Leaf Spy data of 2014 Leaf.

Here's Leafspy data of a 2014 Leaf I got today, impressive and a lot of fast charges !

Got to say I wouldn't be too worried about buying a 2 year old leaf, good savings to be had also !

steelboots

Hi Mad_Lad,

Can you explain a little about the graph and what it represents, sorry, but I'm new to all this.

steelboots

steelboots wrote: »

Hi Mad_Lad,

Can you explain a little about the graph and what it represents, sorry, but I'm new to all this.

Sure,

Bat sts :ahr is the Available capacity of the battery remaining, it will vary by + - 1-3 Ah depending on usage, fast charging etc.

SOH is "state of health" and measures the general overall condition of the battery.

Hx is also deemed a general condition of the battery though there is some dispute about this.

Here's a link to the leafspy wiki.

http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/Leaf_Spy_Pro

BoatMad

Steelboots

AT 4.12mV the cells are fully charged ( but interesting that SOC is reported at 90%) , Balance is reasonable with average 5mV and one at 9mV. it would be interesting to see a discharged battery ( 20 % etc ) , Note that as far as I can see battery balancing only occurs on L1/l2 charging , so it might be useful to give it a few of those cycles

cros13

Ideally if you are buying a 2nd hand Leaf you should have an ODB dongle and Leaf Spy. Ideally take a look at the battery almost full and at 20% SoC as BoatMad suggested. That will give you about as good an overview of the battery condition as you can reasonably get.

cros13

cros13 wrote: »

Ideally take a look at the battery almost full and at 20% SoC as BoatMad suggested. That will give you about as good an overview of the battery condition as you can reasonably get.

No need really, I think the Ah reading and the SOH is good enough.

BoatMad

BoatMad wrote: »

Steelboots

AT 4.12mV the cells are fully charged ( but interesting that SOC is reported at 90%) , Balance is reasonable with average 5mV and one at 9mV. it would be interesting to see a discharged battery ( 20 % etc ) , Note that as far as I can see battery balancing only occurs on L1/l2 charging , so it might be useful to give it a few of those cycles

I think the dash was indicating 95% SOC.

It will always read a bit higher because of the reserve they've built in.

pavelpro

hi Guys, need your opinion about battery with below results from Leaf Spy. On my opinion looks ok.

oinkely

I've ordered a v1.5 dongle so i can have a gander at the batteries in my two. The nissan battery reports gave both of them 5 stars in all categories so it will be interesting to compare with what leaf spy says. The 132 gen 1 i have had 1032 (IIRC) standard charges and 1 rapid charge at the last battery report from Nissan. I added a few more rapids on my way home though.

Interested to see what leafspy says

KCross

pavelpro wrote: »

hi Guys, need your opinion about battery with below results from Leaf Spy. On my opinion looks ok.

SOH=92% and only 16k miles.... thats poor enough I'd say. Maybe it needs a full charge cycle.... a rapid charge to 80 and a slow charge to 100 and give it a few hours after that to balance and then check leafspy.

How old is the car?

pavelpro

KCross wrote: »

SOH=92% and only 16k miles.... thats poor enough I'd say. Maybe it needs a full charge cycle.... a rapid charge to 80 and a slow charge to 100 and give it a few hours after that to balance and then check leafspy.

Hold old is the car?

Less than 2 years. September 2014 registration.

KCross

pavelpro wrote: »

Less than 2 years. September 2014 registration.

Even look at the very first post in the thread.. a 2014 car with 99% SOH.

Is this your own car or one you are thinking of buying? Is it at a dealer or private?

pavelpro

KCross wrote: »

Even look at the very first post in the thread.. a 2014 car with 99% SOH.

Is this your own car or one you are thinking of buying? Is it at a dealer or private?

Going to buy. Its private sale. Car had battery replaced by dealer in first few months (Oct 2014) because original new car battery had almost the same as now numbers 92% SOH. After replacement it was all ok, battery was taken from similar dealer demo car.

October 2015 data for the same car
11,000 miles in the year with 111 rapid charges and 360 L1/2 charges.
Capacity is till showing at 67.36AHr so that hasn't dropped at all!
SOH is 100%
Hx is 103%

So quite degradation for last half a year.

KCross

pavelpro wrote: »

Going to buy. Its private sale. Car had battery replaced by dealer in first few months (Oct 2014) because original new car battery had almost the same as now numbers 92% SOH. After replacement it was all ok, battery was taken from similar dealer demo car.

That all sounds dodgy to me. Why would they take the battery from a demo car? It would surely be a warranty job and a new battery from the factory would be fitted. Something doesnt add up there.

Is this the story the private seller is giving you? Have you checked with the original dealer to verify the story?

pavelpro

KCross wrote: »

That all sounds dodgy to me. Why would they take the battery from a demo car? It would surely be a warranty job and a new battery from the factory would be fitted. Something doesnt add up there.

Is this the story the private seller is giving you? Have you checked with the original dealer to verify the story?

As i understand official Nissan doesn’t agree that smth wrong with the battery and refuse to change it for new so it was call from the dealer who swap batteries with demo car to make customer happy. That’s all i have and it was discussed with current owner on UK Leaf forums.

