General MMA Chat/News mk2

CurryFlavoured

In fairness Tim Means resurgence in the last couple of years was a bit iffy, he was cut in 2013 now he's breaking into the top 15 at WW. Pity as he's such an exciting fighter.

Devastator

Cowboy Cerrone vs Cowboy Oliveira in a WWF style "Winner keeps the nickname" matchup?

I can't remember seeing Oliveira fight off the top of my head. I see from his record hes been on a few FN cards. I would have thought there would be higher profile LWs out there to headline a card Maybe Diaz? It would be relevant to the rankings and been a good long time since they fought, plus it was a good fight last time out.

ASOT

Brazillian Cowboy is in against American Cowboy, should be a cracking fight.

Paully D

Torres v Namajunas set for the 16th April card.

I can't wait for this one. A really good matchup.

Torres beat her via decision in Invicta back in 2013.

Wrongway1985

Paully D wrote: »

Torres v Namajunas set for the 16th April card.

I can't wait for this one. A really good matchup.

Torres beat her via decision in Invicta back in 2013.

That was a very good contest too sensible match up

Mellor

ASOT wrote: »

Oh right Yeah that's makes much more sense now :pac: taught it was aimed at means resurgence in his second ufc stint!

Going by Means' twitter. He was flagged for a SARM, but is claiming he never even heard of it (the particular drug). Claims innocence ("Look at my physic. Do I look like a steroid user"), and will get his B-Sample tested.

Davei141

I hate when fighters say "look at my physique" as a defence. If you are innocent then get testing those supplements ASAP to see what caused the positive.

Mellor

Davei141 wrote: »

I hate when fighters say "look at my physique" as a defence. If you are innocent then get testing those supplements ASAP to see what caused the positive.

The whole "tainted" supplements excuse is a load of pony imo. But it's probably the angle we'll hear here.

maximoose

Mellor wrote: »

The whole "tainted" supplements excuse is a load of pony imo. But it's probably the angle we'll hear here.

I 99% agree with that, but I never knew until a few days ago when listening to the Joe Rogan podcast with Chris Bell that supplements in America are completely unregulated - and there have been some studies showing pretty high levels of spiking

Mellor

maximoose wrote: »

I 99% agree with that, but I never knew until a few days ago when listening to the Joe Rogan podcast with Chris Bell that supplements in America are completely unregulated - and there have been some studies showing pretty high levels of spiking

Most supplements aren't regulated because they are just food, vitamins etc. But doesn't mean they can add what they want. Steroids are highly regulated. They can't just added them to protein powder. The link refers to tests from 2001. Plus it says it's mostly chinese products that were tainted.

Drugs are expensive. It's makes no sense for a company to put $100 doses of SARMs/AAS into $25 tubs of protein.

Mellor

maximoose wrote: »

I 99% agree with that, but I never knew until a few days ago when listening to the Joe Rogan podcast with Chris Bell that supplements in America are completely unregulated - and there have been some studies showing pretty high levels of spiking

Most supplements aren't regulated because they are just food, vitamins etc. But doesn't mean they can add what they want. Steroids are highly regulated. They can't just added them to protein powder. The link refers to tests from 2001. Plus it says it's mostly chinese products that were tainted.

Drugs are expensive. It's makes no sense for a company to put $100 doses of SARMs/AAS into $25 tubs of protein.

Davei141

Mellor wrote: »

The whole "tainted" supplements excuse is a load of pony imo. But it's probably the angle we'll hear here.

Agreed. But if he was genuinely innocent he would be getting them tested is my point. If he just mouths off about dodgy supps and pleads ignorance without doing anything i wouldn't believe a word of it.

I would be much more inclined to believe dodgy supps excuse if somebody popped for something stimulant related.

Mellor

Just to add, a lot of over the counter supps were/are prohormones. Where could be flagged as containing steroids/drugs. But they aren't tainted, you getting exactly what it says on the tin.

Somebody buying "androstone-7-beta-max" knows what they are getting in for.

Davei141 wrote: »

I would be much more inclined to believe dodgy supps excuse if somebody popped for something stimulant related.

That's true. A lot of the WADA banned stimulants are legal OTC. Sudafed can lead to fail above a certain level.

CatFromHue

Any rumours on when Paddy Holohan/Ais Daly will fight again?

Subcomandante Marcos

Henderson says since he's signed for Bellator his phone has been going non stop with UFC fighters who are running our of contract contacting him to ask about Bellator and what the UFC offered him.

The exodus has begun.

Devastator

CatFromHue wrote: »

Any rumours on when Paddy Holohan/Ais Daly will fight again?

