Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note Post #2331

TheTownie

Martial's transfer document has leaked. Full document is here

Fee structure was;

€20M upfront
€30M 1st July 2016

Bonuses:
€10M after 25 goals first team goals in competitive matches.
€10M after 25 French caps (at least 45mins in each cap)
€10M if he is nominated for the Ballon d'or.

jayo26

Pro. F wrote: »

No, he simply did not miss a significant number of good chances. All that happened is that the team created so few chances that the few he missed stood out in peoples' memories more.

People also tried blaming Martial for a while. Although this took the form of "he's only he a kid, you can't expect him to be a good enough finisher yet." And this was inspite of the fact that Martial has been pretty damn lethal with the paltry chances he has been given.



They were the same as they normally are. Which is to say, his touch is fine and his movement is excellent. But when you completely isolate a striker (especially a striker who is not a big lump) in a static attack, you can expect him to lose the ball a lot.

Yesterday's game, compared to the games that came just before it, should be very instructive on what the problem in our attack is. Rooney barely got a kick all game and only got one chance in the box. Everybody agreed he was in form, but we saw what happens when the attack is dysfunctional and the in-form striker is completely isolated. ...Oh but he scored his one chance - you will say. Just see how long that lasts, if LVG decides to stick with the defensive style again. There is no striker in the world who will score consistently from so few chances.



You are talking about a handful of shots here. Drawing conclusions based on such a tiny sample (finishing rates are subject to massive variance, even for the very best strikers) is misguided.

I can't argue they have created less but easiest way for me to say it is on average this season in league and champs league rooney has averaged 2.5 shots per game in and scored 7 and 1.5 of them shots are from inside the box.

Martial a young kid has 1.5 shots per game and outscored him while playing on the wing alot of the time and in the same team.

Rooneys hit rate was always alot higher then that over the years when he was on form.

Last couple weeks of weeks he looks alot better against Newcastle he had only 3 shots and scored 2.

The_Kew_Tour

homerjay2005 wrote: »

this is the away end yesterday when we scored. the definition of bedlem

Loved to have been there.

Spent about 8-10 minutes just looking at people reactions, of which they're all sorts.

Great photo.

Headshot

TheTownie wrote: »

Martial's transfer document has leaked. Full document is here

Fee structure was;

€20M upfront
€30M 1st July 2016

Bonuses:
€10M after 25 goals first team goals in competitive matches.
€10M after 25 French caps (at least 45mins in each cap)
€10M if he is nominated for the Ballon d'or.

Its a given at this stage

Pro. F

jayo26 wrote: »

I can't argue they have created less but easiest way for me to say it is on average this season in league and champs league rooney has averaged 2.5 shots per game in and scored 7 and 1.5 of them shots are from inside the box.

Martial a young kid has 1.5 shots per game and outscored him while playing on the wing alot of the time and in the same team.

Rooneys hit rate was always alot higher then that over the years when he was on form.

Last couple weeks of weeks he looks alot better against Newcastle he had only 3 shots and scored 2.

You're not getting it, finishing rates have massive variance. They do not tell you anything meaningful when you look at such small sample sizes, ie less than a couple of seasons worth of data.

But if you insist on looking at the finishing rates from the season so far, then let's do a bit of comparing, with some of the world's best. Since we don't have the tools to properly adjust for chance quality (expected goals would be best for this but I can only find that information for teams, not individuals), lets just make do and limit this to non-penalty goals scored inside the area per shot taken inside the area. All numbers calculated from squawka's comparison matrix.

15/16 League non-penalty goals inside area per shot inside area:

Suarez 0.288
Rooney 0.173
Messi 0.170
Aguero 0.136
Ronaldo 0.122

Or, if you'd prefer to keep it simple, all league non-penalty goals per shot (both inside and outside the box):

Suarez 0.239
Aguero 0.182
Messi 0.113
Rooney 0.109
Ronaldo 0.092

tinofapples

Pereira almost scored a peach for U21's, controlled ball on the edge of the box , dinked it over the oncoming defender and lashed a volley which the Saints keeper tipped over.