The main Q is with current data from Leaf Spy how many km i loosing with 92%. In general i don’t think car was abused.

Is it any chance to improve current numbers?

KCross

pavelpro wrote: »

October 2015 data for the same car
11,000 miles in the year with 111 rapid charges and 360 L1/2 charges.
Capacity is till showing at 67.36AHr so that hasn't dropped at all!
SOH is 100%
Hx is 103%

So quite degradation for last half a year.

Based on the Oct 15 and the current stats it seems odd.... it got charged every day and only did 5000 miles. Doing the math on that it was doing very low average daily mileage but charging every day... good chance it was over charged or left at 100% alot.... I'd be asking alot more questions before buying also considering the other story about it already getting a battery replacement.

If it were a 2011 car with 40-60k miles it might be ok but not a 2yr old car with 16k miles.... thats my gut instinct. Lets see what others here say.

I got one word to say about it,

Avoid. I wouldn't trust it. Plenty of 2nd hand examples around, this is a U.K car correct ? plenty of them around even with the 6.6 Kw charger.

Currently the Gen 1.5 batteries are holding up very well so unless abused it shouldn't loose almost 10% in such little mileage.

A few U.K taxies (gen 1.5) have covered 100,000 miles and lost just 10% or a little less.

It could be the case a Gen I battery was fitted, either way I'd avoid.

pavelpro

The buyer as well saying that
"HX varies from 90% to 101% when rapid charged few times as well that recently it was showing 61+AHr"

Could this be a case when training of the battery needed, charge to the specific volume fast and slow?

AH + Health will vary up to 5% and those fast charged a lot tend to show higher AH than cars doing less mileage and sitting around.

However, if the car is sitting for a long time at a very high state of charge this is not good.

You will find better examples that show much better Leafspy results.

You will find much better examples with much better leaf spy results even with higher mileage and those are the ones I'd go for, I wouldn't go with a gen 1.5 with that mileage and age with those battery results because after a 15% loss you loose your first battery capacity bar.

The very fact the battery was replaced or supposedly replaced and the low leaf spy figures it's just one I would simply avoid, there are plenty of other examples to choose from.

The AH reading may go up and the health but it may not, a risk I wouldn't be willing to take and the reason I say this is because the Gen 1.5 battery is so much better than the original.

Is this a metallic red car, just read about it the other day? --- It's a very odd result as it appears that the cells are really well balanced (9 mV at 50 odd percent of SOC is better than I have ever seen on our 152 which shows at the best 14 mV when balanced) but the capacity is uniformly low.

The car has still plenty of warranty left so should be safe enough to buy I reckon.

Edit: But haggle based on the low battery reading. The current owner was not happy with the car originally due to less than specified capacity. The thread about it is in speakev.

KCross

samih wrote: »

Is this a metallic red car, just read about it the other day? --- It's a very odd result as it appears that the cells are really well balanced (9 mV at 50 odd percent of SOC is better than I have ever seen on our 152 which shows at the best 14 mV when balanced) but the capacity is uniformly low.

The car has still plenty of warranty left so should be safe enough to buy I reckon.

Edit: But haggle based on the low battery reading. The current owner was not happy with the car originally due to less than specified capacity. The thread about it is in speakev.

Why haggle, just walk away. There are plenty of used LEAF's in the UK to choose from. Why pick the one with questionable background even if it is a good price.

Saving a thousand now could cost you several thousand in a few years either via replacing the battery outside warranty or struggling to sell it on and having to take a hit then. I'd walk.

pavelpro

I am trying to get an answer from the owner on this, to explain such low numbers.

I read little bit about batteries and it looks that such low numbers are quite common among leaf users. Looks like battery is like lottery you can get a good one or get with lower readings brand new but in any case Nissan will always claim its ok.

I still hope that if fast charge it few times after get it to turtle mode the numbers will be different.

The car tick all my marks so its hard to say no at that moment.

It's a possibility that the battery will "wake up" when used properly. Ask the owner if he has been largely charging to 80 percent only. According to a lady from taxi company in UK that just reached 150k miles on one of their Mk 1.5 Leafs says that continuous usage of rapid charging and not letting the battery to cool down after charging will lead to improved reported capacity. I think that car finally lost one capacity bar just before 150 k miles (i.e. the car has lost about 15 percent of the original capacity) so *many* rapid charges have not damaged it anyway.

samih

samih wrote: »

I think that car finally lost one capacity bar just before 150 k miles (i.e. the car has lost about 15 percent of the original capacity) so *many* rapid charges have not damaged it anyway.

Who's to say it wouldn't have reached 200k with far less fast chargers ?

I just checked leaf spy yesterday and it reported 61.5 ah and 64% health at 38,500 kms bought January 2015 , this would not be uncommon and it doesn't take fast chargers to being it back to 65-66.5 ah and 100% capacity. A lot of driving does this and in sure charging at 6.6 kW in work helps but I think kits of driving help.

When I got the leaf it showed 65.5 ish capacity.

