Brexit Referendum Superthread

djpbarry

Bit cynical wrote: »

Farage did what he had to do to win. In that respect he did not mess up. Outright lying, to the extent that he did lie, did not in fact help him to win since lies are easily exposed.

You mean post-referendum, when the people peddling the lies admitted they were lies?

Bit cynical wrote: »

The UK will have its ups and downs, and during difficult times there will always be some people who will say that Britain should have remained in the EU. And they may even be correct that a particular problem the UK faces would not occur if they were members of the EU.

There are, of course, other problems that Britain will avoid by not being a member. Other Euro-crises will occur and the former Brexiters will say "look at the bullet we dodged".

How? We’ve been told throughout the campaign that the UK will seek to secure a free trade deal with the EU post-Brexit, because about 50% of the UK’s exports go to EU countries. Ergo, an economic crisis in the EU is still going to severly affect the UK.

Bit cynical wrote: »

I think one of the reasons the Remain side lost was that they were obsessed with Farage. Apoplectic with rage, they made him into a central figure and attacked him rather than deal with the underlying issues concerning membership of the EU.

Ah yes, all those “issues” that the Remain side discussed so articulately and will now no doubt seek to address in negotiating their exit from the EU.

Let’s see, what was there…

1. Immigrants.

Am I forgetting anything?

molloyjh

stefanovich wrote: »

I can't see any mess from where I'm sitting.

Pound at a 31 year low to the dollar and dropping still. Select the 1M timeframe on the below to get a sense of it:

http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/GBPUSD:CUR

Bob24

Deleted User wrote: »

M&G suspended....

I think the British political elite might need to realise they have to cancel their holidays and bring clarity about Brexit ASAP. Especially the conservative party which needs to designate a new leader who can give a direction for what is coming next - leaving the country in limbo with Cameron as a caretaker fro the whole summer might not work if financial markets and investors start to panic because of the uncertainty and the lack of leadership.

djpbarry

Latest Tory leadership voting totals:

Theresa May - 141
Andrea Leadsom - 43
Michael Gove - 27
Stephen Crabb - 24
Liam Fox - 9

Deadline is at 18:00.

May looks a virtual certainty, but who she'll be running against seems fairly open at the moment.

I don't know much about Fox or Leadsom, but that Stephen Crabb is a right piece of work. Can't imagine why Ken Clarke is voting for him.

He's essentially a Tory David Brent.

Crabb has eked an entire political career out of this chip on his shoulder about people drawing benefits. The Labour Party could not wish for a less charismatic, more unpopular leader for the Conservative Party.

I hope he wins.

Rightwing

Polo_Mint wrote: »

While the Brexiters are hoping that, I dont believe that would be the case.

I believe the EU will change their objectives with the Brexit.

The Brexit will have just given the EU a wake up call. And they wont stand still over it.

While the UK would be the catalyst of reform within the EU, They will be standing on the outside with zero benefit of structural change within the EU.

With Elections in France, Germany, Austria and Italy, The current governments with take some right wing policies to please the masses who would vote for far right politians.

It will only slow it down for a while. Project EU is all about expansion. I hope it fails, and quickly.

CMOTDibbler

djpbarry wrote: »

Latest Tory leadership voting totals:

Theresa May - 141
Andrea Leadsom - 43
Michael Gove - 27
Stephen Crabb - 24
Liam Fox - 9

Deadline is at 18:00.

May looks a virtual certainty, but who she'll be running against seems fairly open at the moment.

Results out now:

Theresa May - 165
Andrea Leadsom - 66
Michael Gove - 48
Stephen Crabb - 34
Liam Fox - 16

Patser

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Results out now:

Theresa May - 165
Andrea Leadsom - 66
Michael Gove - 48
Stephen Crabb - 34
Liam Fox - 16

So a female PM guaranteed then?

And Gove off the you Brexit, you fix it hook.

Tell me how

Patser wrote:

And Gove off the you Brexit, you fix it hook.

Could you please translate?

Lemming

Tell me how wrote: »

Could you please translate?

Gove doesn't have to fix what he broke, otherwise known as facing the consequences for your actions (or lies in his case).

Rightwing

djpbarry wrote: »

You mean post-referendum, when the people peddling the lies admitted they were lies?
How? We’ve been told throughout the campaign that the UK will seek to secure a free trade deal with the EU post-Brexit, because about 50% of the UK’s exports go to EU countries. Ergo, an economic crisis in the EU is still going to severly affect the UK.
Ah yes, all those “issues” that the Remain side discussed so articulately and will now no doubt seek to address in negotiating their exit from the EU.


Let’s see, what was there…

1. Immigrants.

Am I forgetting anything?

Immigrants are a threat, we should be under no illusions about that. Maybe heroes like Sutherland have fooled you, but not me.

CMOTDibbler

Rightwing wrote: »

Immigrants are a threat, we should be under no illusions about that. Maybe heroes like Sutherland have fooled you, but not me.

There's a generalisation for the 21st century :rolleyes:

Suryavarman

Rightwing wrote: »

Immigrants are a threat, we should be under no illusions about that. Maybe heroes like Sutherland have fooled you, but not me.

Yeah, Pavel the local shopkeeper is a dangerous character alright. Don't know what the EU are thinking of with this free movement of people craic.

