John Terry Retiring

Skylinehead

Lukker- wrote: »

If I was grading your post I'd give you an F.

Fifpro team of the year from 2004-2009

Ancellotti who managed multiple players you mentioned called him "the captain of captains" and one of the best players he's managed.

Capello said he was the only player he managed who didn't shrink when he put on the national jersey and quit his job after not being allowed to select him.

What's so wrong with his post? It's not like Terry was better than the mentioned players

Barr

I think what people forget is the goals Terry scored. Great record for a CB.

The Golden Miller

Lukker- wrote: »

If I was grading your post I'd give you an F.

Fifpro team of the year from 2004-2009

Ancellotti who managed multiple players you mentioned called him "the captain of captains" and one of the best players he's managed.

Capello said he was the only player he managed who didn't shrink when he put on the national jersey and quit his job after not being allowed to select him.

Yes he got into FIFApro teams in an era where Chelsea played with a highly defensive system where there was plenty of cover helping out. In big games they would normally park the bus and you'd regularly have 10 guys helping him out.

Since then he's never been "as good" funnily enough and his reading of the game and defensive abilities have regularly been exposed in international football. In saying that he's very good in his own right but certainly not up there with the great defensive visionaries of the game.

But if you only watch the EPL and buy into the British media and your opinion is skewed by seeing him score quite a lot of goals for a defender, then I suppose it's easy to mistake him as an all time great

castletownman

As an United fan, Terry has to be regarded as one of the greatest of all time. Put him as part of a pair beside Rio, or Sol, or McGrath, or Nemanja, and he stands out as a master of the art of defending (though himself and Nemanja would be too similar to pair together). Even made Gary Cahill look like a competent top level centre half.

Panthro

Be nice to go mad and have a thread where posters come in to give the bloke his dues for what he's achieved in football over the years rather than the same oul same oul "such and such was better than him" pointless arguing.
/rant.


Absolutely servant to Chelsea. His blood runs Blue. I'd go so far as to say he's commitment to the club will not be replaced. One of the last of the rare breeds sadly.
The board have well and truly fuct this up.
He played every single minute last season, weve been beyond brutal this season but it aint down to Terry.
Id hope the new manager recognises Terry has so much more to offer and insist on him staying.

The Golden Miller

Panthro wrote: »

Be nice to go mad and have a thread where posters come in to give the bloke his dues for what he's achieved in football over the years rather than the same oul same oul "such and such was better than him" pointless arguing./rant..

Well I suppose if you've certain people calling him an all time great then it has to be put into context

Panthro

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Well I suppose if you've certain people calling him and all time great, then it has to be put into context next to the actual all time greats

It really does, doesn't it.

Barr

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Well I suppose if you've certain people calling him and all time great, then it has to be put into context next to the actual all time greats

Your context maybe.

The Golden Miller

Barr wrote: »

Your context maybe.

My context is pretty much the same as the general consensus.

keeponhurling

castletownman wrote: »

As an United fan, Terry has to be regarded as one of the greatest of all time. Put him as part of a pair beside Rio, or Sol, or McGrath, or Nemanja, and he stands out as a master of the art of defending (though himself and Nemanja would be too similar to pair together). Even made Gary Cahill look like a competent top level centre half.

Jaap Stam, Vincent Kompany would also come to mind.

If I had to pick one as best of PL era, think I'd go for Tony Adams

Mr.Nice Guy

I find him thoroughly unlikeable as a person but I don't think it can be denied that he was a bloody brilliant defender and will go down as one of the greats.

BMMachine

I think if Vincent Kompany wasn't so injury prone he would/will be contesting for those same spots as Terry, Adams, Rio etc

Barr

The Golden Miller wrote:

My context is pretty much the same as the general consensus.

Don't think so somehow.

keeponhurling

Here's a link to his top 10 scandals
www.tsmplug.com/top-10/john-terry-scandals-full-list/

The Golden Miller

Barr wrote: »

Don't think so somehow.

