#GE16 - North Kildare

Redsoxfan

Orion wrote:

not that any of that would make me vote for O'Rourke. First question I'd ask him is where he's getting his money from. The size of the fcuking posters he's putting up are ridiculous. 40 foot container size at Manor Mills and billboard size at the business park roundabout. Both site owned by businesses - make your own conclusions.

There is a trailer on the Maynooth to Straffan Road and another near the McDonald's in Naas.

Also a VW Caddye (or similar) white van with his image on the back that was travelling suspiciously slowly on the Straffan to Clane Road during the morning rush hour.

SQ2

Another trailer near Kilcock graveyard!

milewidehead

Orion wrote: »

Anthony Lawlor has made a boo boo. This is being picked up all over the place:

http://www.rabble.ie/2016/02/14/brewtal-truth/
http://www.thejournal.ie/brewery-owner-hits-out-at-fine-gael-td-who-claimed-to-have-delivered-jobs-2605055-Feb2016/

Rye River has responded quite funnily too:
https://twitter.com/ryeriverbrewing/status/699233588592697344

Thught this was a bit unfair to Lawlor. He also discovered Peniciin, developed smokeless coal and is currently working on a cure for cancer.

milewidehead

Orion wrote: »

He says he's not and I believe him. He did mention that O'Rourke did help him in setting up the Celbridge site - how I don't know. I think that Phelan is just giving credit where due and vice versa.

not that any of that would make me vote for O'Rourke. First question I'd ask him is where he's getting his money from. The size of the fcuking posters he's putting up are ridiculous. 40 foot container size at Manor Mills and billboard size at the business park roundabout. Both site owned by businesses - make your own conclusions.

I think O'Rourke is a bit confused as to which election he's running in. The sheer OTT size and brazen cash-spend of his "poster" campaign would make Donald Trump blush.

granturismo

milewidehead wrote: »

Blueshirts ....

Thats a blast from the last century.

milewidehead

granturismo wrote: »

Thats a blast from the last century.

Well, we can't be selective about just one party's history and airbrush another's Nazi flirtations out of existence now, can we?

Orion

granturismo wrote: »

Thats a blast from the last century.

I was thinking that too until ...

milewidehead wrote: »

Well, we can't be selective about just one party's history and airbrush another's Nazi flirtations out of existence now, can we?

This is a fair point.

granturismo

milewidehead wrote: »

Well, we can't be selective about just one party's history and airbrush another's Nazi flirtations out of existence now, can we?

It was 80 years ago. The blueshirts were an embarrassing episode in Irish history, didnt come any where near the bravery and commitment shown by Irish fighters on the Spanish republican side. They basically got on a boat, marched and camped their way around eastern Spain and came home again. Their street politics in Ireland went nowhere.

The FF leader sent a letter of condolence to Germany on Hitler's death. That was only 71 years ago. Some of SF predecessors supported Germany in WW2.

FF, FG all evolved from the IRA (one person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist) and SF more recent history puts the blueshirt fiasco into the minor leagues. SF members visit to FARC in Columbia was 15 years ago.

All political parties have a history, some of that history is now irrelevant and some parties claim it is irrelevant. I dont think any candidate in N Kildare is a blueshirt, nazi apologist or terrorist. Some might be an embarrassment, gaffed or are just not up to the job.

L1011

Those that use it as a pejorative term are often the same people trying to insist that whatever their party did 5-15 years ago is irrelevant and "history" at the same time.

milewidehead

L1011 wrote: »

Those that use it as a pejorative term are often the same people trying to insist that whatever their party did 5-15 years ago is irrelevant and "history" at the same time.

So when is the "cut-off" point? Who decides? We're constantly lectured about "going forward" and "not living in the past". (Unless the other party's past is politically expedient to bring up.)

L1011

milewidehead wrote: »

So when is the "cut-off" point? Who decides? We're constantly lectured about "going forward" and "not living in the past". (Unless the other party's past is politically expedient to bring up.)

Pretty much something for each individual voter to decide - but someone wailing on one hand about what they did in 2010 being ancient history cannot make reference to the 1930s with any conviction.

milewidehead

granturismo wrote: »

It was 80 years ago. The blueshirts were an embarrassing episode in Irish history, didnt come any where near the bravery and commitment shown by Irish fighters on the Spanish republican side. They basically got on a boat, marched and camped their way around eastern Spain and came home again. Their street politics in Ireland went nowhere.

The FF leader sent a letter of condolence to Germany on Hitler's death. That was only 71 years ago. Some of SF predecessors supported Germany in WW2.

