Star Wars Episode VIII - The Last Jedi *spoilers from Post 2857*

david75

Also raises the question why shields have never been a thing at the forefront in Star Wars before either for the Rebels or the empire. Even rogue one has the hammerheads running up and pushing the Star destroyers into destruction. First scene of ROTS is ships blowing the sh!t out of each other bow to bow as well.

Star Wars

Sometimes you just have to ignore stuff.

Varik

There's multiple type of shields, most you see just stop energy weapons.

Like the aforementioned ramming, and rolling thermal detonators under the shield of destroyer droids or the hundreds of times something either flies or walks though a shield.

Ray/particle shields stop matter.

Keyzer

david75 wrote: »

You do know what SJW stands for right? And in real world terms it’s used as a pejorative by Trumptards and alt right loons who throw it at anyone who disagrees with them?

Educate me

Tony EH

david75 wrote: »

They already have the tech to stop it happening. Interdictor class Star destroyers. Can stop ships going to hyperspace and can pull ships out of hyperspace l.
They just have to make sure each deployment of First order ships now has to include an interdictor in each deployment. They look a bit mental.

This begs the question as to why such a thing wasn't on the state of the art Supremacy then? It's even kitted out with the top of the line hyperspace tracker system.

We can't get away from this.

Every excuse is met by another question, met by another excuse, met by...

The simple fact is Johnson created a nice scene and didn't stop to think about it. But, other people will.

Apparently the Star Wars RPG community is a conniption about it. :pac:

Tony EH

Saruhashi wrote: »

I think the RLM guys really don't like fandom in general. That could be the good fans or the bad fans.

The "gloss" they are talking about is the Disney PR spin on everything.

They are basically saying that the originals, and the prequels to a lesser extent, feel more authentic but the new stuff feels like it's expertly marketed but not very genuine.

I thought they made some good points here.

I think they dislike the "everything's kewl man" attitude of some areas of fandom. This onerous hyper-excitement that some people engage in, especially in America.

I tend to agree with their assments of a lot of films, tbh. I had the opposite opinion to them on 'Rogue One' and their review of 'The Force Awakens' and disagree with them on 'Man of Steel' and 'Batman vs Superman'. But, by and large, I find they're on the money.

They're roughly my age and were burnt by the prequels, so are approaching "Dis Wars" with caution. Their observations on the ridiculous levels that fandom can descend to coincide with my own. Although, my observations are limited to interwebzone reading. In real life, most of the conversations I have with people about Star Wars aren't as obsessive/crazy as the stuff I see online.

Keyzer

Sums it up really although I dont agree with his harsh language directed towards females.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNoMQSvNAWE

buried

I watched that full review from the RLM guys. Another great point they made was the problem with the limits to the Universe of the Star Wars as a entity in itself. The original trilogy was just a collection of entertaining enjoyable fantasy action movies, much like the Back to The Future trilogy. You can't really expand on what was just 3 good enjoyable works concerning basically the story of a few hero types or a single family. You can't make a "Goldie Wilson" standalone movie or even a "Biff Tannen" standalone thing, there is just no point, the characters won't work as a single entity without the rest of the story/heros/protagonists to effect it. The only way the magick of those movies Universe even exists is the couple of legendary characters that exist within the story- Luke, Han, Vader/Marty McFly, Doc Brown, Biff. Take them out you have nothing, just put them in for the sake of trying to expand it - you just have a huge awful mess.
I thought that was a very good point.

david75

Tony EH wrote: »

This begs the question as to why such a thing wasn't on the state of the art Supremacy then? It's even kitted out with the top of the line hyperspace tracker system.

We can't get away from this.

Every excuse is met by another question, met by another excuse, met by...

The simple fact is Johnson created a nice scene and didn't stop to think about it. But, other people will.

Apparently the Star Wars RPG community is a conniption about it. :pac:

Tony. In canon They’ve had this tech since Pre ANH so why don’t the empire have one of this ships at every single encounter with the Rebels throughout the OT? It was used in an episode of Rebels earlier this season. (Which is set just pre ANH). It would put a stop to them in no time.

