Star Wars Episode VIII - The Last Jedi *spoilers from Post 2857*

david75

RIP

https://twitter.com/david75donovan/status/905192651372318723

Sad Professor

david75 wrote: »

Nah they won't push it back. It's only in development. Something like 70% of Han has been reshot and it's still on course for its release date and they aren't changing that. They've what, two years til 9? They've loads of time.

They'll push it back. Even before Trevorrow left they were unlikely to meet that release date. It was going to get pushed back to December 2019. But now it will be no earlier than summer 2020.

johnny_ultimate

Falthyron wrote: »

Since Abrahms all of the directors chosen have been new, up-and-coming, and (by extension) risky. Edwards needed help on Rogue One, the lads directing the Han Solo film have been replaced, and now Trevorrow is gone. I know Rian Johnson can also be considered up-and-coming, but perhaps he is the exception? Considering Kennedy went with Ron Howard to steer Han Solo to completion, I think she will play it safe with Episode IX's next director.

Zemeckis all the way :pac:

Also lost Josh Trank!

I also think it's important to note that most of the directors were risky in the sense of young and/or inexperienced as opposed to in any sense artistically risky directors (always baffled that Lord & Miller were considered to be as much by some). Johnson is the most artistically risky choice they've made by a long shot (albeit capable of working in mainstream genres), which is why it'll be so interesting to see how his film fares.

Falthyron

All things considered, the Disney generation of Star Wars has been a bit of a mess.

1. Ford's leg/ankle is broken on the set of The Force Awakens.
2. Re-writes to The Force Awaken's character development of Rey, and to Finn.
3. Box Office success, but much criticism for following A New Hope's template.
4. Rogue One problems and relatively extensive re-shoots.
5. Good critical impression, but less box office takings than TFA.
5. Lord and Millar removed from Han Solo film and replaced by Ron Howard with extensive re-shoots.
6. The death of Carrie Fisher (nobody's fault, of course, but definitely has impacted on the final cut of the film - possible re-shoots).
7. Episode IX to be re-written due to the death of Carrie Fisher.
8. Colin Trevorrow leaves Episode IX.

LucasFilm need some positive news right now. They should get the trailer out soon or announce the next anthology film. I do hope their reluctance to show images or a new trailer isn't because they are having trouble finalising what will and won't be in the final cut... :S

pixelburp

Good riddance to mediocririty, even by the standards of Hollywood blockbusters. Recently rewatched Jurassic World and without the nostalgia goggles on, it's such a flat, insipid film without the hint of flourish. Point and shoot, and let the FX guys work out the rest.

The replacement choice will be very interesting because just from a narrative point of view, presumably Episode IX will be when all the chickens come home to roost. Ideally you'll really want a director that can sell whatever threads and arcs that need sewing up; Point & Shoot Man simply won't cut it here.

Ipso

Falthyron wrote: »

All things considered, the Disney generation of Star Wars has been a bit of a mess.

1. Ford's leg/ankle is broken on the set of The Force Awakens.
2. Re-writes to The Force Awaken's character development of Rey, and to Finn.
3. Box Office success, but much criticism for following A New Hope's template.
4. Rogue One problems and relatively extensive re-shoots.
5. Good critical impression, but less box office takings than TFA.
5. Lord and Millar removed from Han Solo film and replaced by Ron Howard with extensive re-shoots.
6. The death of Carrie Fisher (nobody's fault, of course, but definitely has impacted on the final cut of the film - possible re-shoots).
7. Episode IX to be re-written due to the death of Carrie Fisher.
8. Colin Trevorrow leaves Episode IX.

LucasFilm need some positive news right now. They should get the trailer out soon or announce the next anthology film. I do hope their reluctance to show images or a new trailer isn't because they are having trouble finalising what will and won't be in the final cut... :S

They need two positives, one to balance out the negative and one just for a positive.
Regarding the reshoots on The Force Awakens, wouldn't this come down to script issues and not the director? Shirley they have an idea of how things will progress going by the script alone.
Also the two fellas leaving the Han Solo movie is a bit strange, either there was a massive two way misunderstanding about the tone of the film or they decided to do their own thing and it got found out at a very late point.
It seems to me that there are some decision making issue at a high level in Disney.

david75

Falthyron wrote: »

All things considered, the Disney generation of Star Wars has been a bit of a mess.

