General Election discussion: TOBACCO PRODUCTS DIRECTIVE 2014/40(EU) ARTICLE 20

dball

Taken from ezsmoke newsletter I received yesterday, definitely something to discuss with any candidates calling to the door over the next few weeks....... me thinks!

Help protect vaping in Ireland

As you may be aware, in May of this year electronic cigarettes are to be regulated under Tobacco Products Directive 2014/40(EU) Article 20. Although ezSmoke as a founding member of Irish Vape Vendors Associaton (IVVA) welcome proper & proportionate regulation there is much that we disagree with the Tobacco Products Directive (TPD).

In summary, these are the main aspects of the TPD with which we have issue with:

(1) Limiting size of e-juice containers to 10ml *
(2) Limiting the size of tanks or clearomizers to 2ml *
(3) Limiting the strength of nicotine containing liquids to (4) 20mg/ml (2%) nicotine*
(5) "Leak free" filling mechanism
(6) Notification regime (which could be very costly)
(7) A ban on almost all advertising sponsorship and promotion of e-cigarettes
(8) Possible ban on internet sales
And more


The items marked with an asterisk (*) above are concrete measures set in stone so to speak, and there is little or no room for interpretation with these. These measures will have a serious impact for many people who vape. If you wish to read more on how these measures will have a serious effect on vaping in Ireland / EU we recommend reading Clive Bates analysis of same at http://www.clivebates.com/?p=3026

The Irish Government / Department of Health held a consultation process of sorts late last year and we await an announcement on how Ireland will implement the more discretionary aspects of Article 20 and the TPD. The UK have released their draft implementation of the TPD, and where ecigs are concerned it can be said that the UK have taken a “light touch” approach.

What can you do?

As you are no doubt aware, we are in the middle of a General Election campaign. If you feel that ecigs / vaping have made a difference to your life, we urge you to let your local candidates know this, and to advocate & educate your local candidates on the positive aspects of ecigs and let them know if vaping has improved your life & health. Ask them, their views on electronic cigarettes, and whether they support light touch regulation.

We do welcome regulation, but poor regulation could result in ecigs becoming more difficult to get hold of than real cigarettes, and that is just wrong on so many levels.

jno547

Add the tax that Sinn Féin and I presume the other parties to liquid nic products and it's a right bloody mess coming down the tracks.

dball

it goes without saying i guess but the tax thing is always going to get us in the end.
I believe that the government are waiting for more people to start vaping, the more that are committed to e-liquid the bigger the revenue.
If they start implementing a tax on eliquid now the price will increase considerably and will put people off moving onto e-cigs. If they wait for another year or 2 then there will be a small tax and this will be increased year on year until ecigs are similarly price to tobacco products.
I guess its all about timing and hopefully its another year or 2 before they introduce a tax.

make hay while the sun shines - stock up now

its the limiting to 10ml that pi55e5 me off

jno547

Time to clear them bloody chicken nuggets out of the freezer and get the priorities right,fill it with nic.

Zelda247

jno547 wrote: »

Time to clear them bloody chicken nuggets out of the freezer and get the priorities right,fill it with nic.

Can you freeze the liquid then?

jno547

Zelda247 wrote: »

Can you freeze the liquid then?

Yes you can store liquid nicotine in a freezer,if storing for more than 6 weeks it is advisable to transfer it to a glass bottle.
There are 3 factors that will effect the quality of nicotine,oxygen,uv light and heat,the best way to avoid these is your freezer.

Warning If storing nicotine in your freezer be vigilant if kids are present as liquid nicotine is Dangerous

PG and VG base liquid can be stored in the fridge compartment but again if storing for any length of time it is advisable to transfer these to glass bottles as plastic containers can break down with chemical reactions over a period of time.

jno547

And here is a little piece from Piratevapes on storing Nic

Nicotine WILL NOT degrade if it is 100% pure and nitrogen sealed in dark glass bottles and kept at a low temperature. That's how professional labs keep it so it’s as close as a fact as you will get when it comes to nicotine storage! Obviously you aren’t going to be able to achieve all those criteria at home (you wont have 100% pure nicotine being the main one) BUT majority of us could accomplish two of those important criteria.

