What would you do?

LegacyUser

Hey there, Im going unreg for this.

I have been working in a big financial company for the past 2.5 years. Before this, I had no experience in finance and worked in a different field altogether but job cuts in my sector forced me out of my old job.

There are a few very lazy people on my team, our manager included, and the majority of the work in my team is done by the three women (one of whom is me) and one man.
For example, one lad in particular "E" stands every day with his hands in his pockets, walking from desk to desk to have a 20 min chat with each the lads about football. He could pass nearly 2 hours without actually doing anything, but because he's on the office floor the boss is thinking "oh he's busy"
Another guy, "S" ,unless he is handed work, will actually sit there on with his head on the desk, sit on the net, or go and get food from the canteen two and three times during a morning and just sit there eating it, browsing , while we're working around him.
You would honestly have to see it to believe it.

NB: the type of work my team does is supposed to be completed in full by all of us every day. We rarely have work that goes onto the next day, so have to complete everything from that day.

Im only there over 2 years and am already trained up on everything in the office, whereas these two lads in particular are here 10 years and are asking me how to do things. They also havent trained up on more important and responsible tasks , which leaves me and and the other two girls responsible for doing those tasks too because "you know how to do it"

I mailed my manager last Monday to ask him speak to the team regarding people ignoring work, and leaving it up to the same people all the time. He did mention it at a team meeting on Tuesday.
Then, on Wednesday morning, not one word of what he had said was listened to, and the usual crap of talking and walking around the office started. "S" sat at his desk on his phone eating yogurts for 45 mins.. The manager's desk is right beside his .

I sent another mail to the boss asking to speak to him privately. He obliged, and I had a meeting with him and said I was getting increasingly frustrated working in the office where it was just taken for granted that "x, y and z will do all the work and pick up the slack"
I also said the words "i want to put in a complaint about the behaviour of "S" and "E" "

The boss gave the usual "jeepers, thats awful, you shouldn't be feeling like that" etc, and promised a formal meeting before work the next day where he would remind everyone of his words and that he was serious.
The next day the boss called in sick for the first time in 8 years.......

On Friday when he came back in, I was waiting for our meeting, and nothing happened, Nothing was mentioned to me. After an hour of the usual job dodging, I said to the boss, "just to let you know, when you were out yesterday, the problem was even worse than usual with one of the lads going missing from the office for nearly an hour" ...... his reply "jeepers, oh my God, Dont worry!"


Anyway, it's a week now since I complained, and nothing has been done at all. The boss is acting like nothing has happened at all, and gone back to his mildly sexist management . (I was doing this difficult task yesterday when he got a call in for another job to be done and called over to me, "can you sort this out asap please"... so I replied with "no I cant, im busy doin this, but you could ask one of the lads standing chatting over there" ... he'll roll his eyes and laugh at a comment like this.

What makes it worse is I am on CRAP money in that office and I know those two guys are on good money. I've tried taking a back seat and slacking in my own work, but I cant, None of us get to go until the work is done. Also, the once or twice the girls stop for a chat while making tea, the boss is over like a light and pretends to be joking "c'mon now girls what's this? back to work now" (while winking at the lads)

I'm so sorry for the long shpeel. I've never worked for a private company and had a problem like this. I've never encountered anything like this before at all tbh..
(the boss is actually a lovely man, very nice , but too lazy, slightly sexist/old fashioned and mild mannered to be a manager. One of the "boys" in a company that a position was made for.
Thank you very much, any advice appreciated

toadfly

Do you have a HR Dept? Is your boss top of the ladder or does he have a boss?

Mrs OBumble

Find a new job in another company, or at least another team.

Why?

Your boss isn't willing to deal with this for whatever reason. He's made that very clear to you.

So your choices are to complain to his boss (unlikely to go well for you), suck it up, or leave.

Munstermissy

In a similar situation and it sucks. On the look out for a new job! Boys club is a joke but hey ho��

Munstermissy

In a similar situation and it sucks. On the look out for a new job! Boys club is a joke but hey ho😡

LegacyUser

An awful lot of companies are still very sexist. I work for a company where the men are valued way more than women when it comes to being paid (I do the wages so I know!). The men are also invited to go to lunch with the boss the odd time whereas the women aren't.

It is very galling to see my paypacket in relation to theirs when I put in a similar effort, and to see the "boys club" in operation however in certain industries it still seems to be that way. I have worked in other companies where this is not quite so obvious.

OP if you can leave do so because it won't change. You will only become a nuisance to your boss if you keep going to him as he has made it obvious he is not going to change and he will feel you are pressurising him.

Diziet

I agree you should look for another job and leave, or at the very least move departments. Your boss has made it crystal clear he won't do anything, and there is nothing you can do about it from where you are now. But you can move and find something better.

Go out there, develop you career and I am sure you will be a far more effective manager than he is.

