TG4 HD testing on saorview

Digifriendly

Hibrasil wrote: »

Apologies for the lack of knowledge.....but what / where is the RNI1 (formerly NIMM). Thanks in advance for updating me!

There are 3 transmitters who carry RNI1 - Black Mountain (West Belfast); Carnmoney (North Belfast) and Brougher Mountain (Co. Tyrone). All channels are SD only. Quite a lot of RTE's sporting content is geo-blocked e.g. CL/ROI soccer internationals as well as some entertainment programmes e.g. Home and Away.

Rick_

Checked this morning, the picture quality on TG 4 from Belfast is better than the one from Clermont. Madness! Also, TG 4 is still broadcasting on one of the test channels on Saorview, but even it doesn't look as good a quality as the one from Belfast at least not going by the graphics on screen.

Is the test of TG 4 still a HD test? Is it ever going to launch?

pad e

pad e wrote: »

Checked this morning, the picture quality on TG 4 from Belfast is better than the one from Clermont. Madness! Also, TG 4 is still broadcasting on one of the test channels on Saorview, but even it doesn't look as good a quality as the one from Belfast at least not going by the graphics on screen.

Is the test of TG 4 still a HD test? Is it ever going to launch?

There hasn't been a TG4 HD test for ages. I think it only lasted for one night?

But yeah, TG4 in NI is 720x576 while it's 544x576 on Saorview. Absolute madness.

The Cush

A point to note, carriage of TG4 on the NImux is paid for by the UK government as part of the Good Friday agreement.

Regarding the HD test broadcast on LCN14, we don't know the purpose of it, maybe just filling mux space.

Slightly off-topic, red button active on TG4 tonight - https://www.saorview.ie/en/news

Karsini

Karsini wrote: »

There hasn't been a TG4 HD test for ages. I think it only lasted for one night?

But yeah, TG4 in NI is 720x576 while it's 544x576 on Saorview. Absolute madness.

Absolutely. Was watching the Dublin v Kerry match last Sunday & it looked atrocious. All five main UK channels will soon be HD and we are stuck with this 3rd rate rubbish. Its the digital equivalent of the 405 line broadcast era.

Kalyke

The Cush wrote: »

A point to note, carriage of TG4 on the NImux is paid for by the UK government as part of the Good Friday agreement.

Regarding the HD test broadcast on LCN14, we don't know the purpose of it, maybe just filling mux space.

Slightly off-topic, red button active on TG4 tonight - https://www.saorview.ie/en/news

How can Red Button coverage be accessed on a non Saorview approved box, ie no red button?

PabloAndRoy

Kalyke wrote: »

How can Red Button coverage be accessed on a non Saorview approved box, ie no red button?

we need to know what LCN it is on and manually add it .. depending on what your set up is ..

Anyone know what the LCN is/will be?

I just did a scan and can't find anything new.

PabloAndRoy

PabloAndRoy wrote: »

we need to know what LCN it is on and manually add it .. depending on what your set up is ..

Anyone know what the LCN is/will be?

I just did a scan and can't find anything new.

I think it was 42 the last time.

StreetLight

Kalyke wrote: »

How can Red Button coverage be accessed on a non Saorview approved box, ie no red button?

It'll be carried on one of the blank placeholders. You'll just have to flick through them all when the time is right.
I'm sure it will be reported here, so keep an eye on this forum.

Digifriendly

Any idea how you record red button on Saorview? Last time it was on (Connacht vs Ospreys) I tried to both manually record and timer record on my PVR but the main TG4 programme recorded instead. When red button is on Freeview it can be accessed via a separate channel (601) but this does not seem to be the case with Freeview. BTW I live in N. Ireland and I'm using a Panasonic Freeview HD PVR with Saorview channels in the 800's.

Edit: Red button channel here in NI for Freeview HD TVs/STBs/PVRS is 825.

