Policy cancelled due to non-disclosure

baby builder

HI there

I recently got quoted for car insurance. I said I had one accident in the last five years (it was 4 years ago0 but put the wrong sum down. It was actually for 1800 and I wrote 5000 as that was the amount for my car.

I sent in the no claims bonus information and wrote on the police to show where I had made the mistake,

They have now cancelled my policy due to non-disclosure. What can I do? Will I ever get insurance again? It was a total accident and I only found out because I rang to ask them when my disc would be sent out??

MuddyDog

I'd call them and state your case. It sounds like you just misunderstood the question and filled in an amount greater than what you actually claimed. If you would have filled in lower than what you claimed then I could see more of an argument for the insurance company to think that you're trying to do them over, but since you've actually gave a larger figure, I'd assume they have based your premium on this figure and therefore your premium should have increased. It may not have increased as much if you wrote in a smaller figure than what you actually claimed. I hope that makes sense! I'm open to correction on the above though but that's what I'm thinking anyway.

Chris_Heilong

How long into the policy did you amend these details?

baby builder

10 days into the policy - I sent it the amended form in with the no-claims bonus information.

I wrote the claim was worth 5000 when in fact it was 18000 (I didn't factor in the other car - and actually have no idea how they claimed so much - but the case was closed straight away).

baby builder

I did call them and they said they would check if I could just cancel the policy from my end - but they came back to me to say the underwriter said no.

testicle

baby builder wrote: »

10 days into the policy - I sent it the amended form in with the no-claims bonus information.

I wrote the claim was worth 5000 when in fact it was 18000 (I didn't factor in the other car - and actually have no idea how they claimed so much - but the case was closed straight away).

That's a bit different than what you wrote in your OP. Which figure is correct?

Dermo123

Last year I had my newly taken out policy with AIB/AXA cancelled for non disclosure reasons being cited.
In my case I had a car with them previously, changed to a different car for a year and then was taking out a policy on the original car again.
In the meantime the original car was sold to a friend who used the car in the interm.
Because I never told them this fact, they assumed that I owned this car for a period longer than 3 months without having insurance on it and not having it declared off the road.
No amount of letters and explanations was sufficient for them and I was directed by them to the financial services ombudsman who looked for the same information as they did.
In the end after the ombudsman got involved they rescinded the cancellation and I was able to get access to the insurance market again after 6 months without it.
Bloody nightmare it was and would not wish the experience on anyone.

baby builder

It was eighteen thousand euro - I actually didn't even know the figure until last week when I saw it on the no claims bonus information

JoyPad

Sounds strange to me that you had the accident 4 years ago, but only now you found out how much the claim was. Didn't you renew your policy every year? Every NCB should have had this amount on it for the past 3-4 years.

emeldc

baby builder wrote: »

It was eighteen thousand euro - I actually didn't even know the figure until last week when I saw it on the no claims bonus information

Ok, so you made a mistake to your advantage on the claim details. I still would have thought that they would adjust your premium upwards accordingly rather than cancel it altogether. It's hardly the crime of the century.

bear1

So the pay out was for 18k and you wrote 5k. To be honest if you had put 1800e then it may have been allowed to continue but because the figure doesn't come into it at all (i.e. it is in no way similar to the actual payout) then I can see why they cancelled the policy.
Just to get the timeline correct though:

You requested insurance and advised them you had one accident which resulted in a 5k payout -> they requested proof of no claims -> you got the NCB and saw it actually said it was for 18000e -> you amended the policy and sent it back into them -> they cancelled the insurance.

Is this timeline correct?
It could be that they found out this information before you disclosed it and hence cancelled the insurance. Have you paid in full or a deposit? Regardless you need to see if you have been refunded.
Again, I'd call them up and explain as much as possible that it was a simple error and you notified them immediately when you realised the mistake.
Your policy more than likely would have been cancelled anyway as the quote given would have been based on a 5k payout and they may have a threshold in place which yours went over hence cancelling your policy.
It does look like though that you only told them because they asked for the NCB - it's also surprising that you hadn't a clue what the total claim was for.
Not saying you had ill intentions I'm just thinking from the insurance companies perspective.
Best to go into a branch and talk face to face rather than call as it is much easier.
If they won't budge you will need to declare two things now 1) 18k payout 4 years ago and 2) that you've had a policy cancelled.