BreadnBuddha

Sometimes it's difficult for people to accept where they fit in the workplace, especially when they sit there thinking about how much more valuable or productive they are than their co-workers.

You've just listed a load of petty complaints, things your colleagues do that annoy you. You haven't said you're exhausted, mentally or physically worn out, bullied, discriminated against, denied opportunities for promotion or any of the types of things that give real grounds to complain. You're just having a moan because you don't like it.

You're letting a load of little things bug you, when you're actually there to do a job instead of monitoring the social interactions of your male colleagues, their eating habits, topics of conversation and otherwise. Maybe it is old fashioned, but that doesn't mean there actually IS an old boys club, with a sexist undertone at play.

A couple of male colleagues talking about football? Sinister stuff. A manager out sick and having to catch up on PRESSING business when he returns, instead of following up on a 1-to-1 to hear you complaining about people eating yoghurt? Apalling behaviour. Seriously, you see this, don't you?

It's very simple. You have a job to do. You might not like how low paid you are, but that's how it goes when you're relatively new and lack a decade of experience compared to your co-workers. You have to work harder and learn fast, simply because of this. It's up to you to expand your skills, increase your value to the employer. It's up to you to stay focused, to avoid making a nuisance of yourself (because, that's what it is, whether people like to hear it or not) complaining about things that are quite frankly unimportant.

Focus on yourself when you're speaking with your manager. Speak about what you're doing, how much you're getting done and how effective you are. Stop pointing fingers at others as though you have some cross to bear as a result. You don't. You just have a job to do and the role doesn't involve you supervising or managing the performance of others.

What would I do? Get on with it, that's what.

LegacyUser

Hi OP here.

Thank you all for your replies. There are slightly more jobs becoming available in what I studied for and worked in for years, so hopefully I will be back in that field of work soon.


BreadnBuddha, thanks for your input, if I come across as petty or a moan i'll try to explain.

BreadnBuddha wrote: »

You haven't said you're exhausted, mentally or physically worn out, bullied, discriminated against, denied opportunities

I am exhausted, and mentally drained working in the office, as like I said, I am doing approximately 30% of the work in a team of 8 people and when I ask these people for help completing a big load of work (that's supposed to be shared) I have received a "haha, no, sure you're fine doing it on your own!" "you're well able yourself there, hahaha" (cue the lads, including the manager thinking this is hilarious and all laughing along too)

BreadnBuddha wrote: »

A couple of male colleagues talking about football? Sinister stuff. A manager out sick and having to catch up on PRESSING business when he returns, instead of following up on a 1-to-1 to hear you complaining about people eating yoghurt? Apalling behaviour. Seriously, you see this, don't you?

Just to clear this up. It's not just having a chat about football. As I said in my OP this one guy can walk from desk to desk for a good two hours and have the same conversation with different people about football. This wouldn't have anything to do with me, if I didn't have to pick up the slack and complete his "share" of the teams work (which is under a time deadline every morning)
and about the yoghurt, I know that sounds totally petulant of me, but this is while, again, a massive pile of deadline work has to be completed by the entire team within the next hour and this guy sits there on his phone/the net eating and when we ask for help will say "in a minute" etc and not come over until the work is almost complete.

BreadnBuddha wrote: »

You might not like how low paid you are, but that's how it goes when you're relatively new and lack a decade of experience compared to your co-workers. You have to work harder and learn fast, simply because of this. It's up to you to expand your skills, increase your value to the employer. It's up to you to stay focused, to avoid making a nuisance of yourself (because, that's what it is, whether people like to hear it or not) complaining about things that are quite frankly unimportant.

I totally understand this, and respect the fact that people have to climb the ladder, and find their way in jobs through experience. However, these guys, as mentioned above, although are there longer than me, have no jobs with responsibilities. They aren't trained up on any important tasks and when they finally do any tiny piece of work it will be easy little jobs because "oh i'm not trained up on anything else"

BreadnBuddha wrote: »

Focus on yourself when you're speaking with your manager. Speak about what you're doing, how much you're getting done and how effective you are.

Thanks for this advice. I agree with a lot of what you're saying, but wouldnt consider the things I was complaining about unimportant.

BreadnBuddha

If it's really how you describe it (and I'll accept that given your very reasonable response!), there's little you can do to increase everyone elses level of activity, without absolutely turning the place upside down. It doesn't seem like anyone except you and a couple of others have any interest in that happening.

That kind of workplace, where everyone's comfortable and relaxed in their roles, doesn't transform just because one person does enough work that it should put the rest to shame. Long service sometimes enables people to slow down, to enjoy the benefit of knowing they've put in the work, secured a decent salary and that they're there long enough they'll be well taken care of if their positions are made redundant. I've worked with lots of clowns who take that approach. It's reprehensible and something I have zero time for, but it's just the way it is once that kind of culture is allowed develop.

