Gangland Shootings in Dublin MOD Warning in Post #1 (updated 29/05/16)

Gamebred

pablo128 wrote: »

Fat Freddie nicked last night after the Hutch hit. Blood on his runners and tracksuit bottoms. Gardai are awaiting the results of tests.

He wouldnt be getting out if they suspected him to be involved in that hit,not a prayer they'd release him dna results back or not.

donvito99

Gamebred wrote: »

Rubbish,try explaining that to the families of Tony Golden and Adrian Donohoe.

Tony Golden was shot and killed in a domestic dispute.

donvito99

JustTheOne wrote: »

Seriously are you trying to say there was no murders before fg took charge?

The idiotic stuff I read on these threads sometimes makes me think a good portion of this country are braindead.

Every five years boards posters change their "The Government Is Never Right" blinkers.

The FG/Labour ones are getting quite worn at this stage.

JustTheOne

donvito99 wrote: »

Tony Golden was shot and killed in a domestic dispute.

Didn't rattigan get locked up for shooting at a garda car while been chased?

These lads will shoot anyone who gets in their way make no mistake.

Gamebred

donvito99 wrote: »

Tony Golden was shot and killed in a domestic dispute.

The lads in the hotel were getting a life sentence for the murder reguardless,In for a penny in for a pound as they say nobody knows but my guess is they woulda fired on the police if needed to escape.

P.Walnuts

Gamebred wrote: »

The lads in the hotel were getting a life sentence for the murder reguardless,In for a penny in for a pound as they say nobody knows but my guess is they woulda fired on the police if needed to escape.

Think I remember reading that killing a guard results in a full life sentence ( or a 40 yr minimum I can't quite remember) . The average regular "life sentence" here is about 17 yrs, so there is a bit of a distinction between the two.

Hammer89

pablo128 wrote: »

Fat Freddie nicked last night after the Hutch hit. Blood on his runners and tracksuit bottoms. Gardai are awaiting the results of tests.

Surely they don't consider him a murder suspect? The reason why every high-profile gangster has that profile is because they don't do hits anymore I imagine. I'd have thought that carrying out a murder yourself was for ambitious up and comers trying to make a name for themselves - not established figures in the underworld. Same with any business really; the higher you climb, the less dirty work you need to do.

tomwaterford

Hammer89 wrote: »

Surely they don't consider him a murder suspect? The reason why every high-profile gangster has that profile is because they don't do hits anymore I imagine. I'd have thought that carrying out a murder yourself was for ambitious up and comers trying to make a name for themselves - not established figures in the underworld. Same with any business really; the higher you climb, the less dirty work you need to do.

**shakes head**


You just can't get the help these days

STB.

donvito99 wrote: »

Disagree. A thousand fresh faced recruits out of Templemore will no doubt assist with crime generally, but it won't fundamentally undermine gangs.

More beat on the street means more involvement in communities. More resourcing in general is better than an overstretched workforce.

donvito99 wrote: »

Closing Garda Stations inconveniences people who need passport forms stamped. It doesn't make life easier for drug dealers.

Tell that to the people in rural areas. Crime is up massively in the country. The guards are based in x, but that opens up for 3 hours a day, or not all, and you have guards spread over quite a distance attempting to respond to burglary sprees. Organised Criminal tourism targets this very weakness.

donvito99 wrote: »

Hugely. Hugely expensive. What do you want; more guards, stations or neither but years of costly training and enormous expense to train guards how to and when not to shoot.

500,000 a year they saved in closing those stations. The Minister for Justice herself admitted as much.

donvito99 wrote: »

No they don't, they're dogs.

Its an expression. The journos printed numerous stories including one on 30/1/16 that armed gardai were on alert as Kinahan mob fly in for boxing event.

donvito99 wrote: »

The "media" also predicted bloodshed last November. There can't be armed guards at every sporting event with criminals.

And there very nearly was bloodshed last November, with another attempted hit at the Red Cow Inn but for the guman's gun jammed! Again linked to this very feud going on right now.

I agree the guards do not have the resources, and that's not their fault. Point is very much made for them now.

