Star Wars Episode VIII - The Last Jedi *spoilers from Post 2857*

Inviere

I'd say Luke feels that "balance", means no Jedi, and no Sith...just pure force use. He's probably reluctant to increase Jedi numbers because as long as there's been Jedi, there's been temptation, and thus Sith. Also, he probably feels responsible for Kylo wiping out all of the pupils that were being trained too, and won't want a repeat of that. Ultimately, as mentioned above, Rey will convince him that there must be Jedi, if true balance is to be achieved...as long as people are force sensitive, there'll be those who use it for good, and those who use it for bad, and everything in between.

py2006

pjohnson wrote: »

I found it super enjoyable. I guess part of that could be the sheer uniqueness of a movie fitting into a universe without having 3-4 tie in/sequels in the work. Such a great breath of fresh air. I did like most characters aswell (Baze, Cassian were meh's)

I agree but i found its release very odd. Huge tidal wave and anticipation surrounding the new trilogy. It just seems odd to throw it in when they did. Worked out well for them though.

Jan_de_Bakker

By the way, the title in Spanish is Los Ultimos Jedi so it's plural.

Don't try and pick who in particular is the Last Jedi as it could mean 2 or a group

Sad Professor

Jan_de_Bakker wrote: »

By the way, the title in Spanish is Los Ultimos Jedi so it's plural.

Don't try and pick who in particular is the Last Jedi as it could mean 2 or a group

According to Johnson it's singular. He was surprised there was any question about it given that Luke is referred to as "the last Jedi" in the TFA opening scroll.

J Mysterio

Sad Professor wrote: »

According to Johnson it's singular. He was surprised there was any question about it given that Luke is referred to as "the last Jedi" in the TFA opening scroll.

The linguists (translators) who localized this text will be very unhappy not to have received this contextual info from Mr. Johnson.

Tony EH

J Mysterio wrote: »

I can't believe how well received Rogue One was (and continues to be). I found it so flat, the characters so insipid.

I must have seen a different film, because there was a million times more emotion and depth alone in Jyn's response to her father's holomessage than anything that appears in 'The Force Awakens'.

Cassian's few words of solemn comfort to her as they await their approaching death blasts any words that Rey, Finn, Poe or ANYONE else in Episode VII.

The goofball attmpt at "comedy" of Finn and the "wide eyed wonder" of Rey is not good character. It's distraction to mask bad character.

pixelburp

I think what Force Awakens had over Rogue One was that the cast had charisma in place of any strong characterisation. That was clear by the obvious chemistry between Rey & Finn, whereas there wasn't that much going on with them otherwise. Rogue One excised any flippancy or adventure from its story, so the cast (or at least the principal characters) only had their characterisations to call on, given their tortured paths didn't really leave a lot of room for charisma

david75

Was important to make Rey likeable and charistmatic. She's your focus and she has a journey.
The rogue one characters could have done with even a little of that. But probably written so flatly given their fates are predetermined.

david75

Also we should remember jj co wrote force awakens with kasdan. Who is also writing the Han film. And jj always deferred to kasdan in the writing too.

Tony EH

The writing for 'The Force Awakens' was awful.

david75

Inviere wrote: »

I'd say Luke feels that "balance", means no Jedi, and no Sith...just pure force use. He's probably reluctant to increase Jedi numbers because as long as there's been Jedi, there's been temptation, and thus Sith. Also, he probably feels responsible for Kylo wiping out all of the pupils that were being trained too, and won't want a repeat of that. Ultimately, as mentioned above, Rey will convince him that there must be Jedi, if true balance is to be achieved...as long as people are force sensitive, there'll be those who use it for good, and those who use it for bad, and everything in between.

You might find this interesting. George wrote it as the intro to the saga. Could be the journals are the books we see in the trailer.

First comes the day
Then comes the night.
After the darkness
Shines through the light.
The difference, they say,
Is only made right
By the resolving of gray
Through refined Jedi sight."