1. Ford's leg/ankle is broken on the set of The Force Awakens.
2. Re-writes to The Force Awaken's character development of Rey, and to Finn.
3. Box Office success, but much criticism for following A New Hope's template.
4. Rogue One problems and relatively extensive re-shoots.
5. Good critical impression, but less box office takings than TFA.
5. Lord and Millar removed from Han Solo film and replaced by Ron Howard with extensive re-shoots.
6. The death of Carrie Fisher (nobody's fault, of course, but definitely has impacted on the final cut of the film - possible re-shoots).
7. Episode IX to be re-written due to the death of Carrie Fisher.
8. Colin Trevorrow leaves Episode IX.

LucasFilm need some positive news right now. They should get the trailer out soon or announce the next anthology film. I do hope their reluctance to show images or a new trailer isn't because they are having trouble finalising what will and won't be in the final cut... :S

There were no reshoots whatsoever to deal with Carries death. There were no reshoots on the last Jedi at all. Her death did bring about a rewrite for 9. And I think we're seeing the fallout of that in Treverow leaving.

Falthyron

Ipso wrote: »

They need two positives, one to balance out the negative and one just for a positive.
Regarding the reshoots on The Force Awakens, wouldn't this come down to script issues and not the director? Shirley they have an idea of how things will progress going by the script alone.
Also the two fellas leaving the Han Solo movie is a bit strange, either there was a massive two way misunderstanding about the tone of the film or they decided to do their own thing and it got found out at a very late point.
It seems to me that there are some decision making issue at a high level in Disney.

Announce the Obi-Wan film: safe, money in the bank.
Announce Knights of the Old Republic film: risky, but fans will go crazy with excitement.

Inter-cut both announcements with the trailer for The Last Jedi.

No problem, Disney, I am available for work. Just give me a call.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

There were no reshoots whatsoever to deal with Carries death. There were no reshoots on the last Jedi at all. Her death did bring about a rewrite for 9. And I think we're seeing the fallout of that in Treverow leaving.

Eh, what? Kathleen Kennedy said that Carrie's film was to be Episode IX. They will need to change how her final scenes play out in TLJ to account for her absence in Episode IX. How can it not have affected TLJ?

david75

Falthyron wrote: »

Eh, what? Kathleen Kennedy said that Carrie's film was to be Episode IX. They will need to change how her final scenes play out in TLJ to account for her absence in Episode IX. How can it not have affected TLJ?

The last Jedi was finished and in the can done filmin before carries death. The above post said they had to reshoot TLJ to account for that. It didn't. They didn't reshoot anything.Rian and KK have both said as much. 9 was rewritten to factor her death in. Her real life death doesn't aftect the last Jedi at all. It does affect 9 yeah. I'd say the rewrite is where the fracture started and treverow is out.

Sad Professor

Falthyron wrote: »

Eh, what? Kathleen Kennedy said that Carrie's film was to be Episode IX. They will need to change how her final scenes play out in TLJ to account for her absence in Episode IX. How can it not have affected TLJ?

Opening crawl of episode 9: "General Leia has died. The galaxy is in mourning." Etc. etc. Problem solved.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

The last Jedi was finished and in the can done filmin before carries death. The above post said they had to reshoot TLJ to account for that. It didn't. They didn't reshoot anything.Rian and KK have both said as much. 9 was rewritten to factor her death in. Her real life death doesn't aftect the last Jedi at all. It does affect 9 yeah. I'd say the rewrite is where the fracture started and treverow is out.

They will kill her off in TLJ. They won't do some off-screen death in Episode IX. It wouldn't be respectful to Carrie or to the fans. Having her on screen in TLJ, present, contributing, and being a part of that film's story followed by a death will be a greater impact and a better tribute to her.

She will be seen getting on a transport near the end of the film having parted ways with Luke or Rey and then we will see the transport being attacked or something. For her to die off-screen two years later in another film where we won't have seen her at all would be very poor and in bad taste. She has to die in TLJ.

Sad Professor

Falthyron wrote: »

They will kill her off in TLJ. They won't do some off-screen death in Episode IX. It wouldn't be respectful to Carrie or to the fans. Having her on screen in TLJ, present, contributing, and being a part of that film's story followed by a death will be a greater impact and a better tribute to her.

She will be seen getting on a transport near the end of the film having parted ways with Luke or Rey and then we will see the transport being attacked or something. For her to die off-screen two years later in another film where we won't have seen her at all would be very poor and in bad taste. She has to die in TLJ.

She already apparently gets injured in the film so having her recover only to die at the end in some random, meaningless way may not work. It might also involve losing crucial parts of Fisher's final performance for the sake getting Leia's death out of the way in 8. It really depends on the story of 8 and whether there's an obvious place they could kill her without losing Fisher's performance, but the impression I got was that they wanted to keep her in the film as was originally intended a la Heath Ledger in TDK.

david75

Falthyron wrote: »

They will kill her off in TLJ. They won't do some off-screen death in Episode IX. It wouldn't be respectful to Carrie or to the fans. Having her on screen in TLJ, present, contributing, and being a part of that film's story followed by a death will be a greater impact and a better tribute to her.

