Star Wars Episode VIII - The Last Jedi *spoilers from Post 2857*

Sad Professor

Wibbs wrote: »

That I am clinging to a childhood version of them?

No, sorry Wibbs, misuse of bolded text. I meant that I disagreed that Luke going into exile etc is badly written.

Slydice

One Billion Dollars!
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=starwars8.htm

Domestic: $517,144,228 (49.7%)
+ Foreign: $523,300,000 (50.3%)
= Worldwide: $1,040,444,228

Earthhorse

david75 wrote: »

Ehhhh that’s exactly what happened

No, not really. She doesn't learn from him inadvertently by copying his routine. She spends the majority of her time on the island face-timing Kylo Ren and sort of annoys Luke into teaching her. That's only superficially the same as the scenario I described.

Sad Professor wrote: »

Nearly all of what I wrote happened on screen in the previous movies and is consistent with Luke’s character in TLJ. But yeah other stuff happened off screen. It’s 30 years later and the movie can't be expected to explain all of that, just enough of it that is relevant to this story. A story which is not primarily about Luke but about Rey, Kylo etc.

Personally I loved Luke throwing his lightsaber over his shoulder. It's funny and knocks the audience off-balance, immediately establishing that things are not going to play out the way you expect. However, I appreciate how disconcerting this moment and everything that followed might be for some fans. Many fans were upset by the implication in TFA that Han was a bad father. It's tough but these characters cannot be expected to stay true to everyone's childhood ideal of them.

On the one hand you're saying fans are having difficulty letting go of their childhood ideal of these characters, on the other that Luke's behaviour is entirely consistent with his OT self; which is it?

That aside, his character in the OT has doubts but he isn't a cynic. They're not the same thing. And by the end of the OT his character has changed; which is of course one of the pleasures of watching a character you love, seeing them change and evolve. It's extremely clunky and entirely unsatisfying when this happens off screen though, and it is very much a change, but if Rian was convinced this needed to happen he could have approached it more deftly; the whole movie is an exercise in exposition though.

The throw of the light saber got a chuckle out of me but that's not he point. Anyone can write a cheap gag. If you're gonna make a good movie you've gotta make all the elements work though and earn the odd cheap gag and unfortunately TLJ falls far short of that.

david75 wrote: »

Have to go out.
Thanks for a deadly load of thoughts and ideas and revelations you all gave and sorry for being always sh!t bombing this thread. Star Wars is the world to me. Hope you all have a great night and new year. Good luck and may the force be with you.

Happy New Year, man! Hope it's a good one for you.

namloc1980

The Poe / Hux phonecall silliness at the beginning of the movie as well as the ludicrous WW2 bombing run (which was just beyond ridiculous) set the tone for me. Silly storytelling that made little to no sense. And the less said about the ironing scene the better.

py2006

Andrew Beef wrote: »

I saw it again today and it’s gone up in my estimation.

Luke is excellent, Kylo Ren is excellent, and there are some fantastic scenes.

8/10 for me.

Yea I thought it was better on second viewing. May do a third.

david75

JJ said he’s using 9 to bring it all to a conclusion and tying in all three trilogies.
One of the elements of that could well be that Rey is the chosen one who was to bring balance to the force. This could address a lot of concerns about her.
I’d be reluctant to go near the poorly written awful idea of that prophesy again but if it was well written into 9 it could be good.

The Nal

david75 wrote: »

One of the elements of that could well be that Rey is the chosen one who was to bring balance to the force.

Anakin was the chosen one who brought balance to the force.

Tony EH

That chosen one nonsense needs to be dropped.

Nettle Soup

Slydice wrote: »

One Billion Dollars!
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=starwars8.htm

A victory for marketing and paying off critics over actual content.
I doubt any Star Wars fan was not going to go no matter how rubbish they heard it was.

david75

The Nal wrote: »

Anakin was the chosen one who brought balance to the force.

For his time. The thinking is Rey is the chosen one for this time. The whole idea of the prophesy and balance is ropey at best. I’d rather they stayed away from it but it is a possibility too.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

For his time. The thinking is Rey is the chosen one for this time. The whole idea of the prophesy and balance is ropey at best. I’d rather they stayed away from it but it is a possibility too.

