Hyundai Ioniq 28kWh

irishgrover

Black_Knight wrote:

So the Irish version won't have any of those features, yes?

Correct, but it still has a shed load of cool stuff....

Black_Knight

Leather seats, power seats(memory) and heated steering wheel would be the main ones that I'd like, but I have none of these at the moment in my car so I'm not missing out on something I'm accustomed to.

Importing isn't an option for me though. Just ain't gonna go through that hassle.

irishgrover

Black_Knight wrote:

Importing isn't an option for me though. Just ain't gonna go through that hassle.

Everyone is different, and I had never imported before.....but honestly the whole importing thing was genuinely painless (I bought 2 month only demo) - but treated as new car for VAT purposes..

Starlightalina

Hi everyone!
Thank you all for all the useful information here, this thread helped me a lot over the last few weeks.
I am now a proud owner of 181 marina blue ioniq picked it up last wed and it's been so much fun driving it

iggy

Silly question time.
The autolock cable button is on automatically.
Does this mean your cable is locked in all the time even if its fully charged?
I know with my home charger I have to press the unlock button twice on my fob to release. Is it the same with the slow esb destination chargers?
Cheers

Black_Knight

Just back from my test drive. Inside the car with all the tech and toys was grand fun, and perfectly pleasant. The drive was grand, bit of zip in the car (though i've no idea what mode I was driving in), and oddly quiet.

Only downside I can see is the colour, silver... Though some tinted windows and a black wrapped front grill might appease that.

I'm between 2 minds at the moment. It's a good price, it's not counties away from me and the car is pretty clean (scuffed alloys at worst), or wait it out for a non silver one and probably pay more.

Mickeroo

If you really dislike the colour then I'd hold off, if you're spending that much money on something it should be the version you actually want.

I hope it was sport mode you drove in, you'd be able to tell by what the instrument cluster looked like, this is the sport one:

Black_Knight

Mickeroo wrote: »

If you really dislike the colour then I'd hold off, if you're spending that much money on something it should be the version you actually want.

I hope it was sport mode you drove in, you'd be able to tell by what the instrument cluster looked like, this is the sport one:

Sport mode = showing the power guage?

It was showing speed when I was driving. I guess the default, since he didn't change it, and I forgot it resets every time the car turns off

Mickeroo

Yah you were in normal so I'd say. If you were in eco you'd probably have been put right off!

Black_Knight

Going checking out a white one now. Busy day. What's high milage for an EV?

Black_Knight

Black_Knight wrote: »

Going checking out a white one now. Busy day. What's high milage for an EV?

Can't say that was a success. Arrived and was told the car wasn't starting, it's up on a hoist, talk of replacing the battery, and I didn't even get to see it.

A bit of googling and I'm hoping I'll hear back that it was just a dead 12v battery, rather than the big one. Though the dealer suggested it was the main battery that was at fault and being replaced. Anyone ever hear of that? Should I run a mile?

irishgrover

Have never heard of a main bat being replaced. My car is 181 50k km and bat is still at 100% state of health
Personally I'd be worried if the main bat needed replacing, as I've never heard of such a thing on an ioniq. Would guess that it is the 12v bat.
You can check the SOH using a dongle and an android app.
Re is 50k a lot. Don't think it matters that much on EV. I've had all services and nothing done but filters and software.......and recently tyres

Black_Knight

Yeah, hoping the salesman just didn't know what was wrong and was guessing the main battery. I'll find out more during the week I guess.

Silent Running

Black_Knight wrote: »

Yeah, hoping the salesman just didn't know what was wrong and was guessing the main battery. I'll find out more during the week I guess.

The 12V battery is known to be a problem if it runs low. It can cause all sorts of false fault warnings. If the 12V is too low, the car won't start and it'll throw up a load of lights on the dash.

Before the dealer breaks something, advise him to stick a charger on the 12V. If you decide to buy it, get him to put a new 12v in it. But make sure it's a quality brand, not some no-name cheapo.