There's no malice in it, but if that's what all these coworkers of yours are waiting for, you won't change it. They'll be sitting back and waiting for the pay-off. Is there a chance that department would be moved offshore or combined with another department if they show inefficiency and/or high costs for the business?

What can you do? Realistically? Can you move, sideways to another team where everyone's under pressure and you'll actually be valuable in the role?

banbhaaifric

Just wondering how the work is assigned in the morning? Is there a way the work can be divided up fairly before you all start?
If you get on with the other three who pull their weight could you all chip in saying " I'll cover xyz" leaving specific tasks they would have to take on...
Not sure what kind of job it is but would this work?

banbhaaifric

Just wondering how the work is assigned in the morning? Is there a way the work can be divided up fairly before you all start?
If you get on with the other three who pull their weight could you all chip in saying " I'll cover xyz" leaving specific tasks they would have to take on...
Not sure what kind of job it is but would this work?

banbhaaifric

Just in case you didn't hear me the first time

Also I don't agree with the posters who say suck it up or leave.

banbhaaifric

Just in case you didn't hear me the first time

Also I don't agree with the posters who say suck it up or leave.

BreadnBuddha

banbhaaifric wrote: »

Just in case you didn't hear me the first time

Also I don't agree with the posters who say suck it up or leave.

You don't have to agree but maybe you have a developed and reasoned argument to make rather than just an expression of opinion?

Suggesting the OP and her 3 colleagues decide what they will or won't do is unrealistic. Unless that course of action is sponsored and enforced by the manager it's a waste of time and focuses energy on the ongoing frustration the OP feels when it's most likely not going to change anyway.

Avatar MIA

What happens when you go on two weeks annual holiday _ who does the work?

Water John

Ah Bread, giving the good old Gordon Gekko response, again. Be glad of your position and use your time to learn how to become one of these lazy gobs. Except to achieve that you'll have to have a sex change too.

Bandana boy

This could be a great opportunity , it is far easier to get ahead with incompetence between you and the top than it is with superstar managers all queing ahead of you !

Is there anything to be said to start managing these guys yourself .
Your manager is not managing never mind leading the team , and I suspect that everybody behaves this way in part because of his leadership.

Maybe if you start to break the work out , maybe use a white board with jobs as they come in and position them into columns against everybody’s name.
You will for sure have resistance but if you can voice this in a manner that talks about fairness ,and getting out on time every evening, your manager will likely back you up as that’s far easier than taking the responsibility himself to solve the problem.
There will for certain be one or two problems at the outset but most people are happy for a leader to step up and lead. I suspect that will be noticed pretty quickly above your manager and could lead to more opportunities for you.

beauf

sickofmyjob wrote: »

...There are a few very lazy people on my team, our manager included, and the majority of the work in my team is done by the three women (one of whom is me) and one man...

Your actually enabling them to do this by doing the work for them. You are also allowing the manager to ignore it, as if the work gets done he has no problem.

I don't see much point going head to head with the manager, that rarely works out well, managers don't like people going behind a manager either. Also you might need a reference.

I would just leave, especially if you are not being paid well. You've not stated any positives about staying. So why stay? It would almost be impossible for anywhere else to be worse.

Stealthfins

It's happening in a lot of companies.
There's a lot of people unsuitable for their positions in a lot of job's.

Walk around chatty people would be better off selling newspapers to passing car's during the rush hour.

Or being laid back traffic wardens.

It's infuriating watching these people on their tour of duty.

Management are the problem,not up to you to sort out all this.

It usually backfires on you.

People get resentful and could start calling you a trouble maker.

I was once like the op but now I go with the flow.

It's not worth the hassle.

beauf

People almost always shoot the messenger.

As a sweeping generalisation these days, it seems to be more advantageous to move often, rather than stay in the same place too long.

eeguy

My advice is to just do your job. No more, no less.

I worked with a guy that came in 20 mins late, then spent an hour on facebook.
He then spent most of the day on his phone texting his friends and girlfriend.

We had a system where every batch of work was input into an excel. I added a column for the name of the person who did the work (for accountability )

At the end of 3 months I had done 3 times more than him, just by putting in the regular hours, not getting stressed or working overtime. It was there in black and white for everyone to see.

Ficheall

Sounds like you're working too hard, OP. Slow down.

How is the work measured & allocated?
Is it objectively transparent - eg: number of invoices processed or is it less obvious?

Irish_Elect_Eng

You have a great opportunity.

You have an incompetent manager, take his job, if what you describe is true, he will be virtually powerless to stop you.

Start taking his responsibilities one by one, if he is not competent he will happily delegate most of them to you. As you are the best employee in the office, you should be able to handle the tasks. Then when you have the office running well, make a case to his manager to replace him.