StreetLight

Red button coverage now on LCN 42.

lertsnim

Digifriendly wrote: »

Any idea how you record red button on Saorview? Last time it was on (Connacht vs Ospreys) I tried to both manually record and timer record on my PVR but the main TG4 programme recorded instead. When red button is on Freeview it can be accessed via a separate channel (601) but this does not seem to be the case with Freeview. BTW I live in N. Ireland and I'm using a Panasonic Freeview HD PVR with Saorview channels in the 800's.

Use a PVR that will allow you to put all channels including the blank ones onto a channel list is one way

Digifriendly

lertsnim wrote: »

Use a PVR that will allow you to put all channels including the blank ones onto a channel list is one way

Thanks for this. As the latest edit on my last post shows the red button is on LCN 825 and I am manually recording this. Many thanks for advice anyway.

Sam Russell

Strange one.

I have three TVs, two of which are set to Country=044. Two are Saorview approved (one is a Freesat model and so set to UK).

Non-Saorview works on red button. Freesat one works on red button but with no sound. Saorview on works fine.

Strange - I wonder why no sound?

Digifriendly

I wonder with Connacht/Leinster/Munster all at home next weekend and all matches kicking off simultaneously will Saorview red button be in operation again?

STB.

Sam Russell wrote: »

Strange one.

I have three TVs, two of which are set to Country=044. Two are Saorview approved (one is a Freesat model and so set to UK).

Non-Saorview works on red button. Freesat one works on red button but with no sound. Saorview on works fine.

Strange - I wonder why no sound?

Is the sound defaulting to a narrative audio stream ?

Pressing the audio button if there is one should allow you to switch audio stream.

STB.

StreetLight wrote: »

It'll be carried on one of the blank placeholders. You'll just have to flick through them all when the time is right.
I'm sure it will be reported here, so keep an eye on this forum.

There are a few 2rn placeholders but I presume its the 1440x1080 channel running the scenes from Ireland content with the RTENL logo that is the sym linked red button channel its linking to ?





.

lertsnim

Nope. It was on a different channel. That HD channel was still running when I was looking for the red button stream.

The Cush

lertsnim wrote: »

Nope. It was on a different channel. That HD channel was still running when I was looking for the red button stream.

It was carried on LCN 42, one of the blank channels.

Sam Russell

STB. wrote: »

Is the sound defaulting to a narrative audio stream ?

Pressing the audio button if there is one should allow you to switch audio stream.

Nope. Tried everything - just no audio. Now this TV is Saorview approved - just set to UK. Works fine on the BBC Red Botton, but not apparently on the Saorview one - well video works but silence.

Strange - especially the fact that the other (non-Saorview) one works fine and it is also set to UK.

STB.

The Cush wrote: »

It was carried on LCN 42, one of the blank channels.

At least one of the blanks also has a test card.

The one with 720p resolution ? Labelled Tástáil Innealtóireachta

I don't have an approved box to check the LCN as I am using linux boxes.

lertsnim

The Cush wrote: »

It was carried on LCN 42, one of the blank channels.

I know. I found it.

icdg

Digifriendly wrote: »

I wonder with Connacht/Leinster/Munster all at home next weekend and all matches kicking off simultaneously will Saorview red button be in operation again?

Ospreys v Ulster confirmed as Sky's game (also on BBC NI) but TG4 are keeping very quiet about who they are showing, as are BBC Wales and S4C. BBC Alba appear not to have a game scheduled.

Digifriendly

icdg wrote: »

Ospreys v Ulster confirmed as Sky's game (also on BBC NI) but TG4 are keeping very quiet about who they are showing, as are BBC Wales and S4C. BBC Alba appear not to have a game scheduled.