It would fantastic if he can push on and get into contention for first 11.

CantGetNoSleep

TheTownie wrote: »

Martial's transfer document has leaked. Full document is here

Fee structure was;

€20M upfront
€30M 1st July 2016

Bonuses:
€10M after 25 goals first team goals in competitive matches.
€10M after 25 French caps (at least 45mins in each cap)
€10M if he is nominated for the Ballon d'or.

The first two are almost a given. If he makes these, 70m EUR is a lot. If he makes the third, he will have been a bargain at 80m

VW 1

CantGetNoSleep wrote:

The first two are almost a given. If he makes these, 70m EUR is a lot. If he makes the third, he will have been a bargain at 80m

25 caps at at least 45 mins is a lot over the course of a contract considering there is only 10 or so international games a year. It presumes he plays most games he is fit for, when he has the likes of Benzema and Griezmann up front for competition.

sigmundv

TheTownie wrote:

Fee structure was;

TheTownie wrote:

€20M upfront €30M 1st July 2016

TheTownie wrote:

Bonuses: €10M after 25 goals first team goals in competitive matches. €10M after 25 French caps (at least 45mins in each cap) €10M if he is nominated for the Ballon d'or.

Hah, I used to make deals like this on Football Manager.

Headshot

I was getting withdrawal symptoms

Flint Fredstone

Borked.ie

Maximus Alexander

I bet it was Fellaini's fault.

jayo26

Pro. F wrote: »

You're not getting it, finishing rates have massive variance. They do not tell you anything meaningful when you look at such small sample sizes, ie less than a couple of seasons worth of data.

But if you insist on looking at the finishing rates from the season so far, then let's do a bit of comparing, with some of the world's best. Since we don't have the tools to properly adjust for chance quality (expected goals would be best for this but I can only find that information for teams, not individuals), lets just make do and limit this to non-penalty goals scored inside the area per shot taken inside the area. All numbers calculated from squawka's comparison matrix.

15/16 League non-penalty goals inside area per shot inside area:

Suarez 0.288
Rooney 0.173
Messi 0.170
Aguero 0.136
Ronaldo 0.122

Or, if you'd prefer to keep it simple, all league non-penalty goals per shot (both inside and outside the box):

Suarez 0.239
Aguero 0.182
Messi 0.113
Rooney 0.109
Ronaldo 0.092

I dont like all your numbers mate ill just stick to my opinion that he has improved his form over past few weeks ha

Pro. F

Pro. F wrote: »

15/16 League non-penalty goals inside area per shot inside area:

Suarez 0.288
Rooney 0.173
Messi 0.170
Aguero 0.136
Ronaldo 0.122

Or, if you'd prefer to keep it simple, all league non-penalty goals per shot (both inside and outside the box):

Suarez 0.239
Aguero 0.182
Messi 0.113
Rooney 0.109
Ronaldo 0.092

Could you do comparisons to top stirkers in the league he is playing in aswell, I know Ageuro is there just think it'd be a better reflection.

I've no idea if he will look better or worse just asking

RobertKK

We are being linked with Cavani again.

hufpc8w3adnk65

Liverpool fans meltdown after Sunday crashed boards.



Where's the cartman gif?

Liam McPoyle

RobertKK wrote: »

We are being linked with Cavani again.

I read somewhere yesterday (Sindo I think) that Madrid want to sell us Kroos for £40m to finance a deal for Cavani before their embargo takes effect.

I would like that.

PhlegmyMoses

Kroos would struggle in our team as it is now.

Liam McPoyle

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Kroos would struggle in our team as it is now.

I said I would like that.

Don't harsh my buzz man.

:mad:

jayo26

We're back


LVG OUT

FutureGuy

Yay!

Maximus Alexander

#WellDoneFellaini :mad:

bangkok

I bet Liverpool fans attacked the site to stop us celebrating during the week

Trigger

Wahey.. unbeaten in 2016!!!