Hammer89

tomwaterford wrote: »

**shakes head**

You just can't get the help these days

As long as there are people who look up to these blokes, there'll always be people willing to commit murder in order to raise their street credit and get in with their heroes I reckon.

Finding a hitter for Eddie Hutch wouldn't have been too difficult. I'm sure there was no shortage of volunteers. This isn't a reflection on Hutch, because I don't know anything about him or his enemies, but I do know that killing a high-profile figure is a sure way to progress in this type of business and it seems to be below Thompson to carry it out personally.

ThisRegard

hurler32 wrote: »

Fine Gael will be known forever as the party who closed all these garda stations making murder commonplace in Dublin whilst those in Rural Ireland are been robbed by travelling gangs week in week out....in rural ireland its defintley going to cost them votes...

WTF happens to good old fashioned logic when some people enter threads like this?

NIMAN

Its depressing to see how much money and resources will now be ploughed into these scumbags, at the expense of those who really need the services of our forces of law and order.

I appreciate that the Gardai have to be seen to do everything they can around gangland murders/feuds etc, but wouldn't it be great if these low-lifes would just go someone and kill each other, leaving the rest of us to get on with normal life.

emmetlego

Whitehall Garda station was closed in the recent cost saving measures, but it's less than 2 minutes walk, never mind a 15 second drive from the Regency. I can assure you, this hit would not have taken place so close to a Garda station. I'm not saying it wouldn't have happened elsewhere, but defo not last Friday in that location if the station was fully manned and open! Therefore the Gov have a lot to answer for.

2forjoy

pablo128 wrote: »

Fat Freddie nicked last night after the Hutch hit. Blood on his runners and tracksuit bottoms. Gardai are awaiting the results of tests.

And he was released without charge - maybe he cut himself shaving

STB.

NIMAN wrote: »

Its depressing to see how much money and resources will now be ploughed into these scumbags, at the expense of those who really need the services of our forces of law and order.

I appreciate that the Gardai have to be seen to do everything they can around gangland murders/feuds etc, but wouldn't it be great if these low-lifes would just go someone and kill each other, leaving the rest of us to get on with normal life.

Unfortunately the next boys are queuing up to take their place.

or as Larry Dunne put it, If you think we were bad, just wait till you see what's coming after us.

donvito99

emmetlego wrote: »

Whitehall Garda station was closed in the recent cost saving measures, but it's less than 2 minutes walk, never mind a 15 second drive from the Regency. I can assure you, this hit would not have taken place so close to a Garda station. I'm not saying it wouldn't have happened elsewhere, but defo not last Friday in that location if the station was fully manned and open! Therefore the Gov have a lot to answer for.

That's bollocks. I can't count on my hand the number of times Rathmines post office has been held up, a stone's throw from Rathmines GS. These assassins were in and out in less than 2 minutes. There still had to be made 999 calls, and Gardaí needed to be dispatched. Its also reasonable to think that armed patrols were out of station on jobs. What good is the unarmed Sergeant in charge going to do when he rambles down from Whitehall GS.

The closure of Garda stations has nothing whatsover to do with this. The reduction in overtime and the effect to schemes like Operation Anvil might have. Fundamentally, there's very little the Guards can do.

KingBrian2

emmetlego wrote: »

Whitehall Garda station was closed in the recent cost saving measures, but it's less than 2 minutes walk, never mind a 15 second drive from the Regency. I can assure you, this hit would not have taken place so close to a Garda station. I'm not saying it wouldn't have happened elsewhere, but defo not last Friday in that location if the station was fully manned and open! Therefore the Gov have a lot to answer for.

Linking Garda closures to crime is a stretch. You need well trained Gardaí that can intimidate ex convicts. A lot of the criminals of this fine City can hit well known celebrity personalities, judges, politicians and the Gardaí. An extra station remaining open is not going to do a lot of good when many within the criminal underworld have known only a life of violence and hard drugs. On an upbeat note crime rates have decreased and lets see the judiciary put away a lot of these dangerous offenders.

STB.

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Linking Garda closures to crime is a stretch.

