative. Mourinho just has so much baggage and Pep seems on the way to City, though personally I would take Hughes ahead of Pep considering the squad rebuilding nited have to undergo.

Headshot

dixiefly wrote: »

I have said it here before and received the usual knockbacks but Mark Hughes deserves serious consideration for the position of next United manager. Absolutely fantastic performance as Stoke manager and he is a United legend.

After Carlo Ancelotti I am finding it difficult to identify a really good alternative. Mourinho just has so much baggage and Pep seems on the way to City, though personally I would take Hughes ahead of Pep considering the squad rebuilding nited have to undergo.

There's a good reason for that

dixiefly

eagle eye wrote: »

I think they should go after Mark Hughes. The man is a United legend who has went off and done his own thing and been successful at it.

The fact he hasn't won anything shouldn't detract from what he has done. He has been managing through an era where there were a couple of clubs way richer than the rest and his only shot at that was with Manchester City where imo he didn't get enough time.

I'd imagine the fans would get behind him and his football is much more attractive than what you've been seeing up to now. Mourinho's teams don't exactly play entertaining football either and I think he would be the wrong choice after Van Gaal.

Long term United fan here (my first game in Olt T was Martin Buchan's first game) and I have come around to agree with this. Always a risk in any appointment but I would give Sparky the job ahead of pretty well anyone except Carlo Ancelotti.

The guy is well experienced, at the perfect age, has his team playing good football and shows desire and commitment that we never see fr the likes of LVG. Not too unlike the stage that SAF was when he took over at United. To me Giggs has too little experience while Mourinho just has way too much baggage. Hi spell at City did do him damage but I feel that his overall experience makes him eminently suitable for the job.

dixiefly

Headshot wrote: »

There's a good reason for that

And who is your better alternative?

TheDoc

Lord TSC wrote: »

Meh. To me, if people are paying the money required, showing dedication to go to the games, then they deserve to voice their displeasure any way they want. LVG has shown little to demand blind loyalty over the last few weeks, and after 8 games without a win, fans are entitled to voice those worries.

Is wearing a scarf any different to me saying, here and now, that I want Jose in over LVG?

If LVG wants unyielding support from fans, he needs to earn it back.

I think it's shocking to be honest. It's perfectly fine with fans voicing opinions in various mediums. But attending the games, you do so as a supporter.

Fans should be supporting the manager and team hoping fortunes turn around. Especially in the ground, during a big game.

bantee

Mark Hughes please no

TheDoc

bantee wrote: »

Mark Hughes please no

Such a weird name to be throwing around. Talk about inflated reputation from beating ourselves (with our own well catalogued problems) Stoke were extremely underwhelming and dare I say short of questions being asked to portions of their start of the season.

Pretty much anywhere he has been I'd rank him as a streaky manager at best, that very much seems to do well from his reputation as a player and stint at Blackburn, enjoying the premier league merry go round of managers, not to dissimilar to Steve Bruce at a time.

I see nothing to indicate Hughes is anything more then a middle of the ranks PL manager.

bantee

TheDoc wrote: »

Such a weird name to be throwing around. Talk about inflated reputation from beating ourselves (with our own well catalogued problems) Stoke were extremely underwhelming and dare I say short of questions being asked to portions of their start of the season.

Pretty much anywhere he has been I'd rank him as a streaky manager at best, that very much seems to do well from his reputation as a player and stint at Blackburn, enjoying the premier league merry go round of managers, not to dissimilar to Steve Bruce at a time.

I see nothing to indicate Hughes is anything more then a middle of the ranks PL manager.

Great United player, I love him for the goals/trophies etc, but as a manager he's had a checkered past. I think he comes across as one of the most dull or boring speakers with the media, not United managerial material IMO.

homerjay2005

Brendan Flowers wrote: »

Does he? Has he come out and said he's happy with the situation at the moment?

That is the accepted view yes.the fact that almost every man in world football has said LVG should have been sacked weeks ago yet he is still there prooves those views are correct.

TheDoc

homerjay2005 wrote: »

That is the accepted view yes.the fact that almost every man in world football has said LVG should have been sacked weeks ago yet he is still there prooves those views are correct.

If Van Gaal is sacked, it's probably Woodward writing his own P45.

Not surprised in the slightest that he would support him until it was career suicide to continue to do so(ie if we hit another loss of top 4)

homerjay2005

TheDoc wrote: »

If Van Gaal is sacked, it's probably Woodward writing his own P45.

Not surprised in the slightest that he would support him until it was career suicide to continue to do so(ie if we hit another loss of top 4)

Like hanging on to Moyes for financial reasons despite him being out of his depth for 6 months????

Nalz

Interesting fact about Sparky

He played two games in one day
For Munich and Wales

sky88

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Like hanging on to Moyes for financial reasons despite him being out of his depth for 6 months????

Is there any truth to that I've never heard that??

Vic Vinegar

Nalz wrote: »

Interesting fact about Sparky

He played two games in one day
For Munich and Wales

That is hardcore!

Cantona's Collars

We last scored a first half goal at home in September against Wolfsburg,that is fucking depressing.