Black_Knight

Silent Running wrote: »

The 12V battery is known to be a problem if it runs low. It can cause all sorts of false fault warnings. If the 12V is too low, the car won't start and it'll throw up a load of lights on the dash.

Before the dealer breaks something, advise him to stick a charger on the 12V. If you decide to buy it, get him to put a new 12v in it. But make sure it's a quality brand, not some no-name cheapo.

Dealers mechanics are looking at it. Surely they'd know their own cars? .... Surely!?

Starlightalina

Quick question, my car won't show any charging stations when I use the "nearby stations" option. Does that mean the maps are not updated? Or something else?

Silent Running

Black_Knight wrote: »

Dealers mechanics are looking at it. Surely they'd know their own cars? .... Surely!?

A Hyundai dealership? Yes, they will have a trained high voltage tech.

I thought you were just working with an independent dealer.

Dont be at yourself

Starlightalina wrote: »

Quick question, my car won't show any charging stations when I use the "nearby stations" option. Does that mean the maps are not updated? Or something else?

You can choose which type of stations to filter for, so it's possible you're filtering for some odd standard.

Black_Knight

Silent Running wrote: »

A Hyundai dealership? Yes, they will have a trained high voltage tech.

I thought you were just working with an independent dealer.

Yup. Hyundai. Twas a Saturday so I'd guess no tech was in, and the salesman was just giving me 2nd hand information.
Cheers for the info

fricatus

Starlightalina wrote: »

Quick question, my car won't show any charging stations when I use the "nearby stations" option. Does that mean the maps are not updated? Or something else?

Dont be at yourself wrote: »

You can choose which type of stations to filter for, so it's possible you're filtering for some odd standard.

Or not filtering at all. My car never showed the chargers, which didn’t bother me because I knew where the ones I needed were.

Just went out now to see if it was just a filter and sure enough, Settings (gearwheel button), Navigation, EV Driving, then Connector Type... “All” was unticked, so I ticked it and hey presto!

And here was I thinking I must get on to the dealership... d’oh!

zg3409

Silent Running wrote: »

Black_Knight wrote: »

get him to put a new 12v in it.

The latest firmware (software) reduces the chances of the 12v battery going flat. One general warning is to not sit in car without 'engine' turned on, as in green arrow showing on display. Otherwise your 12volt battery can go flat very quickly, if for example you are listening to the radio or hooving the car. With the green arrow on it is constantly topped up with main battery. You get a discharge warning in the radio display but it is easy to miss or ignore. This may be what happened at dealer. 12 volt may not have been the best and had the radio on.

unkel

Very important advice that. My wife let my daughter stay in the car while she went to the shops for about 15 minutes. She played music and perhaps opened / closed the windows and whatever else you can do when the engine is off. When my wife came back from the shops, the car wouldn't start. Eventually after a few minutes of trying she got going, but it must have been a close call.


Have you any details of that fix? The high voltage battery system checking and topping up the 12V more regularly maybe? No reason for this not to happen every few minutes.

zg3409

unkel wrote: »

Have you any details of that fix? The high voltage battery system checking and topping up the 12V more regularly maybe? No reason for this not to happen every few minutes.

I unloaded a washing machine out of the boot flipped down seats etc. and next morning car was so dead doors would not unlock. Dealer updated firmware to 09 2017 version and claimed 12v battery showed OK after being charged back up. Cars user manual says "battery saver" activates every 3 days when parked up, but I notice it seems to kick in on frosty nights when car is not plugged into wall. 12v battery seems to be charged all the time while home charging and while driving, but it is not charged when not plugged in sitting parked, except for when battery saver is triggered. This seems to happen at 11.9 volt (according to someone on another forum) and in my case it seems to happen any frosty night not plugged into wall. So I guess my 12v battery is not great, but it does not matter main battery tops it up. I have to be careful when car is stopped to ensure I keep 'engine on' just to be sure unless I am leaving car straight away. Dealer said the firmware fix stopped flat 12v batteries and it seems to work for me.

unkel

11.9V is very low for a lead acid 12V battery. It represents about 10% SOC (11.8V = 0%, 12.7V=100%)

Wonder why EVs don't use lithium 12V batteries. They would last the lifetime of the car. You only need half the amp hours of lead acid, so wouldn't cost more than a few hundred quid or so. There's no engine to crank, so the traditional benefit of very high cranking amps of a lead acid battery is no longer of any use.

