Secondary school detention concerns

SAMTALK

Gebgbegb wrote: »

in fairness though the OP stated that the child was 'no angel' either.

And again if you read back my posts i have made reference to that .
And as I have already said most kids are "no angels" yet it doesnt make them delinquents either

eurokev

OP were you on detention when your class were doing full stops in school..

Seriously though, you should be ashamed of yourself, your son will never learn a lesson with you as a parent. God help him when he hits the real world.

You are making an issue out of something very minor. In fact if your son just manned up and took the punishment on the chin, teachers would have much more respect for him. I just can't see the lad amounting to much with this type of behavior and parenting

feargale

SAMTALK wrote: »

For sure beveragelady there are parents like this in every school.
I just think people are a bit harsh with OP as people seem to be making the assumption that her child is bad/trouble maker.

If that is so why doesn't OP clear that up by answering a few questions and giving a few details?

weldoninhio

SAMTALK wrote: »

As I dared to be critical of teachers can I take it I'm included in this?

I didnt have any problems when I was in school.

I did have a couple of issues in my childs school as stated and they were dealt with. No fuss. No shouting. No bullying of teacher.

My point is that sometimes teachers can get it wrong.

Yes a child that continually disrupts a class is a problem both for teacher and other pupils but I think people seem to be judging OP harshly. She has admitted that her son is no angel and has got notes/detention but maybe this time the teacher is wrong.

We would need to hear teachers side of the story to know for sure but I think having a go at OP is a bit harsh

We haven't even gotten the OPs side of the story because she keeps going on a rant every time she is asked a question. She has given zero evidence of any "bullying", she has changed her story several times, she refuses to answer straightforward questions and has even jumped down the throats of people supporting her on this thread

amdublin

Op please post a coherent sequence of events of what actually happened. I've read the whole thread and cannot make head nor tails.

I've said before and I'll say it again, if I was you I'd let this go and get on with the bigger picture of helping my son through his junior cert.

Frankly allowing this be used as a distraction is not helping your son in the long run.

maggiepip

eurokev wrote: »

OP were you on detention when your class were doing full stops in school..

Seriously though, you should be ashamed of yourself, your son will never learn a lesson with you as a parent. God help him when he hits the real world.

You are making an issue out of something very minor. In fact if your son just manned up and took the punishment on the chin, teachers would have much more respect for him. I just can't see the lad amounting to much with this type of behavior and parenting

YOU should be ashamed of yourself posting rubbish like this.

byhookorbycrook

I'm going to ask one last time, what form is the bullying the teacher is alleged to be doing to this boy?

Has there been an allegation made of teacher bullying made to the school?

What was the outcome of the ensuing investigation? Without these answers, the OP is losing any shred of credibility.

SAMTALK

feargale wrote: »

If that is so why doesn't OP clear that up by answering a few questions and giving a few details?

I get the feeling OP has abandoned us. To be honest I dont think she expected some of the hostility she got. I like to give people a chance and I dont think she deserves some of the comnents made here.

byhookorbycrook

SAMTALK wrote: »

I get the feeling OP has abandoned us. To be honest I dont think she expected some of the hostility she got..

Actually, I think she has departed the thread as people didn't agree 100% with her about detention being illegal and not wanting to actually specify how the teacher was allegedly bullying her child, leading me to believe that it wasn't a case of bullying but rather a parent who has an issue with her child being corrected.

NO teacher I know would want to have to sit with a child all day for a very minor once off misdemeanor.

haveringchick

SAMTALK wrote: »

I get the feeling OP has abandoned us. To be honest I dont think she expected some of the hostility she got. I like to give people a chance and I dont think she deserves some of the comnents made here.

I'm sympathetic to a point aswell, unfortunately, in the real world, when you bandy about words like "bullying " and "legal" and claim to have confronted someone else's teenage daughter, before confronting a teacher, then that gets folks backs up.
As I said already, parents are sick to their back teeth of disruptive pupils and their equally disruptive parents
The best way to support your child is to teach them to have manners and consideration for others, to be kind in as much as you can and to appreciate the opportunity to learn and improve your prospects
The OP is teaching her son to meet authority in a defensive confrontational manner
Sooner or later he will have to face authority, a boss, a Garda etc as an adult.
Will she come running then and how will that work for him?