Not that I've heard. I'm surprised they've not got at least 1 other Irish fighter on the 196 card consider 194 had nobody apart from Conor(I'm leaving out Gunni for sake of my point lol). With events coming up in Croatia & Holland maybe they'll get on there. No news of Neil Seery either

Subcomandante Marcos wrote: »

Henderson says since he's signed for Bellator his phone has been going non stop with UFC fighters who are running our of contract contacting him to ask about Bellator and what the UFC offered him.

The exodus has begun.

Dana said the UFC had a chance to match the offer but declined. He said their offer wasn't as much initially but IF Bendo became champ again the UFC offer would have blown Bellators offer out of the water.

Subcomandante Marcos

Devastator wrote: »

Not that I've heard. I'm surprised they've not got at least 1 other Irish fighter on the 196 card consider 194 had nobody apart from Conor(I'm leaving out Gunni for sake of my point lol). With events coming up in Croatia & Holland maybe they'll get on there. No news of Neil Seery either



Dana said the UFC had a chance to match the offer but declined. He said their offer wasn't as much initially but IF Bendo became champ again the UFC offer would have blown Bellators offer out of the water.

It's not just the fighter pay though.

It's the difference between making 60-100k per fight in personal sponsorships as opposed to 15k to wear a mandatory horrible reebok kit.

I'd also take anything Dana White says with a large pinch of salt.

Lukker-

Dana's gotta be worried a little bit about losing Henderson. It could potentially open the flood gates once people see what Benson is making with sponsorships and an instant title shot. He won't be worried about losing champs but IMO a lot of the challengers might move there.

I could see people like Cowboy, the Diaz brothers and many other fighters who don't have individual deals with reebok leaving.

Lukker-

Dana's gotta be worried a little bit about losing Henderson. It could potentially open the flood gates once people see what Benson is making with sponsorships and an instant title shot. He won't be worried about losing champs but IMO a lot of the challengers might move there.

I could see people like Cowboy, the Diaz brothers and many other fighters who don't have individual deals with reebok leaving.

weemcd

Lukker- wrote: »

Dana's gotta be worried a little bit about losing Henderson. It could potentially open the flood gates once people see what Benson is making with sponsorships and an instant title shot. He won't be worried about losing champs but IMO a lot of the challengers might move there.

I could see people like Cowboy, the Diaz brothers and many other fighters who don't have individual deals with reebok leaving.

I'd say you're right, not about Bendo himself because he was very unpopular as champion and never a draw. But like you say, somebody like Nate Diaz would be prime to walk IMO if there's more money in it. They messed with cowboy too last time out when he had the patch on his shorts, and Cowboy is the ultimate company man ffs.

Torn on this, as a fan it's a better product when the best fight the best consistently, but there is absolutely NO upside to the Reebok deal, it has been a catastrophic failure from start to finish. Wouldn't do any harm for Dana or the UFC brass to have their ego checked once and a while.

Devastator

Subcomandante Marcos wrote: »

It's not just the fighter pay though.

It's the difference between making 60-100k per fight in personal sponsorships as opposed to 15k to wear a mandatory horrible reebok kit.

I'd also take anything Dana White says with a large pinch of salt.

True we don't know if what Dana claims is actually true, same way we don't know for certain what Bendo or other fighters claims into sponsorship(pre reebok) are true. I'm sure it was more than what they're currently earning anyway.

The thing is with sponsorship though I don't expect fighters would be offered the same amounts now as to what they previously earned pre reebok. Bellator doesn't have as much exposure as UFC so the potential earnings for the sponsors would be less therefore I think they'll offer less. Again, would it be as low/similar to reebok we don't know for sure.

The biggest surprise I got with UFC not doing more to keep Bendo is because he was always up for a short notice fight, or so it seemed, and could fight at 155 or 170. I think he did say on the MMA hour that he took some of his recent short notice fights to run up his contract quicker but still think he's the type of fighter which is good to keep around.

Lukker-

weemcd wrote: »

I'd say you're right, not about Bendo himself because he was very unpopular as champion and never a draw. But like you say, somebody like Nate Diaz would be prime to walk IMO if there's more money in it. They messed with cowboy too last time out when he had the patch on his shorts, and Cowboy is the ultimate company man ffs.

Torn on this, as a fan it's a better product when the best fight the best consistently, but there is absolutely NO upside to the Reebok deal, it has been a catastrophic failure from start to finish. Wouldn't do any harm for Dana or the UFC brass to have their ego checked once and a while.

Yeah he wasn't a very popular fighter or anything and that's definitely why Dana let him go so easily but he probably overlooked the precedent it sets.

He's the first fighter who can be considered still in his prime who has jumped ship to another organisation.

