HSE attitude

borderlinemeath

I always frequent my local cafe that is dog friendly. They allow dogs onto their terrace and covered conservatory area. The cafe itself is off limits - ie close to the kitchen where they prep food - and is available for those oh so delicate types that might recoil in horror at seeing a dog beside a very popular dog walking beach. There's water bowls available for the dogs and plenty of other cafes and restaurants close by for the people that might not want to look at a dog while they're eating. Funny enough, it's always busy, even on bad weather days. The oh so delicate types tend not to go walking in inclement weather, so in effect, they depend a good bit on the dog owners for business.

My local rescue have also used a local pub (that has a beer garden) for fund raising days, they also use the 2 local shopping centres and always have a couple of dogs with them as representatives. Do the asthmatic/dander allergic kick up a fuss? I doubt it, they tend to go elsewhere if it's going to be a dangerous environment for them. Luckily for the delicate/sickly/offended types, they are well catered for, ie almost everywhere. The few places that are pet friendly are far too thin on the ground.

borderlinemeath

L1011 wrote: »

I'm entirely in agreement with the HSE here. As well behaved as anyones dogs can be, they are an unquantifiable health risk. I wouldn't frequent a pub or restaurant that allowed dogs in anyway so it wouldn't directly impact on me if one did, but the health concerns are still there.

What can you catch from a dog?
Very little. Perhaps if they were untreated for worms, or were hopping with fleas you might be at risk, but the majority of transmittable diseases that are harmful to humans are passed on from, wait for it, Other Humans!!:eek::eek:

Unless you live in a sterile bubble and don't go out, you're far more likely to catch something in a pub from another human. Buy a drink? Hand the barman money teeming in bacteria. He gives you change, with MILLIONS more bacteria on it. You put it back in your wallet, maybe in your bag, if you're female maybe you put on some lipgloss with the same hand, transmitting bacteria to your make up. Maybe you blow your nose, sending loads more of that lovely bacteria towards your respiratory system. You might touch the table, the person there before you might have a virus and the table may not have been cleaned before you sat at it. You probably touched the stool which definitely didn't get a wipe down. You might use the toilet, touching door handles, toilet handles, hand dryers (don't forget the handle on the way out the door!) and unless you bundle up and wear gloves, you've touched the main door coming in and going out the pub. Probably taking in a few inhalations of nicotine from the porchful of smokers.

And this is all assuming this is a pub without dogs. People need to get a grip on reality. Everything is a risk, everything has germs, we've just been conditioned by good marketing to think we should exist in a 99.9% germ free environment. We need germs to build up an immune system. The sickest people I know are ones that live in a too clean house.

gctest50

DBB wrote: »

Oh sweet jebus!
Will someone PLEASE think of the children?!!!!

oh noes the horror they will get the super-aids

/starts school-dog campaign

Dubl07

gctest50 wrote: »

oh noes the horror they will get the super-aids


/starts school-dog campaign

Actually that's a superb idea. It should start in nursery with PAT trained dogs and give small children training on how to interact with canines, from types of dogs to worming and hand washing and responsible ownership (eg "Santa doesn't ever bring a puppy"). A child would learn even if he or she just watched from across the room or from a Wendy house if they were nervous.

I'd guarantee that a visit once a week for an hour or two to every class from junior infants to second class would be of enormous benefit to the vast majority of those children. After that, it might be best to have it after school. I had cycling proficiency classes in school when I was ten. I wasn't in a position to own a dog at that point but took my neigbhour's dog out at every opportunity. I'd have jumped at the chance to do extracurricular classes on understanding dog behaviour and signs of discomfort, basic training and/or agility as well as grooming, even if I didn't have my own dog.

I know some strict adherents to Islam and Judaism won't entertain contact with dogs but Irish eateries and pubs have traditionally welcomed our doggy friends. Pet dogs are not unclean - just as a menstruating woman or new mum is not and should not be considered pariahs as was held by some Catholic religious regarding women in the not so distant past. Let's have more proper science and less hysteria.

