Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning link in OP 20/3

Chagan

I think it would be best for all concerned if Leicester did the honourable thing and allowed us the win on Sunday. That way we get a vital three points and they can win the league in front if their own fans next weekend.

Alf Veedersane

jayo26 wrote: »

I dont think it will be im quietly confident of keeping him.

Not confident but more hopeful in recent weeks than I have been.

Lord TSC

Vardy ban has been extended by one game, and he will deco miss our game now.

Kind of feel sorry for him. He will likely miss the game where they win the title.

Lord TSC

United's POTY awards are to be held Monday 2nd May, 4 games before the end of the season.

Since the inaugural awards dinner in 2006, United have held the event seven times after the penultimate game of the Premier League season and three times following the last league game.

MEN are suggesting its cause they want them done before they announce Jose :P

Alf Veedersane

Pretty short shortlist for POTY I'd imagine...

syngindub

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Pretty short shortlist for POTY I'd imagine...

Must be the octopus between the sticks again !!

Jayop

Do people still think it's "deluded" that we could get 4th? Given it's almost in our own hands at this stage I don't see it as deluded at all.

Manutd_4life

I wonder what LVG will say in his speech.

I imagine it is gonna be much different than last years :P

jayo26

Manutd_4life wrote: »

I wonder what LVG will say in his speech.

I imagine it is gonna be much different than last years :P

that was the highlight of his two years so far haha. Followed by his fall on the touchline.

I have visions of him getting pissed and singing Frank sinatra I did it my way. That would be nice.

Jayop

I really hope he goes out with the cup and top4. I think if he does history will be kinder to his time at United than the heat of the moment.

Headshot

Lord TSC wrote: »

United's POTY awards are to be held Monday 2nd May, 4 games before the end of the season.

Since the inaugural awards dinner in 2006, United have held the event seven times after the penultimate game of the Premier League season and three times following the last league game.

MEN are suggesting its cause they want them done before they announce Jose :P

DeGea or Martial

Nobody else

Fellani^

Lord TSC

Headshot wrote: »

DeGea or Martial

Nobody else

Smalling would probably be in third, but I would have him well below those two.

De Gea well deserves it.

Jayop

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Fellani^

Welbeck?

Manutd_4life

Easy pick once again - De Gea

Martial hasn't been consistent all year whereas De Gea has.

Trigger

Has to be Dave, no one else comes even close. I really hope that the spend a bit of time celebrating the U21's, They have had a great season.

glued

Let's hope he doesn't try abandon ship in the Summer again. We really need to be more competitive next season to keep the likes of De Gea and Martial at the club.

glued

glued wrote: »

Let's hope he doesn't try abandon ship in the Summer again. We really need to be more competitive next season to keep the likes of De Gea and Martial at the club.

Where's Martial going???
Sell a player for the future that LVG scouted and urged the board to spend big on and got it 100% right? Not a chance.

Flint Fredstone

Confirmed that Vardy will miss the game on Sunday.

StringerBell

POTY is De Gea obviously, that is why the awards are a little earlier then usual, no need to drag it out, only one candidate.

Deserves it of course, feckin irritating that our POTY is again the goalkeeper though!

brinty

De gea and Martial is the short list

brinty

StringerBell wrote:

Deserves it of course, feckin irritating that our POTY is again the goalkeeper though!

Is that three years in a row
Says it all really about the rest of the squad
As I say De gea and martial are the only players certain to start under Jose

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Not much talk of the 46 mil signing of Renato Sanches. Haven't seen too much of him but lot of money for a 18 yo. Anyone know more?

Maximus Alexander

brinty wrote: »

Is that three years in a row
Says it all really about the rest of the squad
As I say De gea and martial are the only players certain to start under Jose

I know everybody thinks Jose is amazing, but I'd say he'd still need to start a full eleven.

brinty

Maximus Alexander wrote:

I know everybody thinks Jose is amazing, but I'd say he'd still need to start a full eleven.