Starlightalina

fricatus wrote: »

Or not filtering at all. My car never showed the chargers, which didn’t bother me because I knew where the ones I needed were.

Just went out now to see if it was just a filter and sure enough, Settings (gearwheel button), Navigation, EV Driving, then Connector Type... “All” was unticked, so I ticked it and hey presto!

And here was I thinking I must get on to the dealership... d’oh!

That worked for me too, thank you. Found a charger right next to my apartment that I didn't even know about

fricatus

After fiddling with the settings on my car yesterday to try and display the charger locations, there's now a really annoying new warning sound. It's a two-tone chime, not unlike a doorbell "gling-glung", and it seems to come from the area above the steering wheel.

When I first heard it, I was looking frantically for warning lights/messages, but there were none. It seemed to only happen near my house, so I figured maybe it's a notification that there are new weather or traffic updates (because it's within wi-fi range), but then it happened somewhere close to Kilkenny on my way to work, so it has to be something else.

There's no index item for "Sounds" in the manual, so I'm a little stumped. Any ideas?

Mickeroo

fricatus wrote: »

After fiddling with the settings on my car yesterday to try and display the charger locations, there's now a really annoying new warning sound. It's a two-tone chime, not unlike a doorbell "gling-glung", and it seems to come from the area above the steering wheel.

When I first heard it, I was looking frantically for warning lights/messages, but there were none. It seemed to only happen near my house, so I figured maybe it's a notification that there are new weather or traffic updates (because it's within wi-fi range), but then it happened somewhere close to Kilkenny on my way to work, so it has to be something else.

There's no index item for "Sounds" in the manual, so I'm a little stumped. Any ideas?

I'd say it's the frost warning, if it reads the temp as 4C or below it will do a ding ding and the temp will flash on the dash when you start up the car. Mine did it this morning too.

zg3409

fricatus wrote: »

there's now a really annoying new warning sound.

If temperature drops to 4 Celsius or lower car bongs and temperature display flashes in bottom right for a couple of seconds. It is to warn you roads might be icy. Happened on my car this morning

fricatus

Mickeroo wrote: »

I'd say it's the frost warning, if it reads the temp as 4C or below it will do a ding ding and the temp will flash on the dash when you start up the car. Mine did it this morning too.

zg3409 wrote: »

If temperature drops to 4 Celsius or lower car bongs and temperature display flashes in bottom right for a couple of seconds. It is to warn you roads might be icy. Happened on my car this morning

Thanks for the responses lads, but no, that's not it - I'm familiar with the frost warning. That's accompanied by the flashing temperature/snowflake icon, so when I first heard it, I was able to figure out fairly quickly what it was. This notification is sort of louder and more intrusive, and seems to come from a different place in the car - if that makes sense?

I'm just thinking of other things I could have enabled while I was mickeying around with the settings yesterday - I think I enabled speed camera locations in the POIs, and I might have enabled live services or something - not that I can figure out how to disable them again!

listermint

unkel wrote: »

11.9V is very low for a lead acid 12V battery. It represents about 10% SOC (11.8V = 0%, 12.7V=100%)

Wonder why EVs don't use lithium 12V batteries. They would last the lifetime of the car. You only need half the amp hours of lead acid, so wouldn't cost more than a few hundred quid or so. There's no engine to crank, so the traditional benefit of very high cranking amps of a lead acid battery is no longer of any use.

Don't quote me on this, but I believe lithium batterys as a main battery are not as reliable if left to completely empty. They just don't have the resilience of lead acid. Which can be rescued and charged up quite easily. Their simplicity is their resilience. Also cost is a factor.