ASOT

Your inside your cooling off period so what I would do is send back your cert and disc immediately and avail of this. Send the cert and disc back by registered post and the policy will be cancelled by yourself from inception date and it will be as if you never held a policy with that company before. I'm not sure who your with but that's what id advise if it happened to one of the clients I was dealing with.

listermint

JoyPad wrote: »

Sounds strange to me that you had the accident 4 years ago, but only now you found out how much the claim was. Didn't you renew your policy every year? Every NCB should have had this amount on it for the past 3-4 years.

Why ? If someone made an injury claim against his policy they generally will not find out till its settled, these things literally take years.

Not ideal place to be in.

bear1

ASOT wrote: »

Your inside your cooling off period so what I would do is send back your cert and disc immediately and avail of this. Send the cert and disc back by registered post and the policy will be cancelled by yourself from inception date and it will be as if you never held a policy with that company before. I'm not sure who your with but that's what id advise if it happened to one of the clients I was dealing with.

Too late for that, he had called to find out when his disk would be sent out. So he never received the disk.
Count yourself lucky OP also that you weren't caught driving or crashed as you'd have been uninsured.

ASOT

bear1 wrote: »

Too late for that, he had called to find out when his disk would be sent out. So he never received the disk.
Count yourself lucky OP also that you weren't caught driving or crashed as you'd have been uninsured.

If he receives the disc before the 14 days he's sorted, if not then he will be pretty much uninsurable for having a policy cancelled for non disclosure.

bear1

ASOT wrote: »

If he receives the disc before the 14 days he's sorted, if not then he will be pretty much uninsurable for having a policy cancelled for non disclosure.

But from what I understood they are not sending the disk nor have they sent the disk.
OP, have they sent out the disc or not? If they have then hope and pray it arrives soon and send it back registered ASAP.
If not... well.
Would you not go back to your old insurance company? They know the history and you can tell them the error.
They may be more forgiving.

emeldc

ASOT wrote: »

If he receives the disc before the 14 days he's sorted, if not then he will be pretty much uninsurable for having a policy cancelled for non disclosure.

Why do they ask for claim details if they're going to check them anyway. Seems like they're setting people up to fail if and when genuine mistakes are made.

bear1

emeldc wrote: »

Why do they ask for claim details if they're going to check them anyway. Seems like they're setting people up to fail if and when genuine mistakes are made.

Seeing the way the insurance companies rob us blind then I'm glad they are making sure everyone has been honest with their applications.
I think that even if the OP had said he/she never had a claim they would still check to make sure.

emeldc

bear1 wrote: »

Seeing the way the insurance companies rob us blind then I'm glad they are making sure everyone has been honest with their applications.
I think that even if the OP had said he/she never had a claim they would still check to make sure.

And I would agree with you but if we give the OP the benefit of the doubt that a genuine mistake was made, there would appear to be no way back for him.

bear1

emeldc wrote: »

And I would agree with you but if we give the OP the benefit of the doubt that a genuine mistake was made, there would appear to be no way back for him.

I think in that case he could go to the ombudsman for help. Not sure how far you'd get though.
If it were me I'd be pleading and explaining face to face what happened but I'd expect they will quote him so high he wouldn't be able to accept.
Next port of call would be my old insurance company which dealt with the claim.
I think you can be refused 3 times before they must provide you with a quote.

ASOT

bear1 wrote: »

But from what I understood they are not sending the disk nor have they sent the disk.
OP, have they sent out the disc or not? If they have then hope and pray it arrives soon and send it back registered ASAP.
If not... well.
Would you not go back to your old insurance company? They know the history and you can tell them the error.
They may be more forgiving.

If there not sending it they he should be able to invoke cancellation over the phone, once the insurance company are in possession of his disc then he's fine to cancel. With my company the cert/disc go out automatically once the policy is made live. If I was him though I'd ring ask to speak to a supervisor then ask the supervisor to ring the underwriter and see if they will agree to keep the policy on cover as it does seem a genuine mistake, if not avail of the cooling of period.

emeldc wrote: »

Why do they ask for claim details if they're going to check them anyway. Seems like they're setting people up to fail if and when genuine mistakes are made.

They ask them so they can provide a quote, when I'm quoting someone I make sure they have the correct details, it can Be found on the bonus cert, if they don't have it I give them an indicative quote until he/she can confirm them, because if what they tell me doesn't match the bonus then they would end up in the situation the op is in

emeldc

ASOT wrote: »

They ask them so they can provide a quote, when I'm quoting someone I make sure they have the correct details, it can Be found on the bonus cert, if they don't have it I give them an indicative quote until he/she can confirm them, because if what they tell me doesn't match the bonus then they would end up in the situation the op is in

So is there no means to adjust the quote up or down if a mistake is made.