Funny guy Maximus....
He would of course but outside Dave and Tony Marshal the other 9 places are up for grabs

Maximus Alexander

brinty wrote: »

Funny guy Maximus....
He would of course but outside Dave and Tony Marshal the other 9 places are up for grabs

I'm the Archbishop of Banterbury. :pac:

brinty

Mike Litoris wrote:

And just when you think Ramsey has something resembling a heart he comes out with the feed her to the dogs comment. Brilliant.

Maximus Alexander wrote:

I'm the Archbishop of Banterbury.

Bantz mate
Bantum of the opera
Banter brigade...

Rayne Wooney

Sanches looks like a crazy talent although still understandably raw

That being said spending 45 million on a teenager when there is uncertainty over who will be managing the team next season might not be a great idea. Is it Mendes doing Mourinho's bidding early?

sigmundv

Lord TSC wrote:

MEN: As suspected, Mourinho has agreed a deal to become the next United manager #mufc

Lord TSC wrote:

Though when you click the story, there's nothing new...

At this point they're just rehashing the same story because there is nothing new to report.

sigmundv

People get a bit carried away with respect to De Gea I think. Remember that he hasn't achieved anything yet and his career has only just started, so let's hold off mentioning him among all-time greats like Big Pete and EvdS.

UnitedIrishman

Went over to a Benfica forum to see what they were saying about Renato Sanches. About the only thing I learned is Google translate is absolutely shít at translating from Portuguese.

From the bits I gathered - they think the figure of €60m being mentioned is nuts. But most think he's the reason they're in pole position to win the league. And a few are worried how restricted he'll become if he joins us (and Mourinho is here) but that's to be expected.

Thecon21

sigmundv wrote: »

People get a bit carried away with respect to De Gea I think. Remember that he hasn't achieved anything yet and his career has only just started, so let's hold off mentioning him among all-time greats like Big Pete and EvdS.

Except for single handedly carrying United and keep us somewhat competitive in the past couple seasons.. While being in his early-to-mid twenties..

Liam McPoyle

sigmundv wrote: »

People get a bit carried away with respect to De Gea I think. Remember that he hasn't achieved anything yet and his career has only just started, so let's hold off mentioning him among all-time greats like Big Pete and EvdS.

So a players contributions can only be measured in trophies won?

He has been the one constant shining light in a stuttering, misfiring team for the last 3 years.

Only for him we wouldn't have gotten top 4 last year, we wouldn't be in the cup final this year and we wouldn't be still in with an outside chance of top 4 this season.

He is as important to us as Mahrez has been for Leicester or Payet has been for WHU.

His contributions cannot be overstated enough IMO.

Its not hard to imagine many players who had a move to Madrid fall through to act the bollox and sulk but he went about his work magnificently, he is a real role model.

And credit where its due to LVG and the decision makers, they handled the whole situation perfectly.

I'll make a prediction now, if we can keep him, get Jose in and sign 2 to 3 first team players, we will win the league.

bucketybuck

Saul T Nutzz wrote: »

His contributions cannot be overstated enough IMO.

They are being overstated. His heroics have meant we will probably finish 5th instead of 7th, thats not his fault but it is the reality and it does put his contributions in context, had we a lesser keeper this past 3 years our situation probably wouldn't be all that different.

Its still likely that the best years of his career will be spent at Madrid instead of here, and its still very possible that in 30 years time when people look back at De Gea his time at United will be a footnote, those formative years in a bad team and winning nothing.

I think De Gea will be one of the greatest ever, he oozes class, I'm glad we have him and I hope we keep him. But his contributions do be overstated in my opinion, he has bailed us out in lots of games but as far as the bigger picture goes it was all a bit of a waste really. Such a shame that he wasn't bailing us out of games that mattered more, CL semi finals or big matches against title rivals.

I know, saving a penalty in the FA Cup semi final means **** all. Thanks-a-lot De Gea

s8n

Guys, DDG is the ONLY current world class player we have at the club and we have a LOT to thank him for.

