Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning link in OP 20/3

StringerBell

mewe wrote: »

He gave Vardy a second yellow for a dive inside the box and sent him off and then gave West Ham a peno for more or less the same thing.

Vardy deserved his second yellow, his first was debatable.

Huth and Morgan were at it all game and could have been the cause of numerous penalties, they were warned a lot and even brought to the ref together and told to cut it out. They didn't, tough ****. There were multiple instances where Huth/Morgan were clearly not even looking at the ball, just obstructing, putting their elbows into the throat of or grabbing or pushing to the ground the men they were marking, they can have no complaints.

The Leicester penalty was debatable too actually.

It was not more or less the same thing either.

Vardy initiated contact and threw himself to the ground, nothing like the West Ham penalty.

mewe

StringerBell wrote: »

Vardy deserved his second yellow, his first was debatable.



Huth and Morgan were at it all game and could have been the cause of numerous penalties, they were warned a lot and even brought to the ref together and told to cut it out. They didn't, tough ****. There were multiple instances where Huth/Morgan were clearly not even looking at the ball, just obstructing, putting their elbows into the throat of or grabbing or pushing to the ground the men they were marking, they can have no complaints.

The Leicester penalty was debatable too actually.

It was not more or less the same thing either.

Vardy initiated contact and threw himself to the ground, nothing like the West Ham penalty.

It was more or less the same thing. He played for the penalty and threw his legs in towards Morgan to make it look more like a coming together. Also by your logic of Huth/Morgan grabbing or obstructing all game there would be ten penos in most premier league games.

I agree the Leicester peno was debatable too. Another example of his dodgy refereeing.

Rayne Wooney

Giggs has been complicit, he can't have it both ways. He can't say he didn't believe in what Van Gaal was doing after staying on for two years as number 2. He should have quit, very publicly, if that was the case. He'll try and play the "I was just there as a Class of 92 showpiece" card without any say but yet he still stayed with Van Gaal for two years despite not having any say in what was going on? Pull the other one Ryan.

Send him out the door with Van Gaal, if he's good he will do well elsewhere and eventually get the chance to come back, as it should be.

StringerBell

mewe wrote: »

It was more or less the same thing. He played for the penalty and threw his legs in towards Morgan to make it look more like a coming together. Also by your logic of Huth/Morgan grabbing or obstructing all game there would be ten penos in most premier league games.

I agree the Leicester peno was debatable too. Another example of his dodgy refereeing.

Not to the level Huth in particular was at it, literally just pushed a guy to the ground at one point never looking toward the ball, Morgan drove his elbow into a players throat in another instance. Not the same as the usual tussling that goes on in most games. Threw his legs toward Morgan? Morgan was holding him around the waist and pulling and him, then pushed him.

Its a penalty all day long, whether the tactics employed by Huth and Morgan deserve penalties in every game (they do) or not doesn't matter really.

You can't say it was a harsh penalty, and it was certainly not like the Vardy one where he was running on to the ball and jumped into the air, flicked his legs out to make contact. It was a dive and clear to see to even a ref who was some distance away. It was a pathetic effort tbh.

You play on the edge you are going to be punished sometimes, you might get away with it a lot, and playing the percentages on it has certainly helped Leicester this season. I think they would happily accept it now and then going against them all things considered, Huth and Morgan just love getting their hands all over players and fouling, they get away with it a lot. Fair play to them, but they can't feel hard done by when they do get punished.

mewe

StringerBell wrote: »

Not to the level Huth in particular was at it, literally just pushed a guy to the ground at one point never looking toward the ball, Morgan drove his elbow into a players throat in another instance. Not the same as the usual tussling that goes on in most games. Threw his legs toward Morgan? Morgan was holding him around the waist and pulling and him, then pushed him.

Its a penalty all day long, whether the tactics employed by Huth and Morgan deserve penalties in every game (they do) or not doesn't matter really.