I think Snoke's words on the dark rising with the light to meet it pretty much scuppers the whole 'chosen one' prophecy. You don't need someone to balance the force if light and dark rise together, and consequently, sink together. You can't have one without the other.

Rey and Kylo to die together in Episode IX - that would leave the force balanced as there would be no known Jedi or Sith to tip the scales, until the next force sensitive people emerge and form some sort of a religion. That's my prediction for 2019.

Theboinkmaster

Sad Professor wrote: »

Personally I loved Luke throwing his lightsaber over his shoulder. It's funny and knocks the audience off-balance, immediately establishing that things are not going to play out the way you expect.

I didn't find it funny at all - that moment for me is like the poe/hux conversation at the beginning, the rey "put some clothes on" line to kylo....

Not funny at all, upset the entire tone of the film and completely misjudged IMO.

I think in years to come this film is going to be viewed very poorly - it just doesn't work on any level whatsoever.

Theboinkmaster

Interesting to see the IMDB ratings drop, now sitting at 7.6 and likely to fall further IMO.

For context:

Force Awakens 8.0
Rogue One 7.8

A new hope 8.7
Empire Strikes back 8.8
Return of the Jedi 8.4

The Nal

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

Interesting to see the IMDB ratings drop, now sitting at 7.6 and likely to fall further IMO.

Yeah people are morons, nothing new there. I remember all the Nolan Batman fans voting down The Godfather to get one of the Batman movies to the highest rated movie ever.

Theboinkmaster

The Nal wrote: »

Yeah people are morons, nothing new there. I remember all the Nolan Batman fans voting down The Godfather to get one of the Batman movies to the highest rated movie ever.

To be fair I find the ratings a decent enough indicator as a very general rule.

Hyzepher

Falthyron wrote: »

I think Snoke's words on the dark rising with the light to meet it pretty much scuppers the whole 'chosen one' prophecy. You don't need someone to balance the force if light and dark rise together, and consequently, sink together. You can't have one without the other.

Rey and Kylo to die together in Episode IX - that would leave the force balanced as there would be no known Jedi or Sith to tip the scales, until the next force sensitive people emerge and form some sort of a religion. That's my prediction for 2019.

My take on the whole "balance" issue laid with the conversation Luke and Rey had. He went on about the arrogance of the Jedi and their "ownership" of the force. He asks Rey to reach out to the force but is horrified when she takes an interest in the dark side.

I think this shows that there is no point on being "light" or being "dark". The balance should lie within everyone. Learn to use the light and dark side together. Be a balanced Jedi - with the ability to control both sides. No one can bring balance to the Force without having the balance of light and dark within.

Rey has shown that she understands the need to understand the dark side as well as the light side.

Falthyron

Hyzepher wrote: »

My take on the whole "balance" issue laid with the conversation Luke and Rey had. He went on about the arrogance of the Jedi and their "ownership" of the force. He asks Rey to reach out to the force but is horrified when she takes an interest in the dark side.

I think this shows that there is no point on being "light" or being "dark". The balance should lie within everyone. Learn to use the light and dark side together. Be a balanced Jedi - with the ability to control both sides. No one can bring balance to the Force without having the balance of light and dark within.

Rey has shown that she understands the need to understand the dark side as well as the light side.

That would have made for a far more interesting film, tbh. Luke should have embraced both sides of the force and that could have been the shock factor for the audience. I'm not sure Rey has understood the need to familiarise herself with both sides yet though. Luke's primary lesson to Rey should have followed Sun Tzu: 'If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles.'

The Nal

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

To be fair I find the ratings a decent enough indicator as a very general rule.

I do too yeah but people tend to jump on bandwagons on occasion.

Sand

I'm taking it from the reviews and comments that this film is not worth paying to go see? I didn't particularly enjoy TFA (Rogue One was okay). After seeing TFA I joked that MaRey Sue was going to take Luke on as her apprentice, and apparently that is what occurs, plus other assorted eye-gouging plot points. If that is the case, I'll just wait till it appears on Netflix or somesuch.

Goodshape

Hyzepher wrote: »

My take on the whole "balance" issue laid with the conversation Luke and Rey had. He went on about the arrogance of the Jedi and their "ownership" of the force. He asks Rey to reach out to the force but is horrified when she takes an interest in the dark side..

...

I like that, and it sounds plausible as a direction they might be headed toward in the next film.