Mitch Connor

bucketybuck wrote: »

They are being overstated. His heroics have meant we will probably finish 5th instead of 7th, thats not his fault but it is the reality and it does put his contributions in context, had we a lesser keeper this past 3 years our situation probably wouldn't be all that different.

Its still likely that the best years of his career will be spent at Madrid instead of here, and its still very possible that in 30 years time when people look back at De Gea his time at United will be a footnote, those formative years in a bad team and winning nothing.

I think De Gea will be one of the greatest ever, he oozes class, I'm glad we have him and I hope we keep him. But his contributions do be overstated in my opinion, he has bailed us out in lots of games but as far as the bigger picture goes it was all a bit of a waste really. Such a shame that he wasn't bailing us out of games that mattered more, CL semi finals or big matches against title rivals.

Personally I think judging the quality or input of an individual based on what a team has won, is just stupid.

It isn't De Gea's fault that he has been playing for a useless United side. He is a better keeper than VDS was after he got his nose broken, imo. Probably better in most aspects of the game than VDS anyway, bar defensive co-ordination - though VDS had one of the best pairings ever in front of him.

I don't think Ter Stegen or Valdes are better keepers than De Gea, but their trophy haul at Barcelona is a lot better - success of a team is poor judge of the merits of an individual. Has Ronaldo done nowt for Real domestically because they've only won one league in his time there? Sure he has scored loads of goals, but mostly it has been the difference between finishing second or third....put it into context, eh?

De Gea is one of the best keepers in the world right now, because of his contributions to United. If they were not stellar, we'd be in 10th and no one would be talking about De Gea.

bucketybuck

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I know, saving a penalty in the FA Cup semi final means **** all. Thanks-a-lot De Gea

Have you an actual opinion, or is it just going to be snide one liners going forward? Because you really should save yourself the bother.

bucketybuck

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Personally I think judging the quality or input of an individual based on what a team has won, is just stupid.

Its not about his quality or input, its about his legacy. I never denied his undoubted quality, just the opposite in fact.

Drumpot

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I must admit it would give me great joy to see Van Gaal lifting the FA cup

He has tried his best to make it work here, even if I disagree with how he has tried to do it.and it hasn't worked out in the end. A likeable character

I Agree.

I know I am in minority but I wouldn't mind if LVG was kept, certainly a better option then Jose. I think there are signs of recovery and particularly signs that the squad has more potential then the one he inherited. An FA cup win could do to these players what it did for the 2004 winners.

I hate the hiring and firing element of the sport. The irony of people demanding success and at the same time accepting a top 4 spot as satisfactory. Fans demanding exciting football and then hoping Jose is manager.

The landscape of football , particularly in England, makes it extremely difficult for teams to constantly succeed. The stability of having one exceptional manager for 3 decades was what allowed United to stand out from the rest.

Now United has nothing exceptional other then a balance sheet that sounds nice. But uniteds spending is in no way exceptional in comparison to the same teams vying for the same place. So why do fans still think the club should be top 4?

Look at the champions of England languishing in mid table. How can a team go from so high to so low? Good, consistent Players aren't easy to come by and if we throw city into the mix it's clear that the modern footballer is happy with sporadic success.

Assuming uniteds plan is for long term growth, I am completely supportive of LVG. Top 4 isn't important if there are proper strategies in place to grow the club back to the top. In any other top league the poor quality of opposition would facilitate CL qualification and rebuilding at the same time. The toughness of England does not afford that luxury.

I haven't found it easy watching united but I think if United replace LVG with Jose I don't expect the football to look better and worse still I think it's the owners admitting they don't know what to do. Whether you agree with the appointment or not, moyes and LVG signalled an intention to promote from within as a policy. Hiring Jose is a panic move throwing out three years of work. Ironically, Leicesters premier league story would suggest that uniteds current strategy may be more successful if maintained.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

Have you an actual opinion, or is it just going to be snide one liners going forward? Because you really should save yourself the bother.