ASOT

emeldc wrote: »

So is there no means to adjust the quote up or down if a mistake is made.

Yes there is but it's at the discretion of the underwriter. It's not hard to read off figures from a document and have them correct. In the ops case there's a massive difference between 5 grand and 18 grand, underwriters all have different acceptance criteria for claims e.g so many within a certain amount of years, so many claims of x value, some iv seen would be 15k. It's stated numerous times that accurate information would be needed, seems like a genuine mistake on the ops part though that's why I'd advise them to call there company again and speak to someone with authority and try to remain on cover, if not invoke the cooling off period of he could be in trouble.

To Elland Back

Lets just look at the facts that the OP has given us. There may be more to it but we haven't been told

OP had an accident 4 years ago. Insurers would have engaged with the OP, getting their version of events, completed claim form etc. OP's insurers are obliged to notify them almost immediately, under Central Bank Regulations, when they decide liability and then again when they intend to make a payment. Even if this takes years, their insurer will have done this, as developments arise

At 1st renewal, the OP's no claim bonus will have said something along the lines of €5k paid for own damages, claim status open. Now if the OP had protected bonus, they would not notice much of an increase in premium. But I ask you, how many of us would let the wording on that NCB pass without querying it? Then comes the next year and then the next year etc. and still no questions asked. Eventually the NCB letter would say €18k paid to 3rd party and €5k own damages. This letter would have been given to the OP at least 3 weeks, by Central Bank Regulations, prior to the renewal date and long before they instructed the new insurer to proceed

Before everyone shouts Ombudsman an robbing insurers, please question why they take misrepresentation seriously and also why we have the mess of an insurance market that we do

baby builder

Sorry to get back to everyone so late - I've been insured with the same company for 13 years. I've only ever renewed, and didn't go looking for cheaper insurance.

There are no open claims - the claim just over four years ago was closed.

The issue is that I genuinely didn't realise the cost to the insurer of that claim four years ago.

When I realised, eg when I asked for my no claims bonus information, I wrote it on the form that I sent in and highlighted the discrepancy.

I got insured from the 1st Feb. I received a letter dated the 8th Feb from the insurance company to say that they hadn't received my details. I rang on the 10th Feb to check as I had sent everything and legend informed me the policy would be cancelled due to non-disclosure.

I received no cert or disc.

I asked could I cancel the policy myself and they said no as the underwriters decision was final and the letter would have been issued to me today and I would receive it in the next day or two.

I've opened a formal complaint but I'm heart-sick as it is my fault.

They said that I ticked the terms and conditions on the online quote and paid the deposit - so even though I wrote it on the documents I sent in, it was no use.

I brought it to their attention. I didn't send the letter saying I had 4 years no claims bonus and the last accident was in Jan 2012 - I sent all details regarding amount etc that my previous insurer had also sent out.

Thank's for all the help - hopefully the formal complaint department may be able to help.

To Elland Back

baby builder wrote: »

Sorry to get back to everyone so late - I've been insured with the same company for 13 years. I've only ever renewed, and didn't go looking for cheaper insurance.

There are no open claims - the claim just over four years ago was closed.

The issue is that I genuinely didn't realise the cost to the insurer of that claim four years ago.
.

Did you ever discuss with your insurer as to who was considered responsible for the accident?
Did you ever get correspondence advising that liability had been decided?
Did you ever get a letter outlining the final settlement payments?
Did you not automatically get a no claims bonus letter each year from your insurer, regardless of whether or not you were looking for an alternative quote?

ASOT

If youv been with the same company and you were only renewing why would you have to send in your bonus etc again? That would all be on file. Where you buying a new policy every year online rather than go through the renewal process of the same policy?

Chris_Heilong

insn't there a 14 day cooling off period where you can decide not to take out insurance with a particular company, they might not have cancelled your policy per say but instead just decided not to insure you which is a better option than having a policy cancelled on you.

emeldc

ASOT wrote: »

If youv been with the same company and you were only renewing why would you have to send in your bonus etc again? That would all be on file. Where you buying a new policy every year online rather than go through the renewal process of the same policy?

OP needs to clarify some stuff here. I actually thought this was first quote in 4 yrs. But then the NCB wouldn't apply. I'm completely confused now.

bear1

I'm lost.

ASOT

emeldc wrote: »

OP needs to clarify some stuff here. I actually thought this was first quote in 4 yrs. But then the NCB wouldn't apply. I'm completely confused now.

Originally I assumed he changed company and on his new policy didn't list the correct value for the claim, now he says he hasnt changed company in 13 years so that's that out the window and I'm compleatly bamboozled