Once you add other chemicals such as PG or VG into the bottle and can't remove all the oxygen then degradation occurs. At what rate and the effect is open to question as no one has actually kept PG or VG nicotine base in a freezer for more than about 5 years so far but it will degrade to some degree even if you do keep it in your freezer. The issue really is with the oxygen either from air trapped in the bottle or through energy put into the chemical system via light (UV) breaking down the dilutant (PG or VG), which unfortunately being organic compounds have oxygen in their make up. It's fine normally because the oxygen in the dilutant is attached to a hydrogen, making a diol (O-H) and will not compete for the nicotine but if you add energy into the system the one single covalent bond between the oxygen and the hydrogen can be broken and you have the issue of the spare oxygen running around causing problems. This is the reason to keep the nic base in amber glass bottles and is the same reason that nicotine is kept nitrogen sealed in labs - so there are no spare oxygen atoms. Keeping the nicotine base at low (freezer) temperatures also slows down the movement of the molecules, which obviously slows down any chemical reactions.

Oxygen is nicotine’s main enemy,
Oxygen converts it to nicotine oxide in an oxidation reaction and nicotine oxide being a charged molecule has free electrons, this is why the colour change occurs (free electron movement between the atomic energy levels). These free electrons can also target other substances in e-liquid such as flavourings and changes their chemical structure, which coincidentally is the reason why e-liquid has a shelf life.

Storage Basics
Always buy the highest % nicotine base you can buy (currently 7.2% legally in the UK) as the less PG/VG you have in the bottle the better and always buy the best quality, freshest base you can find to start off with.

What to store it in?
Nicotine base should be stored in dark amber glass bottles to stop UV degradation and potential chemical leaching caused by plastic bottles.

How to store it?
Depending on your usage if you bought 1 litre+ bottles then you should decant it into smaller quantity bottles containing the amount you would probably use in 3 or 4 months so that you aren't exposing the majority of the nicotine base to more oxygen every time you want to use it. Once you open a bottle it’s best to store it in a fridge if possible rather than just a shelf at room temperature and ALWAYS out of sunlight. It is worth noting that PG nicotine base remains fairly free flowing even straight out of the freezer but VG base turns into a gel and will need several hours at room temperature to be useable.

Where in the freezer to store it?
Purely from a safety point of view it is best to store it at the bottom of the freezer so that if it does leak it doesn't contaminate anything else in the freezer. I know that some people have a separate freezer for their nicotine base but plenty just stick it in with rest of the families shopping! Make sure that the bottle is clearly labelled, not for you but for the other people using the freezer. If you have young children it would be very wise, if not essential, to buy a small freezer to keep in the garage or similar just for your nicotine stocks.

What's better, PG or VG as the Dilutant ?
A personal preference really but with regards to degradation then VG has an extra O-H functional group (3 compared to 2 in PG) so it is possible that if degradation did take place it would be quicker in the VG. However VG has a better shelf life than PG, 2 years compared to 1 year generally AND VG’s viscosity works in it’s favour for once as the more viscous a liquid the less the molecules move about …… so it’s probably 6 of one half a dozen of the other really as to which is best!

How long will it last?
It would be expected to possibly see and experience noticeable degradation after 5 -10 years storage either in taste or colour. Strength drop would need chemical analysis once someone has stored it for that long to determine but it is believed by many that it won't be anywhere near half.

What not to do
Leave the bottles alone! The less they are disturbed the better. DO NOT open the bottles if you don't need to and never shake them as this introduces oxygen to more of the nicotine base rather than just the surface.

NOTE: Piratesvape Ltd are not qualified Industrial Chemists. This information has been obtained from conversations with qualified Industrial Chemists and personal experience and is for information only. We recommend you use this information as the basis for your own research rather than the definitive guide to Nicotine Base storage.

bd2012

As an addition to the above
If anyone is looking for Amber glass bottles I picked some up from ampulla in the uk. Very reasonable. Delivery was the kicker (about 15€ but very professionally packaged and I was getting a good few of them in different sizes). Probably much better with parcel motel.

I got some 250mls and 100mls as I mix in those quantities every few months and didn't want to leave my mixes standing in plastic bottles for a long time. Probably could have got them cheaper but they should last a while hopefully!