You can't say it was a harsh penalty, and it was certainly not like the Vardy one where he was running on to the ball and jumped into the air, flicked his legs out to make contact. It was a dive and clear to see to even a ref who was some distance away. It was a pathetic effort tbh.

You play on the edge you are going to be punished sometimes, you might get away with it a lot, and playing the percentages on it has certainly helped Leicester this season. I think they would happily accept it now and then going against them all things considered, Huth and Morgan just love getting their hands all over players and fouling, they get away with it a lot. Fair play to them, but they can't feel hard done by when they do get punished.

Watch the replays of the West Ham peno again and tell me he doesn't throw his leg back towards Morgan like I said.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FswvUw1YQ8

I stand by what I said already with regard to Huth/Morgan grabbing and shoving. Centre backs do this in most games. It's not unique to Huth or Morgan.

bucketybuck

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Giggs has been complicit, he can't have it both ways. He can't say he didn't believe in what Van Gaal was doing after staying on for two years as number 2. He should have quit, very publicly, if that was the case. He'll try and play the "I was just there as a Class of 92 showpiece" card without any say but yet he still stayed with Van Gaal for two years despite not having any say in what was going on? Pull the other one Ryan.

Without a doubt he is complicit. Even if nothing else, he is the coach of a team that clearly is very badly coached, he either has responsibility for that or he is a lame duck water carrier that has done nothing for 3 years. Its one or the other, and either should rule him out of the managers job.

jimmytwotimes 2013

No way should Giggs be given the United job. He has sat quietly through LVG's tenure despite how poor United have been.

In order to have any credibility he should have quit and publicly stated that the tradition of attacking football at Old Trafford had been destroyed by LVG.

By doing this he could also have taken up a championship club job and cut his teeth there. Giggs may have something to offer in the future as a boss but the signs aren't good as regards the standards he's willing to sit and watch.

StringerBell

I didn't say it was unique to Huth/Morgan. It doesn't change the point that they play that way and they will get caught now and then. Even in that video you see multiple instances that could have seen penalties given against them.

Vardy jumps into his man, initiating contact and trying to cheat his way to a penalty. Rightfully received yellow card.

Reid is running to the near post at a corner, with Morgan holding around the waist, Morgan then pushes Reid, Reid falls. I can't say for sure if he throws his legs toward him, or if thats just how he fell. Penalty.

You are forgetting the numerous times the ref had warned Huth and Morgan that he was watching them and to cut it out, they ignored his warnings.

Was it one of the softer fouls committed by one of them at a set piece today? Very possibly.

Does a totting up system come in to a referees head? Certainly, it is why players get booked for multiple innocuous fouls as well as one bad one.

Centre backs foul in most games and get away with it is not a defence for Morgan in this case.

He committed the foul, he took the risk, the ref gave the penalty.

mewe

StringerBell wrote: »

I didn't say it was unique to Huth/Morgan. It doesn't change the point that they play that way and they will get caught now and then. Even in that video you see multiple instances that could have seen penalties given against them.

Vardy jumps into his man, initiating contact and trying to cheat his way to a penalty. Rightfully received yellow card.

Reid is running to the near post at a corner, with Morgan holding around the waist, Morgan then pushes Reid, Reid falls. I can't say for sure if he throws his legs toward him, or if thats just how he fell. Penalty.

You are forgetting the numerous times the ref had warned Huth and Morgan that he was watching them and to cut it out, they ignored his warnings.

Was it one of the softer fouls committed by one of them at a set piece today? Very possibly.

Does a totting up system come in to a referees head? Certainly, it is why players get booked for multiple innocuous fouls as well as one bad one.

Centre backs foul in most games and get away with it is not a defence for Morgan in this case.

He committed the foul, he took the risk, the ref gave the penalty.

Morgan pushes Reid to the ground? Cmon man. You can convince yourself all day long that you're right. I disagree. Maybe Vardy's looks more dramatic because he's running faster but it's more or less the same thing.