My opinion is that you somehow managed to take an obvious positive and
somehow turn it negative but each to there own

You made a sweeping statement claiming he hasn't made significant saves in games that matter which is outright wrong

jayo26

bucketybuck wrote: »

Its not about his quality or input, its about his legacy. I never denied his undoubted quality, just the opposite in fact.

Who mentioned his legacy most of us were discussing his ability and what he has done for the team to which you said it is been overstated so id take that as talking about his ability.

You can't comment on his legacy until he has retired or left the club which he hasn't done either yet.

bucketybuck

M!Ck^ wrote: »

My opinion is that you somehow managed to take an obvious positive and
somehow turn it negative but each to there own

Yeah you keep saying things along these lines, its pretty boring.

You made a sweeping statement claiming he hasn't made significant saves in games that matter

No I didn't.

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

I Agree.

I know I am in minority but I wouldn't mind if LVG was kept, certainly a better option then Jose. I think there are signs of recovery and particularly signs that the squad has more potential then the one he inherited. An FA cup win could do to these players what it did for the 2004 winners.

I hate the hiring and firing element of the sport. The irony of people demanding success and at the same time accepting a top 4 spot as satisfactory. Fans demanding exciting football and then hoping Jose is manager.

The landscape of football , particularly in England, makes it extremely difficult for teams to constantly succeed. The stability of having one exceptional manager for 3 decades was what allowed United to stand out from the rest.

Now United has nothing exceptional other then a balance sheet that sounds nice. But uniteds spending is in no way exceptional in comparison to the same teams vying for the same place. So why do fans still think the club should be top 4?

Look at the champions of England languishing in mid table. How can a team go from so high to so low? Good, consistent Players aren't easy to come by and if we throw city into the mix it's clear that the modern footballer is happy with sporadic success.

Assuming uniteds plan is for long term growth, I am completely supportive of LVG. Top 4 isn't important if there are proper strategies in place to grow the club back to the top. In any other top league the poor quality of opposition would facilitate CL qualification and rebuilding at the same time. The toughness of England does not afford that luxury.

I haven't found it easy watching united but I think if United replace LVG with Jose I don't expect the football to look better and worse still I think it's the owners admitting they don't know what to do. Whether you agree with the appointment or not, moyes and LVG signalled an intention to promote from within as a policy. Hiring Jose is a panic move throwing out three years of work. Ironically, Leicesters premier league story would suggest that uniteds current strategy may be more successful if maintained.

So much here I disagree with.

What signs of recovering or positivity are you seeing? Because we scraped past everton in the semi? We looked good in the first half, were lucky in the second. Or was it the recent hammering we took off Spurs? Or was it the way we just about managed to scrape a win vs one of the worst sides in PL history? A side that has been tonked either side of that game, but could easily have come away with a draw from OT, with United haning on in the end.

What should we not want exciting football and why should we not expect to see it from Jose? His Chelsea side set records for points won and goals scored, but sure why let facts like that get in the way? Sure he shuts down in big games, much like Fergie did. Much like LVG has done vs pretty much anyone. Watford at home - to holding midfielders please....

I honestly don't know what you are watching that you think more seasons of LVG would actually be good for United in the long term. He scraped 4th last sedason with similar points to what Moyes achieved and he MIGHT do the same this year, again with similar points. He has spent a fortune and not actually made United a better side - he has at best maintained mediocrity, and given the investment in the squad that just is not acceptable. I'm not saying we should be winning the title every year, but we should be in contention for it and we haven't looked close to that under LVG and I see no reason to think he has the tools, or the self-awareness, to change that positively. He blames injuries, to the small squad he chose to have, for us not winning the league, saying he is doing the best with the players he has. It is all someone, or something, elses fault. He has haphazzardly moved from one player to the next, one formation to the next, with no evidence of long term planning having gone into the choices.

I can understand why people may argue against Jose (youth defvelopment would be the only argument I personally think is valid from a football perspective) but I can't for the life of me understand how anyone could view the last two years as a good argument for keeping LVG in charge.