Well it most certainly is. You think in 30 years people around the world will look back and be calling Terry one of the all time greats alongside Beckenbauer and Maldini? Pull the other one. Maybe in Britain for obvious reason, but that's about it

Don't understand how people so easily call him the best ever when he wasn't even the best Chelsea defender in the premiership era. That would be Carvalho.

Then to say he was clearly better than Pallister, Bruce, Hyppia, Adams, Ferdinand, Stam, Vidic, Campbell and the most under rated premiership defender and one of my personal favourites, Ledley King, is baffling.

If you had to pick a pairing from the above list it's fair to say Terry might not make the top 3 pairings which leaves him far from the best ever.

Also came across as a fairly descipable human if we are to believe everything we have read or heard about him.

Lukker-

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Well it most certainly is. You think in 30 years people around the world will look back and be calling Terry one of the all time greats alongside Beckenbauer and Maldini? Pull the other one. Maybe in Britain for obvious reason, but that's about it

No one in the thread called him the greatest defender of all time, you invented that assumption in your own head. Best of the PL era has been the common theme.

Lukker-

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Don't understand how people so easily call him the best ever when he wasn't even the best Chelsea defender in the premiership era. That would be Carvalho.

Then to say he was clearly better than Pallister, Bruce, Hyppia, Adams, Ferdinand, Stam, Vidic, Campbell and the most under rated premiership defender and one of my personal favourites, Ledley King is baffling.

If you had to pick two from the above list it's fair to say Terry might not make the top 3 pairings which leaves him far from the best ever.

Also came across as a fairly descipable human if we are to believe everything we have read or heard about him.

Carvalho was excellent for 2 seasons then woefully inconsistent and injury prone for the rest of his career.

All good players you mention but none were as good as Terry was in his prime or as consistent as him over their entire careers. Terry's had longevity that none can match.

astonaidan

Those who say JT wasnt one of the best PL defenders, like seriously LOL, ye really havent a clue.
The amount of tripe that gets bandied around is hilarious, but since were at it, Martin Laursen for me is the best PL defender of all time :pac:

~Rebel~

He's certainly one of the best. Don't think it's an easy or clear cut decision to pick between them though. For Brit's, Ferdinand and Campbell were immense too.

For non-natives, I'd add Desailly to the others listed as well. Monster of a player and a great footballer. Wasn't at his very peak for long enough of his PL career to be given the overall nod really though, but worthy of a mention.

StringerBell

Lukker- wrote: »

Carvalho was excellent for 2 seasons then woefully inconsistent and injury prone for the rest of his career.

All good players you mention but none were as good as Terry was in his prime or as consistent as him over their entire careers. Terry's had longevity that none can match.

Really?

Adams, Campbell, Ferdinand etc can't match his longevity?

I think you need to re think that claim.

As I said before, I rank him below Rio, but that is no shame as I rank Rio as probably the best to have played for United, maybe England and certainly the best the Premier League has had overall. In terms of longevity Terry doesn't stand out as much as you seem to think.

He has less league apps then Rio, Sol or Adams for example.

Stam had a lengthy successful career also and was still performing at a very high level toward the end.

He is up there with the Adams and Campbells of the great English defenders for me, and just a little bit below Rio. Of course being a massive Rio fan probably colours that opinion a little but I do truly believe he is up there as one of the ATG central defenders.

dfx-

Chelsea are making the right decision, it waits to be seen whether they renege on it and offer a contract after fans kick up a fuss.

Whatever pace he did have, he doesn't now and keeping him is going to hamstring how deep they defend (some might argue that has for a number of seasons) and him sitting on the bench will keep the new manager under pressure, such as the consternation that accompanied Benitez and Mourinho when they left him out/subbed him.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Lukker- wrote: »

If I was grading your post I'd give you an F.

Fifpro team of the year from 2004-2009

Ancellotti who managed multiple players you mentioned called him "the captain of captains" and one of the best players he's managed.

Capello said he was the only player he managed who didn't shrink when he put on the national jersey and quit his job after not being allowed to select him.

Sergio Ramos for some reason gets on the FIFpro every single year so I wouldn't put too much emphasis on that achievement.