StringerBell

mewe wrote: »

Morgan pushes Reid to the ground? Cmon man. You can convince yourself all day long that you're right. I disagree. Maybe Vardy's looks more dramatic because he's running faster but it's more or less the same thing.

Morgan pushes Reid.

Vardy flings himself into the air.

Since we are in the United thread and obviously not going to reach any kind of consensus on the matter we may as well leave it there I suppose.

mewe

StringerBell wrote: »

Morgan pushes Reid.

Vardy flings himself into the air.

Since we are in the United thread and obviously not going to reach any kind of consensus on the matter we may as well leave it there I suppose.

Going by your logic Vardy was pushed aswell. Clearly hand on player = push. They were both dives. Simple as.

StringerBell

Rashford rumoured to be close to agreeing a new deal which is a good thing, he has taken his chance very well and I am interested to see how far he can go. Too early to make any predictions really with him but nice to see a young guy come through the ranks, never stood out in the reserves really, Fosu-Mensah on the other hand is not as much of a surprise and equally delighted to see him look so comfortable playing in the senior team.

I hope Rashford doesn't go to the Euro's though. No point really, let him have the summer off and prepare for a challenge cementing his first team squad place next season. Could be some interesting moves this summer given the emergence of some of the younger guys, could turn out to be great squad players and potentially change the summer targets slightly, make them more streamlined perhaps.

The greaseman was linked again, he would be a very welcome addition.

Rayne Wooney

Speaking objectively you'd have to question the ambition of a player leaving Atletico Madrid for us.

A club that is growing at a considerable rate both on and off field. Europa league, Copa del Rey, league title and runners up in CL in the last 3 seasons and could still possibly win a major trophy or two this season. Moving to a 70,000 seater next season and the new tv deal in Spain is worth double what their current deal is paying.

Atletico is a better career option right now, if a player moved they must either be a big fan or like money or both. I think the reason a lot of us have warmed to Herrera is because he genuinely seems to love playing for United, which is a real bonus, unlike the Robbie Keane "it's my dream to play for X" kind of loyalty

StringerBell

Griezmann is a United fan though so would be a pull for him, also money obviously, and a chance to increase his stature considerably from a marketing point of view.

The ceiling is probably higher for United too though, even if it is not exactly a rose garden right now, and you do always have that "I can be the man to save the club" ego boost approach.

I wouldn't question the ambition of a player leaving AM for us, they have to sell players to balance the books and it would suit the club to let a player go to a foreign team rather then get hoovered up by the big two (and often get wasted, Turan/Illamarendi/Isco(for the most part)/Canales/Vidal)

In general it is not a love of the club or anything like it that attracts players to United and it has been that way for a long time.

I think right now AM are a better team obviously, but we are hardly Liverpool all of a sudden

Trigger

The links to Griezmann are coming up cause his brother tweeted this
https://twitter.com/TheoGriezmann/status/721773500407660544

Every man and his dog knows they are united fans, how easy is it to be a sports journalist these days ffs.

StringerBell

astradave wrote: »

The links to Griezmann are coming up cause his brother tweeted this
https://twitter.com/TheoGriezmann/status/721773500407660544

Every man and his dog knows they are united fans, how easy is it to be a sports journalist these days ffs.

Throwing **** at the wall, seeing what stick, getting paid for it.

Handy money

Lord TSC

Griezmann's brother has pulled this before. I get the feeling he likes trolling United fans. Wouldn't listen to this at all....

DARK-KNIGHT

That guy is a parasite trying to cash in on his brother by posting utter ****e like that

Flint Fredstone

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

That guy is a parasite trying to cash in on his brother by posting utter ****e like that

Or maybe he's just a United fan saying United fan things?

Maximus Alexander

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

That guy is a parasite trying to cash in on his brother by posting utter ****e like that

Who do you reckon is paying him for posting it?

brinty

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Who do you reckon is paying him for posting it?

Woody...

IamtheWalrus

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

Liam O

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

eh?