This isn’t a TLJ problem sorry to tell you. It’s a Star Wars inconsistency

tigger123

Keyzer wrote: »

Sums it up really although I dont agree with his harsh language directed towards females.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNoMQSvNAWE

That guy has a serious chip on his shoulder.

Keyzer

tigger123 wrote: »

That guy has a serious chip on his shoulder.

Perhaps but he makes perfectly valid points.

Regardless of my feelings on the SJW/Feminist agenda rammed down the audiences throat at every opportunity, this is just a really bad film with a dreadful story.

Rian Johnson should hang his head in shame for not only directing this garbage but also writing it.

david75

Keyzer wrote: »

Perhaps but he makes perfectly valid points.

Regardless of my feelings on the SJW/Feminist agenda rammed down the audiences throat at every opportunity, this is just a really bad film with a dreadful story.

Rian Johnson should hang his head in shame for not only directing this garbage but also writing it.

If your own personal sense of masculinity is so obviously fragile and threatened by women in a space fantasy film, or in any film, you have more problems than you claim this film has.

Watch Hidden Figures. You’ll need a therapist after it.

tigger123

Keyzer wrote: »

Perhaps but he makes perfectly valid points.

Regardless of my feelings on the SJW/Feminist agenda rammed down the audiences throat at every opportunity, this is just a really bad film with a dreadful story.

Rian Johnson should hang his head in shame for not only directing this garbage but also writing it.

It's hard to take any of what he says seriously when he has such an obvious issue with women tbh. He repeatedly refers to Rose a "fat asian b*tch" within the first few minutes of the video.

johnny_ultimate

I’ll never cease to be amused at how dramatically YouTube ideologues have managed to lower the general standard of discussion.

david75

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I’ll never cease to be amused at how dramatically YouTube ideologues have managed to lower the general standard of discussion.

And it all comes directly back to those very RLM lads. Every angry little goon with a computer and no experience whatsoever in film appreciation or criticism (or real life, as above clip shows) suddenly thinks they’re godsent to enlighten us all.

uncleoswald

david75 wrote: »

And it all comes directly back to those very RLM lads. Every angry little goon with a computer and no experience whatsoever in film appreciation or criticism (or real life, as above clip shows) suddenly thinks they’re godsent to enlighten us all.

And everyone with a keyboard too.

david75

uncleoswald wrote: »

And everyone with a keyboard too.

It makes a blaster sound every time I hit a key. I never miss either

Chris_Heilong

Fixes some of the mistakes.

david75

I’ve never known YouTube to help ‘fix’ anything.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

david75 wrote: »

I’ve never known YouTube to help ‘fix’ anything.

You're so salty. Why do you even keep visiting this thread.

david75

Hunky Monster wrote: »

You're so salty. Why do you even keep visiting this thread.

Salty. You’re so with it.
You’re right though. Between Waiting on millenials to catch up with Star Wars and actually understand it even a little bit and right wing women hating morons it’s like an unpaid dayjob. You’re right. Quitting would be better. Endless fvckin whining Grown men complaining constantly does gets tiring. But here to help.

Wedwood

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

Fixes some of the mistakes.

Actually, that video proves Rian Johnson made the right choices and created a proper movie with unexpected ideas rather than a live action fanboy comic.

On the Force projection piece - it was 'old Jedi mind trick'. Much happier with that rather than the fan boy 'Super Luke'. Plus 62 year old Obi Wan in ANH - ' I'm getting too old for this sort of thing' and ' your powers are weak old man'. Fast forward to TLJ, 62 year old Luke, consistent with the first movie.

Keyzer

david75 wrote: »

Salty. You’re so with it.
You’re right though. Between Waiting on millenials to catch up with Star Wars and actually understand it even a little bit and right wing women hating morons it’s like an unpaid dayjob. You’re right. Quitting would be better. Endless fvckin whining Grown men complaining constantly does gets tiring. But here to help.