LiamoSail

So Threasa Mé Féin is the favourite. A lady who only two weeks ago blatantly put her own political ambitions ahead of what she felt was right for her country. What a courageous politician

Rightwing

Suryavarman wrote: »

Yeah, Pavel the local shopkeeper is a dangerous character alright. Don't know what the EU are thinking of with this free movement of people craic.

Pavel, and maybe million more are ok too. But a line has to be drawn somewhere. That's 1 issue Britons/Europeans want addressed. And it's a big one.

LiamoSail

Rightwing wrote: »

Pavel, and maybe million more are ok too. But a line has to be drawn somewhere. That's 1 issue Britons/Europeans want addressed. And it's a big one.

Maybe the Brits should consider this more before they start another bombing campaign

Rightwing

LiamoSail wrote: »

Maybe the Brits should consider this more before they start another bombing campaign

Only a fool would think the Brits are any different to others. Europeans are getting sick of the liberal agenda, solve the world's solutions. Britain has accepted in hundreds of thousands of people annually. Can their systems cope with millions? I don't think so.

CMOTDibbler

LiamoSail wrote: »

So Threasa Mé Féin is the favourite. A lady who only two weeks ago blatantly put her own political ambitions ahead of what she felt was right for her country. What a courageous politician

I like that

Should go well with Andrea Loathsome








Sorry, I hear Leadsome, My mind just says loathsome.

Suryavarman

Rightwing wrote: »

Pavel, and maybe million more are ok too. But a line has to be drawn somewhere. That's 1 issue Britons/Europeans want addressed. And it's a big one.

I disagree.

Rightwing

Suryavarman wrote: »

I disagree.

You'd see nothing wrong with say 3m Turks, Africans, Afghanis, Arabs, etc coming into Ireland?

Inquitus

Rightwing wrote: »

It will only slow it down for a while. Project EU is all about expansion. I hope it fails, and quickly.

EU countries see the mess the UK is in, and public opinion swings back behind the EU.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-07-04/eu-support-surges-in-denmark-as-brexit-scare-spreads-in-nordics

LiamoSail

Rightwing wrote: »

Only a fool would think the Brits are any different to others. Europeans are getting sick of the liberal agenda, solve the world's solutions. Britain has accepted in hundreds of thousands of people annually. Can their systems cope with millions? I don't think so.

I'd imagine the British system is a hell of a lot better at coping with these people than their countries of origin, that the British bombed to oblivion.

Actions have consequences, and this is a consequence of British military action. The British have a moral obligation to face up to this, irrespective of what percentage of the population are blatantly xenophobic

Rightwing

Inquitus wrote: »

EU countries see the mess the UK is in, and public opinion swings back behind the EU.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-07-04/eu-support-surges-in-denmark-as-brexit-scare-spreads-in-nordics

Short term phenomenon.

Wait until the Italian banks go bust and contagion spreads. This ain't over.

Rightwing

Rightwing wrote: »

You'd see nothing wrong with say 3m Turks, Africans, Afghanis, Arabs, etc coming into Ireland?

I would. I have no problem saying that migration must be controlled in an orderly, civilised, democratic society.

What bothers me, and what alienates people from your argument, is the flash of racism that is often implicit in the argument.

Why are you singling out Africa, Turkey, Afganistan and the Arab world, for example? Ireland couldn't cope with three million extra Brits, Brazilian students, or yanks, either.

We couldn't even cope with three million more Irish babies.

It's not a race issue.

Rightwing

LiamoSail wrote: »

I'd imagine the British system is a hell of a lot better at coping with these people than their countries of origin, that the British bombed to oblivion.

Actions have consequences, and this is a consequence of British military action. The British have a moral obligation to face up to this, irrespective of what percentage of the population are blatantly xenophobic

I'm afraid you must have got on to the wrong thread.

mansize

Crabb standing down after fox loses leaves 3

May, Leadsome and Gove

mansize

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

I like that

Should go well with Andrea Loathsome


Amy nickname for Gove?







Sorry, I hear Leadsome, My mind just says loathsome.

Any nickname for Gove?

Rightwing

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I would. I have no problem saying that migration must be controlled in an orderly, civilised, democratic society.

What bothers me, and what alienates people from your argument, is the flash of racism that is often implicit in the argument.

Why are you singling out Africa, Turkey, Afganistan and the Arab world, for example? Ireland couldn't cope with three million extra Brits, Brazilian students, or yanks, either.

We couldn't even cope with three million more Irish babies.

It's not a race issue.

So we have established that a line exists. Unfortunately, this is where Merkel erred very badly.

The reason those folks are singled out is they are the very ones on the move. And they have little to nothing to offer. It may sound harsh, but it is the reality of it.

Inquitus

mansize wrote: »

Crabb standing down after fox loses leaves 3

May, Leadsome and Gove

When's the next vote? You'd have to think May will have enough of her members vote for the presumably unelectable Leadsome that the 2 ladies are the final 2 to go to the Party?

Suryavarman

Rightwing wrote: »

You'd see nothing wrong with say 3m Turks, Africans, Afghanis, Arabs, etc coming into Ireland?

No I wouldn't. No more than I would have an issue with 3m Americans, English or Germans coming to the country. In fact I'd probably prefer the Turks and friends to come as they would experience a far greater improvement in their standard of living than Americans and friends would.