SAMTALK

haveringchick wrote: »

I'm sympathetic toa point aswell, unfortunately, in the real world, when you bandy about words like "bullying " and "legal" and claim to have confronted someone else's teenage daughter, before confronting a teacher, then that gets folks backs up.
As I said already, parents are sick to their back teeth of disruptive pupils and their equally disruptive parents
The best way to support your child is to teach them to have manners and consideration for others, to be kind in as much as you can and to appreciate the opportunity to learn and improve your prospects
The OP is teaching her son to meet authority in a defensive confrontational manner
Sooner or later he will have to face authority, a boss, a Garda etc as an adult.
Will she come running then and how will that work for him?

I get what you're saying but I dont see that OP is disruptive as such just because she had an issue with school. Correct me if im wrong but I didnt get the impression she was in that often. I'm not sure why pupil got other detentions.

In our school if u get so many notes in a week you get detention. These notes might be for forgotten books, wrong jacket etc so not exactly disruptive behaviour.

I do agree there has to be rules and as you say it sets you up for the real world but I also feel that if OP felt there was a problem she had a right to talk to teacher who she says changed her story

And yes before anyone jumps down my neck it would help if OP clarified a few points

evolving_doors

SAMTALK wrote: »

I get the feeling OP has abandoned us. To be honest I dont think she expected some of the hostility she got. I like to give people a chance and I dont think she deserves some of the comnents made here.

In fairness too the OP has stayed on and responded longer than most parents who have grievances against a school do when they come on boards.

It's usually the way with these 'Parents Vs School Vs Teachers Vs Student Vs Offspring' threads that more information is demanded and that invariably ends up going around in unsatisfied circles. The Parent is reporting stuff said 1st,2nd and 3rd hand (and I think this parent has being doing his best to try and give their version of events).

At the end of the day we will never be happy with the information given and it's too easy to pick apart what was or wasn't said as none of us were there.

Is it legal?

I'd say no-one has offered any suggestion of illegality on this thread.

evolving_doors

SAMTALK wrote: »

I get what you're saying but I dont see that OP is disruptive as such just because she had an issue with school. Correct me if im wrong but I didnt get the impression she was in that often. I'm not sure why pupil got other detentions.

In our school if u get so many notes in a week you get detention. These notes might be for forgotten books, wrong jacket etc so not exactly disruptive behaviour.

I do agree there has to be rules and as you say it sets you up for the real world but I also feel that if OP felt there was a problem she had a right to talk to teacher who she says changed her story

And yes before anyone jumps down my neck it would help if OP clarified a few points

In our school there's quite a few things that'll get you an automatic in-house detention (but we do the 3 strikes rule too!). Walking out of class/school is one of them.

SAMTALK

Gebgbegb wrote: »

In our school there's quite a few things that'll get you an automatic in-house detention (but we do the 3 strikes rule too!). Walking out of class/school is one of them.

And rightly so.. I do sympatise with teachers to a certain degree. I most certainly wouldnt like their job.

The point I was making is that OP felt she had a grievance and is entitled to air this but I think some posters were harsh (and in some cases rude) and I dont think OP deserved it

Mary63

Forgotten books,wrong jackets etc is disruptive behaviour after the first few weeks in first year.

Correcting this laziness is taking up teachers time and energy and its affecting the learning outcomes for the students who have the right books and who want to learn.

SAMTALK

Mary63 wrote: »

Forgotten books,wrong jackets etc is disruptive behaviour after the first few weeks in first year.

Correcting this laziness is taking up teachers time and energy and its affecting the learning outcomes for the students who have the right books and who want to learn.

Distruptive behaviour or laziness?
I doubt very much if there is a student who hasnt ever forgptten a book.

Mary63

It is disruptive,how could it not be if the teacher has to spend time in every class giving out because the same idiot has forgotten the book yet again.