Nekarsulm

You would imagine that the HSE would have enough on its hands, sorting out the trolly crises, or investigating abuse of the elderly by staff in care homes under its remit, rather than visiting city centre pubs to tell the owner what or who can come in the door.

ElKavo

gctest50 wrote: »

oh noes the horror they will get the super-aids


/starts school-dog campaign

This, in reality, is the best possible idea. Having dogs in classrooms will help with the overall education on human canine interaction. We, as a country are led to believe that because a dog looks a certain way it is either cute, cuddly, aggressive, or friendly. Which is nonsense. The more supervised interaction and education that children can have with dogs the better IMO. It will reduce the number of dog bites far more than restriction on dogs in premises or by the likes of BSL. As for dogs being a risk to public health, Pfffft. nonsense. there have been a peer reviewed studies that prove having dogs is great for our physical, mental, and emotional health.

Evac101

Slightly tangential to the objections raised by oppenheimer1 and L1011 but, coming from the country originally, I've seen hundreds, if not thousands, of occasions where humans (of the farmer variety) entered pubs with boots still on from the fields, or stains of a nature I didn't care to investigate too closely on work clothes. It seems like this might present a more legitimate health risk to other patrons but we don't bother putting up signs saying "Farmers go home. Wash up and get changed" on pub doors. Aside from the proven benefits of associating with dogs from an early age to the immune system (pages of Google results from the search term dogs human immune system), the psychological benefits of interacting with dogs (search mental health assistance dogs, psychological benefits of dogs, etc) and the wonderful companionship they provide, pets in public area's, especially ones where pet owners can control interactions, provide the opportunity to teach people (especially younger people) how to properly approach new animals in a manner which minimises the risks to both sides. If the owner/proprietor of an establishment has no objections to humans of varying levels of cleanliness enter their businesses, then I find it hard to find the 'dirty animal' argument based in fact.

pegasus1

The HSE have backed down due to the irish guideline is in breach of EU regulations..
So dogs are welcome back to the MVP

We ourselves were welcome to the Metro cafe off Grafton st. only yesterday..They even offered food for our dogs..

dudara

I visit the MVP regularly and one of the big attractions is having dogs in the pub. It's warm and friendly. The dogs who visit are well behaved and often enjoy the extra attention from other guests.

I used to live in Amsterdam and a fair amount of local cafes / bars / restaurants would have a cat wandering around.

There needs to be a bit of cop on / common sense applied here. It's a pub after all.

awanderer

pegasus1 wrote: »

The HSE have backed down due to the irish guideline is in breach of EU regulations..
So dogs are welcome back to the MVP

We ourselves were welcome to the Metro cafe off Grafton st. only yesterday..They even offered food for our dogs..

What surprises me is that it is only recently that the HSE took the decision to prohibit dogs. I remember working in a very busy pub in the west of Ireland more than 10 years ago when, after the visit of a food inspector, we had to ask a local man to stop bringing his dog to the pub. The dog was very clean, always sitting near his owner's stool near the bar at the side opposite to the kitchen but it didn't make any difference as the health inspector had said that dogs couldn't be allowed where food was served. I thought it was the same everywhere.

I remember being angry at the time and thinking that instead of prohibiting pubs from accepting dogs, they could ask that the pubs that accept dogs put a sticker saying so on their door/window so that customers who don't like the idea to eat in a place where dogs are allowed, could decide to go elsewhere.

gctest50

dudara wrote: »

...........
I used to live in Amsterdam and a fair amount of local cafes / bars / restaurants would have a cat wandering around.
.......

How bout cats in hospitals

Oscar has sucessfully predicted the deaths of about 100 people at this stage

He sniffs the air, gives Mrs. T. one final look, then jumps off the bed and quickly leaves the room. Not today.

Oscar arrives at Room 313, Mrs. K. is resting peacefully in her bed, her breathing steady but shallow.
Oscar jumps onto her bed and again sniffs the air. He pauses to consider the situation, and then turns around twice before curling up beside Mrs. K.