―Journal of the Whills, 7:477

valoren

If Obi-Wan can appear to Luke as a force ghost in ESB and ROTJ, could this not be used as a tool with the sequels also?
Is it possible for any force ghosts to make cameos in this film? I'd imagine there isn't much of a social scene on Skellig's for Luke. So would it be possible for him to communicate albeit in the form of voiceovers to confer and consult with his Father or Yoda a la Obi Wan to Qui Gon between episode 3 and 4? It seems to be the done thing with Jedi's gone into exile. There could be a recall of Vader's line from ESB where he tells Luke that it is his destiny to join the Dark Side and Luke trying as he might and having gone mad through isolation is actually gone to the dark side and that it is Rey who is the Last Jedi in reality as Luke no longer deems himself a Jedi.

Tony EH

The only one that would "work" would be Yoda.

Both Alec Guinness and Sebastian Shaw are dead, although that didn't stop the necromancy in 'Rogue One' and I suspect 'The Last Jedi'. Something will have to be done about Leia in that film.

Frankly, the "force ghost" stuff is generally a bad idea. It was only conjured up because Lucas had painted himself into a corner with the Skywalker familial issues.

valoren

Tony EH wrote: »

The only one that would "work" would be Yoda.

Both Alec Guinness and Sebastian Shaw are dead, although that didn't stop the necromancy in 'Rogue One' and I suspect 'The Last Jedi'. Something will have to be done about Leia in that film.

Frankly, the "force ghost" stuff is generally a bad idea. It was only conjured up because Lucas had painted himself into a corner with the Skywalker familial issues.

So is Peter Cushing

Tony EH

valoren wrote: »

So is Peter Cushing

Tony EH wrote: »

The only one that would "work" would be Yoda.

Both Alec Guinness and Sebastian Shaw are dead, although that didn't stop the necromancy in 'Rogue One' and I suspect 'The Last Jedi'. Something will have to be done about Leia in that film.

Frankly, the "force ghost" stuff is generally a bad idea. It was only conjured up because Lucas had painted himself into a corner with the Skywalker familial issues.

I know.

david75

valoren wrote: »

If Obi-Wan can appear to Luke as a force ghost in ESB and ROTJ, could this not be used as a tool with the sequels also?
Is it possible for any force ghosts to make cameos in this film? I'd imagine there isn't much of a social scene on Skellig's for Luke. So would it be possible for him to communicate albeit in the form of voiceovers to confer and consult with his Father or Yoda a la Obi Wan to Qui Gon between episode 3 and 4? It seems to be the done thing with Jedi's gone into exile. There could be a recall of Vader's line from ESB where he tells Luke that it is his destiny to join the Dark Side and Luke trying as he might and having gone mad through isolation is actually gone to the dark side and that it is Rey who is the Last Jedi in reality as Luke no longer deems himself a Jedi.

All but confirmed that Yoda is appearing in this yeah. That's a cool idea. She takes him back from the brink. I don't think he's dark side but rather just abandoned the Jedi teachings for this new way he's found.

In which case Yoda is definitely gonna have something to say to him


Once she's trained though will she go dark side?
The image on the poster has her lightsaber starting blue and bleeding into red.
It's an interesting idea if she does.

pjohnson

david75 wrote: »

All but confirmed that Yoda is appearing in this yeah. That's a cool idea. She takes him back from the brink. I don't think he's dark side but rather just abandoned the Jedi teachings for this new way he's found.

In which case Yoda is definitely gonna have something to say to him


Once she's trained though will she go dark side?
The image on the poster has her lightsaber starting blue and bleeding into red.
It's an interesting idea if she does.

So it'd be up to Finn/Poe/BB8 combined to beat Kylo/Rey combined on the "dark side"?

BB8 has this sh*t

Inviere

david75 wrote: »

Once she's trained though will she go dark side?
The image on the poster has her lightsaber starting blue and bleeding into red.
It's an interesting idea if she does.