If this takes up five minutes of every class and you have eight classes a day thats forty minutes worth of teaching time wasted and this is unfair on the teacher and the students who manage to have the right book.

gormdubhgorm

SAMTALK wrote: »

Distruptive behaviour or laziness?
I doubt very much if there is a student who hasnt ever forgptten a book.

But an example of how this can be disruptive.
Class starts 9.15
9.20 student arrives late
9.25 Student says I forgot me book can I share with xyz?
9.30 student finishes dragging desk over to xyz desk making racket
9.35 miss/sir has anyone got the loan of a pen?
9.45 miss/sir can I go to the toilet? Ah jayus miss/sir I am bursting,
9.50 student is talking and messing with student xyz
10.00 class over student runs out of room

SAMTALK

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

But an example of how this can be disruptive.
Class starts 9.15
9.20 student arrives late
9.25 Student says I forgot me book can I share with xyz?
9.30 student finishes dragging desk over to xyz desk making racket
9.35 miss/sir has anyone got the loan of a pen?
9.45 miss/sir can I go to the toilet? Ah jayus miss/sir I am bursting,
9.50 student is talking and messing with student xyz
10.00 class over student runs out of room

Well if this is all from the one student there most definetly is a problem!!
And from reading back on posts it seems it will lead to bag snatching /guards/court

There seems to be a lot of surmising about this pupil but few seem to pick up on the fact that the teacher changed her story and that school said they would start with a clean state

I would imagine if a pupil is as troublesome as some posters are inferring the school would be looking at a suspension surely

REXER

Mary63 wrote: »

It is disruptive,how could it not be if the teacher has to spend time in every class giving out because the same idiot has forgotten the book yet again.

If this takes up five minutes of every class and you have eight classes a day thats forty minutes worth of teaching time wasted and this is unfair on the teacher and the students who manage to have the right book.

I certainly hope that you are not a teacher with that sort of attitude. Applying that sort of label to any child is just not on!

SAMTALK

Mary63 wrote: »

It is disruptive,how could it not be if the teacher has to spend time in every class giving out because the same idiot has forgotten the book yet again.

If this takes up five minutes of every class and you have eight classes a day thats forty minutes worth of teaching time wasted and this is unfair on the teacher and the students who manage to have the right book.

Yes if its a regular thing with the same pupil it is a problem

iguana

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Actually, I think she has departed the thread as people didn't agree 100% with her about detention being illegal and not wanting to actually specify how the teacher was allegedly bullying her child, leading me to believe that it wasn't a case of bullying but rather a parent who has an issue with her child being corrected.

NO teacher I know would want to have to sit with a child all day for a very minor once off misdemeanor.

The behaviour of an awful lot of posters on this thread has skirted very close to the line of bullying the op. As the parent of a preschool aged child it's frankly quite scary. The nasty, dismissive way she has been treated, the badgering way she is constantly being asked questions (in spite of boards policy) most of which she has answered repeatedly, the replies that seem founded on disproven theories of child psychology, the clear closing of the ranks by the teachers. It all seems evidence of an authoritarian culture in education that I honestly believed we'd moved on from.

REXER

iguana wrote: »

The behaviour of an awful lot of posters on this thread has skirted very close to the line of bullying the op. As the parent of a preschool aged child it's frankly quite scary. The nasty, dismissive way she has been treated, the badgering way she is constantly being asked questions (in spite of boards policy) most of which she has answered repeatedly, the replies that seem founded on disproven theories of child psychology, the clear closing of the ranks by the teachers. It all seems evidence of an authoritarian culture in education that I honestly believed we'd moved on from.

Agreed, obviously parents and the general public have a lot more work to do to correct this!

seavill

Just to clarify from being in the teaching and lecturing forum there was only 3-4 teachers posting in this thread the majority of people were not teachers passing comment so I don't see it as helpful to start slating and criticising teachers now.
I have already said that personally , as a teacher, I found a lot of the comments too critical and out of line about the parent and child. Most jumping to a lot of conclusions with little to back up the opinion.