FF, FG all evolved from the IRA (one person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist) and SF more recent history puts the blueshirt fiasco into the minor leagues. SF members visit to FARC in Columbia was 15 years ago.

All political parties have a history, some of that history is now irrelevant and some parties claim it is irrelevant. I dont think any candidate in N Kildare is a blueshirt, nazi apologist or terrorist. Some might be an embarrassment, gaffed or are just not up to the job.

Nor do I believe any candidate or supporter is any of the above. But if you were to believe the current media "spin", you would be calling the bomb-squad and Armed Response Unit every time a Sinn Féin canvasser called. As for history, most of the current membership of SF (some 9,000 or so) have joined since the 1998 Good Friday Agreement was signed, though not necessarily on account of it.
Regarding
this election, "It's (still) the economy, stupid.", despite ceaseless ongoing efforts to make the voters look elsewhere.

milewidehead

L1011 wrote: »

Pretty much something for each individual voter to decide - but someone wailing on one hand about what they did in 2010 being ancient history cannot make reference to the 1930s with any conviction.

You've lost me on the 2010 thing. As for the history of political parties, it's great for pub-quizzes and TG4 documentaries. The IRA and the Army Council really have gone away, (unless it's election time.)

granturismo

milewidehead wrote: »

Nor do I believe any candidate or supporter is any of the above. But if you were to believe the current media "spin", you would be calling the bomb-squad and Armed Response Unit every time a Sinn Féin canvasser called. ....

I must have access to different media outlets.

milewidehead wrote: »

... As for history, most of the current membership of SF (some 9,000 or so) have joined since the 1998 Good Friday Agreement was signed, though not necessarily on account of it.
....

milewidehead wrote: »

Well, we can't be selective about just one party's history and airbrush another's Nazi flirtations out of existence now, can we?

So, its unfair for some commentators to refer to the events of the latter half the twentieth century, Columbia (2001) and more from 2015-2106, but its ok to call a FG TD a blueshirt?

milewidehead wrote: »

... Regarding this election, "It's (still) the economy, stupid.", despite ceaseless ongoing efforts to make the voters look elsewhere.

There's a forum on boards.ie for conspiracy theories.

L1011

milewidehead wrote: »

You've lost me on the 2010 thing. As for the history of political parties, it's great for pub-quizzes and TG4 documentaries. The IRA and the Army Council really have gone away, (unless it's election time.)

I've had an FFer tell me that 2010 was "ancient history" and "irrelevant" in the same conversation when he made Nazi-implications and frequently used the term Blueshirt.

milewidehead

L1011 wrote: »

I've had an FFer tell me that 2010 was "ancient history" and "irrelevant" in the same conversation when he made Nazi-implications and frequently used the term Blueshirt.

Indeed.(It's election time). Probably drinks pints with his political opponents afterwards, as I do, and as they do in the Dáil bar.

milewidehead

granturismo wrote: »

I must have access to different media outlets.





So, its unfair for some commentators to refer to the events of the latter half the twentieth century, Columbia (2001) and more from 2015-2106, but its ok to call a FG TD a blueshirt?




There's a forum on boards.ie for conspiracy theories.

I think this is what they term a "circular argument" so I'm out. I've to go canvassing, anyway.

milewidehead

Joe Public wrote: »

A pity photoshop doesn't wash off in the rain.

Ouch! Sailing close to the wind there!;)

Banjoxed

milewidehead wrote: »

Well, we can't be selective about just one party's history and airbrush another's Nazi flirtations out of existence now, can we?

Google "no free speech for traitors", you might learn something about the 1932 and 1933 elections and the atmosphere they were fought in.

milewidehead

Banjoxed wrote: »

Google "no free speech for traitors", you might learn something about the 1932 and 1933 elections and the atmosphere they were fought in.

You know something? I might even look! Everyday a school day.

Banjoxed

milewidehead wrote: »

You know something? I might even look! Everyday a school day.

No bother!

Orion

scheister wrote: »

Cant find him now but their was someone who ran in 2011 or 2007 in a number of area and polled single digits in more

Adrian Kavanagh just posted a list of the fewest 1st pref votes in 2011

https://adriankavanaghelections.org/2016/02/17/better-luck-next-time-baby-2011-general-election-candidates-with-the-lowest-first-preference-votes/

Rosahane

Banjoxed wrote: »

Google "no free speech for traitors", you might learn something about the 1932 and 1933 elections and the atmosphere they were fought in.