Thirty minutes later, Mrs. K. takes her last earthly breath

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp078108

sillysmiles

I was thinking about this again yesterday when we drove from Kildare to Wexford. We stopped along the way for lunch. It would have been so much nicer to be able to stop somewhere that we could have brought the dog while we ate. But no we had to leave the dog in the car with the window cracked.
Obviously this would not be an option during the summer.

Demonique

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Thankfully, the pubs and restaurants I frequent prohibit dogs in general so I do have little experience if seeing it happen in those places. That's not my point though, its how is a business owner going to know how well trained this animal that someone has brought onto his premises is:

How is the owner supposed to know how well behaved a child brought into the premises is? I've been many more badly behaved children than badly behaved dogs in pubs

JustAThought

Theres always one who will spoil it for others.
The pity is thst now small minded & insecure cafe workers & dog-haters have now the fodder to ask people sitting outside in cafes with their pets to leave. Yet I increasingly see people with chemical cigarettes sneeky smoking in restaurants & cafes - Time to start reporting them I think. Food is not prepared outside & people sitting smoking or shopping & eating in the pyjamas they slept in are more of a disgusting health risk.

tk123

JustAThought wrote: »

Theres always one who will spoil it for others.
The pity is thst now small minded & insecure cafe workers & dog-haters have now the fodder to ask people sitting outside in cafes with their pets to leave. Yet I increasingly see people with chemical cigarettes sneeky smoking in restaurants & cafes - Time to start reporting them I think. Food is not prepared outside & people sitting smoking or shopping & eating in the pyjamas they slept in are more of a disgusting health risk.

I disagree - we were the only customers at a normally packed cafe this morning because it was raining and were warmly welcomed! Last week we got free love heart chocolates because it was valentines day lol! Business owners aren't going to suddenly start turning customers away. Funny the place we we go to has one sign asking for dogs to be kept on lead in the courtyard - a no brainer - yet a whole blackboard with rules for parents :pac:

Cherry Blossom

JustAThought wrote: »

Theres always one who will spoil it for others.
The pity is thst now small minded & insecure cafe workers & dog-haters have now the fodder to ask people sitting outside in cafes with their pets to leave. Yet I increasingly see people with chemical cigarettes sneeky smoking in restaurants & cafes - Time to start reporting them I think. Food is not prepared outside & people sitting smoking or shopping & eating in the pyjamas they slept in are more of a disgusting health risk.

Are you talking about e-cigs? If so, the smoking ban doesn't apply to these as far as I know. There is a man sits and vapes away between courses at a cafe I frequent and no one bats an eyelid.

Todd Toddington III

"Chemical cigarettes" is not smoking, it's vapourised liquid hence the term vaping. they're not banned under smoking legislation so report all you want. Businesses can choose to ban them just as they can to ban dogs. But not children mind, shame, noisy, smelly buggers

dudara

A new dog-focussed cafe, Pupp, is to open on Clanbrassil Street

pegasus1

the EU reg's three main words where dogs are not allowed on a premises is

1) Prepared.. obviously means the kitchen.

2) Handled.. Food is literally handled by the staff. from storeroom to kitchen?
....I would presume it does not mean handled by the customer, except for a ....supermarket like loose veg. It does not mean served..
3) Stored.. speaks for itself.

One of the reasons I used to like the summit inn on howth head was that it allowed dogs, not that I ever brought ours as they always get car sick on long journeys.

There used to be a black scruffy Heinz 50 there a few time I visited, don't know if he belonged to the pub or one of the regulars but it had the begging face down to a tee. More then once he managed to sit on the couch with us and have a crisp or two.

Can't say I ever left a place because they allowed animals, I have however more than once left a place because of some screaming brat running around picking its nose and scratching its hole, while their parents sit around gossiping.

blah

dudara wrote: »

A new dog-focussed cafe, Pupp, is to open on Clanbrassil Street

We took our cocker cross there for brunch on Sunday, it was great, nice food and about 7/8 dogs. Dog had a great time introducing himself to everyone. All the tables were occupied so they had to keep telling people to come back later. Would definitely go back. We drove over from the north-side so hopefully somewhere closer will open up.