Uriel.

Thinking of bringing in a HEV Ioniq from the UK - 2017 - Just wondering if it is worth spending approx extra €1,500 for the premium SE spec over the "regular" premium.

Difference is about €18,500 versus €20,000 - about 18k miles on the clock.

Mickeroo

Uriel. wrote: »

Thinking of bringing in a HEV Ioniq from the UK - 2017 - Just wondering if it is worth spending approx extra €1,500 for the premium SE spec over the "regular" premium.

Difference is about €18,500 versus €20,000 - about 18k miles on the clock.

That's up to you, there's not a lot between them so it depends on your preference. I think irishgrover posted the differences a few pages back for the BEV but I think it's likely the same for the HEV.

irishgrover

Mickeroo wrote: »

...I think irishgrover posted the differences a few pages back for the BEV but I think it's likely the same for the HEV.

Leather seats
Front seats ventilated (and heated)
Powered driver seat (with 2 presets)
Heated steering wheel
Heated seats in back (2 outside seats only)
Front and back parking sensors
Blind spot detection system

ELM327

The main problem with the HEV vs BEV is the additional weight in the front and poisonous liquid tank.

bp_me

ELM327 wrote: »

The main problem with the HEV vs BEV is the additional weight in the front and poisonous liquid tank.

And the PHEV generally being same price or cheaper than HEV?

ELM327

bp_me wrote: »

And the PHEV generally being same price or cheaper than HEV?

And that.
Sorry I was being facetious in my earlier post, as I was moreso alluding to the fact that I can't understand why anyone would buy an Ioniq but not the BEV!

Uriel.

ELM327 wrote: »

And that.
Sorry I was being facetious in my earlier post, as I was moreso alluding to the fact that I can't understand why anyone would buy an Ioniq but not the BEV!

EV version is out of my price range at the moment, and when I do make the move to EV, I would prefer higher range and available EVs that I actually like with higher range (eg.Niro) are way outside of price range.

Uriel.

Mickeroo wrote: »

That's up to you, there's not a lot between them so it depends on your preference. I think irishgrover posted the differences a few pages back for the BEV but I think it's likely the same for the HEV.

irishgrover wrote: »

Leather seats
Front seats ventilated (and heated)
Powered driver seat (with 2 presets)
Heated steering wheel
Heated seats in back (2 outside seats only)
Front and back parking sensors
Blind spot detection system

Thanks both.

unkel

listermint wrote: »

Don't quote me on this, but I believe lithium batterys as a main battery are not as reliable if left to completely empty.

That's why all lithium batteries have a battery management system

I believe it is getting quite common on motorbikes to have lithium instead of lead acid. Their batteries are smaller again, so cost is less of a factor. And there is substantial weight savings. Quite important on a motorbike.

unkel

Uriel. wrote: »

EV version is out of my price range at the moment

Probably only a few grand in it? Why don't you take a fully electric on a 24h test drive from a main dealer and see what you think of the range.

As ELM327, I don't see a lot of reasons in favour of buying a HEV or even a PHEV Ioniq. For similar money you could buy say a BMW 330e PHEV, which would be a far superior car

KCross

listermint wrote: »

Don't quote me on this, but I believe lithium batterys as a main battery are not as reliable if left to completely empty. They just don't have the resilience of lead acid. Which can be rescued and charged up quite easily. Their simplicity is their resilience. Also cost is a factor.

Cost is definitely one of the main reasons but also the fact that you want to have your 12V at 100% all the time... the very thing that Li-ion doesnt want!

You could over-engineer a 12V li-ion to not go to 100% but that feeds back into the cost issue.

Black_Knight

listermint wrote: »

Don't quote me on this....

Quoted repeatedly :pac:

Uriel.

unkel wrote: »

Probably only a few grand in it? Why don't you take a fully electric on a 24h test drive from a main dealer and see what you think of the range.