The thread fell apart from lack of a coherent story with too many holes and unanswered questions to be able to form a proper opinion. Then aggression from both sides from about page two sent the page down hill.
There wasn't a full story from the ops side and obviously we didn't have the other side of the story.

The strongest opinions and the rude comments came from non teachers. Look at early comments from spurious, byhookorbycrook and Beverly lady (I think is the name) in general trying to possibly give the other side and suggesting the only solution being meet the school again it took about 5 pages for the op to say they were going in again Monday to talk about it.
My long lost a few pages back was trying to put the story together and help it make sense in one post. There was no closing ranks there either.

If people just stuck to the issue rather than blaming teachers, passing unfounded comments about the op or disparaging comments about the child that have no basis this thread would be fine.
I would have expected a mod wouldn't get involved in that side of things

SAMTALK

seavill wrote: »

Just to clarify from being in the teaching and lecturing forum there was only 3-4 teachers posting in this thread the majority of people were not teachers passing comment so I don't see it as helpful to start slating and criticising teachers now.
I have already said that personally , as a teacher, I found a lot of the comments too critical and out of line about the parent and child. Most jumping to a lot of conclusions with little to back up the opinion.

The thread fell apart from lack of a coherent story with too many holes and unanswered questions to be able to form a proper opinion. Then aggression from both sides from about page two sent the page down hill.
There wasn't a full story from the ops side and obviously we didn't have the other side of the story.

The strongest opinions and the rude comments came from non teachers. Look at early comments from spurious, byhookorbycrook and Beverly lady (I think is the name) in general trying to possibly give the other side and suggesting the only solution being meet the school again it took about 5 pages for the op to say they were going in again Monday to talk about it.
My long lost a few pages back was trying to put the story together and help it make sense in one post. There was no closing ranks there either.

If people just stuck to the issue rather than blaming teachers, passing unfounded comments about the op or disparaging comments about the child that have no basis this thread would be fine.
I would have expected a mod wouldn't get involved in that side of things

We actually dont know how many are teachers or not for a fact.
I dont see any slating of teachers here to be honest.
Yes I agree that OP and child did get a hard time here and yes there does need to be clarification from OP

stoplooklisten

OP chat to your son and ask him what he thinks needs to happen so that the situation can be resolved and his earning can move forward.

Also ask him if he is struggling with the content of the lessons in that subject


Chat to him and not confront him.

Get him to come up with a workable solution

seavill

SAMTALK wrote: »

We actually dont know how many are teachers or not for a fact.
I dont see any slating of teachers here to be honest.
Yes I agree that OP and child did get a hard time here and yes there does need to be clarification from OP

The post from the mod above was starting to blame teachers closing of ranks and implying other things. I was suggestion there's no need to go down that road in the same way I said there was no need to criticise the parent or child.

Several so people with strong opinions have said they are not teachers.
The majority of teachers post in the t&L forum at some stage so I stand over the correct point that the majority of people here posting were not teachers

SAMTALK

seavill wrote: »

The post from the mod above was starting to blame teachers closing of ranks and implying other things. I was suggestion there's no need to go down that road in the same way I said there was no need to criticise the parent or child.

Several so people with strong opinions have said they are not teachers.
The majority of teachers post in the t&L forum at some stage so I stand over the correct point that the majority of people here posting were not teachers

And it amuses my that OP and child got slated from page 1 and only 1 or 2 posters stood up for her.

seavill

Irrelevant to my point really. I have repeated the same point since I pointed a few pages back. I put my point about being critical to either side across since I posted so I don't see where you are going with this back and forth.
The thread is being dragged off point by these irrelevant back and forth for several pages. If people stuck to the topic it wouldn't be 22 pages long and much easier to read

SAMTALK

seavill wrote: »

Irrelevant to my point really. I have repeated the same point since I pointed a few pages back. I put my point about being critical to either side across since I posted so I don't see where you are going with this back and forth.
The thread is being dragged off point by these irrelevant back and forth for several pages. If people stuck to the topic it wouldn't be 22 pages long and much easier to read

And this is a talk forum. And I have repeated my points since the start also,
It was dragged off topic when OP childs was being portrayed as toublesome and mammys going into schools to defend their child