The football has been terrible.
The results have not been good enough.
We were embarrassed in the CL.
We were embarrassed in the league cup.
We've been an embarrassment in the league.
We have stumbled through the FA Cup.

He claims he needs 3 years to implement his plan and philosphy - can someone tell Ranieri and Pochetino to hold there horses so, it should be seemingly impossible to get a team playing good football competently in less than 3 years and for less than 250million.

But yeah, giving the dead duck another season, sure why not?

Donnielighto

bucketybuck wrote: »

They are being overstated. His heroics have meant we will probably finish 5th instead of 7th, thats not his fault but it is the reality and it does put his contributions in context, had we a lesser keeper this past 3 years our situation probably wouldn't be all that different.

Its still likely that the best years of his career will be spent at Madrid instead of here, and its still very possible that in 30 years time when people look back at De Gea his time at United will be a footnote, those formative years in a bad team and winning nothing.

I think De Gea will be one of the greatest ever, he oozes class, I'm glad we have him and I hope we keep him. But his contributions do be overstated in my opinion, he has bailed us out in lots of games but as far as the bigger picture goes it was all a bit of a waste really. Such a shame that he wasn't bailing us out of games that mattered more, CL semi finals or big matches against title rivals.

Your unfailing ability to look at glasses and see the empty bit is tiresome. How often do you correct someone where you have the more positive view?

bucketybuck

Donnielighto wrote: »

Your unfailing ability to look at glasses and see the empty bit is tiresome. How often do you correct someone where you have the more positive view?

Learn how to use the ignore list then.

Mitch Connor

I would like to apologise for my use of 'to' rather than 'two', and 'there' rather than 'their', above. Painful mistakes....

glued

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Where's Martial going???
Sell a player for the future that LVG scouted and urged the board to spend big on and got it 100% right? Not a chance.

What are you on about? If we continue to fail to qualify for the CL the likes Martial and De Gea won't want to stay.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So much here I disagree with.

What signs of recovering or positivity are you seeing? Because we scraped past everton in the semi? We looked good in the first half, were lucky in the second. Or was it the recent hammering we took off Spurs? Or was it the way we just about managed to scrape a win vs one of the worst sides in PL history? A side that has been tonked either side of that game, but could easily have come away with a draw from OT, with United haning on in the end.

What should we not want exciting football and why should we not expect to see it from Jose? His Chelsea side set records for points won and goals scored, but sure why let facts like that get in the way? Sure he shuts down in big games, much like Fergie did. Much like LVG has done vs pretty much anyone. Watford at home - to holding midfielders please....

I honestly don't know what you are watching that you think more seasons of LVG would actually be good for United in the long term. He scraped 4th last sedason with similar points to what Moyes achieved and he MIGHT do the same this year, again with similar points. He has spent a fortune and not actually made United a better side - he has at best maintained mediocrity, and given the investment in the squad that just is not acceptable. I'm not saying we should be winning the title every year, but we should be in contention for it and we haven't looked close to that under LVG and I see no reason to think he has the tools, or the self-awareness, to change that positively. He blames injuries, to the small squad he chose to have, for us not winning the league, saying he is doing the best with the players he has. It is all someone, or something, elses fault. He has haphazzardly moved from one player to the next, one formation to the next, with no evidence of long term planning having gone into the choices.

I can understand why people may argue against Jose (youth defvelopment would be the only argument I personally think is valid from a football perspective) but I can't for the life of me understand how anyone could view the last two years as a good argument for keeping LVG in charge.

The football has been terrible.
The results have not been good enough.
We were embarrassed in the CL.
We were embarrassed in the league cup.
We've been an embarrassment in the league.
We have stumbled through the FA Cup.

He claims he needs 3 years to implement his plan and philosphy - can someone tell Ranieri and Pochetino to hold there horses so, it should be seemingly impossible to get a team playing good football competently in less than 3 years and for less than 250million.

But yeah, giving the dead duck another season, sure why not?