I would guess Connacht vs Glasgow will be on TG4 with BBC2W/S4C showing Munster vs Scarlets/Ospreys vs Ulster. Edinburgh vs Cardiff match is of no consequence for Welsh viewers as Cardiff have nothing to play for, although Edinburgh have a slim chance of qualifying for CC if they win with a BP and Munster lose without a BP and Ospreys fail to beat Ulster.

lertsnim

TG4 will be showing two games this Saturday. It is good to see that the red button isn't being used sparingly. The TG4 website lists the following

Saturday, 07.05.16 @ 2.30pm

2.30pm – Connacht v Glasgow Warriors
3.00pm – Munster v Scarlets on TG4 Player Live / UPC 602 / Saorview Red Button

S4C will have Munster v Scarlets
BBC 2 Wales are showing Edinburgh v Cardiff Blues

galtee boy

Mods, please don't eat me for this,but isn't time the name of this thread was changed to the Red Button TG4 or something like that, as TG4 HD is not testing on Saorview and hasnt been for a long time, if it ever was.

The Cush

galtee boy wrote: »

Mods, please don't eat me for this,but isn't time the name of this thread was changed to the Red Button TG4 or something like that, as TG4 is not testing on Saorview and hasnt been for a long time, if it ever was.

bk created this Red Button thread earlier today by removing the off-topic posts from the Saorview Connect thread.

It might be a good place to move the red button posts here as they're basically on the same topic.

Digifriendly

galtee boy wrote: »

Mods, please don't eat me for this,but isn't time the name of this thread was changed to the Red Button TG4 or something like that, as TG4 is not testing on Saorview and hasnt been for a long time, if it ever was.

There is still a rolling video with music on one of the Saorview channels - the name/label on the channel is in Irish and picture looks like HD to me. Is this not TG4 HD testing? If not what is it showing?

The Cush

Digifriendly wrote: »

There is still a rolling video with music on one of the Saorview channels - the name on the channel is in Irish and picture looks like HD to me. Is this not TG4 HD testing? If not what is it showing?

LCN 14 and it's carrying an RTÉNL HD video loop (hidden/in the dark), Tástáil Innealtóireachta Ardghléine (HD Engineering Test).

http://www.digitalbitrate.com/dtv.php?mux=PSB-MUX-2&pid=2104&live=15&sec=0&lang=en

STB.

Digifriendly wrote: »

There is still a rolling video with music on one of the Saorview channels - the name on the channel is in Irish and picture looks like HD to me. Is this not TG4 HD testing? If not what is it showing?

TG4 are not testing HD on Saorview, they never were. People saw the other stream was HD and made presumptions.

There is quite obviously an agreement going on with 2RN at the moment for coinciding content that Tg4 cannot fit into their own programme schedule and are utilising free space. Saorview will maintain that they are testing the interactive functionality of MHEG5 on the DVB network.

The Cush wrote: »

LCN 14 and it's carrying an RTÉNL HD video loop (hidden/in the dark), Tástáil Innealtóireachta Ardghléine (HD Engineering Test).

http://www.digitalbitrate.com/dtv.php?mux=PSB-MUX-2&pid=2104&live=15&sec=0&lang=en

Yes I remember screencapping it, but that post seems to have disappeared in the split! Anyhow.

galtee boy

Digifriendly wrote: »

There is still a rolling video with music on one of the Saorview channels - the name/label on the channel is in Irish and picture looks like HD to me. Is this not TG4 HD testing? If not what is it showing?

That is just a HD test loop, that has been running on and off for months, it could be a test for any channel, the fact that the test name is in Irish means nothing. The test for the Oireachtas channel is in Irish too.

Sam Russell

galtee boy wrote: »

That is just a HD test loop, that has been running on and off for months, it could be a test for any channel, the fact that the test name is in Irish means nothing. The test for the Oireachtas channel is in Irish too.

But LCN 14 is for TG4 +1 - that is what gave rise to the speculation.

STB.

Sam Russell wrote: »

But LCN 14 is for TG4 +1 - that is what gave rise to the speculation.

Where did you get that from Sam

They are all unassigned blanks.

lertsnim

STB. wrote: »

TG4 are not testing HD on Saorview, they never were. People saw the other stream was HD and made presumptions.

People did see TG4 in HD. I saw it myself.