Rayne Wooney

3 years without a trophy in May if Van Gaal stays at the helm

It really baffles me seeing names like Allegri De Boer and even Giggs being mentioned ahead of Mourinho, do people want the club to fall into obscurity?

Give these guys time to implement their philosophy, buy players and then 2 years down the line it isn't working out and we're 5 or 6 years trophy-less.

Sand

TheDoc wrote: »

If Van Gaal is sacked, it's probably Woodward writing his own P45.

Hardly - Woodward doesn't set the tactics or pick the players or run the coaching sessions. His performance is judged by the Glazers on how he runs the club business and revenue. And he has been dominant in that arena. Which is the only interest the Glazers have in the club. And that's not even a bad thing assuming they leave the football business to the football people at the club. Which, by and large, they have.

Sand

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

3 years without a trophy in May if Van Gaal stays at the helm

It really baffles me seeing names like Allegri De Boer and even Giggs being mentioned ahead of Mourinho, do people want the club to fall into obscurity?

Give these guys time to implement their philosophy, buy players and then 2 years down the line it isn't working out and we're 5 or 6 years trophy-less.

The club have given LVG a 3 year contract to implement his philosophy, buy players. So now we hire Mourinho, throw the last 2 seasons out the window. Implement an entirely new philosophy. Sell all LVGs players and replace them with Mourinho players.

Guaranteed we are 5 or 6 years trophy-less, and then it will be about time for Mourinho to throw his customary strop. And then we have to get in another manager. Implement an entirely new philosophy, because people will be sick of boring football by that point and want the "United Way" back. Sell all Mourinho's players and replace them with some other guys picks. And so on.

Its right to say we wont see a 20 year reigning manager much anymore. So the managers need to be selected on the basis that they are successful *and* build on the work already done at the club. Rather than fight against it so there is a squad rebuild every 3-4 years and the club is in a constant state of flux. Personally, I see Guardiola as the perfect LVG replacement. They are in broad agreement on how to play football and LVGs work will offer a perfect platform for Pep to carry out his own. Pep is definitely available at the end of the season and the club should go all out to get him. If Guardiola is not available, then certainly the club should be looking at managers who think the same as either LVG or his preferred replacement. Mourinho is intensely hostile to possession based football as practised by LVG and Guardiola.

Mourinhos unique selling point is that he is incredibly successful, so its worth putting up with his nonsense. Its truer to say he was incredibly successful. Since Jan 1st, from 35 PL games he secured 54 points. In the same period, from 35 PL games, LVG secured 63 points. I don't see the upgrade that justifies spending another 2-3 years without success rebuilding the team to play Mourinhos brand of football.

Rayne Wooney

Sand wrote: »

The club have given LVG a 3 year contract to implement his philosophy, buy players. So now we hire Mourinho, throw the last 2 seasons out the window. Implement an entirely new philosophy. Sell all LVGs players and replace them with Mourinho players.

Guaranteed we are 5 or 6 years trophy-less, and then it will be about time for Mourinho to throw his customary strop. And then we have to get in another manager. Implement an entirely new philosophy, because people will be sick of boring football by that point and want the "United Way" back. Sell all Mourinho's players and replace them with some other guys picks. And so on.

Its right to say we wont see a 20 year reigning manager much anymore. So the managers need to be selected on the basis that they are successful *and* build on the work already done at the club. Rather than fight against it so there is a squad rebuild every 3-4 years and the club is in a constant state of flux. Personally, I see Guardiola as the perfect LVG replacement. They are in broad agreement on how to play football and LVGs work will offer a perfect platform for Pep to carry out his own. Pep is definitely available at the end of the season and the club should go all out to get him. If Guardiola is not available, then certainly the club should be looking at managers who think the same as either LVG or his preferred replacement. Mourinho is intensely hostile to possession based football as practised by LVG and Guardiola.

Mourinhos unique selling point is that he is incredibly successful, so its worth putting up with his nonsense. Its truer to say he was incredibly successful. Since Jan 1st, from 35 PL games he secured 54 points. In the same period, from 35 PL games, LVG secured 63 points. I don't see the upgrade that justifies spending another 2-3 years without success rebuilding the team to play Mourinhos brand of football.

So saying all of that who are the viable options should Guardiola pick City instead?

Sand

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

So saying all of that who are the viable options should Guardiola pick City instead?

Past Guardiola, I honestly don't know who is available, has the desired profile and who will pick up the work done. My patience on the LVG front is very much down to not seeing any ready made replacements currently available. But I wouldn't rush to make definitely the wrong appointment.

The thinking on Mourinho seems to go along the line of "1. Appoint Mourinho. 2. Something something 3. Win trophies". It seems obvious, right? I don't see grounds for certainty on the trophy front if Mourinho is the coach next season. In that scenario, Guardiola definitely is at City next August. City are already a very good side and with Guardiola in place will be on track to start building a dynasty the same way Ferguson did in the 90s. Meanwhile, United are in their 3rd rebuild in 4 seasons under a manager who is usually bettered by Guardiola, to the point where Mourinho obsesses about Guardiola. Guardiola doesn't obsess about him.

