Emigrants, thinking of coming home?

BizzyC

I've been in London for 5 years now.

I'd love some day to be able to move the family home, but the Irish job market is just not strong enough for me to do so without taking a massive pay cut.

My biggest hope right now is for the "Brexit" to take place, which will see a lot of firms shifting their offices to Dublin.

catbear

BizzyC wrote: »

I'd love some day to be able to move the family home, but the Irish job market is just not strong enough for me to do so without taking a massive pay cut.

I took a huge pay cut when I left australia, zero regrets.

At least you'll be able to have a good think about it in the run up to Brexit. A lot of finance companies think it would have a serious negative effect of the UK and the pound, Goldman Sachs think it would devalue the pound by 20%. Good for exporters but you'd feel it in your wallet.

catbear

Here's a US site that compares living in the US with other countries. The data for Ireland is a bit out of date as it has 2013 unemployment.
http://www.ifitweremyhome.com/compare/US/IE

Kev_2012

I did move home. Not through choice but I had considered it and now I'm like "ah f*ck this I'm out of here again as soon as I get my sh*t sorted".

There are a lot of things I love about Ireland :
- my family is here
- the quality of food produce is really good
- the beer (good lord the beer)
- the sense of humour
- the people (in terms of going out and having a laugh with friends)
- the sport.

I love all of that and Ireland is one of the most beautiful countries in the world. It truly is.

However, there are many many others things I can't stand after spending 2 years in Vancouver.

- As a software engineer, I've found far FAR more fulfilling positions are available to me in North America (not working in something I don't enjoy like the pharmaceutical or finance industries)
- I much preferred the working conditions/work life balance I had in Canada. With no micromanagement, no bullsh*t about dress code and all other stupid things affecting work and flexi hours (I know that is here too, but it's a little restrictive in most places).
- People don't seem to want to do anything outside of go to the pub. Don't get me wrong, I love going to the pub, but I'd much rather go do something like go for a hike or snowboard or go to the beach or something first.
- I prefer the whole thing about getting food in bars and actually having a table and table service and then start having the beers.
- Ireland is turning a corner, but I really liked how people look after themselves in Vancouver. It makes you wanna take care of your health and fitness more.
- THE WEATHER. Whatever about rain, that feckin wind drives me bananas!

beach_walker

If I were to move home I'd be going back to higher taxes, poorer standards of public service, crap public transport (non-driver here!) and would have to go to Dublin to get anywhere near my current pay.

I do miss certain aspects of home but I've made friends here and as time goes on I'm not so sure I want to go back. Don't get me wrong, I hate those emigrants who constantly talk down Ireland but for me right now I'm happy out where I am.

Dohnjoe

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

That tax is amazing

I'm at the other end of the spectrum, pay huge amounts of tax (smack bang in the centre of Europe)

That aside I do get 7 weeks holiday a year, work 7 hours a day (minus lunch, not a minute more required) and am fully covered health, pension, etc, etc, I can take a year off work and come straight back to the same job (by law)

My US friends are jealous of that, I'm jealous of their tax and salary - still I think the whole work/life balance just wins out in the end for me

Frank Bullitt

Was interested in seeing a thread like this pop up, mind you reading it was a different experience altogether.

I've been in Vancouver for the past 2.5 years, and should (hopefully) have the residency sorted out in the next few weeks. At one point last year when i had a Canadian GF I thought I was more or less settling here, we talked about settling here, but that eventually didn't work out and we broke up in October.

I was home for the whole month of December for my birthday Christmas, and the bug about going back to Ireland bit me and left a mark. Part of that was that coming back to Vancouver was different this time around (I had been home before), no GF and it felt like I was stuck in life limbo.

I was working before I left Ireland before I left in my industry, and had no issues getting a job etc, I left because I wanted to try something different and challenge myself to see if i could do the living abroad thing, and also to get some life experience while I'm at it.

The first year away was hard, but then things Van picked up work wise and I am now working in a great job, earning good money and living a decent life here. So where does the feeling of wanting to go back to Ireland come from for me?