Aimed at me and countless others no doubt. Regardless, these movies (the originals) are very important to a lot of people. I'm not a massive Star Wars fan but I like the movies and my son is obsessed with it. But it pisses me off when they fúck them up so badly.

But listen, I'm just a woman hating moron with a fragile sense of masculinity. So, disregard everything I say and perhaps listen to this woman give her opinion on how sh1t the last jedi was and her issues with the movie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jY010oKl7c

Saruhashi

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I’ll never cease to be amused at how dramatically YouTube ideologues have managed to lower the general standard of discussion.

Honestly, I feel like you have almost no sense of self-awareness here at all.

How is a "Youtuber" any different than any of the posters giving their opinions on movies here?

If I posted my comments on the film and someone like david75 was attacking my character rather than my points about the movie then surely you'd need to put your mod hat on and say "address the points, don't attack the poster".

I'd expect the same too. I am not against someone giving me a reminder if I am going into personal swipes at people instead of addressing the points.

Here we are though. Somebody posts a Youtube video that makes points about the movie (good or bad points, it doesn't matter) and your entire contribution to that is to try and discredit the idea of people on Youtube criticizing movies.

What's the difference between a Youtuber with an opinion on movies and johnny_ultimate with an opinion on movies?

What's the difference between a Youtuber with an opinion on movies, that is obviously influenced by personal political beliefs, and johnny_ultimate with an opinion on movies, that is obviously influenced by personal political beliefs?

johnny_ultimate

Saruhashi wrote: »

How is a "Youtuber" any different than any of the posters giving their opinions on movies here?

Because thankfully almost all of the posters here are reasonable enough to not use horrifically misogynist language like the YouTube ideologue in question (and he is not alone). I know some people freak out when the ‘m’ word is used, but rather appropriate here. I tend to think language such as ‘fat Asian *****’ rather lowers the general standard of discussion, no?

I never attack posters here. When it’s some chap on YouTube being a raging bigot, fair game, and they deserve nothing more than being instantly dismissed. And if someone who agreed with me on other points used that sort of language, I’d ignore them too

Saruhashi

david75 wrote: »

And it all comes directly back to those very RLM lads. Every angry little goon with a computer and no experience whatsoever in film appreciation or criticism (or real life, as above clip shows) suddenly thinks they’re godsent to enlighten us all.

Yet the RLM lads do a good job with criticism and discussion of movies and the state of the industry. They have opinions worth listening to.

I had a quick look at their Last Jedi review there and they have 1.7 Million views and 52 thousand likes (3 thousand dislikes). Based on likes and dislikes they have a 93% approval rating on the video.

What makes you think that you or me, guys passing the time by posting stuff on an obscure Irish message board, have some kind of superiority over folks sitting down and recording their views and posting them on youtube?

I don't get it. How is the criticism invalidated because it's posted on Youtube?

I checked the video that was shared and the guy has almost 890k views on his 40 minute Star Wars rant. 47k likes, 13k dislikes, so about 78% "fresh" rating.

He might be wrong about some things but I think you'd be better off attacking his points rather than his character.

Instead I'm supposed to just accept that these folks are just angry little goons because you said so?

The truth is that these folks have hundred of thousands of people watching their opinions on the movie and the likes to dislikes ration implies that people largely either agree with or enjoy listening to those opinions.

I don't see how what they are doing is any different from what you or I are doing. Just we are doing it on a much much smaller scale.

I looked at the Dishonored Wolf guys channel and his list of videos and apart from maybe 5 videos out of his 92 posted I don't see anything that makes me think he is right-wing or woman hating?

He just looks like a guy sharing his opinion on movies and video games with his 50k subscribers.

He's got Justice League as the worst movie of 2017 with 125K views on that video.

He's got a video about understanding depression where he makes "an attempt to help break the stigma surrounding depression, self harm, and suicide" and gives the numbers to many organisations people can call if they need help. I know at least you think that's a good thing.

A few videos against Feminism for sure so maybe you are onto something there.

I just feel like yourself and johnny_ultimate have adopted this tactic multiple times on the thread now. "Hurrr durr Youtubers are sooooo dumb, you guys".