Withdrawls the last 2 days

RobertKK

Brendan Rodgers has said United can win the Premier League.

RobertKK

VW 1 wrote: »

25 caps at at least 45 mins is a lot over the course of a contract considering there is only 10 or so international games a year. It presumes he plays most games he is fit for, when he has the likes of Benzema and Griezmann up front for competition.

He is a regular for the French team.

Look forward to watching him play in the Euro's, apart from our own team, there are so many teams I look forward to watching.

Maximus Alexander

RobertKK wrote: »

Brendan Rodgers has said United can win the Premier League.

He's obviously trying to butter up the board so they'll take a look at his CV in the summer.

Headshot

its been a horrible horrible 2 days

Giggsy11

TheTownie wrote: »

Martial's transfer document has leaked. Full document is here

Fee structure was;

€20M upfront
€30M 1st July 2016

Bonuses:
€10M after 25 goals first team goals in competitive matches.
€10M after 25 French caps (at least 45mins in each cap)
€10M if he is nominated for the Ballon d'or.

Hard to believe that pdf.

Who calls CEO with their short name. Ed Woodward instead of Edward Woodward. Also there is not a single logo of either clubs, I mean it's not even clubs letter head or some revenue/stamp paper. Transaction of that huge money is done on a plain white paper? Really hard to believe that.

RobertKK

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Hard to believe that pdf.

Who calls CEO with their short name. Ed Woodward instead of Edward Woodward. Also there is not a single logo of either clubs, I mean it's not even clubs letter head or some revenue/stamp paper. Transaction of that huge money is done on a plain white paper? Really hard to believe that.

It was said at the time of the transfer that Monac did not want to sell, and United kept adding add ons till Monaco caved in.

There is also if United sold the player for above €80 million, that Monaco would get 50% of the difference above that.

Do Monaco use official paper when selling their players, is the bank account IBAN legitimate?
There are things there that can be clarified.

Headshot

Headshot wrote: »

its been a horrible horrible 2 days

Why, because you had to actually do some work :P

RobertKK

Well we know bangkok is not a girl.

https://twitter.com/ChevroletFC/status/689784432316846080

For those who can't see it is a woman celebrating and in the background on TV is Fellaini.

Adamcp898

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Hard to believe that pdf.

Who calls CEO with their short name. Ed Woodward instead of Edward Woodward. Also there is not a single logo of either clubs, I mean it's not even clubs letter head or some revenue/stamp paper. Transaction of that huge money is done on a plain white paper? Really hard to believe that.

Not sure if this has been covered or not given the state of the site atm.

But fwiw, this transfer agreement came from a site called football leaks which has loads of contracts, transfer agreements etc. uploaded. They're mainly from deals involving Portugeese clubs or players but have some others.

Directly related to this, they have Rojo's deal from Sporting Lisbon as well and Ed's signature is the same on it as it is on the Martial one.

https://footballleaks2015.wordpress.com/

Whatsisname

My daily ritual of finishing work, cooking the dinner and then reading boards has been rightly fúcked up these last two days. Dunno what to be doing with myself.

adox

I read a book. #oldskool

Liam O

I've finally made my way into the matrix

ankles

Van Gaal to go in the summer. Fair compromise?

Headshot

God I had to go outside. It's weird out there

homerjay2005

Headshot wrote: »

its been a horrible horrible 2 days

i dunno about you buddy, but ive had a permanent smile on my face for the last 3 days. ive watched the rooney goal about 200 times on loop off sky sports and when i got bored, i watched the various fan footage of the goals. i then watch the Rooney goal on Sky again, rinse and repeat.

its been a rough few months, but the last few days have been brilliant and i am hopeful that this is the turning point of our season. i cant wait for the trip over saturday morning, first time ive been looking forward to a game in a long long time.