She will be seen getting on a transport near the end of the film having parted ways with Luke or Rey and then we will see the transport being attacked or something. For her to die off-screen two years later in another film where we won't have seen her at all would be very poor and in bad taste. She has to die in TLJ.

If you say so.

Falthyron

Sad Professor wrote: »

She already apparently gets injured in the film so having her recover only to die at the end in some random, meaningless way may not work. It might also involve losing crucial parts of Fisher's final performance for the sake getting Leia's death out of the way in 8. It really depends on the story of 8 and whether there's an obvious place they could kill her without losing Fisher's performance, but the impression I got was that they wanted to keep her in the film as was originally intended a la Heath Ledger in TDK.

If it can work, that would be great, but there is something cheap about having her suddenly die before Episode IX and mentioning it in the scrawl. Perhaps she will die of her wounds off-screen? Some extra walks on set to interrupt Rey, Luke, the Resistance etc., to say that General Organa didn't make it?

david75

Falthyron wrote: »

If it can work, that would be great, but there is something cheap about having her suddenly die before Episode IX and mentioning it in the scrawl. Perhaps she will die of her wounds off-screen? Some extra walks on set to interrupt Rey, Luke, the Resistance etc., to say that General Organa didn't make it?

It was already told to us that her performance is complete and untouched in the last Jedi and they're not dishonouring her memory by altering it. We were also told 9 was rewritten to deal with carries death. I don't know what you're not getting here.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

If you say so.

There's no need to be so curt. I think it would make for a better story if she were to die in TLJ as opposed to just sticking her death in the scrawl for Episode IX. My theory as to how she might die could prove true as nobody outside of LucasFilm has seen the film yet... Being passive aggressive about a theory that upsets your fantasy is a bit much.

david75

Falthyron wrote: »

There's no need to be so curt. I think it would make for a better story if she were to die in TLJ as opposed to just sticking her death in the scrawl for Episode IX. My theory as to how she might die could prove true as nobody outside of LucasFilm has seen the film yet... Being passive aggressive about a theory that upsets your fantasy is a bit much.

I was just wondering how your frankly wild speculation is somehow blocking your understanding of what's been said on the record by Kathleen Kennedy Rian Johnson and bob iger heard of Disney about carries death and how they're going to deal with Leia in the final film.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

It was already told to us that her performance is complete and untouched in the last Jedi and they're not dishonouring her memory by altering it. We were also told 9 was rewritten to deal with carries death. I don't know what you're not getting here.

Having an extra walk on to a scene to tell the main characters that General Organa's ship was attacked doesn't affect Carrie Fisher's performance whatsoever.

Re-written to address Carrie's death doesn't mean she dies in Episode IX or between TLJ and Episode IX. It could very well mean that her role in that film is no longer there; that her contribution to plot development has been removed/replaced.

Nothing is definitive until we see TLJ. There is no evidence yet to suggest Leia dies in TLJ, Episode IX or the interim period. Nothing. Conversely, she could just as easily die in TLJ, Episode IX, or the interim period, and it wouldn't affect Carrie's performance.

Sad Professor

Falthyron wrote: »

If it can work, that would be great, but there is something cheap about having her suddenly die before Episode IX and mentioning it in the scrawl. Perhaps she will die of her wounds off-screen? Some extra walks on set to interrupt Rey, Luke, the Resistance etc., to say that General Organa didn't make it?

Yeah but again that might mean cutting out a significant part of Fisher's final performance. That wouldn't be paying respect to her. It would also have probably involved significant reshoots. I think we would have heard about them. Dramatically you can't just throw something like that into the last 5 minutes of the movie. Easier to deal with it in 9, either in the crawl or a funeral or something.

Or maybe Leia won't die. She might survive and they can do an Oliver Reed on her, having her appear silently in the final shot or something. I don't think it's a big deal personally as the third movie will be more about the new characters. I'm just glad she got to appear in 7 and 8.

Falthyron

david75 wrote: »

I was just wondering how your frankly wild speculation is somehow blocking your understanding of what's been said on the record by Kathleen Kennedy Rian Johnson and bob iger heard of Disney about carries death and how they're going to deal with Leia in the final film.

Show me the article/quote/video/interview that says 'Carrie's death will be shown/experienced/detailed in Episode IX. Her character does not die in TLJ'.