A_Sober_Paddy

The Nal wrote: »

Anakin was the chosen one who brought balance to the force.

Yoda said that the phophsey may have been misinterpreted, to mace windu

shamrock55

Seen it for the 2nd time today and actually think it's worse,very boring movie with a nothing story line, I had a job staying awake actually,it's up there with the worst of them for me

pixelburp

Sand wrote: »

I'm taking it from the reviews and comments that this film is not worth paying to go see? I didn't particularly enjoy TFA (Rogue One was okay). After seeing TFA I joked that MaRey Sue was going to take Luke on as her apprentice, and apparently that is what occurs, plus other assorted eye-gouging plot points. If that is the case, I'll just wait till it appears on Netflix or somesuch.

Sounds like you've already made up your mind, but while it's a divisive film yes, if you're tempted, then why not just go see it and do so with an open mind. At worst your 2nd hand reviews are confirmed, at best it surpasses your expectations

A_Sober_Paddy

david75 wrote: »

For his time. The thinking is Rey is the chosen one for this time. The whole idea of the prophesy and balance is ropey at best. I’d rather they stayed away from it but it is a possibility too.

A religion's have prophecy's of sorts, with end of days, return of prophets etc...Why not the coming of a Jedi who brings balance. Which would suggest someone who understands the light and dark side, and those bring a balanced approach to the use of the force

Andrew Beef

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

Yoda said that the phophsey may have been misinterpreted, to mace windu

Didn’t Yoda mean that perhaps Anakin was not the Chosen One?

He was though; the prophecy was that the Chosen One would destroy the Sith and restore balance to the Force. Anakin was conceived by the midichlorians (Shmi had a virgin birth), had the highest ever midichlorian count, and destroyed the Sith by turning back to the light and killing Palpatine.

Anakin was the Chosen One.

SteM

Why do people that hate it keep gong back to see it!? Disney won't care about rotten tomatoes or imdb scores. They'll care about the box office, if this movie continues to do well you'll get more like it in the future. If you don't like it, don't go back and they might give you something closer to what you want in the future.

nix

SteM wrote: »

Why do people that hate it keep gong back to see it!? Disney won't care about rotten tomatoes or imdb scores. They'll care about the box office, if this movie continues to do well you'll get more like it in the future. If you don't like it, don't go back and they might give you something closer to what you want in the future.

Well i seen it twice, because i was initially booked in for the liemax with a load of friends weeks in advance on the Saturday week of release. My brother however twisted my arm to go see it with him on the release day, similar thing happened with TFA but i didnt mind as great movie IMO, needless to say i wasnt looking forward to TLJ on the saturday, but enjoyed it more on the second viewing after the shock of the plot holes and Leia flying.

I might even go again! Im currently just at the tail end of rewatching all the star wars movies in sequence, Prequels > Rogue one > OT > TFA (currently only have TFA left to watch) So might head in again to TLJ, dont worry im not contributing to box office with my cineworld membership

turbbo

The Nal wrote: »

Yeah people are morons, nothing new there. I remember all the Nolan Batman fans voting down The Godfather to get one of the Batman movies to the highest rated movie ever.

The imdb rating is like the stock market it may go up and down.

watched it last night - thought it was very good better than the force awakens because I'm not a major fan of anything that george lucas ever did and that felt like a rehash of all his crap - he would have made a great accountant.

SteM

nix wrote: »

Well i seen it twice, because i was initially booked in for the liemax with a load of friends weeks in advance on the Saturday week of release. My brother however twisted my arm to go see it with him on the release day, similar thing happened with TFA but i didnt mind as great movie IMO, needless to say i wasnt looking forward to TLJ on the saturday, but enjoyed it more on the second viewing after the shock of the plot holes and Leia flying.

I might even go again! Im currently just at the tail end of rewatching all the star wars movies in sequence, Prequels > Rogue one > OT > TFA (currently only have TFA left to watch) So might head in again to TLJ, dont worry im not contributing to box office with my cineworld membership

Even so, some of your cineword membership fee goes towards the movies you view I'd guess.

nix

SteM wrote: »

Even so, some of your cineword membership fee goes towards the movies you view I'd guess.

They don't, at least not to the point where it would be much, plus i think were passed the point of boycotting the movie

We love the universe, majority of people here will continue to go see star wars movies, would take a long line of stinkers for people to give up watching them