Are you joking me.

http://www.wexfordecho.ie/2016/01/03/map-shows-garda-detection-rates-for-robbery-burglary-and-theft-as-low-as-14-in-some-areas/

mynamejeff

Gamebred wrote: »

He wouldnt be getting out if they suspected him to be involved in that hit,not a prayer they'd release him dna results back or not.

lol thats cute

do you know how long it takes to get dna analysis done in Ireland?

Actually its done in the UK and it takes MONTHS !!

even had freddy been held onto he would have been out friday on high court bail and off to where ever .........

Rubber_Soul

STB. wrote: »

Are you joking me.

http://www.wexfordecho.ie/2016/01/03/map-shows-garda-detection-rates-for-robbery-burglary-and-theft-as-low-as-14-in-some-areas/

What were the figures prior to the station closures?

Irelandcool

Reminds a bit of Gotham City tbh. All we need is some batman-like vigilante running around the place and job done. Being in Ireland though I think Arrow would be better suited.

Sam Quentin

mynamejeff wrote: »

lol thats cute

do you know how long it takes to get dna analysis done in Ireland?

Actually its done in the UK and it takes MONTHS !!

even had freddy been held onto he would have been out friday on high court bail and off to where ever .........

Huh, that recent case(body in the canal)DNA was verified in a couple of days!?

Gamebred

Months for DNA results to come back LOL


as for the ''thats cute'' comment very strange.

mynamejeff

sorry to disappoint you boys but there is more ways to id a body even in pieces than DNA.

And yes that sort of analysis is don in a lab in the UK and yes it takes months

mynamejeff

sorry to disappoint you boys but there is more ways to id a body even in pieces than DNA.

And yes that sort of analysis is don in a lab in the UK and yes it takes months

Gamebred

So for them to match somebody with blood on their clothes to the hutch murder it would take months to get a confirmed match? genuinely asking the question I find it hard to believe.

mynamejeff

Gamebred wrote: »

So for them to match somebody with blood on their clothes to the hutch murder it would take months to get a confirmed match? genuinely asking the question I find it hard to believe.

for court standard evidence yes

NomadicGray

mynamejeff wrote: »

sorry to disappoint you boys but there is more ways to id a body even in pieces than DNA.

And yes that sort of analysis is don in a lab in the UK and yes it takes months

In that case it was DNA analysis that matched the two finds

pablo128

mynamejeff wrote: »

sorry to disappoint you boys but there is more ways to id a body even in pieces than DNA.

And yes that sort of analysis is don in a lab in the UK and yes it takes months

https://www.google.be/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjV472kgOzKAhXkYJoKHVJdDncQFgg7MAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.justice.ie%2Fen%2FJELR%2FPages%2FPR15000588&usg=AFQjCNFSEM3iC8oPb-tYYv7_q1L7moRyHw

Highlighting the work undertaken to ensure the necessary practical and technical readiness to operate the database, the Minister said: “I would like to take this opportunity to pay tribute to the very important, largely unseen work of Forensic Science Ireland, headed up by Dr Sheila Willis. FSI already routinely does DNA testing for the Garda Síochána and has established sophisticated scientific expertise in this area, making it ideally suited to be custodians of this national DNA database. I should also commend the Garda Síochána and Commissioner Noírín O’Sullivan for the preparatory work they have undertaken, including training of individual members and the establishment of a new Forensics Coordination Office.”

Sam Quentin

Sam Quentin wrote: »

Huh, that recent case(body in the canal)DNA was verified in a couple of days!?

mynamejeff wrote: »

sorry to disappoint you boys but there is more ways to id a body even in pieces than DNA.

And yes that sort of analysis is don in a lab in the UK and yes it takes months

I remember clearly Rté News stating DNA as they announced the id of that man....


I'm sure it can take 'months' trolling through DNA samples looking for a particular match. but not when you are just pairing a sample to a known sample!?

mynamejeff

Sam Quentin wrote: »

I remember clearly Rté News stating DNA as they announced the id of that man....

a right so sorry if rte said it it must be right , ditto Francis Fitzgerald.


still for court standard testing samples are set to the uk for testing and verification and that takes months

same thing for drug driving analysis which is why they are rarely prosecuted as solicitors object to the testing out side the state and no availability the testers for cross examination.

go ask in the legal fourm if you dont believe me .....