For a start, Vancouver is monumentally expensive. Buying any sort of property here is literally a dream, average house prices have been driven up by foreign investment and are currently over $1 million dollars for a house here. You can go further a field to the suburbs but even they are getting silly expensive, and they also add a horrible commute to the city where most of my work would be (I'm a UI/UX designer). Other things are priced high also, B.C has the highest provincial tax rate in Canada and is also the only province where you have to pay for healthcare (although its still not a bad price to pay).

Renting here is now also very difficult due to the rising house prices. Coal Harbour and the West End are upwards of 60% vacancies despite most of the properties being owned by foreign investors.

Groceries and produce is also quite high here and general day to day things like that are higher than normal.

Weather comes up now and then when people from Ireland talk about leaving, "the weather is Ireland is poxy, ****in ****e it is", come to Vancouver (which is located in a rain forest) and talk to me then. From November until late February is grey and raining, all the time. Honestly I have never seen rain like we get here. But once the summers roll around, its glorious here, it really is.

I haven't decided if I actually want to go back to Ireland or just leave Vancouver at some point. My current job have contributed a lot with my residency and also with work in general, so I am in no rush to actually run off just yet.

Ireland is way better than when I left, and I see that tech is really taking off as well, which bodes well for me if I were to return. The appeal of actually buying a house is also a factor, and although I have a good set up here in Vancouver, it very much feels like the life I am living here has an end date on it for me. Many of my friends (a mix of Irish, Aussie and Canadians) feel the same way about Vancouver, and its heading for a pretty big issue with people leaving the city due to the price of living and wanting property. Vancouver is likely to find itself with a shortage of skilled workers which will ultimately affect the market here.

This post might read a bit odd to some people, but I didn't have much of a plan in my head before I sat down to write it.

I will say this.Leaving Ireland when I did was, hands down, the best thing I have ever done.

It has given me a different perspective on life, improved my relationship with my parents so much, and I have had tremendous experiences here with new friends. I own a nice Ducati and I get to use that a lot in the summer months, I go camping in the beautiful wilderness in B.C and my career is on a different path now. The hard times here were very hard, I worked for myself for a while here freelancing, and I was down to my last few hundred dollars at one point, my grandmother died last year and I was away for that, she had a stroke and was in a coma for a week so in a way I was glad I wasn't there, I have better memories of her so I wouldn't want to remember here in a hospital bed.

I tell people at home now to try the living abroad thing, it changes things for you in a very interesting way. I feel like I'm a different person now. I am not sure how going back to Ireland would turn out, but I know that it would be very different for me than before.

If anyone is using this thread for advice (for god sake don't), just use your own preference for it. If things are going good for you in another country and you have a new life, then that is great. If you feel you want to go home, then do.

catbear

Hey Gintonious, even if you came back it doesn't mean you can't go off again.

The easier it gets to relocate abroad for work and yet keep in touch with home through the internet the less I feel like an emigrant.

Frank Bullitt

catbear wrote: »

Hey Gintonious, even if you came back it doesn't mean you can't go off again.

The easier it gets to relocate abroad for work and yet keep in touch with home through the internet the less I feel like an emigrant.

Agreed fully, and it has crossed my mind as well. I seem to always set my sights on cities or locations that are insanely expensive. After Vancouver it would be maybe London or Singapore.

I suppose realistically, the world really is your oyster. Pick what you want to do and do it. Seeing the discussion about money as well in here shows that that is the top of peoples mind when considering a move etc. My advice would be to prioritize being happy and enjoying yourself over that, money will come.

Interesting read this thread. I notice one of the reasons that keep popping up for moving or staying abroad is better opportunities or better salary etc.

I have to say earning twice or three times what I do would be no good to me if I was living abroad away from friends, family and just Ireland in general. I can earn a decent salary here, yeah I could probably earn more abroad but it just would be no good to me.

Suppose some people have very different outlooks on life.

beach_walker

Talon Future Corkscrew wrote: »

I have to say earning twice or three times what I do would be no good to me if I was living abroad away from friends, family and just Ireland in general.

Well this certainly was a factor for me. I did't want to be too far from the family so didn't really consider Oz or North America. I'm in Edinburgh so it's a relatively short hop home if I want (or if there's an emergency).