Why not just let people watch the videos and make up their own minds instead of trying to "poison the well" against people with movie opinions on Youtube?

Out of curiosity, what qualifies you as someone with experience of film appreciation or criticism?

Saruhashi

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Because thankfully almost all of the posters here are reasonable enough to not use horrifically misogynist language like the YouTube ideologue in question (and he is not alone). I know some people freak out when the ‘m’ word is used, but rather appropriate here. I tend to think language such as ‘fat Asian *****’ rather lowers the general standard of discussion, no?

I never attack posters here. When it’s some chap on YouTube being a raging bigot, fair game, and they deserve nothing more than being instantly dismissed. And if someone who agreed with me on other points used that sort of language, I’d ignore them too

It lowers the tone of the discussion sure but I don't feel like it invalidates any of the points being made.

Sure, the same points could be made with more polite language but that's it really.

You didn't ignore them so I don't know where the "I'd ignore them too" bit is coming from. It's not the first time your contribution to the discussion has boiled down to "Youtubers aren't worth your time lads".

So you aren't "ignoring" them. You are devoting your full attention to discrediting them.

Oh noes, did they use horrifically misogynistic language? That's just awful. Terrible, in fact. I am completely outraged by this. :pac:

johnny_ultimate

Saruhashi wrote: »

Oh noes, did they use horrifically misogynistic language? That's just awful. Terrible, in fact. I am completely outraged by this. :pac:

I’m not outraged. Thankfully I’ve developed thicker skin than to be ‘outraged’ at every random angry chap on the Internet

JohnFalstaff

Saruhashi wrote: »

It lowers the tone of the discussion sure but I don't feel like it invalidates any of the points being made.

Sure, the same points could be made with more polite language but that's it really.

You didn't ignore them so I don't know where the "I'd ignore them too" bit is coming from. It's not the first time your contribution to the discussion has boiled down to "Youtubers aren't worth your time lads".

So you aren't "ignoring" them. You are devoting your full attention to discrediting them.

Oh noes, did they use horrifically misogynistic language? That's just awful. Terrible, in fact. I am completely outraged by this. :pac:

If you are prepared to refer to another person, whether an actor onscreen or someone in real life, as a 'fat asian bitch' you immediately posit yourself, and your views, as inherently problematic. Using this sort of vocabulary shows the mindset at work here and undermines any attempt at valid criticism.

That is why these reviews can be so readily dismissed. If you can't see that, you have the same problem.

Saruhashi

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I’m not outraged. Thankfully I’ve developed thicker skin than to be ‘outraged’ at every random angry chap on the Internet

Just saying, I think a lot of these youtubers make valid points and I also think some of them can be a bit entertaining. Admittedly they are absolutely unprofessional and inappropriate at times. I can hardly imagine Mark Kermode coming out with gender based slurs and borderline right-wing opinions etc.

Honestly, sometimes I can listen to people get REALLY mad about a film because it's just entertaining.

I'm totally against just dismissing them outright and I don't think they are too much different from us giving our opinions.

I think that people like Red Letter Media do offer pretty good movie related content, for example.

Saruhashi

JohnFalstaff wrote: »

If you are prepared to refer to another person, whether an actor onscreen or someone in real life, as a 'fat asian bitch' you immediately posit yourself, and your views, as inherently problematic. Using this sort of vocabulary shows the mindset at work here and undermines any attempt at valid criticism.

That is why these reviews can be so readily dismissed. If you can't see that, you have the same problem.

Yet, people are not readily dismissing them. So clearly many, many, people have that problem.

Sure, language like that is probably "inherently problematic" but for many the response to that is "so what, I want to hear the angry guy rant about the movie".

If there are enough good points thrown in there, or if it's entertaining enough, then people don't seem to mind.

I feel more that you are promoting some kind of "ethical" consumption of film/media criticism. So if the reviewer used some naughty words then that's a no no. I disagree, just like the tens of thousands who liked that guys video. He can say what he likes and I won't dismiss just because he has a crappy attitude.