Boggy

I actually recorded TG4 HD using DVBviewer Transedit on 16-02 during Ros na Rún and it matched the output on TG4 SD. It was on LCN 14. Also the onscreen English subtitles were slightly narrower compared to TG4 SD. It was the only time I've ever seen TG4HD on Saorview

I can't post the link below. If someone else could it be appreciated


i67.tinypic.com/nxpcm0.jpg

refusetolose

Boggy wrote: »

I actually recorded TG4 HD using DVBviewer Transedit on 16-02 during Ros na Rún and it matched the output on TG4 SD. It was on LCN 14. Also the onscreen English subtitles were slightly narrower compared to TG4 SD. It was the only time I've ever seen TG4HD on Saorview

I can't post the link below. If someone else could it be appreciated


i67.tinypic.com/nxpcm0.jpg

Sam Russell

STB. wrote: »

Where did you get that from Sam

They are all unassigned blanks.

When Saorview reassigned LCN numbers, they put RTE 1+1 to 11, and put RTE NN to 21, OTV to 22. The understanding was (as far as I recall, it was announced somewhere):

LCN 1 - 10 - entertainment (?) or main channels.
LCN 11 to 20 would be +1 variants
LCN 21 to 30 News and Info channels.

Now, I would think that unless transmission charges were revised, I cannot see that happening, but it is a coincidence that the LCN they chose for testing TG4 HD was the number one would expect from above was the one for TG4 +1.

Of course, I could be totally wrong.

The Cush

Sam Russell wrote: »

When Saorview reassigned LCN numbers, they put RTE 1+1 to 11, and put RTE NN to 21, OTV to 22. The understanding was (as far as I recall, it was announced somewhere):

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=94032189

Rick_

So the test I saw the other day may actually have been for TG 4+1?

How long are channels going to on-off test for before they actually launch, and if they aren't launching for months and months away, why test so early? Saorview seems like a real mess of a platform.

I don't think that they're tests for any channel in particular. Yes we did see TG4 HD for one night but nothing since.

STB.

The Cush wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=94032189

Thanks Cush and Sam. I wasn't aware of its existence.

Its all pie in the sky stuff anyhow and assumes the existence of a load of content.

This TG4 service is a temporary opt service from what I can see, the LCN they assign it is irrelevant as it will still be the last channel. It doesnt signal anything, just like the presence of a HD carrier doesn't signify that it is a place holder for X channel. They are all labelled as Test channels by the network operator.

Sam Russell

pad e wrote: »

So the test I saw the other day may actually have been for TG 4+1?

How long are channels going to on-off test for before they actually launch, and if they aren't launching for months and months away, why test so early? Saorview seems like a real mess of a platform.

Everything Saorview have done has been cloaked in secrecy - (because of commercial sensitivity - they are a monopoly heavily constrained by regulation from Comreg and The BAI so they have to protect themselves).

Everything Saorview have done since they started has been a disappointment - not delivering what they promised when they promised it, and deliberately screwing the service - with no explanation as to why - see above.

They have deliberately (and without explanation) removed the ability for UK spec PVRs to series link, and have deliberately altered the signal by including two data channels in the first slot on each mux which screws up non approved TV sets. They have also deliberately included 38 blank channel IDs that screw up other non-approved TV sets.

They have been forced by Comreg to introduce a charging model that has caused TV3, TG4, and UTV Ireland to not broadcast in HD despite the room on the Mux being available - and instead Saorview continues to broadcast an HD demo channel and HD and SD test cards.

They continue to allow SD channels to use 544 by 576 instead of 720 by 576, despite using 720 by 576 on the NI mux. All SD channels should go 720 by 576 - they have the room on the Mux. I would have thought all they need to do is change their specification of their service to be SD = 720 by 576i, and HD is 1440 by 1080i. It would have a significant effect of picture quality and only a slight effect on charges.

Saorsat is another disappointment - only RTE and TG4.

Expect more disappointments with the new Saorview Connect product.

Digifriendly

Sam Russell wrote: »

Everything Saorview have done has been cloaked in secrecy - (because of commercial sensitivity - they are a monopoly heavily constrained by regulation from Comreg and The BAI so they have to protect themselves).