Jesus Wept

Wannabe gangsters. Too many re-runs of the sopranos.

Atlantic Dawn

If the Gardaí meet these guys there will be additional deaths from the initially targetted people of the thugs, possibly third parties, is society willing to accept that?

NIMAN

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

If the Gardaí meet these guys there will be additional deaths from the initially targetted people of the thugs, possibly third parties, is society willing to accept that?

They have to be tackled, can't simply let them walk around the streets of Dublin with AK47s.

Having said that, the Guards did seem to have more success in fighting organised crime here maybe a decade or more ago. Whatever happened to CAB etc and targeting these guys, they seem to have free reign now?

Atlantic Dawn

NIMAN wrote: »

They have to be tackled, can't simply let them walk around the streets of Dublin with AK47s.

Having said that, the Guards did seem to have more success in fighting organised crime here maybe a decade or more ago. Whatever happened to CAB etc and targeting these guys, they seem to have free reign now?

But the current law has not been used, the basics have been left go...

• People with no visible means of income leading lifestyles way beyond their means, assets should be seized, dole should be stopped.
• People repeatedly leaving the country with no legitimate reason to, passport should be seized.

NIMAN

Exactly, totally agree.

But why have the authorities gone soft on these folk?
Why are they able to drive around in Lamborghini's? 161 Range Rovers etc?

Atlantic Dawn

NIMAN wrote: »

Exactly, totally agree.

But why have the authorities gone soft on these folk?
Why are they able to drive around in Lamborghini's? 161 Range Rovers etc?

I think a blind eye has been shown, up until Friday nothing much kill wise from these 2 players had happened in a few years.

topmanamillion

NIMAN wrote: »

Exactly, totally agree.

But why have the authorities gone soft on these folk?
Why are they able to drive around in Lamborghini's? 161 Range Rovers etc?

Guards are afraid of them and lack the resources to tackle them.
The reason guards remain in the most unarmed is because there's a theory that unarmed law enforcers are less likely to be attacked/shot than armed ones. Now that may have held up in the past but not anymore.
Apparently Kinahan is worth around billion euro. They aren't an Irish gang they are a pan European gang. To shut them down would take a serious effort coming from EU/interpol level.
Judges have an awful lot to answer for as well imagine how disheartening this kind of stuff is for Guards;

"Derek Hutch killed Barry Maguire (23) and injured another man at the same time, causing him serious harm.
While jailed for 10 years for Mr Maguire’s manslaughter, Mr Justice Patrick McCarthy suspended four years of his sentence to “keep light at the end of the tunnel” and ensure “the business of sentencing” was not about “locking someone up and throwing away the key”.
Hutch had 39 previous convictions at the time, some of which related to gangland crime."

hatrickpatrick

topmanamillion wrote: »

Mr Justice Patrick McCarthy suspended four years of his sentence to “keep light at the end of the tunnel” and ensure “the business of sentencing” was not about “locking someone up and throwing away the key”.
Hutch had 39 previous convictions at the time, some of which related to gangland crime."

This is exactly why this crap isn't getting tackled. Tackling petty crime definitely shouldn't involve hefty jail sentences like it does in America, but as far as I'm concerned anything gangland related should involve pouring cement into keyholes. Exaggerating obviously, but for f*ck's sake is it not becoming obvious that some people are just mindless animals who are too feral to be allowed out in public without supervision? Electronically tag them and lock them up at the first hint of further gangland involvement. Justice in Ireland is an absolute joke.

Calina

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

[*]People repeatedly leaving the country with no legitimate reason to, passport should be seized.
[/LIST]

Define legitimate reason. The country in itself is not a prison where you have to have specific reasons to be allowed come and go.

fullstop

murpho999 wrote: »

So what should they be doing today? Just go around arresting everyone with a gangland connection for no apparent reason.

Really are some stupid ideas people on this thread that are totally impractical.

FYP. There really are a lot of bitter, bitter people with an axe to grind on this thread, it's pretty funny actually!