#LVGredandwhitearmy

adox wrote: »

I read a book. #oldskool

i booked my flights for the remaining TV games, in the coming weeks. booked Arsenal game today for €45......have a spare ticket if anybody wants it!

sReq | uTeK

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i dunno about you buddy, but ive had a permanent smile on my face for the last 3 days. ive watched the rooney goal about 200 times on loop off sky sports and when i got bored, i watched the various fan footage of the goals. i then watch the Rooney goal on Sky again, rinse and repeat.

its been a rough few months, but the last few days have been brilliant and i am hopeful that this is the turning point of our season. i cant wait for the trip over saturday morning, first time ive been looking forward to a game in a long long time.

#LVGredandwhitearmy




i booked my flights for the remaining TV games, in the coming weeks. booked Arsenal game today for €45......have a spare ticket if anybody wants it!

****

TheDoc

Imagine this was the summer transfer window. Be absolutely freaked

eamondunphy

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i dunno about you buddy, but ive had a permanent smile on my face for the last 3 days. ive watched the rooney goal about 200 times on loop off sky sports and when i got bored, i watched the various fan footage of the goals. i then watch the Rooney goal on Sky again, rinse and repeat.

its been a rough few months, but the last few days have been brilliant and i am hopeful that this is the turning point of our season. i cant wait for the trip over saturday morning, first time ive been looking forward to a game in a long long time.

#LVGredandwhitearmy




i booked my flights for the remaining TV games, in the coming weeks. booked Arsenal game today for €45......have a spare ticket if anybody wants it!

What flights did you book for 45??

The_Kew_Tour

It's Euros all way for me. No time for this club stuff

Lord TSC

So the biggest story during the outage seems to be Cavani. Lots of links with some sources saying we approached him and others saying his agents have approached us.

Thoughts? Is he what we need?

The_Kew_Tour

Not his biggest fan, but he is a player who divides opinion

Lord TSC

Lord TSC wrote: »

So the biggest story during the outage seems to be Cavani. Lots of links with some sources saying we approached him and others saying his agents have approached us.

Thoughts? Is he what we need?

He's a target man though. Strong, good finisher but doesn't have much pace.

I'm not so sure he's what we need.

homerjay2005

M!Ck^ wrote: »

He's a target man though. Strong, good finisher but doesn't have much pace.

I'm not so sure he's what we need.

we well do need another striker as we only have 2, but if Rooney is back on form and continues as he has been doing over the last 3 weeks then we dont need a big name striker - its just a back up like Hernandez type player.

priorities right are a center half and a winger, we are desperately crying out for both.

KH25

For the money Cavani would likely cost id prefer to get in a winger and a CB.

Trigger

Lord TSC wrote: »

So the biggest story during the outage seems to be Cavani. Lots of links with some sources saying we approached him and others saying his agents have approached us.

Thoughts? Is he what we need?

Great player on his day but he is 30 now so would only be a short term signing.. for that type of money we should be looking at Lukaku who could stay around for years...

Maximus Alexander

Some good news for United fans for a change. I was just having a look at the stats for the last 15 minutes in the PL. United are the form team, joint top with City. Liverpool are in the relegation zone and I can't see them getting out in their next 15 minutes.

Team|GF|GA|GD|PTS
Man City| 1| 0| 1| 3
Man Utd| 1| 0| 1| 3
Tottenham |1| 0| 1| 3
Chelsea| 1| 1| 0| 1
Everton| 1| 1| 0| 1
Arsenal| 0| 0| 0| 1
Aston Villa| 0| 0| 0| 1
Bournmouth| 0| 0| 0| 1
Leicester| 0| 0| 0| 1|
Newcastle| 0| 0| 0| 1
Norwich| 0| 0| 0| 1|
Southampton| 0| 0| 0| 1
Stoke| 0| 0| 0| 1
Swansea| 0| 0| 0| 1
Watford| 0| 0| 0| 1
West Brom| 0| 0| 0| 1
West Ham| 0| 0| 0| 1
Crystal Palace| 0| 1| -1| 0
Liverpool| 0| 1| -1| 0
Sunderland| 0| 1| -1| 0


I think a corner has been turned.