Everything Saorview have done since they started has been a disappointment - not delivering what they promised when they promised it, and deliberately screwing the service - with no explanation as to why - see above.

They have deliberately (and without explanation) removed the ability for UK spec PVRs to series link, and have deliberately altered the signal by including two data channels in the first slot on each mux which screws up non approved TV sets. They have also deliberately included 38 blank channel IDs that screw up other non-approved TV sets.

They have been forced by Comreg to introduce a charging model that has caused TV3, TG4, and UTV Ireland to not broadcast in HD despite the room on the Mux being available - and instead Saorview continues to broadcast an HD demo channel and HD and SD test cards.

They continue to allow SD channels to use 544 by 576 instead of 720 by 576, despite using 720 by 576 on the NI mux. All SD channels should go 720 by 576 - they have the room on the Mux. I would have thought all they need to do is change their specification of their service to be SD = 720 by 576i, and HD is 1440 by 1080i. It would have a significant effect of picture quality and only a slight effect on charges.

Saorsat is another disappointment - only RTE and TG4.

Expect more disappointments with the new Saorview Connect product.

This is quite a damning report you give. I have no reason to disbelieve any of what you have stated and as I live in NI I am annoyed by all these blank channels. Also I have a Sony Freeview HD PVR which does not allow me to reorder channels so those Saorview channels on the second mux are way down near the bottom of the channel list. Since Channel 5 has now gone HD on Freeview its time that TV3/TG4 went HD on Saorview.

former total

Digifriendly wrote: »

This is quite a damning report you give. I have no reason to disbelieve any of what you have stated and as I live in NI I am annoyed by all these blank channels. Also I have a Sony Freeview HD PVR which does not allow me to reorder channels so those Saorview channels on the second mux are way down near the bottom of the channel list. Since Channel 5 has now gone HD on Freeview its time that TV3/TG4 went HD on Saorview.

But it's TV3's own decision not to go HD. I know the retort will be that carriage fees are too high but that's the way of it. If TV3 won't pony up then that's their call.

Sam Russell

former total wrote: »

But it's TV3's own decision not to go HD. I know the retort will be that carriage fees are too high but that's the way of it. If TV3 won't pony up then that's their call.

No, there is nothing to stop 2RN saying the specification for SD is now 720 by 576, and that all SD channels will be that from now on. This would only result in about a 10% to 20% rise in transmission charges because more of the mux capacity would be used (and therefore paid for) and since it would apply to all channels, they would all pay it - only RTE would benefit because they have two HD channels. Currently, I reckon that RTE pay €8 million of the €12 million to transmit Saorview. They pay another million for Saorsat. It would cost the three broadcasters a bit less than €2m between them to go 720 by 576 which is about €400k per channel with significant improvement in PQ.

gordongekko

Sam Russell wrote: »

No, there is nothing to stop 2RN saying the specification for SD is now 720 by 576, and that all SD channels will be that from now on. This would only result in about a 10% to 20% rise in transmission charges because more of the mux capacity would be used (and therefore paid for) and since it would apply to all channels, they would all pay it - only RTE would benefit because they have two HD channels. Currently, I reckon that RTE pay €8 million of the €12 million to transmit Saorview. They pay another million for Saorsat. It would cost the three broadcasters a bit less than €2m between them to go 720 by 576 which is about €400k per channel with significant improvement in PQ.

400k will pay for a lot of makeup for Lucy Kennedy

Sam Russell

gordongekko wrote: »

400k will pay for a lot of makeup for Lucy Kennedy

She would need it if the improve PQ.

Mickey Mike

Just came across this thread and read all. It leaves me feeling a bit sick in the stomach. Comreg or any of that crowd don't seem to give a damn. By all pulling together they could resolve all of this. Resolve what one might say 'sur its all common sense' Just down right blagarding by the powers that be.

aindriu80

I see TG4 HD on Sky now but didn't see anything on Saorview

jelutong

Just copped it on SKY now myself. Good news