As ELM327, I don't see a lot of reasons in favour of buying a HEV or even a PHEV Ioniq. For similar money you could buy say a BMW 330e PHEV, which would be a far superior car

You're right I had been looking at 350e and 330e. The 350e was close to being a purchase but its stretching my budget by about 2k. Plus we've just found out that we are expecting our first child at the end of year so the few extra grand just isn't available.

unkel

Uriel. wrote: »

You're right I had been looking at 350e and 330e. The 350e was close to being a purchase but its stretching my budget by about 2k. Plus we've just found out that we are expecting our first child at the end of year so the few extra grand just isn't available.

Best of luck!

I understand what you're saying but the extra few grand for Ioniq BEV up front will payback for itself very quickly (and it will keep its value better)

KCross wrote: »

Cost is definitely one of the main reasons but also the fact that you want to have your 12V at 100% all the time... the very thing that Li-ion doesnt want!

You could over-engineer a 12V li-ion to not go to 100% but that feeds back into the cost issue.

What? Every lithium battery has a programmable BMS anyway. Program it to cycle between 25% and 75% and the battery will last forever

KCross

unkel wrote: »

What? Every lithium battery has a programmable BMS anyway. Program it to cycle between 25% and 75% and the battery will last forever

I know, thats what my second statement was referring to. You could over engineer it (i.e. extra spare capacity) to only charge to 75% to protect it but then you have a much more expensive 12V battery than a lead acid.

unkel

You don't need to oversize it. 75% of half of the lead acid amp hours is more than enough to start the car and run all aux systems, remember it's constantly topped up from the high voltage battery when the "engine" is on. And yes, it will cost several times what a lead acid battery costs, but it won't ever have to be replaced. So roughly a 30Ah battery would do. That's just a third of one kWh. Hyundai could do that instead of lead acid and the cost price of the car would only be about €100 higher.

listermint

unkel wrote: »

Best of luck!

I understand what you're saying but the extra few grand for Ioniq BEV up front will payback for itself very quickly (and it will keep its value better)



What? Every lithium battery has a programmable BMS anyway. Program it to cycle between 25% and 75% and the battery will last forever

I've watched them die in motorcycles.

They most certainly can die and do very easily. Hence they simply are not common place. If they were that good they'd be in every new machine.

unkel

Very easy to kill a lithium battery. Charge too high, discharge too low. Charge when very cold or very warm. These things need to be controlled by the BMS

The ones that you saw die were very likely poorly controlled. On the other hand, if you do control a lithium battery properly, it will last forever.

KCross

unkel wrote: »

You don't need to oversize it. 75% of half of the lead acid amp hours is more than enough to start the car and run all aux systems, remember it's constantly topped up from the high voltage battery when the "engine" is on. And yes, it will cost several times what a lead acid battery costs, but it won't ever have to be replaced. So roughly a 30Ah battery would do. That's just a third of one kWh. Hyundai could do that instead of lead acid and the cost price of the car would only be about €100 higher.

Why would a manufacturer do that though?

Nothing really in it for them other than driving up costs. They don’t care if the 12V lasts 5 years or the lifetime of the car and lead acid does the very same job, cheap as chips, ready availability, highly recyclable already... li-ion is none of those yet and there just isn’t much positive there for them to switch.

I’m sure there are technical reasons like temperature (think -15C in Norway etc) that might be an issue for a 12V Li-ion as well.

I think Tesla still use 12V lead acid? If anyone was to switch it would be Tesla. There was talk that they were going to switch to a 12V Li-ion but I’d say it’s just easier/cheaper all round to stick with lead acid.

unkel

KCross wrote: »

I’m sure there are technical reasons like temperature (think -15C in Norway etc) that might be an issue for a 12V Li-ion as well.

Same technical reasons are an issue for a 400V Li-ion battery

Agree with your point on costs though, it would make the car a wee bit more expensive. Surprised no manufacturer is offering it though, not even Tesla and not even as an option. I would happily pay the extra say €200 including all taxes and a bit of profit if I bought a car that I was going to keep for more than a few years.