As for friends... well most of mine from back home have emigrated tbh! And I've made some new ones over here

Kev_2012

Gintonious wrote: »

Was interested in seeing a thread like this pop up, mind you reading it was a different experience altogether.

I've been in Vancouver for the past 2.5 years, and should (hopefully) have the residency sorted out in the next few weeks. At one point last year when i had a Canadian GF I thought I was more or less settling here, we talked about settling here, but that eventually didn't work out and we broke up in October.

I was home for the whole month of December for my birthday Christmas, and the bug about going back to Ireland bit me and left a mark. Part of that was that coming back to Vancouver was different this time around (I had been home before), no GF and it felt like I was stuck in life limbo.

I was working before I left Ireland before I left in my industry, and had no issues getting a job etc, I left because I wanted to try something different and challenge myself to see if i could do the living abroad thing, and also to get some life experience while I'm at it.

The first year away was hard, but then things Van picked up work wise and I am now working in a great job, earning good money and living a decent life here. So where does the feeling of wanting to go back to Ireland come from for me?

For a start, Vancouver is monumentally expensive. Buying any sort of property here is literally a dream, average house prices have been driven up by foreign investment and are currently over $1 million dollars for a house here. You can go further a field to the suburbs but even they are getting silly expensive, and they also add a horrible commute to the city where most of my work would be (I'm a UI/UX designer). Other things are priced high also, B.C has the highest provincial tax rate in Canada and is also the only province where you have to pay for healthcare (although its still not a bad price to pay).

Renting here is now also very difficult due to the rising house prices. Coal Harbour and the West End are upwards of 60% vacancies despite most of the properties being owned by foreign investors.

Groceries and produce is also quite high here and general day to day things like that are higher than normal.

Weather comes up now and then when people from Ireland talk about leaving, "the weather is Ireland is poxy, ****in ****e it is", come to Vancouver (which is located in a rain forest) and talk to me then. From November until late February is grey and raining, all the time. Honestly I have never seen rain like we get here. But once the summers roll around, its glorious here, it really is.

I haven't decided if I actually want to go back to Ireland or just leave Vancouver at some point. My current job have contributed a lot with my residency and also with work in general, so I am in no rush to actually run off just yet.

Ireland is way better than when I left, and I see that tech is really taking off as well, which bodes well for me if I were to return. The appeal of actually buying a house is also a factor, and although I have a good set up here in Vancouver, it very much feels like the life I am living here has an end date on it for me. Many of my friends (a mix of Irish, Aussie and Canadians) feel the same way about Vancouver, and its heading for a pretty big issue with people leaving the city due to the price of living and wanting property. Vancouver is likely to find itself with a shortage of skilled workers which will ultimately affect the market here.

This post might read a bit odd to some people, but I didn't have much of a plan in my head before I sat down to write it.

I will say this.Leaving Ireland when I did was, hands down, the best thing I have ever done.

It has given me a different perspective on life, improved my relationship with my parents so much, and I have had tremendous experiences here with new friends. I own a nice Ducati and I get to use that a lot in the summer months, I go camping in the beautiful wilderness in B.C and my career is on a different path now. The hard times here were very hard, I worked for myself for a while here freelancing, and I was down to my last few hundred dollars at one point, my grandmother died last year and I was away for that, she had a stroke and was in a coma for a week so in a way I was glad I wasn't there, I have better memories of her so I wouldn't want to remember here in a hospital bed.

I tell people at home now to try the living abroad thing, it changes things for you in a very interesting way. I feel like I'm a different person now. I am not sure how going back to Ireland would turn out, but I know that it would be very different for me than before.

If anyone is using this thread for advice (for god sake don't), just use your own preference for it. If things are going good for you in another country and you have a new life, then that is great. If you feel you want to go home, then do.

I agree with you about the owning a home thing. I wouldn't fancy a daily commute from Port Moody or Langley the whole way in!

And yes the produce can be very expensive.