Moist Bread

keeponhurling wrote: »

Here's a link to his top 10 scandals
www.tsmplug.com/top-10/john-terry-scandals-full-list/

That's the best article I've read in a while. Really well written. Poor Wayne Brige.

wonski

Moist Bread wrote: »

That's the best article I've read in a while. Really well written. Poor Wayne Brige.

English is not my first language, and I would be ashamed if it was my piece of ... well calling it an article is an overstatement

Optimalprimerib

I am at a loss for the people dismissing him as one of the best in his time. 10+ years playing at the highest level as a captain, winning every club level trophy available.

Gave 100% in every game he played. Had a few controversial moments, but everyone is forgetting the good moments as well. Giving his time bringing the sick Irish kid around the stadium, being very welcoming.

The best PL defender in my opinion.

LuckyLloyd

callaway92 wrote: »

How can you two be so dismissive of the argument? He's certainly up there.

Because they don't like him.

FutureGuy

John Terry the footballer was one of the very best centre backs in the modern PL era. Fantastic leader, strong, determined and immense to have when set pieces arrived in the box.

Royal Irish

He was a great CB. The greatest of the EPL era? No chance.

Forced out of the England squad too early? Pretty sure he was forced out for being a racist.

Royal Irish

He was a great CB. The greatest of the EPL era? No chance.

Forced out of the England squad too early? Pretty sure he was forced out for being a racist.

ArielAtom

Rumour has it he's gong out to stud😂

Lukker-

StringerBell wrote: »

Really?

Adams, Campbell, Ferdinand etc can't match his longevity?

I think you need to re think that claim.

As I said before, I rank him below Rio, but that is no shame as I rank Rio as probably the best to have played for United, maybe England and certainly the best the Premier League has had overall. In terms of longevity Terry doesn't stand out as much as you seem to think.

He has less league apps then Rio, Sol or Adams for example.

Stam had a lengthy successful career also and was still performing at a very high level toward the end.

He is up there with the Adams and Campbells of the great English defenders for me, and just a little bit below Rio. Of course being a massive Rio fan probably colours that opinion a little but I do truly believe he is up there as one of the ATG central defenders.

The only one who comes close is Adams for me and an Arsenal fan may argue he was better, that's fair enough.

Campbell had a good career at Arsenal and Spurs but certainly didn't match his time at the top.

Rio had an excellent career at United but took a while to get going and also only had 3 years where he could be considered at Terry's level, when he lost his pace his game suffered significantly.

Only Adams would I say played so long at the very top and remained as influential as him throughout his career.

SlickRic

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Well it most certainly is. You think in 30 years people around the world will look back and be calling Terry one of the all time greats alongside Beckenbauer and Maldini? Pull the other one. Maybe in Britain for obvious reason, but that's about it

Who put him in the Beckenbauer and Maldini bracket?

You're making up an argument to sound like you're sounding reasonable.

Chrissybhoy

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Sergio Ramos for some reason gets on the FIFpro every single year so I wouldn't put too much emphasis on that achievement.

Fifpro is a very good way to gauge how good a player is. It's picked by Professional footballers

bucketybuck

John Terry is not the best defender to play in the Premier league, and all the inspirational chest thumping captain heroic rhetoric doesn't change that fact.

Great defender, sure, but the best? Not a chance.

Moist Bread

bucketybuck wrote: »

John Terry is not the best defender to play in the Premier league, and all the inspirational chest thumping captain heroic rhetoric doesn't change that fact.

Great defender, sure, but the best? Not a chance.

Nice arguement. He's not the best because I say so.

bucketybuck

Moist Bread wrote: »

He's not the best because I say so.

Yes, I agree that he is not the best.

A_Sober_Paddy

For a player that is so highly rated(not by me) he has an awful habit of getting caught out of position for headers. Being too far forward and when the ball starts to drop, he realises his in the wrong position, a defender who is English so has been overly hyped.

HalloweenJack

One of my favourite players of all time. Always gave it his all for Chelsea and it will be sad to see him go. He's a guy who genuinely loves the club.