AudreyHepburn

I have to say I love how people on this thread are trying to scapegoat everyone from the Gardai to the Government to the courts to the social welfare system for gangland culture when the truth is, whether you all like it or not, the only ones truly to blame are the gangs themselves and those shield them.

Yes of course our laws need a serious overhaul, the social welfare should be a lot more discerning about whom they issue payments to and the police be armed and have more powers when dealing with gangs but that does not give anyone the right to act like thugs, do whatever they like without any comeback and, in doing so, put innocent people in harms way.

blinding

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I have to say I love how people on this thread are trying to scapegoat everyone from the Gardai to the Government to the courts to the social welfare system for gangland culture when the truth is, whether you all like it or not, the only ones truly to blame are the gangs themselves and those shield them.

Yes of course our laws need a serious overhaul, the social welfare should be a lot more discerning about whom they issue payments to and the police be armed and have more powers when dealing with gangs but that does not give anyone the right to act like thugs, do whatever they like without any comeback and, in doing so, put innocent people in harms way.

Drug users of all shades are financing these gangsters. Its a bit funny when you consider the boycott that is suggested for some business's on other issues.

Maybe its time to boycott the drug dealers !

blinding

blinding wrote: »

Drug users of all shades are financing these gangsters. Its a bit funny when you consider the boycott that is suggested for some business's on other issues.

Maybe its time to boycott the drug dealers !

I agree but consider there have been a few reported cases of Gardaí selling coke too... It would never happen, sure Gerry ryan had a bleeding heart show or two about how recreational coke users are financing criminality... then snorted a gram or 4 off his living room floor. Drugs are part of modern life now.
Doctors, solicitors, MD's, Benn dunne!! have all been caught with it, so are they growing it in their houses!! huge demand = huge supply=competition in the market place.... No sales on isle 3 goods here, just death by AK47.

mariano rivera

Which of these gangs is Shia and which Sunni ?

arayess

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

But the current law has not been used, the basics have been left go...

• People with no visible means of income leading lifestyles way beyond their means, assets should be seized, dole should be stopped.
  [*]People repeatedly leaving the country with no legitimate reason to, passport should be seized.

where did you get the second one?

are you denying people free movement one of the cornerstones of the EU?
we aren't north korea

ectoraige

One point that I haven't seen mentioned is that the Gardaí could well have had surveillance in place at the event, but that doesn't mean there are armed officers on standby to deal with an attack. Most likely form of surveillance would be an undercover detective there to note who was talking/meeting with who. He or she would not really be in a position to take on a heavily armed group, and doing anything more than making a call for backup could easily compromise a long term surveillance operation. I heard the commissioner speaking and she seemed to say they didn't have warning of an attack, but that doesn't rule out that they were monitoring the event. If there were, it's not really something she would be in a position to reveal.

hatrickpatrick

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I have to say I love how people on this thread are trying to scapegoat everyone from the Gardai to the Government to the courts to the social welfare system for gangland culture when the truth is, whether you all like it or not, the only ones truly to blame are the gangs themselves and those shield them.

Yes of course our laws need a serious overhaul, the social welfare should be a lot more discerning about whom they issue payments to and the police be armed and have more powers when dealing with gangs but that does not give anyone the right to act like thugs, do whatever they like without any comeback and, in doing so, put innocent people in harms way.

The justice system is there to prevent scumbags from being able to operate, and in Ireland, the Gardai are repeatedly thwarted by the courts time and time again.

It must be truly heartbreaking to work long hours, overtime, sometimes probably even unpaid overtime, in extremely dangerous conditions and dealing with extremely dangerous people, building a case and securing a conviction only for a judge to say "aww the poor lad had an uncle with asthma, sure he's only an innocent victim. Suspended six month sentence for multiple attempted shootings, off you go now and don't do it again."

If someone is a violent scumbag by nature, they do not belong in public society, end of story.

hatrickpatrick

mariano rivera wrote: »

Which of these gangs is Shia and which Sunni ?

I think in this particular case, the collective noun "shi'ite" would be far more appropriate. :pac:

Tilly

Reports of an attempted break in: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/garda-probe-underway-after-latest-incident-linked-to-gangland-feud-in-dublin-34441769.html