ShooterSF

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

No way. Sure his knee is wrecked...

Mitch Connor

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

Right now - Ole at his best.

Long term, Martial by a distance. If managed correctly and he fulfills his potential he will be one of the very best forwards in the game

NoviGlitzko

Should have been in for Griezmann last summer. He was my number 1 target at the time. He's almost unattainable now.

RobertKK

The Griezmann brothers have attended Old Trafford as fans, I don't care if Theo tweets 'Glory, Glory Man Utd'.
Whatever else, they are genuine fans. I am sure Theo would love to have his brother playing at OT with a nice executive box to watch the game in.

It is very possible that Antoine wants to play at his favourite team at some stage of his career.

ElChe32

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

KH25

Wouldn't read anything into those comments. He's either having a laugh or just supporting the team.

Liam O

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Should have been in for Griezmann last summer. He was my number 1 target at the time. He's almost unattainable now.

No player at Atletico is unattainable. Falcao, Torres, Aguero, Costa, DDG etc. all left when they were offered a good chunk.

Now if it comes to spending 60m on him it becomes a different story about should he be attained for that much. I'd say that's about the limit I'd go for and perhaps market value going on the KDB transfer.

NoviGlitzko

Liam O wrote: »

No player at Atletico is unattainable. Falcao, Torres, Aguero, Costa, DDG etc. all left when they were offered a good chunk.

Now if it comes to spending 60m on him it becomes a different story about should he be attained for that much. I'd say that's about the limit I'd go for and perhaps market value going on the KDB transfer.

True, although I still wouldn't hold out much hope. We're out of the CL unlike last summer and from the posts above it appears they are or will be in a much better financial situation.

If Mourinho does come in his pulling power could be a huge factor though.

Korat

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Anthony Martial or Ole Gunnar Solskjaer? Ole for me.

What's this about?

In case there's a series of these I wouldn't have any current outfield player ahead of any 1st team player pre-Woodward era in the PL.

None of todays team would be worth the bench even.

jayo26

Korat wrote: »

What's this about?

In case there's a series of these I wouldn't have any current outfield player ahead of any 1st team player pre-Woodward era in the PL.

None of todays team would be worth the bench even.

Not even martial vs Welbeck?.??

Think your a bit hard on current team there is some good quality there its easy to dismiss the whole team but fergie never had teams complete with superstars he had teams that would beat superstars.

Korat

jayo26 wrote: »

Not even martial vs Welbeck?.??

Think your a bit hard on current team there is some good quality there its easy to dismiss the whole team but fergie never had teams complete with superstars he had teams that would beat superstars.

Welbeck flopped in Fergies last season but he'd shown promise the season before, much like Martial has this season. Martial isn't much better now than Welbeck was in 2012. The hope is that Martial takes a completely different development trajectory.

I'm judging the current team on what I've seen from them this season and while it's maybe as much to do with the manager the performances have been terrible. The same players may excel under a new manager and I'll be delighted to revise my opinion if that happens.

Antibac

With Rashford doing so well. Does it mean the end for James Wilson? I don't think he's doing great on loan at present

Giggsy11

Antibac wrote: »

With Rashford doing so well. Does it mean the end for James Wilson? I don't think he's doing great on loan at present

I don't think so. He is just 20 year old and have plenty of time on his side. If we play 4-3-3 then he can play as right forward.

He can make it as squad player also. Too early to write him off IMO.

jayo26

Korat wrote: »

Welbeck flopped in Fergies last season but he'd shown promise the season before, much like Martial has this season. Martial isn't much better now than Welbeck was in 2012. The hope is that Martial takes a completely different development trajectory.

I'm judging the current team on what I've seen from them this season and while it's maybe as much to do with the manager the performances have been terrible. The same players may excel under a new manager and I'll be delighted to revise my opinion if that happens.

Yeh ok i can understand your opinion personally myself id like to give some of the current a bit more individually but I understand where you coming from.