So perhaps this leaf would increase the reported figures after a lot of driving but I assure everyone that it's not the fast charging that helps these leaf spy figures to increase. Due to it's history I'd walk away.

I'm beginning to think that after a full charge if leaf spy is showing 21-22 kWh in the battery then the battery is just fine, only way to know is to drive it until it dies and record the kWh consumed.

As you get near low battery warning if you're gentle on the throttle you will get more capacity because it's at a low charge that all the weaker cells show their weakness at low voltage and if you plant the throttle and the voltage dips on these weaker cells this will be shown on the cars battery % , for example, if you have 12 % left and all of a sudden it dips to say 7% and then it shows --- very quickly well then it's these weaker cells that are not performing and driving much gentler well allow these cells to recover a little giving you full capacity.

As the battery ages this well become even more apparent.

All this can be clearly seen with leaf spy.

oinkely

My V1.5 bluetooth dongle turned out to be a V2.1, now have 2 of them! Grrrr

Can't be that hard ? should find one on adverts.ie.

http://www.adverts.ie/other/car-diagnostic-scan-tool-mini-v1-5-elm327-bluetooth/8049970

It's hilarious, some fool is charging 75 Euro's for this adapter !!!

After a weeks driving, My leaf is back from 62.5-64.66 An and 94% health to 98%. HX is back to 99%. I know if I keep driving it will go back to 100% but only from driving it a lot which I won;t be doing until Friday , after my 6th shift it will be well back to 100%. I think DC charging will get it there faster.

Why the 2014+ figures drop when not driven hasn't been figured out yet. I believe my battery has suffered some degradation but nothing worth talking about. I do drive it pretty hard and this adds to the cycling on the battery due to it being charged more often, on the other hand it rarely sees below 30% so deep cycles are rare and I don't fast charge much.

I don't think fast charging is good or bad in normal usage but if it's your only means of charging then I would be more cautious.

I think if you get 21-22 Kwh on a full charge then your battery is doing good and I would , not ignore, but not pay too much attention to Leaf Spy unless it's showing 90% or below health and battery AH but I wouldn't worry about 5-6% in the difference because this varies with usage.

However in this case where the battery is replaced, I'd be a lot more cautious because a 2014 battery shouldn't have needed to be replaced but it's entirely possible it was faulty and also possible it was abused. It's just too hard to know but there are plenty of 2nd hand examples to buy especially in the U.K.

oinkely

bought it on dx i think, searched for own with V1.5 clearly marked in the description, got a 2.1.

Can you send it back ?

pavelpro

oinkely wrote: »

My V1.5 bluetooth dongle turned out to be a V2.1, now have 2 of them! Grrrr

I can buy one from you

pavelpro

GOt some new data after slow charging battery to 100%

[IMG][/img]

[IMG][/img]

Looks like if charge few times on fast charge battery will show even better results.

oinkely

pavelpro wrote: »

I can buy one from you

No problem, You can have one for free if you want it.

The reported health looks alright to me. My MY15 has been at the lowest AHr=62.71, SOH=95%/Hx=96.46 and highest ever was AHr=67.36, SOH=100%/Hx=104.53 after lots of usage and multiple rapid charges.

That's looking better alright.

Remember a 100% charge is only when all the lights on the dash are off, I usually don't set an end timer and give it plenty of time.

OP can you go over this again how you bought the car and the battery being replaced if you don't mind.

I thought you didn't have the car yet !

pavelpro

I dont have car as of yet, going to pick it up this Weekend. I was quite unsure when i received the first feedback on battery status from you guys but after speaking with the owner he sent me the above by slow charging it at 6.6kw
He will be driving it to Port and will travelling 400+ miles i one day and will charge fast few times so expect to see even better numbers.

THe battery was replaced in UK dealer while current owner was not satisfied with it when measure all data by LeafSpy, as the new it was 20.8Kwh. After it was replaced from brand new car it show 67+Ah and 24+kwh and that was the end of the story.

Ah Ok I understand now.........finally.

My battery showed 65.5 ah on delivery and goes down to 62.5 ah back to 66.5- 67 ah after a lot of usage in a week, when off shift and only using it for pottering around it drops.

I've nearly 39,000 kms on it now in 1 year 4 months.

So looking at the above pic I was a bit weary after reading it was replaced, however seeing 62.10 isn't uncommon to mine but mine has almost 40,000 Kms on the battery and it regularly showed 65 new but the BMS in the car might not have been recalibrate so maybe when you get it run it down as low as you can and plug in at turtle, so get home showing --- then you have about 1 Kwh of usable energy, it will die fast so be sure to be very close to home even do a few trips around the block then do a 100% charge using no timers, when you plug in if a timer is set press the timer over ride button and let it charge and fully balance until the next morning, you shouldn't need to repeat this.

Seeing 20.5 Kwh after a full charge wouldn't be uncommon especially in winter if the battery is cold.

Seeing 20-21 kwh after a full charge is much the norm and I would say once you see this after a 100% balanced charge then there is no issue.

You have made a great choice. 6.6 kW charger is a very handy for destination charging while in restaurant/cinema and the metallic red is the fastest colour too. :angel:

Yeah the 6.6 Kw charger is fantastic !