Luke already lost Kylo to the dark side, so I doubt Rey will go that way too. Unless She does, and Kylo actually turns to the light side and they fight it out that way. Either way I'd say Rey will face a struggle in terms of light and dark, but imo will ultimately overcome it

El Duda

I'd like to see some mad switches of allegiance. It would be very ballsy to kill off Kylo Ren this early and replace him with an evil Luke or something like that.

david75

It's already ready set up to have a finale that's bittersweet with not a happy ending but a hard won victory and earned through losses(nothing to do with Carries passing but it probably will factor depending on how they deal with taking her out of the story).

There'll be loads of 'friends' that are double crossers -Laura Dern and BDTs characters, for example.

david75

Have they shown us the start of the film in that trailer?

so the saga films always start with the title, crawl and then a pan through space, right. I know there's a ship involved too. But IF they're going to keep that same opening... is it at all possible that the opening of the trailer is the opening of the movie?
Is it possible we'll see a pan down through space from the crawl, as usual, and then the stars fade to reveal the rock surface just like the opening of the trailer? Maybe he's force pushed her and then the 'who are you?' line we heard of.

Is that the beginning of the movie?

Sad Professor

david75 wrote: »

Have they shown us the start of the film in that trailer?

so the saga films always start with the title, crawl and then a pan through space, right. I know there's a ship involved too. But IF they're going to keep that same opening... is it at all possible that the opening of the trailer is the opening of the movie?
Is it possible we'll see a pan down through space from the crawl, as usual, and then the stars fade to reveal the rock surface just like the opening of the trailer? Maybe he's force pushed her and then the 'who are you?' line we heard of.

Is that the beginning of the movie?

I had this thought as well. It would be pretty cool actually, but I doubt it as we already saw them shooting the continuation of TFA's final scene in the announcement trailer. That shot probably is used as a match cut elsewhere in the film, though. I'd be thinking during another Force vision/flashback.

david75

Sad Professor wrote: »

I had this thought as well. It would be pretty cool actually, but I doubt it as we already saw them shooting the continuation of TFA's final scene in the announcement trailer. That shot probably is used as a match cut elsewhere in the film, though. I'd be thinking during another Force vision/flashback.

Yeah good point.
As if we're gonna get a single shot from the trailer in this film.

Thanks rogue one.

py2006

Unrelated but delightful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4IYLg8TgO8

Sad Professor

py2006 wrote: »

Unrelated but delightful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4IYLg8TgO8

Love it! See also:

david75

Naturally funny likeable charismatic people. Easy to see why they got cast.
Don't get the hate for them at all.

The Golden Miller

Speaking of force ghosts, why doesn't Anakin just appear to Kylo and tell him to cut the sh!t out? Seeing as Snoke and Kylo seem to think Anakin's redemption was a moment of weakness, surely Anakin could show up and clarify this one way or the other?

david75

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Speaking of force ghosts, why doesn't Anakin just appear to Kylo and tell him to cut the sh!t out? Seeing as Snoke and Kylo seem to think Anakin's redemption was a moment of weakness, surely Anakin could show up and clarify this one way or the other?

He might yet show up to him.
Other idea is that he has already.
When he's talking to the helmet he says 'show me again grandfather the power of the dark side' but it's snoke f*ckin with him. Is it literal or is snoke screwing with him showing him fake visions to control him?
Pretty sure Anakin has to turn up at some point. You'd imagine he'd have to have spoken to luke or will at some stage. Lot of explaining to do.

Gbear

david75 wrote: »

Naturally funny likeable charismatic people. Easy to see why they got cast.
Don't get the hate for them at all.

I think the issue is that they tried to leverage that an awful lot in the movie, but rather being complementary, it was pretty much everything that was happening.

The banter served to distract from the fact that you didn't really know what was going on and you didn't really care either.

david75

Rian Johnson. Congrats. Perfect response.

https://twitter.com/gregburke85/status/855483754491424768
https://twitter.com/rianjohnson/status/855525502290980865
https://twitter.com/rianjohnson/status/855582704280129536