*sidesteps wellbeck argumemt*

jayo26

Chicarito talking about rashford and stuff on sky ya just gotta love him.

DARK-KNIGHT

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/jose-mourinho-tells-friends-and-psg-he-is-manchester-united-bound-and-has-gonzalo-higuain-deal-a6988036.html

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE be happening

jayo26

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/jose-mourinho-tells-friends-and-psg-he-is-manchester-united-bound-and-has-gonzalo-higuain-deal-a6988036.html

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE be happening

All linking back to same source its nothing new but just another transfer name in the pot.

My money is safe.

DARK-KNIGHT

jayo26 wrote: »

All linking back to same source its nothing new but just another transfer name in the pot.

My money is safe.

higuain would be some signing imo. an experienced striker in form would give martial and rashford time to grow and instantly bring goals
i know that article is probably as reliable as a torn condom but would love to see it

Giggsy11

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

higuain would be some signing imo. an experienced striker in form would give martial and rashford time to grow and instantly bring goals
i know that article is probably as reliable as a torn condom but would love to see it

Hopefully we don't sign Higuain. Napoli won't sell him for cheap, we will be breaking our transfer record or very close to breaking it to sign him.

Better is to sign Ibra on short term deal.

jayo26

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

higuain would be some signing imo. an experienced striker in form would give martial and rashford time to grow and instantly bring goals
i know that article is probably as reliable as a torn condom but would love to see it

I wouldnt be really excited about Higuain at all, yeh he could turn out to be a great signing but he is 29 in December he is banging in goals in a weak league and at best we are going to break out transfer record for a short term fix.

I would much prefer spend that money on Lukaku or Griezman that have time on their side.

IamtheWalrus

jayo26 wrote: »

I wouldnt be really excited about Higuain at all, yeh he could turn out to be a great signing but he is 29 in December he is banging in goals in a weak league and at best we are going to break out transfer record for a short term fix.

I would much prefer spend that money on Lukaku or Griezman that have time on their side.

Jose doesn't do long term.

StringerBell

Think Higuain would struggle, particularly how we play right now anyway. Doesn't have the speed required to excel.

raze_them_all_

StringerBell wrote: »

Think Higuain would struggle, particularly how we play right now anyway. Doesn't have the speed required to excel.

He could walk all day and still get ahead of our pass forward, pass flat all across the midfield, back to defence and back to de gea to boot to felani

jayo26

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Jose doesn't do long term.

Well he does and he doesn't, he will make short term signing we all know that but its unfair to say he doesn't do long term. He has signed a lot of players under the age of 25 and even younger he has played a lot of players that have been younger too.

If he does come in he is a proven winner it will be intresting to see if he will adapt or change anything to suit united.

We can all say ohh going on past experience he wont but simple fact is he spoke about longterm when he joined chelsea second time around but chelsea are not a long term club.

DARK-KNIGHT

i dont get the jose hate.... the man is a ****ing man mountain of a manager. when he was at chelsea in particular the first run he seemed get business done fast and bought some quality players

Giggsy11

jayo26 wrote: »

Well he does and he doesn't, he will make short term signing we all know that but its unfair to say he doesn't do long term. He has signed a lot of players under the age of 25 and even younger he has played a lot of players that have been younger too.

If he does come in he is a proven winner it will be intresting to see if he will adapt or change anything to suit united.

We can all say ohh going on past experience he wont but simple fact is he spoke about longterm when he joined chelsea second time around but chelsea are not a long term club.

Jose signed many players for long term. It's not hard to see, simple search and you can see all his signings. He has signed many players who are below 25-26.

DARK-KNIGHT

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

i dont get the jose hate.... the man is a ****ing man mountain of a manager. when he was at chelsea in particular the first run he seemed get business done fast and bought some quality players

It's not really "Jose hate"

Some of us are giving consistent reasons why Jose shouldn't take over, doesnt mean hate!

On the point of Higuan, I don't agree.

Not good enough IMO