Jose teams are not entertaining, they are functional and organised. Impressive win statistics do not equate to entertaining football. Oddly, I would of felt they were more like fergies squad in the final season that didn't exactly bowl people over with swashbuckling football. Point is that Jose teams didn't play entertaining football.

LVG doesn't buy players, the club does and its not common practice for major clubs to sign players on the say of managers. People have this misguided view that LVG goes "I want that player" and it just happens which is incorrect. LVG may have a small say in certain players, but most of that squad was picked by the club, not the manager. He would instruct the club to identify specific kind of players, but at the end of the day its not him choosing them.

United's spending has been unspectacular over the last 5 seasons. People are picking, in isolation, specific years, ignoring the under investment in the team for over a decade. City spent more (net) then united when they won the league 2 seasons ago and yet people expect the same or similar results.

Some fans presume that there is some sort of right to expect that United will not decline or have poor seasons. That spending x equates to success, but ignore Chelsea and Leicester this season that completely contradicts the whole "United SHOULD be challenging/top". Its not to excuse LVGs performances, but to highlight the fact that, as I said, the landscape of football has changed dramatically and its misguided to expect similar results from old expectations.

Leicester and Spurs are clubs used to changing managers and building squads, irrespective of managers. Their players are used to working with different managers, the squad SAF were not. Like Chelsea this season, the united squad that last won the league under performed. The players were incapable of performing for a new manager (or didn't perform). Ironically, you want the manager who couldn't get his team to perform this season in a very similar manner in which Moyes couldn't get a champion winning team to perform the season he took over from SAF.

The question I have is what sets united apart from any other team at the top ? If you think a top 4 spot is the minimum, you aren't really any different from any other top team. If you set your target as long term stability and success, you need to try something different. United cannot outspend their rivals, so we can either blend in with the crowd, swap managers every few seasons or we can try things differently, I think its a bold move to try and not be narrow minded with a "top 4 minimum" target.

Then there's the fact that the club has practically overhauled most of its squad in the last 2 seasons. Moyes didn't sell anybody, LVG has had to overhaul the majority of the team. What other top side has had to do that recently and maintained a top level? The Fergie title winning team relied heavily on Evra, Rio, Vidic, , Carrick and Van Persie all of whom are gone or past their best.

Then there is also the fact that this season is clearly a very odd one. We have United, City and Arsenal fighting it out for 3rd and 4th place. Leicester about to win the league and Spurs comfortably 2nd with the champions in mid table. But you seem to have expectations for the team based on the way things normally work ? Like I said, the landscape of football has changed and to have the same expectations based on old methods is outdated and misguided.

I don't necessarily think LVG will be the man to bring United back to the top of the pile, but I do think the club has a better chance of building long term success if they try to give him the time that isn't always afforded at other clubs.

I believe there have been signs of some great football. Considering how young the forward line has been (lindgard, Rashford, Martial), there is also to suggest that this could be explosive when they start to get experience and consistency.

I remember between 2002-04 some fans wanted SAF sacked. There were no obvious signs of recovery and then they won the FA cup. I feel the same could happen to this squad.

Korat

bucketybuck wrote: »

I think De Gea will be one of the greatest ever, he oozes class, I'm glad we have him and I hope we keep him. But his contributions do be overstated in my opinion, he has bailed us out in lots of games but as far as the bigger picture goes it was all a bit of a waste really. Such a shame that he wasn't bailing us out of games that mattered more, CL semi finals or big matches against title rivals.

This is a sensitive subject at the moment as he is our one genuinely world class player, so it’s like taking someone’s favourite toy away if you’re seen to be suggesting he’s not quite all that just yet.

I'm actually finding the way some people are suggesting DDG is an equal or better than Schmeichel or VDS a bit insulting to those club legends.

Peter Schmeichel won Player of the Year in 1996. DDG wasn't even shortlisted this year, when there haven't been many standout players.

By all means praise the kid but don't insult the club's history by going on with unjustified hyperbolic laudation.