J. Marston

homerjay2005

sky88 wrote: »

Is there any truth to that I've never heard that??

Moyes was only sacked when it was mathematically impossible to qualify for CL , meaning the club didn't have to pay out his contract as he didn't hit minimum targets.

His pay off was about £5m, the rest of his contract was worth about £25m.the club "saved" about £20m but actually ended losing about £40m on revenue due to not sacking him when they should have done. They making the same mistake now again , there isn't a man in world football who believes LVG shouldn't be sacked apart from our board members.

homerjay2005

Are those Mark Ogdan quotes going arouund, legit?

Not seen it anywhere apart from Twitter so I assuming somebody has made them up, as usually the case is.

secman

LVG only on borrowed time until next bad run of games... like if/when we are out of cup and struggling to get back in top 4.... doesn't really make sense to persist with him to end of January and jeopardise top 4. If we are out of CL next season... more difficult to attract new players yet alone a new manager.That decision will definitely come from Glaziers and not Woody.

Mitch Connor

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Are those Mark Ogdan quotes going arouund, legit?

Not seen it anywhere apart from Twitter so I assuming somebody has made them up, as usually the case is.

I would assume you are talking about the quotes attributed to Ogden; he was on Sirus (i think) radio yesterday and that is where the quotes are from.

This is the fella that runs the radio show, and the source of the quotes (the only ones that will be real, I suppose).

https://twitter.com/Malachians

adox

Dark times at Utd. Lack of clear and forward decisive thinking looks like it will cost the club dearly again.

Mitch Connor

adox wrote: »

Dark times at Utd. Lack of clear and forward decisive thinking looks like it will cost the club dearly again.

and not just this season - the club is falling further behind structurally and the damage being done now is going to take longer and longer to fix; and it looks like the club has no intention to fix the issues, or it doesn't recognise the problems to begin with.

homerjay2005

It looks like (based off that Ogden interview) that there is a huge split behind the scenes.

I'd imagine a scenario where Woodward is hated by a lot of people inside the club and its getting worse and worse.

IamtheWalrus

It's now obvious that Manchester United was really Fergie and Gill.

Hello classless mediocrity.

Brendan Flowers

homerjay2005 wrote: »

That is the accepted view yes.the fact that almost every man in world football has said LVG should have been sacked weeks ago yet he is still there prooves those views are correct.

So no, he hasn't said or done anything to indicate that he see nothing wrong with the current situation...

Do you think the Board were happy with the state the club were in back in December 1989? Do you think they saw nothing wrong? Would you have been demanding they had taken action back then?

Or is it possible that the the running of a billion pound company is not as black and white as you seem to think?

beno619

The quotes from Ogden are interesting.

I think the majority of United fans were happy with the appointment 18 months ago.

Sacking LVG doesn't reflect poorly on Woodward as he was a good appointment that subsequently hasn't worked out, but letting him stay in the job for the wrong reasons is quite damning.

glued

Ogden isn't really a reliable source. I suspect he's getting his information from the same person that is constantly running to the press every time he sees an opportunity for himself.

Lord TSC

TheDoc wrote: »

I think it's shocking to be honest. It's perfectly fine with fans voicing opinions in various mediums. But attending the games, you do so as a supporter.

Fans should be supporting the manager and team hoping fortunes turn around. Especially in the ground, during a big game.

I guess I just don't agree with that. Fans should support the manager, but at the end of the day, that support shouldn't be blind. I'm not saying that after one or two (or five or six...) bad games, fans should abandon the manager, but when a manager or a team goes on a run of 8 games without a win, without goals and without even shots on target, you should expect fans to give out. And those fans have every right to do so publicly.

For all we sit here and rant and rave about football, its up to the match going fans to actually express those concerns on a public level. Sure, you can argue that it might be cringe-worthy, but blind faith in a struggling manager will do nothing but allow those problems to continue. The guy holding the LVG Out sign last night shines more light on the problems than 100 of us here moaning about recent form.

As a supporter, I support the team. I'll support the manager of the team up to a point, I'll support the players on the team up to a point. But when a point is reached where it's obvious that the manager is not up to scratch, or the players are past underpreforming and on a whole new level, then it's the support of the club that would lead me to accept fans booing or wearing scarves or whatever else they have to do to make their concerns public. Without such acts, the board can pretend that all the criticisms are just keyboard warriors who don't matter. If people continue to go to games (giving them money) and applaud politely, never voicing negative criticisms, then why ever change anything? "Sure, we're in 6th and falling, but look, the fans seem grand with that, so let's stick with it".

Fans who, for example, have those scarfs are holding them as supporters of the club, supporters who want what they think is best for the club. It's up to LVG and the players to shut them up at that stage, and they are failing spectacularly at that. Had we beaten Stoke, or Norwich, or Bournemouth, maybe not been bundled out of cups, hell, maybe even managed a goal or two, then the flags, signs and scarves wouldn't be out.

But attacking fans for voicing their discontent publicly seems to be missing the mark spectacularly with regards where issues lie right now.