Weatherwise, as someone who has been coming and going between both places for the last 3 years, Vancouver wins hands down. The summer is amazing and when it does rain, it is absolutely nothing in comparison to Limerick and there is next to no wind. I think the weather there is basically what Ireland would be like if we didn't have as much wind and actually had seasons. Vancouver's weather wins hands down.

beks101

Gintonious wrote: »

although I have a good set up here in Vancouver, it very much feels like the life I am living here has an end date on it for me. Many of my friends (a mix of Irish, Aussie and Canadians) feel the same way about Vancouver,

I left Toronto after three and a half years because I felt this way. It's a niggling feeling that you can't ignore forever, especially as more and more of your friends move on or move home. You can feel left behind, overly sentimental about home and that runs parallel with the intellectual part of your brain that is telling you you'd be mad to leave, sure I have it so good here.

I think that's the trap with common Irish hotspots like Toronto, Vancouver, Sydney, Melbourne etc. You find yourself naturally gravitating towards other emigrants, probably have a firm circle of Irish friends, and these cities tend to be transitional for most travellers on visas. They get the experience and move on. It's hard not to feel left behind, or like your time to leave should be just around the corner too.

Anyways, I did move home, for about a month before scarpering off to London again, where I've been for more than two years now. Obviously London doesn't come without it's own set of issues, but in the biggest way I found that proximity to home and Irish culture a sigh of relief more than anything. Canadians are different socially and culturally.

I took some wonderful things from my time there - I rarely drink now and am fitness-obsessed, love to hike and run outside and take weekends away exploring. But I also slipped right back into things that I didn't realize I missed all along - the sense of humour over here, which is so much closer to home in London than it ever was in Toronto. Black, inappropriate, cheeky sometimes filthy humour that peppers ever conversation The over-politeness is replaced with something more real. Some people will be nice, lots of people will be rude and abrupt but no-one will have the same filter or will have you second guessing about their feelings in the way I used to feel they did in Toronto. And the closeness to home and ability to get back 4 or 5 times a year; or a random weekend on a whim; for birthdays and weddings and Christenings and funerals - it really is invaluable.

I think what Toronto did for me most of all, was underline the importance of family and friends to me. Good friends that you can see every day or every other week. I couldn't be without them. I couldn't live my life tens of thousands of miles away from them. And that overrides all of everything else for me.

razorblunt

I think if I could get a salary to match mine as it currently is, I'd be very keen, saying that, I haven't even looked into salaries really at home so I can't complain too much. One by one my friends are moving home too, while I have no illusions that we'll be hanging out as much as we were during college, I haven't met friends here that are anywhere near the level of those at home.

We also just bought here (Edinburgh), markets are solid, you're pretty much never going to lose money on a place you buy, provided you buy smart. Our plan is to give it another 4/5 years, which, lets face it, comes around in no time, at that stage it will be a case of "do we buy a house here or do we move home". Hopefully there'll be kids on the scene then too and I think, that as a driver more than anything will mean we're heading home. All going well, I'd love to keep a little 1 bed place here as I don't think we're leaving Edinburgh forever either!

beach_walker

beach_walker wrote: »

As for friends... well most of mine from back home have emigrated tbh! And I've made some new ones over here

Maybe its not that common but only one person in my group of friends is living abroad and he is only in the UK. Most are actually still living in my home area or close to it and are staring to settle for good with houses being bought, getting or already married etc. A few of us are in other parts of the country but in a few more years I'd say my entire group of friends from home/school including myself could all be living back around home as it's the plan for all really.

somefeen

I've just come back after 6 years in remote parts of Scotland.
I suppose I had a 5 year relationship with a Scottish girl so that was incentive to stay but when it ended I didn't see the point.

The isolation was getting to me as well. Its not nice being a single man living on your own with an 2 hours driving between you and any available women or even an hour just for a pint.

I was lucky I got to live in what I think is the most beautiful part of Europe and lived a lifestyle most people can only dream of. But its where people retire to not a place to be a young man.
Also even the most rural parts of Ireland seem to have more life on them. There's more danger in the air or something. Right now though I'm just happy to put my career on hold and spend some much needed time ogling women and meeting new people in an urban centre.