My father had a couple of good stories about the 1932 election and the amount of bully boy tactics and intimidation from Dev's gang.
They never really understood democracy!

quadrifoglio verde

O rourke must be raging with Bernard Durkan

At the abbeyLodge in celbridge where they usually have a massive banner up advertising something or other, O rourke has his nice mugshot blown up in all its glory

Durkan has two posters side by side above it
Couldn't help but chuckle when I saw it yesterday evening

Banjoxed

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

O rourke must be raging with Bernard Durkan

At the abbeyLodge in celbridge where they usually have a massive banner up advertising something or other, O rourke has his nice mugshot blown up in all its glory

Durkan has two posters side by side above it
Couldn't help but chuckle when I saw it yesterday evening

That's gas. Always thought the Abbey Lodge was an FF house. Deputy Dawg is not noted for his shy and retiring nature

Joe Public

I think it's time for some of the older TDs to step aside and give some of the newer more energetic hopefuls a chance. Realistically, how effective will Stagg and Durkan be if voted in again? They are old reliables but not necessarily the best choice.

Celbridge hasn't had a TD since Terry Boylan in the 70s. Celbridge has about 14,000 registered to vote and if people think about it they could make all the difference by going for someone local who has a chance regardless of party affiliations.
The most popular candidate in Celbridge is o'Rourke and despite a few grumbles he seems to be a very driven honest person and over the past five years as KCC councillor has engaged positively with most residents associations, charities, voluntary groups, sports clubs, schools, businesses and many individuals. Maybe politics doesn't suit a straight talking honest person but the more that get elected can only help in restoring public faith in the government. FF don't hold a very high spot in the trustworthy chart but that doesn't put me off pushing for o'Rourke.

L1011

Orourke was elected two, not five years ago as far as I know. I put policies beyond local photo taking and he's useless when it comes to that - having his photo taken by stuff is all he does

That every random builder in the area seems to commit vans and poster sites doesn't help with trying to claim FF have changed from being the developers party either. Incredibly ignorant to reality to do so but yet he has posters on near every site

Also, his addiction to having his photo taken lead to him claiming the massively unpopular lights near Maxol were his doing. I do hope he realises that bad campaigning (like astroturfing)) doesn't work

Joe Public

L1011 wrote: »

Orourke was elected two, not five years ago as far as I know. I put policies beyond local photo taking and he's useless when it comes to that - having his photo taken by stuff is all he does

That every random builder in the area seems to commit vans and poster sites doesn't help with trying to claim FF have changed from being the developers party either. Incredibly ignorant to reality to do so but yet he has posters on near every site

He was co-opted in as councillor 5 years ago. He usually follows up with photo taking to promote himself and also make sure others don't try to make claim to his work, he's not publicity shy. Unfortunately new developments are needed to keep the economy going and can't be ignored.

L1011

Co-option is not election.

The photos happen at *everything* whether he did it or not.

He does little beyond getting snapped. I'm surprised anyone has any reason to big him up really as he does nothing bar a photo for the Champion weekly. You're not a campaigner for him, by any chance?

Banjoxed

Joe Public wrote: »

I think it's time for some of the older TDs to step aside and give some of the newer more energetic hopefuls a chance. Realistically, how effective will Stagg and Durkan be if voted in again? They are old reliables but not necessarily the best choice.

Celbridge hasn't had a TD since Terry Boylan in the 70s. Celbridge has about 14,000 registered to vote and if people think about it they could make all the difference by going for someone local who has a chance regardless of party affiliations.
The most popular candidate in Celbridge is o'Rourke and despite a few grumbles he seems to be a very driven honest person and over the past five years as KCC councillor has engaged positively with most residents associations, charities, voluntary groups, sports clubs, schools, businesses and many individuals. Maybe politics doesn't suit a straight talking honest person but the more that get elected can only help in restoring public faith in the government. FF don't hold a very high spot in the trustworthy chart but that doesn't put me off pushing for o'Rourke.

A couple of things.

1. FF drove the economy off the cliff. Not once but several times - but 2007-2011 was a masterpiece by their standards of cronyism and naked self interest

2. Remind me what O'Rourke and Lawless' positions on the Marriage Referendum and repealing the 8th Amendment are again..

Turning the clock back to the Good Old Days isn't going to help the country, let alone Celbridge. A few local businesses, angry at not being able to have a word in Charlie McCreevy's ear anymore isn't going to change that. Nor will the clock go back to the days of the conservative Irish Catholic monoculture no matter how smart or angry individuals are about that.