Falthyron

Sad Professor wrote: »

I don't think it's a big deal personally as the third movie will be more about the new characters. I'm just glad she got to appear in 7 and 8.

Neither do I, and I am glad her performance (whatever that might be) enabled her to remain a (hopefully) significant part of the film. I don't think they can do a Heath Ledger on Episode IX though. The Joker is arrested/imprisoned at the end of the Dark Knight and we can therefore assume he is still in prison in TDKR. If Leia has a significant role in TLJ and survives, I am curious to learn how she can just disappear for Episode IX. Who knows? Maybe this whole war thing isn't for her and she decides to retire and get away from it all by the end of TLJ. :pac:

david75

They've said they haven't and won't change the last Jedi to deal with her death.
9 was already in development when she died. Her death brought about a total rewrite. So her death will be dealt with in 9. They have said they won't be recreating Carrie digitally onscreen. They didn't say they wouldn't recast Leia.


You don't and they won't throw away one of the most loved characters in the saga with an extra(an extra. Seriously). Or a main character telling Luke eh Leias dead.

I doubt they know what they want to do to deal with it but it's not being dealt with in TLJ that's already wrapped and it will be a factor or even storyline in 9.

david75

*they are probably going to recast her I reckon.

Sad Professor

david75 wrote: »

*they are probably going to recast her I reckon.

There's really no chance in hell of that happening, David. Carrie Fisher IS Leia. And recast her for what? 15 minutes worth of screen-time?

I don't believe them that she would have had a bigger role in 9. That's just something they said because they felt guilty for giving her such a small role in 7 and 8. I seriously doubt her death was a major factor in the script re-writes.

BMMachine

Treverrow got the job on the back of that awful Jurassic World film. Happy hes gone as I think the main episodes of this new star wars has a lot of potential. Im reasonably excited for ep 8 as we get back in touch with ol' Luke which was something I was hoping would happen in VII. Those Han Solo and whatever stand alone films look awful though. Star Wars in reality is a pretty limited universe if you are to get that star wars feel from the films but it has a big enough fan backing where you can just put in random stuff from the films they know in order to get away with sub-par stories.

david75

Pretty great read on the (short) history of Disney owning Lucasfilm and what happened next.

https://www.talkstarwars.co.uk/news/whats-going-on-at-lucasfilm-ltd

Tony EH

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I like to imagine Kathleen Kennedy keeps busts of the heads of all the directors the Star Wars franchise has now defeated.

Like a Fallout 3 bobblehead collection.

Can't say I'm sorry to Trevorrow go. Just like I wasn't sorry to see Lord+Miller get the heave-ho.

I wonder who she has lined up though.

It's funny. I've never really warmed to any Star Wars director. Looking back Kershner was a stroke of genius, or luck (but given his back catalouge up to 1979, I wouldn't see him in the role) and Edwards, I feel, did extremely well to smoothly run his film into the original 'Star Wars'. Not an easy task that. But, everyone else who's done(doing) it, I probably wouldn't have given the job to.

Lucas - did well with 'THX1138', 'American Graffiti' and the original 'Star Wars'. Wisely took his hands off the director's reins though. Brilliant ideas man, but needs tempering from a Kurtz or a Speilberg. When given a free hand and surrounded by Yes Men, the results are awful. Hello Prequels.

Marquand - Milquetoast director. The personification of meh.

Abrams - Woefully unoriginal Magpie. Hasn't done a single thing that wasn't a rehash, sequel, or a riff on someone else.

Johnson - Liked 'Looper'. But a Star Wars director...remains to be seen.

Lord+Miller - One trick pony meta ha ha directors. How their names were put forward for a Star Wars film is beyond belief.

Howard - OK, from time to time. But with some real blandness throughout. In fairness to him, he has ability to carry it through. But, I still wouldn't have gone "Get Ron Howard in!".

Treverrow - 'Jurassic World', that's all I need to know.

As to who would be a good choice for a Star Wars film. I don't really know. Spielberg is passed his sell-by date now. Edgar Wright is all shades of wrong as well.

TBH, I'd hate the job of having to pick.

Tony EH

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Godard for Episode IX.

What's David Lynch doing?

I'm sure he's always regretted not doing 'Return of the Jedi'. LOL.

Can you just imagine... :eek::pac::cool::rolleyes::mad::(

R777B

My money would be on Rian Johnson again, he is the only director/writer that they've worked with that there has been zero problems with (that we know of I guess) and they all seem to be very happy with what he has done for VIII.

If they can get him after only finishing up on this one I guess.

Either way I don't think IX will be out in Summer 2019 I think it'll be pushed to December, and rightly so - the December releases have served them well so far I don't know why they would change it.