As for his overall ability, he's one of the best out and out defenders that's ever been. He's not a great footballer but defensively he's a rock and he has one of the best defensive minds I've ever seen. He's definitely one of the best English defenders ever.

He's a scumbag, sure, but he's our scumbag and any fan of any fan club loves having a player that winds opposition fans up so much. I think he was treated a lot more harshly by the media and fans for his indiscretions than other players who misbehaved in their personal lives.

As for the racism, there's no excusing it and if his England career ended too soon, he only has himself to blame for that.

StringerBell

Lukker- wrote: »

The only one who comes close is Adams for me and an Arsenal fan may argue he was better, that's fair enough.

Campbell had a good career at Arsenal and Spurs but certainly didn't match his time at the top.

Rio had an excellent career at United but took a while to get going and also only had 3 years where he could be considered at Terry's level, when he lost his pace his game suffered significantly.

Only Adams would I say played so long at the very top and remained as influential as him throughout his career.

I don't feel the need to get into a drawn out argument with you on it, we can just agree to disagree if you like. Rio did not simply have an excellent career at United, he was already excellent before getting to United and even when his pace went his reading of the game remained.

You have already conceded the point anyway by acknowledging Adams so no need to go further I guess.

Lukker-

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

For a player that is so highly rated(not by me) he has an awful habit of getting caught out of position for headers. Being too far forward and when the ball starts to drop, he realises his in the wrong position, a defender who is English so has been overly hyped.

He's not exactly popular in England so I don't see how he's overhyped.

More to do with being the foundation of the greatest defence of the PL era.

Mr_Muffin

What will he do for money if he retires?

Japp Stamm, Sol Campbell, Gary Pallister, Vidic, Ferdinand, Tony Adams, Carragher all say hello.
JT the best? IMO no but it's defo debatable.

Would be a good poll actually as a side thought of this thread. Yay or Nay?

Turtyturd

Mr_Muffin wrote: »

What will he do for money if he retires?

Go work with his Da?

bucketybuck

Turtyturd wrote: »

Go work with his Da?

Probably end up shagging his ma if he did that, just force of habit.

Lukker-

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Japp Stamm, Sol Campbell, Gary Pallister, Vidic, Ferdinand, Tony Adams, Carragher all say hello.
JT the best? IMO no but it's defo debatable.

Would be a good poll actually as a side thought of this thread. Yay or Nay?

A poll is for a separate thread and wouldn't be of much use anyway, gonna be a landslide for United and Pool fans.

If you have Carragher up there then his opinion should mean something. He thinks Terry is the best cb of the sky generation.

Lukker-

Lukker- wrote: »

A poll is for a separate thread and wouldn't be of much use anyway, gonna be a landslide for United and Pool fans.

If you have Carragher up there then his opinion should mean something. He thinks Terry is the best cb of the sky generation.

What has Carragher rating Terry got to do with how others rate Carragher as a player? He's entitled to his opinion on Terry which I personally don't agree with.

There are alot of Arsenal fans on this forum so I'd have a feeling they would have a strong impact on the poll if there was one created in a separate thread so not all utd / pool bias.

SlickRic

Lukker-

M!Ck^ wrote: »

There are alot of Arsenal fans on this forum so I'd have a feeling they would have a strong impact on the poll if there was one created in a separate thread so not all utd / pool bias.

Arsenal fans certainly like to vote and win polls.

All I'm saying is polls don't really give an accurate picture of anything, just who has the most fans on boards. Football fans are too tribal in general not to.

theoneeyedman

Good player, rated by Chelsea fans I guess as an all time great but tbh was some way off that. Was fortunate enough to be at Chelsea when they had the resources to spend big and pack the side with brilliant players, and with a coach that built a defensive strategy around his strengths and protected against his weaknesses. An undistinguished England career also doesn't reflect well on his greatness.
Greatest EPL defender, I don't think do. For one Paul McGrath in his short time in the epl was a much more talented center back, even though his epl career was short (after Sly invented soccer in 92).
In fact, I'd argue he wasn't even Chelsea's best centre back since 92, Marcel Desailly says hello.