If other fighters in a similar position who may feel overlooked start to jump ship for that sponsorship money some divisions could start to look very light all of a sudden.

The reebok deal might end up costing the UFC dearly if this keeps happening. Bendo said his phone has been constantly ringing from UFC guys nearing the end of their contracts.

Foxtrol

Lukker- wrote: »

Yeah he wasn't a very popular fighter or anything and that's definitely why Dana let him go so easily but he probably overlooked the precedent it sets.

He's the first fighter who can be considered still in his prime who has jumped ship to another organisation.

If other fighters in a similar position who may feel overlooked start to jump ship for that sponsorship money some divisions could start to look very light all of a sudden.

The reebok deal might end up costing the UFC dearly if this keeps happening. Bendo said his phone has been constantly ringing from UFC guys nearing the end of their contracts.

Depends how you look at the precedent.

You could equally say the precedent they set was that they’re not going to be strong armed into overpaying (in their opinion) for a fighter that isn’t a draw. It’s like football teams sticking to their wage structure, it would probably be worse for them if they matched Bellator’s deal as they’d have a flood of fighters wanting more money.

Lukker-

Foxtrol wrote: »

Depends how you look at the precedent.

You could equally say the precedent they set was that they’re not going to be strong armed into overpaying (in their opinion) for a fighter that isn’t a draw. It’s like football teams sticking to their wage structure, it would probably be worse for them if they matched Bellator’s deal as they’d have a flood of fighters wanting more money.

That's all well and good but he's a former champ, still in his prime and the UFC are meant to attract the best fighters not just the best PPV draws.

If PPV was all that mattered we'd have Kimbo Slice fighting in the UFC. Don't get me wrong PPV's are hugely important, but good matchups are what makes the UFC so exciting.

Look at the WW division, Robbie Lawler himself isn't a marketable fighter who they use to promote the UFC but his fights are because there are killers in the divison and you are guaranteed a good fight. If those guys below Lawler start to leave and he's left beating up bums, who's gonna watch it?

Lukker-

USADA have a new test for HGH.

Apparently the window used to be a few hours of usage to detecting it, that has been bumped to 21 days.

https://twitter.com/jeremybotter/status/695673714633940993

Lukker-

USADA have a new test for HGH.

Apparently the window used to be a few hours of usage to detecting it, that has been bumped to 21 days.

https://twitter.com/jeremybotter/status/695673714633940993

TimRiggins

Lukker- wrote: »

That's all well and good but he's a former champ, still in his prime and the UFC are meant to attract the best fighters not just the best PPV draws.

If PPV was all that mattered we'd have Kimbo Slice fighting in the UFC. Don't get me wrong PPV's are hugely important, but good matchups are what makes the UFC so exciting.

Look at the WW division, Robbie Lawler himself isn't a marketable fighter who they use to promote the UFC but his fights are because there are killers in the divison and you are guaranteed a good fight. If those guys below Lawler start to leave and he's left beating up bums, who's gonna watch it?

Its not going to turn that serious though. For the UFC, They can easily do without Ben, they aren't going to splash big money on keeping him especially seeing as he was a champion and doesn't look like he's going to hit those heights again and isn't a PPV draw. If the UFC matched Bellator's offer Benson would have stayed in the UFC without a doubt.

Davei141

Lukker- wrote: »

USADA have a new test for HGH.

Apparently the window used to be a few hours of usage to detecting it, that has been bumped to 21 days.

https://twitter.com/jeremybotter/status/695673714633940993

I'll only be convinced if they actually pop somebody for HGH.

CatFromHue

Lukker- wrote: »

Dana's gotta be worried a little bit about losing Henderson. It could potentially open the flood gates once people see what Benson is making with sponsorships and an instant title shot. He won't be worried about losing champs but IMO a lot of the challengers might move there.

I could see people like Cowboy, the Diaz brothers and many other fighters who don't have individual deals with reebok leaving.

Is that Dan Henderson everyones talking about? I thought he's signed up to fight Machida in April?

Either way I'm not sure how much a loss he would be as alot of people would like him to stop fighting full stop. He's 45 and since he came back to the UFC he's 3 - 6. In his last 4 losses he's been KO or TKO in 3 of them so I think Dana might be happy to get him off the books.

ASOT

CatFromHue wrote: »

Is that Dan Henderson everyones talking about? I thought he's signed up to fight Machida in April?

Either way I'm not sure how much a loss he would be as alot of people would like him to stop fighting full stop. He's 45 and since he came back to the UFC he's 3 - 6. In his last 4 losses he's been KO or TKO in 3 of them so I think Dana might be happy to get him off the books.

It's Benson Henderson who's gone, Dan is still on the books and will KO Machida hopefully because he's a hero.